Semi-Auto Newbie--'Oh no not again'


PDA






UberNewb
October 24, 2005, 10:04 PM
Hey---I am afraid to say that this is yet another 'what gun should I buy' thread. I do apologize, but the responses on other boards has been great and I have been finding online bulletin boards to be a great asset to helping me get started in this hobby.

I am a young single guy, no kids to worry about, and I am looking to buy a semi-auto 9mm for mostly plinking, range shooting, target shooting and lastly, home defense. I do not plan to carry a gun with other than to the range or to my girlfriends family mountain resort. Being young and still deciding what I want to do with my life, I do have a limited budget. I would like to spend between $300 and $500 on my first pistol, while still getting something that is easy to learn with and use accurately. So far my choices have come up with a few options. The guns below are the ones I am interested and through my research, seem to be what I am looking for. The prices are the best that I have found in my area (3 local gun shops)

Springfield XD 9mm 4" (two 15rd mags + holster + case $460)
Taurus 24/7 9mm (two 17rd mags + case $380)
HK USP9 Full size (factory demo + one hi-cap mag + case $550)

Please understand that I have made up my mind on caliber and format (semi-auto)...so I will say in advance..I am definitely not interested in a revolver/.22/shotgun. And let me also say...I think sigs and glocks are excellent guns, but none even come close to fitting into my budget.

If you enjoyed reading about "Semi-Auto Newbie--'Oh no not again'" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
phorvick
October 24, 2005, 10:18 PM
You can find used Glocks all over for your budget limitation. Check http://www.summitgunbroker.com/index.html

UberNewb
October 24, 2005, 10:21 PM
yeah, thats true, used guns are an option, but I really was hoping to buy new. The factory demo USP I looked at is practically brand new, looks like it has never been fired.

Marshall
October 24, 2005, 10:30 PM
Tough to beat the XD option. Good trigger, good grip feel, good sight options, grip safety, loaded chamber indicator, cocking indicator, accurate, dependable and easy take down to 4 simple pieces in no time at all.

SpookyPistolero
October 24, 2005, 10:38 PM
When you said a cheap, 9mm semi, my first thoughts were the XD or Glock. Either would serve you well, new or used. These questions always end up with the same answer. Go to the shop and see what fits you best; what's comfy and what points well, etc.. If possible, get to a range and rent them each. Those name brands you mentioned will take care of you well, so just go see what your hand likes best.

pyrotechnic
October 24, 2005, 11:01 PM
For that price I would jump all over the USP9. I have a USP45 and love it, however you should handle as many pistols as you can before you make your decision. Get one with a solid reputation and make sure it feels right when you hold it.

Regards,
Maarten

Jim Watson
October 24, 2005, 11:09 PM
USP or XD, pick for feel and features.
But I consider the Taurus unproven. Let somebody else work with the warranty clerk to get the bugs out.

Jamie C.
October 24, 2005, 11:27 PM
Of your three choices, the USP is where I'd go.

Also, even though you didn't mention it, a CZ-75B would be a good choice as well, if you happen to want an all-steel gun. It'll be a bit cheaper, price-wise, than the USP, but will operate in the same manner.


J.C.

10-Ring
October 25, 2005, 12:10 AM
Of your choices, USP 9 all the way! :cool:

UberNewb
October 25, 2005, 12:20 AM
First. I'd get a used Browning Buckmark 22, and come back to look at 9mm's after firing 5-10k rds, preferably some of it under the watchful eye of a good coach. The $500-$1000 that you will save on ammo will more than pay for the .22 and the coaching, and you will be a far better shot for having done things in the time-proven manner.

thank you..but it always seems like everyone reccomends a .22 for a first gun. I have shot many guns before, I just dont own one. I need something that will double as SD and a range weapon. I am not going to buy a .22 and then 'graduate' to a larger caliber. 9mm will suit me just fine for a first pistol, maybe if I hit it off with the sport, I will eventually buy a .40 or .45 for a more dedicated SD weapon.

Black Majik
October 25, 2005, 12:37 AM
Wow! USP9 for $550?! Thats a great price, I'd go for that just for the price!

Of the three options, I'd go for the USP 9. Heh... what a surprise huh? The USP has great ergonomics, able to be carried condition 1 or DA/SA.

I'm too lazy at the moment to type out why the HK is better than the Taurus and Springfield, but the HK is the way to go.

antsi
October 25, 2005, 01:03 AM
I can't believe the lack of people saying "CZ 75B" in this thread. Shopping around, these can be had for $400-425 easy, and I have seen them as low as $350. I think they're the best $-for-$ semiauto out there.

Custard
October 25, 2005, 01:32 AM
... just go see what your hand likes best.

That is the only advice you should take.

Rent them all and see what you like. Remember that guns feel different when you are shooting then when you are just handling them. You need to feel the recoil. Unless you can shoot the exact weapon you will buy you shouldn't get too caught up in the trigger feel. Triggers vary a lot and you can always have it worked over.

Shoot 500 rounds and I bet you will know which one fits you.

Dan

Justang
October 25, 2005, 10:49 AM
HK all the way. Especially for that price!

My HK USP has 10k rounds through it and it has never had one malfunction... EVER. My dad has 50k+ through his. After 50k something broke in the trigger mechinism, sent to HK and they fixed it. 50k rounds between malfunctions is acceptable IMO. :p

But like others said, see which one fits it your hand best. I shot the Glock better than the HK, but the HK felt better in my hand. I ended up with the HK because I knew over time I'd get better with the gun.

Universal
October 25, 2005, 10:54 AM
Of the three mentioned I would certainly suggest you get the Heckler und Koch for that price. That being said, you should be able to find a new GLOCK 17 or 19 for around $500. There are some on-line places that will sell them for something like $460 plus some fees to ship it to your FFL. I would recommend the GLOCK over the H&K.

JDGray
October 25, 2005, 11:46 AM
Check out Rugers P345 $400.00

FullEffect1911
October 25, 2005, 12:30 PM
For me at least, i'd go with the XD-9.

from my experience, Hk's and glocks just don't feel right to me, where as XD's do. But see which one just feels right to you, and i'll bet that you'll find the gun you like. All three are high in quality and reliability, so you can't really go wrong.

Dave Dembinski
October 25, 2005, 01:10 PM
I'd say XD-9. It's comfortable to shoot, easy to take down and clean, and you don't have to feel bad if you end up trashing it due to inexperience. Just make sure you keep the metal bits lightly coated in oil to discourage rust.

New23
October 25, 2005, 01:40 PM
Don't let anyone talk you out of the caliber you want. I started with a Glock 23 (compact .40) and had no problem with it. I also suggest you allot some of your money for some good instruction.

P. Plainsman
October 25, 2005, 03:26 PM
I second the suggestion to take a close look at the CZ 75B in 9mm.

http://www.cz-usa.com/01.detail.php?id=29

It fits comfortably within your budget. Mine was $435 with two 15-round mags. (Ignore the reference to 10-round mags on the website.) It is a modern classic, a svelte, steel-frame pistol with wonderful ergonomics. If this matters, it is also much better looking than the three plastic pistols you've listed.

The CZ is a selective double action/single action pistol with an external thumb safety. That means you can carry it cocked-and-locked (hammer back, safety engaged) and flip down the safety as you draw for a quick, accurate single action first shot. Or, if you prefer, you can keep the hammer down on a round and use the long double action pull for the first shot. I prefer the cocked-and-locked mode and regard it as one of the big strengths of the CZ.

I am extremely satisfied with the 75B. It has a splendid grip feel. It has been perfectly reliable through about 700 rounds. It is a snap to clean. It looks good. It is an accurate gun, and I speak as a revolver fan who tends to get impatient with the accuracy of some common autoloaders.

The single-action trigger is a little creepy. That is my only substantive complaint. Many speak highly of the single-action-only CZs, which supposedly have excellent adjustable triggers with no creep. If I did it over again I might get one of these.

http://www.cz-usa.com/01.detail.php?id=33

conkmwc
October 25, 2005, 03:30 PM
I sure love mine, I only paid $379. Wouldn't trade it for anything.

donkee
October 25, 2005, 06:28 PM
My CZ75 has been great. Couldn't ask for better. I did get the FN Hi-Power SFS from CDNN for my son. That is one sweet pistol as well. I would recommend either. All steel, in the 400-450 range, 9mm (as you wish), and all around classy/classic.

drf
October 25, 2005, 06:30 PM
H&K would be an excellent choice, also the CZ line is tough to beat for the price, I wouldnt have any problem with either one........I own both.........drf

Marshall
October 25, 2005, 06:30 PM
The FN/BHP Hi-Powers are bad boys!

Vex
October 25, 2005, 07:48 PM
used sig p226 or p228 or p229
used beretta 92 series or cougar
used browning bdm http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=6927495

new Bersa Thunder 9mm (fullsize 17-round or compact 13-round)
new cz 75b

out of all of those I'd go with the BDM, here's another one:
http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=7043216

Preacherman
October 25, 2005, 08:03 PM
I'd also recommend the CZ-75B as probably the finest 9mm. "budget-priced" pistol out there. It's a bit heavier than the polymer guns, but it's an excellent weapon, very ergonomic and reliable.

If you want polymer, again, I second the recommendation for the XD range. I use Glocks myself, but in your price range, the XD is more cost-effective.

Fun2Shoot
October 25, 2005, 09:13 PM
Don't over look the Ruger P series in your 9mm gun search. I had a Ruger P95 in 9mm that was a great bang-for-the-buck and was well made and would feed and fire all ammo types.

I had an XD-9 and put over 1k rds down range with it. It was an inherently very accurate firearm and would feed everything. I just do not like striker fired guns. I need either a decocker or a slide safety on my hand guns.

Get some of your choices in your hand. That can tip the scale quickly, one way or the other.

Good Luck

Boss Spearman
October 25, 2005, 09:15 PM
I agree the CZ 75 is the best budget 9mm. I wish my fingers were long enough to work the trigger properly.

The only polymer gun I've tried that I've fallen in love with is the HK USP. I traded my Springfield XD to get a 2nd HK. I had a 24/7 also, and I'll take an HK over it, the XD, Glock, Sig, or just about anything else other than a Hi Power.

The Browning Hi Power of course is another king of the hill.

GigaBuist
October 25, 2005, 09:53 PM
I'm also in the CZ-75B boat... good pistol, good price. It was my first gun too, actually.

My only regret? I should have bought the Kadet kit so I could shoot .22LR out of it. I mean that. I'm serious. These people are right.. having a .22LR pistol to practice with is great! Every single time I go out to practice with pistols my .22LR handgun comes out with me. If I get a flinch, I move to .22LR. Cheap ammo is nice too... and while I could afford to shoot 9mm all day long, it won't do me much more good than shooting a bunch of .22LR to make sure I got the basics down and then moving to 9mm for a final box of 50.

As an added bonus... it would make a great .22LR pistol to get the girlfriend, little brother, nephew, or cousin shooting on too. To switch out slides you're looking at what, 60 seconds?

If you had to get one gun I figure 9mm ain't too bad... but if you pick up a pistol that'll let you shoot .22LR with a slide change you're doing much better. The CZ lets you do that and it keeps the cost down.

Boss Spearman
October 25, 2005, 10:31 PM
already posted, dupe deleted

AMT
October 26, 2005, 01:36 AM
I say go with the H&K, avoid the Taurus. And I give the XD a neutral ( please no hate mail )
If nothing else you will get your money back on the H&K if you ever sell it.:)

only1asterisk
October 26, 2005, 01:59 AM
UberNewb,

Welcome to THR!

You sound like a young man that has done his homework. The full-size service 9mm is far from the worst handgun to learn on. It also allows you to have a viable defensive arm immediately. I could make you a list of about 20 pistols of acceptable quality in your price range, but the best thing to do would be getting some trigger time in before you buy. Shoot everything you can get your hands on first. Knowing what you like and buying the right pistol the first time out will save you time, money and frustration.


David

Marshall
October 26, 2005, 12:33 PM
Hey Vex, tell me about the BDM, I know where one has been sitting on a shelf for over a year, great shape too. However, I know nothing about them other than my Browning love and that you can shoot in SA or DA. Is it easy to strip? Are they dependable? Accurate? Etc. Feel free to PM me if that is better.

dxkj21
October 26, 2005, 01:47 PM
Hey---I am afraid to say that this is yet another 'what gun should I buy' thread. I do apologize, but the responses on other boards has been great and I have been finding online bulletin boards to be a great asset to helping me get started in this hobby.

I am a young single guy, no kids to worry about, and I am looking to buy a semi-auto 9mm for mostly plinking, range shooting, target shooting and lastly, home defense. I do not plan to carry a gun with other than to the range or to my girlfriends family mountain resort. Being young and still deciding what I want to do with my life, I do have a limited budget. I would like to spend between $300 and $500 on my first pistol, while still getting something that is easy to learn with and use accurately. So far my choices have come up with a few options. The guns below are the ones I am interested and through my research, seem to be what I am looking for. The prices are the best that I have found in my area (3 local gun shops)

Springfield XD 9mm 4" (two 15rd mags + holster + case $460)
Taurus 24/7 9mm (two 17rd mags + case $380)
HK USP9 Full size (factory demo + one hi-cap mag + case $550)

Please understand that I have made up my mind on caliber and format (semi-auto)...so I will say in advance..I am definitely not interested in a revolver/.22/shotgun. And let me also say...I think sigs and glocks are excellent guns, but none even come close to fitting into my budget.


I like the taurus and lot of people have good things to say about them... as long as you dont mind the DAO..

The XD is a nice middle ground and I think it would be an excellent choice as a first gun... I ended up choosing a CZ 75 over the XD, but only because the price was right, and I like the all-steel design.

NEtracker
October 26, 2005, 02:03 PM
Any rent-a-gun ranges nearby you? Anyone that you know have these models to try first? It's kind of been mentioned above, that try before you buy is best. I can't tell you how many I've seen go out and buy without trying first, then end up returning the firearm (hardly used), taking a big hit on the $. 9mm is a good choice, but that .22 should be on the list for later.

goon
October 26, 2005, 02:40 PM
While not on your list, I can support the CZ-75 variants. They are great guns and priced around $350-$400. IMO, they are fully the equal of a more expensive gun like a SIG.
Another idea would be to get your hands on a CDNN catalog and see what they have in your price range. They did have SIG P-225's for around $350 but I don't know what they have now. IIRC, they also had FN Hi-Powers for around $399 but that has been awhile ago.
I have owned a few guns and if I had to start again I would probably check out a CDNN catalog as my first stop. You may also watch the for sale board here and see what turns up that may fit your needs.

UberNewb
October 26, 2005, 09:05 PM
I test shot the HK USP compact 9mm and I loved it, made me a much better shooter--and it was my first time with a semi-auto. My shop has a compact USP9 with LEM trigger factory demo LNIB for $450 and a fullsize USP9 factory demo for $550--from what I have reaserched these are excellent prices and I may go with the USP. We'll see;)

Vex
October 26, 2005, 10:32 PM
Hey Vex, tell me about the BDM, I know where one has been sitting on a shelf for over a year, great shape too. However, I know nothing about them other than my Browning love and that you can shoot in SA or DA. Is it easy to strip? Are they dependable? Accurate? Etc. Feel free to PM me if that is better.The BDM is a fullsize "wondernine" but it's not bulky like a Beretta, SIG or Glock. Many remark how thin it is, much like a 1911 or Hi-Power, classic designs which carry very well for their size. It operates on the Modified Browning priciple, (large barrel block which locks with the ejection port, as seen it glocks and sigs and most state of the art pistols). The controls are a frame mounted ambidextrous safety/decocker that allow you to chose from cocked and locked single action, traditional double action, double action only (from a hammer, so you can have a second strike unlike the XD, Glock, Walther P99 etc. you can even cock it like a double action revolver). The frame is steel but this gun weights in at 28oz, that's lighter than most aluminum frame pistols.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42221&highlight=Browning+BDM

downside is that despite being a wonderful design it didn't take off because it came to the market at the end of the wondernine craze and the beginning of the clinton ban so people were looking for .40s and other guns with plenty of mags already available. so you'll have to look around for magazines and holsters.

If you enjoyed reading about "Semi-Auto Newbie--'Oh no not again'" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!