Guns as a hobby, not a weapon


April 1, 2003, 08:17 PM
I am a gun enthusiast. You'll find me drawing pictures of them in my spare time, and I stop by the magazine section of my grocery shop and glance through the gun magazines. However, though I have been known to swat at a fly or two from time to time, the idea of shooting another human, or even an animal, holds no appeal to me at all. Although I lock my car doors at night, I do not keep a loaded gun in my room, nor do I have supplies of tinfoil hats in my dest drawer. So, how is it that I am able to enjoy guns? After all, Sarah Brady and other gun control advocates would have us belive that most gun enthusiasts would jump at an opportunity to fight back with full force, right? Wrong. Whenever a person like Sarah Brady sees a gun, she sees a weapon, created for the sole purpose of murdering people. However, when I see a gun, I see a mystique tool used to defend lives, an opportunity for me to escape the petty stressful routines of life. I see, a hobby.

Sure, guns are loud- but so are rock concerts. Sure, guns are dangerous- but so are drunken drivers. Sure, guns fire bullets- but those very bullets can be used to save lives.

So, even if Sarah Brady shuffles me under her inaccurate streotypes of gun enthusiasts, shooting guns is one hobby I am not prepared to give up.
1. What did you think of my writing? (I feel like it lacked a central point- feels empty, but yet, it was completely spontanious, so it lacked planning)
2. What is your view on guns as a hobby? Should guns be categorized under a hobby or is it something which reaches beyond just "hobby"?

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April 1, 2003, 08:26 PM
How about a hobby that also has the added utility of the capacity to save your rear?

Of course, your writing also faintly hints at some strange satisfaction at your keeping your firearms in a state of unreadiness. (loaded gun=tinfoil hat)

After all, Sarah Brady and other gun control advocates would have us belive that most gun enthusiasts would jump at an opportunity to fight back with full force, right? Wrong.

Sarah might have gotten this one right. My personal belief is that you have a moral obligation to "fight back."

You don't? Not terribly uncommon, BUT:

Darwin is waiting at the back of your (public school, betcha!) class to have a word with you.

Don Gwinn
April 1, 2003, 08:28 PM
Whatever. My guns are weapons. No offense, but I find it a little silly to say "my gun is not a weapon because I've never shot anyone with it." I suppose dad's M16 wasn't a weapon; he never shot anyone the entire time he was in the service, nor did he carry it into combat.

If guns are your hobby, then your hobby involves weapons. Better to come to terms with that reality than to pretend it's otherwise.

April 1, 2003, 08:29 PM
none of us relish the thought of having to use deadly force on anyone. our firearms are our last resort in defending human life.

April 1, 2003, 08:32 PM
Thumper, perhaps I should have clarified. I was trying to say that not all gun enthusiasts have trigger happy fingers and will jump at ANY chance to kill a person. If someone insulted you in public, would you get out your carry weapon and shoot them? What is kids were toilet papering your house? That's what I meant

Don- Good point.

April 1, 2003, 08:35 PM
I generally consider my Swedish Mauser and 1860 Army revolvers to be toys for my shooting hobby, while my scout, Daewoo, and 1911 are weapons. But those categories can (and do) change easily depending on how I'm using them at any given time. Guns are both serious weapons and fun toys. No reason for them to be mutually exclusive...

April 1, 2003, 08:36 PM
Guns are both serious weapons and fun toys. No reason for them to be mutually exclusive

Zactly...though in your current environment, Yohan, "serious weapons" may have been so demonized that you are having a hard time reconciling the two. Understandable, I suppose...

April 1, 2003, 08:40 PM
What are you talking about? When did I ever talk about "serious weapons?" and "toys"? All guns are dangerous, but I'm just trying to say that not all gun owners are trigger happy maniacs sitting in the front porch with a shot gun in hand waiting for an opportunity to kill someone. I'm starting to get an idea that maybe I was wrong :rolleyes:

April 1, 2003, 08:44 PM
Yohan, are you submitting this for class?

1. I think it's a good body but needs a thesis and conclusion. Start by saying that guns are your hobby as your thesis (if that's your point), and conclude that while firearms are weapons, they are perfectly acceptable as a hobby, also (again, if that is your point).

2. Mine started as a hobby, but I have them for defense, and have both ready. I see it as a martial art. Sure, it involves weapons, but so does swordfighting and that's accepted as a martial art. I think it's perfectly acceptable to have guns for sporting only, but would be careful with dividing yourself from other gun owners lest folks you are arguing against think you would agree with 'reasonable' legislation to ban non-sporting weapons.

I use combat firearms for sport--steel matches, 3-gun matches, etc., where if you use a hunting guns, you're screwed.

I'd change the 'drunk driver' thing. A drunk driver is a negligent human, a gun is not. I'd compare a gun more to a screwdriver or a football. I'm careful to avoid comparing firearms to cars, if you do, you better practice your 'gun registration' debate licks.

April 1, 2003, 08:45 PM
I was quoting Ian, again.

I did come off as pretty condescending, though...sorry. regards to the "trigger happy" bit: No one here wants to have to fire at anyone, but there is absolutely such a thing as a righteous killing.

Righteous=good (Just so there's no misunderstanding.)

April 1, 2003, 08:47 PM
Ah, finally- non-igorant and tactical critism I was looking for. Yes, I'm trying to evolve this into an editorial for my school newspaper, to try and disperse the idea that gun owners are trigger happy maniacs (THM). Thanks for the suggestions.

True. (nuff said)

Don Gwinn
April 1, 2003, 08:51 PM
Yohan, slow down and think this through. No one said they wanted to shoot people or anything of the sort. Admitting that a weapon is a weapon doesn't have anything to do with the desire to hurt someone.

We just think that claiming a weapon is not a weapon if you use it for fun is sophistry. It's a word game.

And let's face it; if your intent was to point out that "not all gun owners are trigger-happy and want to shoot people" then you took the long way around the barn. You did not address that point at all; instead, you wrote about what you believe constitutes the difference between a weapon and a "hobby." The two aren't related.

Standing Wolf
April 1, 2003, 08:53 PM
I took my new 1968 Browning Medalist to the range today. Bullseye target shooting is a hobby I've enjoyed for quite a few years, and every bit as much now that I'm too old to shoot competitively as years ago.

I was packing a concealed .357 magnum revolver the whole while. It's not a match pistol, and I carry it to protect my life and property, not indulge myself in a difficult, time- and money-consuming pastime.

There's a lot of overlap; as well, there are plenty of distinctions.

April 1, 2003, 08:56 PM
Yohan, also, I'd be VERY careful to try to play the good guy by giving the 'hobby' disclaimer. I used to do it, but backfires, because they think you would be for "reasonable" limits to your rights.

If I were you, I'd think about promoting firearms as something of a martial art. Punching, kicking etc and other forms of chopsockey are harmful and people die from it EVERY DAY. Yet good, disciplined, decent guys and gals practice it every day. Why? To build character, learn to defend oneself, have fun, compete, etc. Same reason why I practice and compete with my guns.

Heck. I am very non-competitive. I like to win WITH people better than I like winning against people. I suck at sparring because I don't like hurting my friends. When people complement me that they really like my CD, I get kinda sheepish. I learned to accept that I'm very passive. I've never gotten into a fight. Not even in high school or junior high while in Los Angeles and everyone picks on me. I don't even like hurting people that I don't like. It's just the way I'm wired.

But why do I shoot, train, shoot more, compete, and train some more? Because it builds character, and heck, I hope I don't need it some day, but like martial arts, it's a nice skill to have around and instead of waiting for the next guy to break in and steal my roommate's VCR, I can get trophies for my efforts. My biggest kick is doing better than myself last month.

April 1, 2003, 08:57 PM
perhaps the title of this thread confused you on my real intentions. I'm trying to say that there are people who enjoy shooting guns as a hobby, I agree with your point that guns are weapons- but when I shoot at non-reactive paper targets, I'm shooting guns for fun, not to train how to take out someone effectively, ok? I think that further discussion should be done through PM. :)


April 1, 2003, 09:11 PM
Sure firearms can be a hobby. And, I hope I never have to use mine on another human being, but under a very specific set of circumstances I would.

Then again, possession of firearms (and similiar) are protected by specific parts on the Constitution. They are far, far more than a hobby and the laws and society respect that fact.

They may be the tools of a hobby but the are also the tools of self defense and, in cases, survival. In honestly, and in the US, they are the tools of freedom far more than are they the tools of oppression.


April 1, 2003, 09:37 PM
My guns are many things to me.

They are:

1) Fine works of art, constructed of metal and wood (and that plastic one by Stoner may even qualify).

2) A tangible link to my Father, Grandfather and Great Grandfather.

3) A link to historical times and conflicts.

4) Tranportation to a time and place in the past; a meadow, a sunrise, a dark wood, a deep snow.

5) Tools to harvest game.

6) Tools to protect myself and family from those who have no conscience or social morals.

7) Objects that demand repect and responsibility in their use.

8) An enjoyable hobby.

April 1, 2003, 09:39 PM
Why do we like sports cars? No-one I know drives them at 9/10ths in 4-wheel drifts on Alpine roads.

Why do we like Macho 4x4s? No-one I know has driven one across Mongolia or the Serengeti?

Why do we play golf when we know we won't be making Millions at the next Masters?

Why ask why?:confused:

April 2, 2003, 12:31 AM
How about guns as a martial art? Proper handling and accurate shooting require dedication, self control/analysis and all the discipline of any Asian derived artform. Is my shooting any less a sport or artform because I do "double taps", "Bill Drill", "Mozambique" or just squint and squeeze? Maybe it isn't much of an artform when I do it, but the desire is there!

Don't ignore the political streak to guns. Empowerment of the commonest plebian. An armed man is a free man and for many an acknowledgement of a level of civil responsibility akin to voting.

Don Gwinn
April 2, 2003, 11:29 AM
I'm not sure why we'd go to PM. If I have offended you, I apologize. I understand quite well what you intended to say; I'm just pointing out that I don't think what you intended to say is what came across.

April 2, 2003, 12:53 PM
yohan, your point does lack direction. it fails to address that there are circumstances in which deadly force is necessary. for example to defend against an attacker who intends to harm you or someone else. or on a pitbull that is attacking you.

your short 'essay' also seems to cave in to the antis argument that there is no 'legitimate need' for firearms. i've argued with the mental midgets at micheal moores website in months past where they claimed that 'no one needs to hunt, all your food sources can be bought at the store'. perhaps you dont like the thought of hunting. many here do hunt to put food in the freezer and avoid buying meat at the supermarket that has been processed, loaded with chemicals and drugs and handled by god knows how many unclean hands.

your essay should acknowledge that there are more legitimate uses for firearms than most people think. you can target shoot, compete for prizes in competitions, prepare for defending your home and family, hunting to provide food, and of course, the pure joy of making a hole in a paper target over and over again.

point out the skills necessary and responsibility required in order to be successful in all those aspects. paint the picture that gun enthusiasts like yourself are not the irresponsible rednecks that go out with a case of beer and hunt anything that moves.
"oh my god, its coming right at us!"

a more constructive criticism from me would be that i wouldnt include that you draw guns. to me, that sounds like an obsession. i think about firearms a lot myself, read tons of gunrags, and spend way too much time on this forum researching the knowledge of thousands of others far more experienced than i am.

oh yeah, one more thing, you should also paint into the essay how the politics of the 2nd amendment is also one of your concerns. how the fight to stop infringements on the RKBA deeply interests you. this will make it easier for antis to accept, if they see a responsible young person active in the political realm who knows what they are talking about.

April 2, 2003, 01:45 PM
Given that many of your audience do have loaded weapons in their home, equating doing so with the "tinfoil hat" brigade is not only insulting, but potentially fatal to your argument. After all, if people read insults like that, they are less likely to read anything you ever write again. How can you get your point across then?

April 2, 2003, 11:15 PM
I appriciate all of your constructive criticisms! I'll try and write a piece every now and then and maybe I'll be able to track progress! :D Thanks.

April 3, 2003, 08:02 AM
Skunk, I completely agree with you. Shooting is indeed a martial art in a league of it's own.

Certainly, it doesn't require the strength that some of the others do, but it damned sure requires the discipline.

April 3, 2003, 09:40 AM
Guns are weapons. Deal with it. :D

April 3, 2003, 10:42 AM
for my grandfather a gun was a way of putting food on the table when he was younger in southern Indiana but after the big wars his ability of putting food on the table was no longer an issue when he moved to the city ( Indianapolis ) so he turned it into a hoby by shooting clays and skeet . so from going o a weapon to a hobby is present . also Yohan not to be a :cuss: hole . Don Gwinn is a teacher ,so He could help you in many ways as he is on our side and can give you pointers for good writting skills on trying to prove a point .

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