got pulled over while carrying


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Ukraine Train
October 24, 2005, 11:38 PM
This was the first time I've been stopped while carrying. I saw the lights come on and as I pulled over was wondering what I did wrong, as far as I knew nothing, but nevertheless I've never been more nervous during a stop. I'm an Ohio resident but was in Flint, MI where I go to school. As the officer approached he asked for my license and registration but instead of reaching for anything I kept my hands on the wheel and informed him that I had a CCW and was carrying. He asked where it was and I told him on my right hip and that my wallet is in my back left pocket. As I got my wallet I asked if there was a problem and he said he was just "checking my plates" for some reason. Maybe because I drive an ex cop car, who knows. He saw my out of state license and asked what I was doing in MI and I explained. He asked if my school knew I had a CCW and I told him I live off campus so they don't have to know. He then gave me back my papers and told me I was free to go. He never even ran my license or plate number.

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hkmp5g17
October 24, 2005, 11:59 PM
Please note that this is not a joke.


My friend and I got pulled over a while back. I had my KelTec P-11 in my lap. So I put my hands on the dashboard to make sure he didn't see me as a threat. The officer walks up and asks for my friend's ID(he was driving) As he does this he sticks his head well into the Honda.

Me- " Officer- I should let you know there is a weapon in the car"

Officer (looking at the pistol 2 feet away) "Wait your turn!"

So I wait for the conversation to end.

Me- " Officer I should.. and get cut off!

Officer- "Was I talking to you!" Still within 2 feet of pistol!

After about 2 minutes the officer finally says- "So what do you want?"

Me- " I should let you know there's a firearm in the vehicle" My friend is trying hard not to laugh!"

Well where is it! At this point my friend can no longer contain his laughter- the cop didn't like this!

The officer asks that I hand it to him which I do. As he grabs it the muzzle brushes my friend's head- stopping his laughter!

Officer -"How do you take the "Clip" out?

Me- just hit the mag release.............blank stare from officer.:confused:

It's in the same position as on yours....... blank stare again!

The little button on the side by the trigger.... mag comes out.

"Theres a round in the... cop walks off- friend resumes laughter.


After the officer returns my pistol( butt first) I check the chamber- LOADED!:what:

Kinda makes me wonder about the academy's training:(

I also hope the officer never has to use his weapon.

Anthony

Double Naught Spy
October 25, 2005, 12:42 AM
Ukraine Train, I would be willing to guess that the officer ran your plate before he turned on his lights or was in the process of doing it when he turned on his lights and so by the time he got to you, he knew to whom the car was registered, that that person was not wanted, and that the car wasn't reported stolen. Once he had your ID and your name matched the information from the plate check, he had no real reason to go back and do it all over again.

hkmp5g17, what are the laws in your state? I take it from some of your other posts that you are in Colorado. I take it that you don't have a permit, hence why you had the gun in the open. I see where a person with a CCW permit does not have to notify law enforcement about carrying when stopped by law enforcement, but I could not find anything that says you have to notify law enforcement when open carrying in a vehicle.

In Texas with a CHL, if you are a passenger in a vehicle stopped for some traffic issue or whatever, the passenger does not have to inform the officer about having a permit and carrying a gun at that time unless the officer addresses the passenger as part of the stop.

So, in Colorado, do you have to disclose that you have a gun if you are a passenger in a car stopped by an officer? I am still trying to figure out the reasoning behind your emphatic attempts to tell the officer, even to the point of disobeying his directive to keep quiet.

I also don't see you shock about the gun being returned to you with a round in the chamber. He simply returned the gun to you in the same manner as he took it back to his car.

Jayock
October 25, 2005, 01:54 AM
In colorado, nobody has to inform an officer of a concealed weapon, unless asked. Then permit must be presented and the officer may choose to disarm you. Further, CCW permits are not required to concealed carry in a motor vehicle in colorado.

neoncowboy
October 25, 2005, 07:39 AM
I got pulled over a couple months back, carrying as usual. Kept my hands on the wheel until officer asked for papers then reached for wallet and got license.

I didn't mention the gun. Figure concealed means concealed.

She didn't ask.

She gave me a ticket for running a stop sign, was very polite and professional about the whole thing and we were done in a few minutes.

Georgia doesn't specifically demand that we notify law enforcement of carrying...so I don't. As far as I'm concerned, it's no more the officer's business than it is anyone else's and the polite thing to do is just keep it to myself and not let it become an issue.

goon
October 25, 2005, 07:56 AM
I had this happen to me once. I was speeding. I didn't realize it until I saw the police car and sort of instinctively slowed down.
I was polite to the cop, because after all, I was speeding. I immediately told him that I had a rifle behind the seat, a 9mm on the passenger seat, and a .38 at the small of my back.
I live in rural PA.
He asked to see my CCW, asked that I keep the guns put away while he was present, and went on about his business.
I still got a ticket but he wrote it up in such a way that I got fewer points taken off my license. Note the advantage of not being a jerk, especially to cops.

bogie
October 25, 2005, 08:25 AM
Yeah, I think it's to your advantage to reveal a CCW to cops... (1) If you have to get out of the car for any reason, and you get made, you could end up with Mr. Glock in your ear until you get forcibly relieved of it; (2) It lets the cop know that you could pass the background checks.

GRB
October 25, 2005, 08:34 AM
I am going to take it as it was said, that the story of the pistol on the passenger's lap (in the 2nd post of this thread) was true. In that case I make reference to thb below quote from a later post:

I also don't see you shock about the gun being returned to you with a round in the chamber. He simply returned the gun to you in the same manner as he took it back to his car. It was an extremely bad move by the officer to have given this firearm back in a ready to fire condition. If you cannot figure out why, then at least review what are now a days called the "4" rules of gun safety (I could not disagree more that there are only 4 basic gun safety rules - but that is for another thread). You should be able to see what is wrong by reviewing them.

If that is not enough to convince you that the officer was extremely neglgent to have handed a firearm back in said condition then think officer safety. He did not know what he was dealing with from step one - you never really do when you make a stop. For instance the guy had the gun in his lap when the car was stopped. That is more than enough justification for an officer to draw his own weapon. Now I am not saying he should have drawn, just that it was more than enough to justify such. Of course that is only if he had seem it on the guy's lap. Chances are tha when the passenger leaned forward to place his hands of the dashboard, he obstructed the officers view of the pistol; either with his belly or with his arms, or maybe a jacket. In that case, or in any case, the officer should have paid better atention. It is not the usual thing for people to lean forward and place their hands on the dashboard when pulled over, nor is it the usual thing for 'most' people to tell you they are armed. The officer was not paying attention and this is a thing that often leads to or facilitates an officer being killed.

Finally, after realizing there was a firearm in the car and on the person's lap, what does the officer do? Does the officer take it away? Well yes and no but, let me say, no not exactly and, definitely not safely. He has the passenger hand it to him from the passenger side to the driver's side (apparetly across the front of the driver's face). This was an extremely bad and potentially extremely dangerous move on the part of the officer. I don't care how compliant someone seems - this was a bone head move especially in light of the fact that the driver is laughing. (Would this indicate to anyone else the possibility (note I said possibility) of the driver and/or passenger possibly being intoxicated or nervous - no I am not saying you were nor even implying such - I am saying that this is at least one thing of which the cop should have been thinking - as laughter like that is fairly unusual in a car stop and is a sign of something being off kilter.) Would you tell a possibly intoxicated person to hand you a gun, or even a sober person to hand you a gun that he had to pass in front of a possibly intoxicated person or even in across a sober person? Not me, let alone the fact that you could have been any number of bad things with that firearm on your lap. No, a cop cannot know you are a good guy in a situation like that, or at least should not assume it. At the very least and, just because of the firearm on the passenger's lap, the officer should have been at a very heightened level of readiness.

Then to take the firearm and not unload it before handing it back was simply ludicrous if for no other reason than the officer already had decided to take out the magazine! Why do you think the officer removed the magazine. It was in all likelihood for some semblance of officer safety. Yes even this officer, who did so much that was blatantly wrong, decided to try to do something right. The sad part is though not that the officer asked how to take out the mag but, that the officer did not remove the round from the chamber. Then he handed it back butt first. So the pistol was now pointed in some fashion at the officer, the guy in the car had control of the end of the pistol that houses the firing control (the trigger) and that houses the directional control, the grip. Had the passenger decided this is the time to do it - well there would likely have been one shot officer or maybe one shot driver (somehow I doubt the officer would have realized his mistake in time and been quick enough to turn the pistol away). That is why he should not have handed it back ready to fire.

All the best,
GB

Turtle Club
October 25, 2005, 08:42 AM
I asked if there was a problem and he said he was just "checking my plates" for some reason....

That my friend is a Civil Rights Violation. Its called Racial,Economical,Age,Gender ECT....PROFILING. The officer can run your plates for any reason. But he has to have probable cause to detain you in a traffic stop i.e. expired tags, correct tags not on plate, they can even pull you over if you car is dirty and licence plate is clean or vise vera because that is a minor sign of a stolen car.

If that were the case...Fine. The officer can "check your plates" from his car while he is following you. If the car is in your name I assume, he already knew that you had a CCW when he ran your plates, if he did prior hand to walking up to your car.

My answer would have been..."Officer I don't belieive that the Michigan Administrative Code constitutes "checking your plates" to be valid probable cause for detaining me in an un lawful traffic stop. I would like to file a complaint. What is your badge and car # and Supervisors' names?"

My quote of the hour "Know your rights. For god sake go to Borders and buy a copy of the ORC (Ohio Revised Code) and OAC (Ohio Administrative Code), this may not have helped your out of state, but you would be surpried how studing it will help you talk your way out of traffic tickets and other stuff with police."

GRB
October 25, 2005, 08:58 AM
Civil Rights violation, wow that is as heavy as being ignorant of the requirements to make a traffic stop. The officer does not have to tell you why he stopped you. If he does tell you why, he does not have to tell you the truth and he can still be within his legal rights. As a matter of fact an officer does not need probable cause to make a traffic stop or to keep you there for the purposes of a STOP. Probable cause is required for an arrest not for a traffic stop. It is required to search a car without a warrant - again not for a mere stop. If you did not know that, then you need to refresh your latest legal training.

Did you ever, even for a brief moment, consider that the there could have been something wrong - maybe traveling 1 MPH overt he speed limit, maybe a bit of a zig when it should have been a zag, maybe straying over the centerline, maybe a felony car stop looking for a crime suspect who was reported driving a similar car. Did you also ever think that maybe, just maybe, the attitude of the driver, his being upfront about the CCW and his being polite, led to the officer letting him go without a ticket (in the event it was a stop due to a violation). Did you ever think that maybe Ukraine Train had a better way of getting out of a ticket thatn you do with your cheese grater type of attitude. Heck if I were a police officer who pulled you over and you told me you wanted to make a complaint, I'd show you my shield and cred number as required. Then I'd write you for every tiny violation I could find, including the one for which I had pulled you over. It would all be quite legal and correct too. Want to bet who would win in court.

Zach S
October 25, 2005, 10:21 AM
I drive an ex cop car
You forgot the word "obvious," lol.

hkmp5g17
October 25, 2005, 10:24 AM
Howdy! Yes I'm in Colorado and didn't have a permit at the time. Why did I tell the officer?
So that he wouldn't suddenly "notice" the pistol and potentially go on the defensive. Same thing for placing my hands on the dashboard- the officer had no way of knowing that if I intended to use the weapon or not(I didn't of course)

Regarding not clearing the chamber- I did not want the officer walking up to see me doing something with my hands out of view and then see a gun in my lap-as it could have protracted the situation. I am upset because the officer covered(and touched) my friend with the muzzle- and later pointed a loaded weapon at himself while handing the butt to a stranger.

My friends outburst certainly didn't help the situation.

Regarding the opinion that open carry is legal and you don't have to tell the officer- that's certainly true.

Could have turned out worse (potentiallY) if the officer had finally noticed the pistol- and I hadn't said anything.


The law and an officer's perception of it are two different things.

Anthony

EddieCoyle
October 25, 2005, 10:40 AM
I got pulled over for "speeding" while carrying a couple of months ago at about 3:00 AM on a Saturday morning. I was doing 44 in a 40 mph zone. The real reason I got pulled over was because I was out at 3:00 AM on a weekend night and the local cop was trolling for drunks. You'd normally have to be doing at least 50 or 55 to get pulled over on this stretch.

Anyway, while I waited for him to get out of his car, I retrieved my license, registration, and CCW permit. Then I rolled down my window and put both hands on the wheel. He walks up and before I can say anything he says,

"Good morning. Have you been drinking?"

I told him that I hadn't and he asked me for my license and registration. I keep my right hand on the wheel and with my left I hand him my driver's license, registration, and Class A LTC. Then I said,

"I'd like to let you know that I'm carrying a handgun. That's my Class A LTC there in your hand."

He looked at my ID's and then asked me where my gun was; I told him that it was on my left hip. He asked me what kind of gun it was and I told him a .38 revolver. Then he surprised me. We had this exchange:
LEO: Oh yeah? What kind?
ME: It's a Smith and Wesson 642.
LEO: The hammerless Airweight? Do you like it? I was thinking of getting one for a backup gun.
ME: Yeah, I like it fine. It so light that you forget your carrying it.
LEO: Is it accurate?
ME: Do you have any experience with a DAO revolver? If not, it takes some practice getting used to.
LEO: Can't say that I have. We carry autos (points to his duty weapon, a Sig).
ME: You're welcome to try mine out (I invite him to meet me at my club later that afternoon).
LEO: I might take you up on that. Be safe and have a good night. He hands me back my stuff and I drive away.

outfieldjack
October 25, 2005, 10:43 AM
I got pulled a few weeks ago comming FROM the range and heading out to the woods to workk on deer stands. Needless to say I had two rifles in the back seat of my truck and my glock on my hip.

I never saw the highay patrolman.....

He lit me up and I was pulled over before he got turned around. I cut the truck off and lowered the window and just kept my hands on the steering wheel.

Told him right away I was carrying.... he was like "cool"

He saw I had a HP sticker on my truck.... "who do you know in the HP" he asked.....

"Uh, my father-in-law" :rolleyes:

"Whats his name"

I told him..... he was like "I don't know him"..... "slow it down"

:D

kirkcdl
October 25, 2005, 11:02 AM
I don't know the laws where Glenn lives,but in Oregon,they must inform you as to the reason for the stop.However,as far as asking for Supervisory contact,I think I'd wait until after I had signed a citation.As long as things are going your way in a traffic stop,there's no reason to aggravate things further by being "difficult"(in the officers eyes).I do tend to notice something in Eddies post,if you are contacted by a police officer that is a "gun guy" you stand a good chance of only getting a warning if you start talking guns,as long as the stop wasn't for something blatant,like running a red light right in their face.On the other hand,several of the local PD aren't really "gun savvy" and ONLY shoot when it's qualification time,I don't say much to them except answer what they ask me.Most of them only look at their firearms as something they're required to carry to have this cool job,and know very little about firearms...I think if I had decided on a Law Enforcement career I would be like the "gun nut" cop in the Police Academy movies...:D


Oh yeah-Eddie,did he show up?

possum
October 25, 2005, 11:29 AM
If i am in an area not near a military post the military I.D will get me off everytime wheather I am carrying or not. Now this dosen't mean i go looking for trouble or try to get pulled over but It works when i need it to. i don't know why it does because we are some of the worst people in the world.:)

M2 Carbine
October 25, 2005, 12:38 PM
Since I got my TX CHL I've been stopped about a dozen times by almost every kind of LEO in TX for reasons from speeding to headlights too bright.
Five of the stops, by three different officers, were in well known speed traps that only exist to get money.

In TX you (should) hand the LEO your CHL with your driver's license.
Only one time did a (local) LEO ask me what I was carrying and where it was. I think he only asked because he was interested in guns.


And I NEVER got a ticket.:confused:
The only thing I can figure is the CHL was identifying me as "one of the good guys".

The speed trap was funny after a couple stops. They would stop me in the middle of the night and we would just BS for 15 minutes.:D

Darth Ruger
October 25, 2005, 12:42 PM
...asks for my friend's ID...As he does this he sticks his head well into the Honda.That right there should have immediately told you that you were dealing with a bonehead cop. That's about the stupidest thing I've ever heard of a cop doing. Maybe he's got a death wish or something.

If he had happened to pull over a drug dealer, a wanted person, or anyone else that has no qualms about killing a cop in order to not be caught, sticking his head well into the car would have made him easy meat in the eyes of a cop killer. Doing something like that speaks volumes about the quality of training he's had. Then again, maybe he's had very good training and he's just really that stupid. Either way, if he keeps that up, he'll end up on the list of Darwin Awards sooner or later.

And giving a gun back to a person with a round in the chamber? Yeah, he just really is that stupid. I hope he has a good life insurance policy for his family's sake.

EddieCoyle
October 25, 2005, 12:44 PM
...I think if I had decided on a Law Enforcement career I would be like the "gun nut" cop in the Police Academy movies...:D


Oh yeah-Eddie,did he show up?


The gun nut cop was named Tackleberry. I almost used it as a screen name.

Nope, he didn't show up.

Ryder
October 25, 2005, 01:00 PM
Good job on the informing UT. Most of the time around here they just hand back my CPL with an "I don't need that" comment, but it is the law. Not a serious violation but who needs the hassle.

You do know Flint is now touted as the second most dangerous city in the country right now on a per capita basis? Can't help but wonder why that city qualifies as an option for anything. I rarely pass through on the interstate and even that gets my adrenaline up.

crofrog
October 25, 2005, 02:47 PM
Really it sounds like you guys need to get a radar dector...

Chris

Ukraine Train
October 25, 2005, 03:53 PM
Yeah, Flint is a dump. I'm always on my toes. Last fall I circulated a petition to allow CCW on campus in accordance with state law and boy did I make some administrators mad lol. Last week there were three freshman robbed at gunpoint by the dorm, what a way to kick off your college career lol. Off hand I know of three students, besides myself, with carry permits and a couple more that just graduated. A lot of off-campus houses keep guns for defense. I'm honestly quite surprised some perp hasn't been shot yet with all the break-ins and robberies we get around here. A guy tried to walk into my friend's house a while back but luckily on my way in he caught my attention and I locked the door. I was carrying at the time, the guy would have had one heck of a surprise if he had walked into the house.

Scott F
October 25, 2005, 04:58 PM
I live in Oregon where it is not necessary to inform an officer if you have a CCL or if you are carrying. I was involved in a forum on CCL in Oregon when this came up. Of all on the forum who had been stopped and told the officer up front none received a ticket. I have not been stopped in over 25 years but if I am I will inform the officer immediately.

JSR
October 25, 2005, 11:00 PM
Hi Scott,glad to see you found your way over here! I'v been stopped a number of times here in OR and with one exception,CHL and firearms in the vehicle were'nt a concern. A city officer told me to keep my hands outside the car window while he ran my DL #. I told him that if I was going to shoot him I wouldn't have told him that I had a gun in the car. "Well maybe,but its for my safety and yours". :rolleyes: Its still only 18 inchs from my hand,you must be feeling lucky! He was shipped out soon after,another story. The best one was on the coast after a days target practice. I was stopped on the way home and after telling the officer,yes I do have 3 firearms on my person,and about 30 more in the vehicle,we talked guns for 10 minutes or so and,"See ya later". A block or two down the road the lites came on behind me again and kind of embarrassed,he told me that he'd forgot to tell me that I had a burn't out headlight. :)

geegee
October 25, 2005, 11:17 PM
I was pulled over last week for speeding on the interstate, on my way back to DFW from West Texas. Having been through this experience before, I handed over my DL and CHL and told the DPS Trooper "Officer, I'd like to make you aware that I have a CHL and am carrying today." Then I put my hands on the steering wheel.

Five minutes later he returned with a written warning, told me to slow it down, and sent me on my way. I have never received anything less than complete professionalism and courtesy from any Texas LEO, state or local.

CAPTAIN MIKE
October 25, 2005, 11:23 PM
# 1: When carrying and driving, it's my habit to keep my license, registration, CCW permit and military ID all in a small pocket above my head in the driver's side upper visor. That way, if stopped, I don't have to reach into a back pocket to retrieve the ID, CCW permit, etc. Makes the officer less nervous.

# 2: When stopped, I calmly keep my hands at the 10 and 2 o'clock position and lower both windows when coming to a stop, presuming that the officer will be coming up on the right side (to avoid traffic danger). Since my sidearm is fairly visible on my right hip in a Yacqui holster, by keeping my hands up and only moving when the officer indicates it's okay, I lower his worry about officer safety and I'm not making any unseen or sudden moves that will make either him or his partner 'nervous'.

# 3: I never refer to my firearms as a 'GUN'. I start by stating that I am a CCW permit holder and that my "sidearm" (less threatening term) is on my right hip and then I ask the officer -- "How do you want me to proceed?" That way, the officer gets to have what he needs -- control of the situation -- and he knows that I am being compliant, and that I'm cooperating with him (or her).

My experiences this way have been positive, every time so far. Twice I have ended up in a friendly conversation comparing my Kimber CDP II 1911 to the officer's duty weapon, etc. In both of those cases I gave the officer my card and said that if he had any friends or family members who needed to renew their CCW, I'd be glad to help them. In the third instance, the officer was polite, professional and told me to look after my right rear tail light. I thanked him for stopping me and letting me know and said I appreciate him "being out here". He told me to have a nice day and sent me on my way without a ticket.

Two of these three instances took place in the People's Socialist Republic of ********** and one took place in Nevada.

Lessons learned: Cops have a right to be concerned about officer safety and we should do what we can to put them at ease in dealing with us. Also, if a CCW permit holder is polite, professional etc. about things and shows courtesy to the officer, it is more than likely going to be reciprocated.

I realize that not all officers are this way, but my 3 experiences have been good -- and I attribute that as much to my own behavior and attitude as to anything else. I hope these comments are helpful to someone else, and that if so, you can pass them along in a positive way to yet another.

possum
October 25, 2005, 11:47 PM
Also a good Yes sir no sir and acting like you have sense will do alot to get you off on a good note. taking responsibility for your actions looks good to most of them!

Phaetos
October 26, 2005, 05:40 PM
Guess cops around here in Baton Rouge,La are either stupid or wierd. They ask you to get out of your car and meet them between vehicles, facing those damn blinding lights so you can't see their face(if it's at night), and no matter WHAT the weather is, you get out. Stupid to me.

Valkman
October 26, 2005, 05:53 PM
Some cops are cool about it - earlier this year we took off for Arizona and stupidly I went over the Hoover Dam. There a cop told me to pull over for inspection because I have a tonneau cover on my truck. So I go over to where a cop is standing and open the cover for him. Now, there's 2 big suitcases that could have anything in them, but they don't even want to know what's in them. Ok. But the wind is blowing my shirt around and the officer says "Sir are you carrying a weapon?". I said "Yes I am" and he asked if I had a permit. I got it out and showed it and then he wanted to BS for a while! I told him I was a knifemaker and he liked that - it was neat but weird. :) I guess it's pretty boring standing there all day.

owsi26
October 27, 2005, 10:12 AM
I got pulled over once for a license plate light that was out. (The cop must have been bored that night.) I showed him my license and right next to my license is my CCW permit in case I forget to mention it.

He saw it and asked if I had any guns in the car. I said: "Yes, I have .45 on the back seat, along with an AR-15, another .45 under my seat, and a .45 on the passenger seat." (I had been shooting.)

He was looking a bit concerned so I told him I was a private detective. Somehow that always assures them even though we have the right to carry what we wish. He almost let me go then even before my license had been run.

All came back fine and he let me go. As I drove off, I realized that I forgot to tell him about the .380 on my left ankle! And I had been standing by the car right next to him. Once I bent down to tie a shoe still forgetting about the ankle gun. If I was a bad guy I would have had the drop on him. They don't pay cops enough.

Oh, his last name was Outlaw! Officer Outlaw.

Sportcat
October 27, 2005, 10:51 AM
I got pulled a few weeks ago comming FROM the range and heading out to the woods to workk on deer stands. Needless to say I had two rifles in the back seat of my truck and my glock on my hip.

I never saw the highay patrolman.....

He lit me up and I was pulled over before he got turned around. I cut the truck off and lowered the window and just kept my hands on the steering wheel.

Told him right away I was carrying.... he was like "cool"

He saw I had a HP sticker on my truck.... "who do you know in the HP" he asked.....

"Uh, my father-in-law" :rolleyes:

"Whats his name"

I told him..... he was like "I don't know him"..... "slow it down"

:D

I take it you had time to turn the tv off in the dash of your truck???:D

GRB
October 27, 2005, 11:28 AM
Guess cops around here in Baton Rouge,La are either stupid or wierd. They ask you to get out of your car and meet them between vehicles, facing those damn blinding lights so you can't see their face(if it's at night), and no matter WHAT the weather is, you get out. Stupid to me. So why are the cops being either stupid or weird? Sounds to me like this type of stop is a bit closer to a felony stop than is usual but maybe that is for officer safety. They want you out of the car therefore, they can see you better, check you visially for weapons, have you unable to run them down with the car, and so forth. Those blinding lights do serve a purpose toward officer saftey too, you sort of already mentioned it "so you can't see..." No it is not because they do not want you to see their face, it is becuase they want you not to be able to see very well at all in the event you pull a weapon and try to shoot them.

Whenever they make a stop, they face the unknown. Better them being safe than their grieving family being sorry.

best regards,
Glenn B

Harry Stone
October 27, 2005, 01:02 PM
Years ago I was driving to a girlfriend's house after shooting at an indoor pistol range. I was hit (after he hit another car) by a kid while I was sitting at a stoplight. The cops show up, and I was told to pull into the parking lot of a KFC next to the intersection. I asked the cop if he would need to get inside my truck. He told he wouldn't have needed to until I asked him that, and what's inside your truck, anyway? I told him I just left the range and there was now empty cases spilled all over my truck and I have a gun in there. I handed him my license and carry permit. He had me wait by his car. He got the report filled out and I waited for quite a while there by his car. He came back to me and asked me what I had in the truck. I told him a Ruger .44 magnum. He asked if it was loaded, I said no. We walk over to my truck, and he asks me if he can see it. This is during rush hour and we're standing in this parking lot on the corner of this busy intersection. I take the gun out of the truck and hand it to him with the cylinder out. He takes it and closes the cylinder and says something along the lines of "this thing is pretty cool" and asks me how it shoots. I tell him it shoots great and it's a lot of fun. He must have forgotten that he had his lights on, he's standing there in uniform with a .44 magnum in his hands and he lines up the sights of my Redhawk at the ground some distance away from him. Immediately thereafter we both hear the screech of tires as two different drivers lock up their brakes on the street behind us. He gets a goofy smile on his face and says, "nice gun". He gave it back to me and we both left.

MikeIsaj
October 27, 2005, 01:22 PM
I don't understand one thing. It has been fifteen years since I've been stopped (said I was speding, I was). In that time I've put about 300,000miles on the road and never been stopped! Am I a very good driver, or are you all just really bad drivers?

hkmp5g17
October 27, 2005, 02:43 PM
I don't understand one thing. It has been fifteen years since I've been stopped (said I was speding, I was). In that time I've put about 300,000miles on the road and never been stopped! Am I a very good driver, or are you all just really bad drivers?


:mad: I rather resent the preceding insinuation. In my case-We were pulled over (in my opinion ) because of the appearance of our vehicle- and it's driver- a young Latino male. We were driving a modified Honda Civic "Euro" -vehicles which are often targeted by the police.

Neither of us races nor do we condone such reckless behavior. We were well under the speed limit and obeying all traffic laws. The officer turned on his lights before we passed him ( he was on the shoulder) pulled behind us and claimed our break lights were out-
They were not.

There would have been no way for him to ascertain this since he initiated his pursuit before we passed.

Many people are pulled over because of appearance, location, race gender, etc.

While it is a small percentage of the police doing this it certainly taints the public's perception.

I have been pulled over numerous times for such reasons- and have never knowingly violated traffic ordinances.

I'm sure this is the case for a large percent of those reading.

Your presumption that the driving habits of the previous authors were sub-par is without basis in reality. It is also insulting.

Words often offend- whether intentional or not- and I believe an apology (or retraction) is in order.

Kind regards-Anthony

PokerPro
October 27, 2005, 03:52 PM
Ukraine Train, I would be willing to guess that the officer ran your plate before he turned on his lights or was in the process of doing it when he turned on his lights and so by the time he got to you, he knew to whom the car was registered, that that person was not wanted, and that the car wasn't reported stolen. Once he had your ID and your name matched the information from the plate check, he had no real reason to go back and do it all over again.

hkmp5g17, what are the laws in your state? I take it from some of your other posts that you are in Colorado. I take it that you don't have a permit, hence why you had the gun in the open. I see where a person with a CCW permit does not have to notify law enforcement about carrying when stopped by law enforcement, but I could not find anything that says you have to notify law enforcement when open carrying in a vehicle.

In Texas with a CHL, if you are a passenger in a vehicle stopped for some traffic issue or whatever, the passenger does not have to inform the officer about having a permit and carrying a gun at that time unless the officer addresses the passenger as part of the stop.

So, in Colorado, do you have to disclose that you have a gun if you are a passenger in a car stopped by an officer? I am still trying to figure out the reasoning behind your emphatic attempts to tell the officer, even to the point of disobeying his directive to keep quiet.

I also don't see you shock about the gun being returned to you with a round in the chamber. He simply returned the gun to you in the same manner as he took it back to his car.

But why did he take the "clip" out if his intentions weren't to make the gun "safe" ?

Cosmoline
October 27, 2005, 04:00 PM
I don't understand one thing. It has been fifteen years since I've been stopped (said I was speding, I was). In that time I've put about 300,000miles on the road and never been stopped! Am I a very good driver, or are you all just really bad drivers?

I've noticed a dramatic increase in the number of times I've been pulled over in the past three years as opposed to the '90's. There seems to be some push or effort among LEOs to do more and more pretense stops. Some bright boy has decided that's the way to catch the bad guys. All I know is getting pulled over once every other week and asked for "zee papers" for no good reason is making me feel like I'm living in a police state. Indeed the *only* things they've zinged me on for the past few years are paperwork violations, which is increasingly easy to do as they impose more and more paperwork requirements on drivers. The only actual speeding ticket I got was on my bike.

Phaetos
October 27, 2005, 04:45 PM
So why are the cops being either stupid or weird? Sounds to me like this type of stop is a bit closer to a felony stop than is usual but maybe that is for officer safety. They want you out of the car therefore, they can see you better, check you visially for weapons, have you unable to run them down with the car, and so forth. Those blinding lights do serve a purpose toward officer saftey too, you sort of already mentioned it "so you can't see..." No it is not because they do not want you to see their face, it is becuase they want you not to be able to see very well at all in the event you pull a weapon and try to shoot them.

Whenever they make a stop, they face the unknown. Better them being safe than their grieving family being sorry.

best regards,
Glenn B

I understand all that, there was a hint of sarcasm in my post. Guess it didn't all ooze out enought :rolleyes: I just always thought it was strange to me.

ruger270man
October 28, 2005, 12:47 AM
well obviously it was the cops intention to unload the gun, if he asked how to take out the "clip" :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

sam59
October 31, 2005, 02:44 AM
I see alot of post (not all) about the dumb cop did this and that blah blah blah. Then they are all lumped together. Well how about stupid civilians, lets bag on them for awhile.

Officer I am carrying a gun and here it is (pointed muzzle first at the cop) whaaaa he slammed me for no reason.

Officer stops vehicle, driver gets out and walks fast toward the cruiser. whaaa he pepper sprayed me for no reason.

Dumbass walks toward Officer with BB gun rifle, Officer points Glock at DA and informs him he will reach room temperature shortly if he doesnt put down the rifle. DA argues it's only a BB gun and after a short tense discussion puts down the rifle. Whaaaa he pointed his gun at me.

Why did you pull me over, shouldnt you be catching dangerous people. As if a 4000 pound missle driven like a maniac with a cell phone stuck in ear, short skirt, no panties and low cut..... wait a minute that was something else. Whaaa he gave me a ticket.

All true- except for the no panties. It was a thong!

Mtnvalley
October 31, 2005, 02:10 PM
As a new CCW applicant who thought he had his planned approach (for a stop) down before carry class, I'm reading this thread with some interest.

For 30+ years, I've always put my hands on the left side of the steering wheel when stopped, whether day or night. My plan was to immediately tell any LEO who stops me that I'm carrying...but the cop "teaching" my CCW class said that might not be a great idea (around here) since informing them is optional.

He said that if it's a common traffic stop, some officers from one local PD will give you the full on-your-knees, hands-on-head patdown if you tell them you're licensed and carrying...so it might be best to not volunteer that info unless asked, and perhaps they won't even ask. (I made sure that I didn't misunderstand him, as I couldn't believe that a LEO would suggest this).

To my understanding, TN flags your DL number with notation that you have a CCW...so I'd think that the LEO would rather hear it from me early on than learn that info over the radio before he reapproaches me. It just seems to me that "failure to communicate" could theoretically create at worst a situation that all would regret later...or at best some extra and unwarranted stress for one or both parties.

Had it not been a local LEO of 30 yrs service telling me this, I'd dismiss the idea a lot more readily; however, I think I'm just going to stick to plan, inform the LEO very early on, and deal with the chance of folks I know driving by and seeing me "assuming the position" for no good reason. Embarrassment heals quicker than holes, and the instructor may have formed his opinion based upon a relative few "incomplete" reports from former students who had been given The Treatment by this particular PD (while neglecting to tell the instructor of "other factors" about the stop).

AVESguy
October 31, 2005, 03:02 PM
I was wondering the same thing as MikeIsaj . I've been stopped once in the last 20 years, and that was in 1985, on a country road near Davis, Ca. for passing illegally (I did get the ticket). I've lived in California, Maryland, and Florida since and haven't been stopped once. I believe in John Farnam's philosophy of trying to be invisible in public and not standing out, for defensive purposes. It seems to work, as that was the last time I was pulled over. I drive about 15, 000 miles a year, at least, that's 300,000 miles since my last traffic stop.

Why do some people get pulled over all the time, and if they do maybe they should change their vehicle/appearance/driving style? I've never been comfortable with the idea of driving a flashy car, here in S Florida I think it makes you a target- of police AND people with bad intentions.

I know that now that I have posted this I will get pulled over within 24 hours....!!!!

Ukraine Train
October 31, 2005, 03:59 PM
Funny story... so I just got pulled over again. This time I was asking for it, though lol (speeding). It was a MI state cop this time. After I informed him I was carrying he had me step out of the car, put my hands on the roof, and he disarmed me. He took it back the cruiser while writing my ticket then brought it back to me unloaded with the slide locked back.

M99M12
October 31, 2005, 04:44 PM
Any Vermont tips. I ain't been pulled over since I was 20. I figured that I'll just keep quiet. Unless I gotta get out of the vehicle.

Byron Quick
October 31, 2005, 05:23 PM
Over my lifetime I've been stopped a right good bit. I've got leadfoot disorder. I've always been armed. It's never been a problem. No requirement to inform officers in Georgia, so I don't. However, as an officer approaches my vehicle, I don't have my hands on the steering wheel unless it's raining. I have them dangling out of the driver's window while holding my license. I don't want him nervous in any degree. Once, after dropping my wallet, my carry gun was exposed when I bent over to pick it up. The trooper asked if I had a permit. I showed it to him and we talked about guns for about a half hour.

I've also been stopped while carrying a backseat full of longarms which the cop wanted to take during the stop. The cops didn't know how to clear the weapons and I got covered with muzzles every single time. With the cop's finger on the trigger. Maybe cops utilize safe gun handling with their peers and not with citizens on a roadside. Based on my personal experience, it's a wonder there are not dead cops lying everywhere-shot by their colleagues by accident.

I've protested officers covering me with the muzzles of my weapons during a stop. I've received giggles in reply. And wisecracks such as,"Boy, don't you know to unload your rifles?"

I've hunted and shot with police officers whose gun safety skills surpass my own. I've never had an officer who wanted to hold my guns during a traffic stop whose gun safety even reached adequate.

Ryder
November 1, 2005, 09:47 PM
so I just got pulled over again

It would seem something is going on. I guess the govenor has decided to step up involuntary fund raising contributions. Cops are definately on the warpath. I even heard radio commentators decrying this unusual group feeding frenzy the other day.

The Michigan Department of Treasury sent my youngest kid a letter a few days ago telling him to pay them money if he wanted to keep driving. Seems he has accumulated a few points on his license (got a ticket for getting stuck in a driveway that wasn't shoveled last Winter). He's not enough of a problem for the Department of Motorvehicles to take any action though. They've invented a new law for punishing people beyond paying their tickets. Mo money Mo money Mo money! Just incredible.

Sistema1927
November 2, 2005, 07:32 PM
He saw my out of state license and asked what I was doing in MI and I explained. He asked if my school knew I had a CCW....

I am surprised that he didn't say (with a German accent): "Papers,please."

Sounds like this cop ought to take a refresher course on the Bill of Rights. Since when do we need police approval to travel to other states?

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