Could a bullet jacket be made from plastic?

[FW]

I was thinking.

Could a bullet jacket be made from plastic instead of copper (or other metal)?

It seems it would cost less, prevent fouling, and be corrosion resistant. The weight difference could be negligable.

Some obvious concerns would be things like temperature resistance and durability.

Maybe it wouldn't work well at really high velocities, but usual handgun velocities might be okay. Sabots are made of plastic and work.

I have heard of plastic bullets for training purposes (that are really light). So how about a plastic jacketed lead bullet or maybe a lead cored plastic bullet?

[Lupinus]

not sure but that is a good question. Thing is plastic is generaly soft and when it heats is gummy stuff...plus melting plastic gives off some pretty nasty vapors and could indeed cause fouling.

Im sure if someone found the right formula it might work. Thing is though plastics nature could very well prevent it from doing a jackets primary job of giving better penitration since it isn't as hard yet giving like metal is. Metal bends while plastic just snaps.

I have seen some things though that talk about plastics and other stuff actually being considered for bullet cores to replace the lead.

[Krenn]

I expect that ceramic or plastic car engines will occur before bullet cartidges. more demand, more available weight and volume, less catastrophic failures....

[KriegHund]

Ceramics the material of the future....

[Gunpacker]

They have made jackets from nylon for pistol ammo, and also from teflon which produced the "armor piercing" handgun ammo. The nylon coated projectiles were called Nyclad I believe, and don't know if they are around still. The actual purpose was to reduce the breakup of the lead core, and reduce lead pollution in indoor ranges. Jackets have been made of steel, copper, nickel and other materials. The basic purpose of the jacket for rifle ammo was to allow the bullet to be fired at higher velocity without leading the barrel. A side effect was to make a somewhat stronger projectile since the copper, steel etc. has a higher tensile strength than lead.

[RyanM]

Ceramics are way too brittle for that kind of application.

I think plastic jackets could certainly be done fairly easily. Plastic sabots, shot cups, and wads work just fine.

They have made jackets from nylon for pistol ammo, and also from teflon which produced the "armor piercing" handgun ammo. The nylon coated projectiles were called Nyclad I believe, and don't know if they are around still.

Actually, in both cases, the plastic was just a very thin coating, not a "jacket" at all. That would be like saying that wiping down a gun with oil turns it into an "oil-jacketed" gun.

[Sam]

Back in the early 80's my father and I made quite a few plastic jackets to experiment with. They worked just fine. Everything from 45 Colt to 30WCF. The term plastic covers a multitude of materiels. We tried DELRIN and 101Nylon with good sucess for jackets. Also solid plastic bullets in various cals and weights fro 10-12 different materials.
.
We also made cases from GRZ and 101 nylon that worked very well and a snap on gas check of 101N that shot well but was too difficult to load.

The pressure, heat and friction interior to firearms are something to take into consideration but are not at all outside the realm of plastics.

Probably the biggest reasons plastic cases, jackets etc haven't caught on are the psychiatric effect it has on shooters. If it ain't lead and brass they don't want it.

Sam

[Chuck Dye]

Absolutely! They are called sabots. :D See

https://www.eabco.com/reload02.html

or

http://www.knightrifles.com/catalog.aspx?catID=Sabots

or run your own search.

You might also look at Nyclad ammo.

[outofbattery]

Sure,but be prepared for bleating about it being a Cop Killer like some numbskulls got the idea that Nyclads would sail through a vest,actual performance be damned:rolleyes:

[jsalcedo]

I remember in the mid 80's all the gun rags were raving about the new plastic cased .38 special loads. They looked like mini shotgun shells.

That died off pretty quick.

I have also purchased high performance self defence ammo wih plastic bullet components.

If it can decrease the cost of ammo and they can convince folks to try it
I don't see why not.

Of course anything plastic is called tactical polymer and the price goes up
dramatically.

[Arch]

Surely you guys must get something like this over there:

http://www.rpgfirearms.com.au/WESTCASTINGS.htm

They are "dry lubed" bullets, that leave ZERO fouling in your barrel. The only fouling I get from shooting them, is from power residue.

[Puncha]

Someone told me that it's a polymer coating while others have called it teflon but what exactly is the black coating found on fiocchi 158gr LRN .38 special loads? Thier website calls it LRN GZN. What is GZN?

[Medusa]

teflon is a polymer, polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE), chemically inert; nonsolvable; has a wide field of applicable temperature, from -200 to +250, temporarily +300 degrees Celsius; has very low friction. And is hard to process, as it doesn't go to liquid state even at temps over 400 oC. So ideal coating - low friction, doesn't peel of at those extreme temps in the gun thus reducing the fouling.

that GZN might be Fiocchi's proprietary acronym.

[benEzra]

and also from teflon which produced the "armor piercing" handgun ammo.
Actually, KTW ammunition was metal piercing because it was a sharply pointed bullet made of very hard metal that wouldn't deform (steel or hardened bronze, IIRC). The Teflon coating was only to keep the hard steel bullet from wearing out the rifling of the handgun when fired; molybdenum disulfide would've worked as well.

Ceramics the material of the future....
A ceramic-jacketed bullet would wear out the barrel very, very quickly, since ceramic is harder than steel.

Actually, in both cases, the plastic was just a very thin coating, not a "jacket" at all. That would be like saying that wiping down a gun with oil turns it into an "oil-jacketed" gun.
In the case of Nyclad ammunition, the nylon case was indeed thick enough for it to be considered a true jacket. It wasn't just a coating.

[Fly320s]

There are these moly coated lead bullets: www.precisionbullets.com.

I don't know if you consider that plastic jacketed, but they work well. :)

[MachIVshooter]

The problem with an actual plastic bullet lies in the physical characteristics of most plastics; that is, they have too much memory. And the material is compromised when pushed beyond its flexibility limit. Think about what happens when you bend something made of plastic. It wants to revert back to it's original shape. When you try to bend it further, it weakens and/or breaks. Copper and lead do not do this. Both are extremely ductile and malleable and have very little memory. Plastic is just the opposite. And those plastics that do behave like soft metals tend to lack integrity. And, of course, there is the weight issue. A plastic bullet of the same size and shape of a 180 gr. .308" spitzer would weigh very little, probably less than 40 grains. Ballistic coefficient would go down the toilet. Plastic is just not a feasible material for conventional projectiles.

Now a poloymer-coated ceramic projectile could certianly find a home in anti-armor applications. lightweight, low friction and extremely high velocity. Hmmmmm.......



There are these moly coated lead bullets: www.precisionbullets.com.

I don't know if you consider that plastic jacketed, but they work well.

"Moly" is an abbreviation for Molybdenum, which is a metallic element.

[bpisler]

I've used cast bullets from bear
creek supply in waterford Ca.
They have a coating which i think
is moly but i'am not sure.Loaded
to 1300fps the 125gr 357mags left
no lead just some residue.It did
clean up great,i've also used them
in 44spl and 45 colt with great
results.

[Gewehr98]

They're .358" wadcutters, HBWC, RN, RNHP, and so forth. All are swaged or cast, with a very thick dark blue/black Nyclad coating on them. So yes, I'd wager a bullet jacked can indeed be made from plastic. ;)

[ndh87]

I've seen a .223 casing made mostly from some sort of white plastic, everything except the base or the casing was made of a frosted white looking plastic

[WT]

Guys, check your history ........... ancient history.

Plastic bullets were made in World War II and were used for training Army Air Force gunners.

________________

"Capt. Cameron Fairchild of the USAAF Gunnery School in Harlingen, Texas came up with the idea of a frangible plastic bullet. The bullet would shatter on contact with armor or canopy plexiglas. This would allow airmen to actually shoot at one another without doing any harm.

"Working with Duke and Princeton Universities and The Bakelite Plastic Co. a plastic bullet was developed. It was hard enough to take the hammering of a 30-caliber machine gun and fragile enough to crumble into fine powder upon impact. However, the bullet would penetrate 4 inches of wood and could kill an unprotected man.

"The bullet was field tested at Laredo, Texas. Gunners fired from the waist of B-17’s and B-24’s at American fighters diving at them at speeds close to 300 MPH. This simulation of battle conditions permitted the gunners to get over their “buck fever” in training, rather than in combat when the first enemy fighters came slamming through.

"Gen. H. H. Arnold noted this as one of the most outstanding USAAF accomplishments in 1944."

_________________

Plastic bullets are not new.

[Chrontius]

I was thinking.

Could a bullet jacket be made from plastic instead of copper (or other metal)?

It seems it would cost less, prevent fouling, and be corrosion resistant. The weight difference could be negligable.

Some obvious concerns would be things like temperature resistance and durability.

Maybe it wouldn't work well at really high velocities, but usual handgun velocities might be okay. Sabots are made of plastic and work.

I have heard of plastic bullets for training purposes (that are really light). So how about a plastic jacketed lead bullet or maybe a lead cored plastic bullet?


Look up nylatron bullets -- it's been done.

[KriegHund]

My turkish 8mm bullets have Cupronickel, a mixture of copper and nickel jakcets.