Just bought a very clean 1941 Garand, and it jammed


PDA






The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 09:02 PM
Admittedly, I didn't strip it and clean it. I took it right from the store to the range and loader her up. In the 40 rounds that I fired, it jammed once. The nature of the jam was that the bolt rode over the round (approximately round number four), only partially stripping it, thus causing it to be part of the way up the ramp, and the corner of the bolt face was stopped on it in the middle of the case. I just pulled it back behind it, and let it go again, and this time it fed all the way in. What caused this? Could the mag spring be too weak and need replacing, or could it be that the guide rails in the mag well need some lube, or both? What say you? Should I be concerned? Weren't these M1s supposed to be able to take all kinds of abuse and keep on working?

If you enjoyed reading about "Just bought a very clean 1941 Garand, and it jammed" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
TimH
November 7, 2005, 09:23 PM
I haven't a clue as far as you problem goes...but if you don't mind me asking how much did you pay for the rifle?

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 09:29 PM
I haven't a clue as far as you problem goes...but if you don't mind me asking how much did you pay for the rifle?$900, but it was very clean, and had a beautiful stock of highly figured walnut.

TimH
November 7, 2005, 09:34 PM
Nice. I've been looking for one in my area. I'm working on getting all my stuff together to do a CMP purchase. Sounds like you got a nice WWII era Garand

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 09:38 PM
Nice. I've been looking for one in my area. I'm working on getting all my stuff together to do a CMP purchase. Sounds like you got a nice WWII era GarandThanks. It's a real beauty. Just a little concerned about the jam, but I guess I should strip it, clean it, lube it and try again. Not really fair to judge it on how it shoots totally dry.

cracked butt
November 7, 2005, 09:57 PM
Detail strip it, clean it up good, any moving parts that are shiny from where the parkerizations has worn thin put a little grease on (except trigger/sear parts), grease the oprod track in the receiver, grease the bolt raceway in the receiver, replace the Oprod spring (these cost about $4-5 and are critical for functioning), then try it again.

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 10:00 PM
Detail strip it, clean it up good, any moving parts that are shiny from where the parkerizations has worn thin put a little grease on (except trigger/sear parts), grease the oprod track in the receiver, grease the bolt raceway in the receiver, replace the Oprod spring (these cost about $4-5 and are critical for functioning), then try it again.What's an oprod, and what's an oprod spring? Thanks. Not really familiar with the rifle yet.

JShirley
November 7, 2005, 10:01 PM
Point of order: a "jam" is a malfunction that necessitates tools to clear. You specifically had a failure to feed malfunction. (Yeah, pedantic, I know, but we might as well all be on the same page. We don't load our "clips" for our "Assault Weapons" with "bullets" either...)

John

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 10:07 PM
Point of order: a "jam" is a malfunction that necessitates tools to clear. You specifically had a failure to feed malfunction. (Yeah, pedantic, I know, but we might as well all be on the same page. We don't load our "clips" for our "Assault Weapons" with "bullets" either...)

JohnThanks. You're right. I knew it when I wrote it, but jam is so much quicker to type than failure to feed malfunction.

jefnvk
November 7, 2005, 10:10 PM
Oprod is that big long rod that the charging handel is connected to, and the oprod spring is the spring that accompanies it.

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 10:13 PM
Oprod is that big long rod that the charging handel is connected to, and the oprod spring is the spring that accompanies it.Thanks. I think I have an idea what you're talking about now, but once I strip it I'll getter a better idea. Any good illustrated stripping and reassembly instructions on the internet that you know about?

cracked butt
November 7, 2005, 10:30 PM
The oprod is the funny little lever you pull back to open the action on one end, and terminates with a gas piston in the gas cylinder on the other.
The oprod spring sits inside the tubular portion of the oprod- its about 20" long.

http://surplusrifle.com/garand/boltdisassemble/index.asp
http://surplusrifle.com/garand/rifledisassembly/index.asp
http://surplusrifle.com/garand/triggerdisassembly/index.asp
The above link shows you how to take it apart- don't take the handguards off- theire's no good reason to do this and it can cause more harm than good. Leave the gas cylinder alone too unless it feels really loose.

You probably don't need to take the trigger group apart either, but its a fun excercise and won't harm anything. The Garand is a real treat to strip and put badck together- you need virtually no tools and its an engineering marvel.

oneshooter
November 7, 2005, 10:32 PM
Try this site:http://www.garandflash.com/

Or this one:http://www.civilianmarksmanship.com/

Oneshooter
Livin in Texas

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 10:42 PM
The trigger guard on mine is different from the one in the illustrations you provided the links to. Mine has a hole in the back for putting something in to provide leverage when pulling the trigger guard up. Why the difference?

cracked butt
November 7, 2005, 10:48 PM
You have the earlier style milled trigger guard. The ones without the hole are stamped- pretty much the only difference, though some claim the stamped triggerguards lock up a bit tighter.

The Real Hawkeye
November 7, 2005, 10:55 PM
Thanks to both of you. All those sites were great. Particularly like the civilian markmanship site. Really detailed. I wish I could take a course in detail stripping it. I would love to learn how to do it like the back of my hand.

mikec
November 7, 2005, 11:17 PM
Does anyone sell a spring replacement kit for the M1? 60+ year old do cause issues now and then.

gaston_45
November 8, 2005, 12:46 AM
One other thing, if you do take out the oprod, DO NOT STRAIGHTEN IT! It's meant to be bent that way, if you straighten it it is guaranteed not to work. It sounds like it just needs a bit of grease to slow things up a bit in the bolt carrier. Those rifles like the old style grease rather than clp or oil.

30Cal
November 8, 2005, 01:30 AM
Clean it--clean the chamber with a GI chamber brush, grease it and go shoot. The oprod spring probably needs to be replaced anyways.

You forgot to mention what ammo you were shooting. Shoot surplus M2 ball or commercial 150gr FMJ equivalent and let us know how it works.

Ty

Steve in PA
November 8, 2005, 02:31 AM
For an oprod spring go to Orion7 and get one of their stainless steel, lifetime warranty springs for something like $7.00.

The jam could be from a weak spring or more than likely lack of lube.

Trebor
November 8, 2005, 02:35 AM
Go to www.odcmp.com and order their "Read This First" guide for the M-1. This is the owners manual they send with the CMP Garands and it's one of the best firearms manuals I've ever seen. It's only about $5 or so and is well worth the money.

You'll need a grease to lubricate the Garand. Either a gun grease, like the old Lubriplate or a modern grease like Tetra. Even a silicone-sythentic high temperature auto grease will work. Grease the Op-rod channel, the bolt locking lugs, and all the shiny parts where there is evidence of wear. You do have to use grease, not oil. Oil won't stay on during firing and will cause problems.

Grease the rifle and buy the book. Do both of those and you'll be much, much better off.

Enjoy your rifle.

The Real Hawkeye
November 8, 2005, 07:52 AM
Clean it--clean the chamber with a GI chamber brush, grease it and go shoot. The oprod spring probably needs to be replaced anyways.

You forgot to mention what ammo you were shooting. Shoot surplus M2 ball or commercial 150gr FMJ equivalent and let us know how it works.

TyI was shooting surplus M2 ball which came in the clips and cloth bandoleer.

ScottsGT
November 8, 2005, 08:24 AM
Check that head stamp on the ammo. If it is KA, it is Korean corrossive ammo. As soon as you get home, clean that rifle with windex to kill the corrossive components, then use the usual cleaning methods afterwards.

dk-corriveau
November 8, 2005, 08:32 AM
If you would like a video the assist in the detailed stripping of the M1, try http://www.jarheadtop.com/video.html. Jim's M1 Garand Care and Cleaning tape should cover any information you need to breakdown, clean and lub your new toy.

And where are the pictures?!

MechAg94
November 8, 2005, 10:41 AM
One other thing, if you do take out the oprod, DO NOT STRAIGHTEN IT! It's meant to be bent that way, if you straighten it it is guaranteed not to work.
Gaston, what kind of bend are you talking about? I had a bent op rod on 2nd hand M1 a while back. It was rubbing on the inside of the charging handle piece. Just curious. I replaced it with another rod, I didn't try to straighten it. I thought I compared it to the M1 I recently got from the CMP, but I'll have to double check.

MechAg94
November 8, 2005, 10:44 AM
One other problem I have had was a few clips that were out of spec as best I can tell. I have 3 clips that are longer across the bottom by a 1/16 of an inch or so. It was just enough to cause problems apparently. Feeding works fine with all my other clips, but not those three. I don't know the origin of the clips and they each had different headstamps. I have quarantined them, but I haven't thrown them away yet.

Khornet
November 8, 2005, 12:50 PM
that if your oprod spring were worn, it would let the bolt and rod go all the way rearward so that when they returned the bolt would strike the casehead properly and you wouldn't get a bolt-over misfeed.

But if your gas cylinder or oprod piston or both are worn out of spec, rearward thrust on bolt and rod will be too low and will be unable to fully compress the oprod spring. Bolt will go back far enough to eject, since the empty is shorter than the live round, but not go past the head of the next case.

If the oprod spring is too strong, same thing.

'course, upward pressure on the follower comes from the oprod spring, but again if the spring were too weak I'd expect it to show up in the first couple of rounds when all are wedged in the clip pretty tightly, not round four by which time they are all pretty loose.

monsternav
November 8, 2005, 02:22 PM
Were you shooting off of a bench? I have had this problem before, but only when shooting off the bench. Off-hand/kneeling/sitting/prone and I have never had a problem.

The Real Hawkeye
November 8, 2005, 03:40 PM
Were you shooting off of a bench? I have had this problem before, but only when shooting off the bench. Off-hand/kneeling/sitting/prone and I have never had a problem.I happen to have been prone when it happened. Off bench was not a problem.

The Real Hawkeye
November 8, 2005, 03:50 PM
And where are the pictures?!Here it is.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=30963&d=1131482995

If you enjoyed reading about "Just bought a very clean 1941 Garand, and it jammed" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!