Is Springfield Armory now using ballistic fingerprinting?


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emc
April 2, 2003, 04:50 PM
I just purchased an XD40 to accompany my XD9. As I was going through the various odds and ends in the case while at the gun shop, I noticed an envelope, which the sales clerk stated contained a spent case. I can't see any reason for this, other than ballistic fingerprinting. However, it was my understanding that Springfield has stated that they will not be doing this. Any thoughts or comments on this?

Thanks,

emc

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243_shooter
April 2, 2003, 05:02 PM
They will if they want to sell a gun in NY.

All handguns (new) that are sold in the state either need;

1) a fired case in a sealed container from the manufacturer

-or-

2) be carted off to the State Police so they can test fire the gun and obtain a fired cartridge.

Why you ask? To be entered into the states ballistic database. <sigh>

I believe there is some type of penalyy / issue regarding makers who ship handguns to NY without providing the fired case but I'm not 100% sure on this. I do remember reading that Ruger was including a fired case with all new handguns to avoid accidentaly being in violation of state laws (I can only assume this refers to NY?).??

Leo

hardcorehunter5
April 2, 2003, 07:16 PM
I have a xd9 and ther eis a spent round there also. Also included was a three shot target. I was under the impression that it was just a verification that the firearm has been shot. I also thought that the ballistic fingerprint was pretty much a pipe dream, considering the network that would have to be maintained for every pistol made and sold in the U.S. Doesn't seem very practical to me. That also means that every round fired would have to be recovered, then recorded for record. All that would have to be done before the gun could be shipped from the manu. The case would not really do any thing for fingerprinting, because extractor claw and firing pin marks would be to easy to modify. BUt who knows what lengths the gov will got to. Most guns purchased legally don't commit crimes anyway. With that said once a gun was stolen the fingerprint would be worthless, because the person registered to that fingerprint no-longer has the weapon,

tomr8368
April 2, 2003, 07:24 PM
The Springfields at the gun shops around Plano, TX have spent shells too. Seems about all the gun mgf. are doing it. ...
Tom:fire:

10-Ring
April 2, 2003, 09:42 PM
Alot of new handguns have a spent casing in order to be sold in certain states that require them...:banghead: I've niether heard or read anything about ballistic fingerprinting & SA

railroader
April 3, 2003, 02:14 AM
http://www.hs2000talk.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=002696#000000 Here's your answer. Mark

rbaker
April 4, 2003, 11:05 AM
It seems like such a waist of time to me. I have 3 barrels for my glock 31 - 375 sig, 40 s&w, and 9 mm, if they ballistic fingerprint the original barrel what about the other 2? I would also think that after the 1300 round I have sent through the original barrel that it would have changed a bit, brush mark from cleaning and so on. I mean the fact they are doing it to the pistols really doesn't bother me just seams a waist of time. If I had to shoot someone with my pistol they would have my pistol long before the check the ballistic fingerprinting and most criminals don't usually shoot people with pistols they go out and buy.

Calanctus
April 4, 2003, 12:56 PM
The whole point with ballistic fingerprinting isn't that it's useful in solving crime, but that it's another hoop and expense for the law-abiding to jump through. Maryland requires a shell casing for all handguns, and are trying to expand that to ALL guns with a bill currently proposed in the legislature. After ~6 million dollars spent, how many crimes have been solved using the system? None. There were 3 matches, which if I recall correctly, came from guns stolen from a dealer to begin with. Good luck with the chain of custody on matching those shells up in court....

dan_s
April 4, 2003, 02:07 PM
Doubt it.. remember the manufacturers do not do the actual "fingerprinting". Is is the Gestapo of a very select few states that must be given the case by the dealer..

Zundfolge
April 4, 2003, 02:37 PM
The real purpose for "ballistic fingerprinting" is because it won't work without gun registration. (I contend it won't work then either, but none of these gun laws are designed to do what they say ... only to control the law abiding).

They want to spend tons of money implementing this "ballistic fingerprinting" nonsense so that they can claim that to justify the expense we'll also need gun registration.

Its just one of those "camel's nose" things.

:fire:

Island Beretta
April 5, 2003, 07:29 AM
Unfortunately, once again, it is the law abiding who suffers, it is the law abiding who is the easy target, it is the law abiding who pays, it is the law abiding who is inconvenienced!!- this happens both ways-from the state and from the criminals!!:confused:

In addition, these administrators have to keep themselves in a job, so anything that pops up is jumped on even when it makes no sense, and then they try to BS us with rhyme and reason!!:fire: :fire:

Ledbetter
April 7, 2003, 03:07 PM
I just bought a brand new Ruger single six .22.

Came with a spent .22 cartridge is a sealed envelope and a list of the states that required it. Yes, a spent .22 case. I'm sure after five thousand rounds or so the cases will still look exactly the same:barf:

Sign of the times.

tomr8368
April 7, 2003, 05:27 PM
Ledbetter...which states are they?
Seems about ever gun comes with one now regardless of where it is sold. Its just another "registration" system for lawabiding folks so someday fat Rosie can get your gun.
Tom

Handy
April 7, 2003, 05:50 PM
It doesn't matter if you change the barrels out. The spent casing gives the police data about the extractor, ejector, firing pin and breechface.


If your gun arrives with a casing, that means it HAS NOT been "fingerprinted", because you now have the only shell casing. I imagine NY and other buyers never see that shell; it's sent to the state by the FFL.

Ledbetter
April 7, 2003, 06:09 PM
Handy is right. You only get the spent case if your state isn't one of the states where the dealer has to turn it over to the cops when selling the gun. I don't have my manual with me to list the states.

243_shooter
April 7, 2003, 06:54 PM
Just picked up a new Ruger KP89.. I saw the sealed bag that contained the empty shell, for a brief second.. Then the dealer ships it off so it can be added to the computer.. :fire:

Leo

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