Flare gun conversion


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DontBurnMyFlag
November 21, 2005, 02:54 PM
I will start off by stating the fact I know this is illegal. I do not intend on doing this, as I am sure my hand, face, body etc will suffer. This is merely a question. Can you put Aguila mini shells, or full size shotshells, in a 12 gauge flare gun??? Will it function, or blow off the face of the shooter? Im just curious.

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Dr.Rob
November 21, 2005, 03:08 PM
.12 ga flare guns are NOT built to take the pressure of a 'live' load, even the capsicum (sp?) bear-defense pepper bullets are a no-no in most flare guns.

You'd likely blow your hand off.

Firethorn
November 21, 2005, 04:09 PM
You could always rig a holder to test fire the flare gun far, far away from you using rope/twine, whatever. Call it a 'safety' experiment. Videotape it, you might want to stick a pane of plexiglass in front of the camera. It'd be along the lines of the bicycle helmet I used up one day. Well, that wasn't deliberate, but to this day I wear the replacement routinely.

I don't know as to how illegal it would be, except in the courts of stupidity.

Carl N. Brown
November 21, 2005, 04:29 PM
Full size shotgun shells will not fit my orange plastic Olin flare gun.
The 12ga Aguila minishells are shorter than a 12ga marine flare.
They will fit, they will fire and they will shatter the plastic barrel.
Plastic barrel + minishell = plastic handgrenade . . . handheld!

NO! NO!! A THOUSAND TIMES NO!!!

On a bad idea scale of 1 to 10, this is . . . INFINITY.

Even the metal flare guns are not intended to withstand live
shotgun ammo. The orange plastic flareguns are not even safe
to fire the 12 gauge adapter shells that hold a .22 shotshell!

c_yeager
November 21, 2005, 04:55 PM
Its probably the cheapest way to get rid of your hand, if thats what your looking to do.

TexasRifleman
November 21, 2005, 05:48 PM
One of the first things I did when I got my boat was to make sure loads from my stainless 12ga on the boat could not accidentally somehow get into the flare gun.

They are too long, at least for the Olin orange plastic gun. The flares are at least an inch shorter than 2 3/4 shotshells. Won't even load. I don't use the Mini's so I didn't look into it. One would have to magically appear on the boat for it to be an issue.

Now, if you DID manage to get it loaded and fire it.........well, you know those "Darwin Award Winners" we always read about? You'd move to the head of the class..........

Preacherman
November 21, 2005, 07:49 PM
I know one person locally who claims to have fired shotgun shells successfully in a plastic flare gun - but I don't know how believable he is. He claims that he put a 20ga. converter into the chamber of his 12ga. flare gun, and put a 20ga. shell in the converter, and fired it successfully. Now, given that the only converters I've seen are full-length (i.e. the same length as a shotgun shell), and given that one can't insert a full-length shell into a flare gun, I suspect his story is BS - but I daresay he could have got a shorter converter, or cut one down, so I can't say for sure. Nevertheless, sounds like a lot of trouble to go to for unsatisfactory results.

hso
November 21, 2005, 07:58 PM
Give it a try and report back to us when you get out of the hospital.
Of course it could take a while typing with one hand while you look out of one eye.:banghead:

deadin
November 21, 2005, 08:25 PM
The other side of this coin is to shoot Olin 12ga flares in a regular shotgun.
I saw the results of this in a $15,000 Perazzi. The guy tried one of the flares in his full choke barrel. It didn't clear. Melted the end right off the barrel.:banghead:

Dean

Artful
November 21, 2005, 11:32 PM
The other side of this coin is to shoot Olin 12ga flares in a regular shotgun.
I saw the results of this in a $15,000 Perazzi. The guy tried one of the flares in his full choke barrel. It didn't clear. Melted the end right off the barrel.:banghead:

Dean

We did it with a JC Higgins - it just reblued it. ;)

Now the report bird scare rounds are more fun.:cool:

Someone was reporting they had 12 ga converter for 27mm flare gun that allowed shooting shotgun ammo in it, don't remember if they had to deepen the chamber or anything to get it to work.:eek:

444
November 21, 2005, 11:36 PM
"I don't know as to how illegal it would be, except in the courts of stupidity."

I don't know for sure that this is illegal, but............
If you had a 12 gauge shotgun with a short pistol length barrel and no buttstock, this would be classified as an NFA weapon: an AOW. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if putting a shotshell into that flare gun is classified by the ATFE as manufacturing an NFA weapon.

Artful
November 21, 2005, 11:46 PM
"I don't know as to how illegal it would be, except in the courts of stupidity."

I don't know for sure that this is illegal, but............
If you had a 12 gauge shotgun with a short pistol length barrel and no buttstock, this would be classified as an NFA weapon: an AOW. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if putting a shotshell into that flare gun is classified by the ATFE as manufacturing an NFA weapon.

Interesting Point - then would you be able to register one as an AOW or would it be a destructive device based on the orginial bore size?

for that matter a AOW Rem 870 3 shot would be a 3 flare projector:D

444
November 21, 2005, 11:52 PM
I am not a lawyer and all that, but I suppose if it worked they would immediately take the flare gun off the market. :D
But, if you wanted a 12 guage pistol, you could file a form 1 and when it came back, you could assemble your pistol. It wouldn't be a DD.

ADK1091
September 2, 2008, 01:12 AM
With the orange orion 12 gauge flare guns 12 gauge shells are too long to fit in the barrel, I have tried it to see if they would fit. But what if you cut about an inch of the plastic on the shell and took the pellets out and the wad and and put it in the flare gun to fire it just as a small blank just to make a noise. They will fit that way and I would believe removing the sealed off part and the pellets would take ALOT of recoil and pressure off of the gun and be semi-safe to fire just as a noise maker. Does anyone know if this could damage the gun, because it would'nt seem as though it would with only the powder being ignited.

ADK1091
September 2, 2008, 01:20 AM
Firing a 12 gauge shell from a flare gun after you have cut off an inch and removed the pellets the recoil is no more than it is when you fire a flare from the gun. The noise is the same as well. Due to the removal of the seal and pellets the noise and recoil are decreased GREATLY. I have a friend who tried this. It is basically the same as firing a flare but nothing being projected except whatever is covering the powder. I was wondering if prolonged firing like this only as a 4th of july type firework trick if it could cause the gun to explode on you after many times of firing.

ColinthePilot
September 2, 2008, 01:20 AM
How about we use flare guns for flares, and shotguns for shotgun shells? This is one of the silliest threads I've ever seen on here.

Better question. Is there anything wrong with firing 12ga flares out of a shotgun?

billdeserthills
September 2, 2008, 01:27 AM
AH, but there is a flare gun that is metal and 12 Ga sized. I have many times wondered the same thing DontBurnMyFlag! I just have too much to lose at the moment to try it... Let me look around, I forget the manufacturer at the moment.

xx7grant7x
September 2, 2008, 02:11 AM
How about we use flare guns for flares, and shotguns for shotgun shells? This is one of the silliest threads I've ever seen on here.

Better question. Is there anything wrong with firing 12ga flares out of a shotgun?

i dunno i thought this was an interesting question and while i knew the answer (and from the disclaimer he wrote, the OP knew it too) it's still interesting to read other peoples reply's kudo's to the question!

SageMonkey
September 2, 2008, 02:26 AM
I remember seeing adverts for a converter to fit a pistol round into flare guns, but don't recall the details off-hand.

bogie
September 2, 2008, 02:27 AM
Guys...

In case any of y'all missed it, lemme spell it out...

s t u p i d

Y'all get that?

Pressure as sealed by an inadequate container is a Bad Thing.

If any of y'all geniuses persist upon testing out this notion, make sure you get it on video... You can watch it after you get outta da hospital.

bcp
September 2, 2008, 02:41 AM
This will happen:

From:
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/050406_firelauncher.htm

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/graphics/fire_8.jpg

Doesn't look healthy.

Bruce

Carl N. Brown
September 2, 2008, 10:59 AM
Post 13 21 Nov 2005
Post 14 Today ( 2 Sep 2008)

That photo shows a plastic flare gun fired with an adapter intended to allow pistol rounds to be fired in a shotgun. A plastic flaregun fired with a 12ga Aguila Minishell woud be more and smaller pieces.

Better question. Is there anything wrong with firing 12ga flares out of a shotgun?

I have fired the 12ga Olin Marine flares from 18.5 inch cylinder bore shotguns
with no problems.

Others have tried to fire 12ga Olin Marine flares from full choke barrels only to
have the flare lodge in the choke burning away at what I have been told is Fahrenheit 5,000, the temperature at which steel turns red and melts (all due apologies to Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 "the temperature at which book paper catches fire and burns").

Of course, the fact that I have done it does not really answer the question "Is there anything wrong with it?":D

The flares are short, like the Aguila Minishells, and do not feed in many repeaters. Manually loaded and fired from NO CHOKE short barrels seems to be no problem. But I would stick to the dedicated flare pistol to be safe: they are designed for the purpose.

I have had no experience with firing shotshells from metal flare pistols, but my father who served in the Pacific in WWII allegedly had a flare gun adapted to shoot shotgun shells. Since the internal ballistics of shotshells
(18,000 psi) are different from flare shells (much lower pressure), all I can say is it has been done but I don't recommend it. It probably ranks with shooting 9mm Parabellum in a 7.63 Mauser.

contenderman
September 2, 2008, 11:01 AM
You've heard the warnings and seen pix of the result, so don't go there, and before someone else chimes in with a comment about the 26.5mm Eastern Bloc flare guns and 12ga flare metal converters that are out there I will caution you against trying that either.

You can pickup a cheapo 45/.410 derringer and load a S&W 460 cart. in it. Some folks have ... and they have paid a hell of a price.

As stated in other posts ... "There is no cure for stupid". :cuss:

kingjoey
September 2, 2008, 12:08 PM
at what I have been told is Fahrenheit 5,000, the temperature at which steel turns red and melts

Actually, that happens at around half of that temperature. At 5000F steel vaporizes and actually burns

Neo-Luddite
September 2, 2008, 12:43 PM
I have often wondered if the 'mini' shells were really encouraging this sort of illegal and horribly foolish line of experimentation with a plastic Olin Flaregun.


M-80's are loads of fun, too---until you have to deal with the fact that you just turned your hand into a 1/2 lb of hamburger for 's---- & giggles' while 'celebrating' a national holiday. Nothing is worth that. One of the great things about this board is that many young people post here--and might be steered clear of a really REALLY dumb idea.

Flare guns are for flares and for emergency signaling. If you want to make noise buy a carbide cannon or a little winchester cannon that fires 10ga blanks. Read the directions and precautions and have at it.

Jim K
September 2, 2008, 02:30 PM
Just FWIW, I once asked ATF if a flare pistol that fired a shotshell would be illegal, since the first shot would blow the gun to pieces. Their response was that if it would fire, no matter what happened after that, it would be illegal if not registered under the NFA.

Jim

Carl N. Brown
September 2, 2008, 03:05 PM
If loading a shotshell in a flare pistol is considered constructive possession of a short barrel shotgun, is firing it and blowing it up considered destructive dispossession?

woodybrighton
September 2, 2008, 03:15 PM
was it sold to you as capable of doing that NO don't do it.
your American you can buy all sorts of guns.
Flares are dangerous enough as standard. Being American you or your parents will have to foot the medical bills :mad:

Golden Hound
September 2, 2008, 03:18 PM
I'm baffled by this thread. What could possibly be the point of firing a shotgun shell from a flare gun or a flare from a shotgun? I mean, I do realize that a lot of things are just asked out of mere curiosity (what would happen IF...) since we shooters are a naturally creative and curious group, so I'm not trying to sound like too much of a jerk but PLEASE....whatever you do DON'T even THINK about trying this!!! I guarantee, your shotgun will do a much better job of shooting out shotgun shells than anything else, because that's what it was designed for in the first place.

geophysicishooter
September 2, 2008, 03:32 PM
Being American you or your parents will have to foot the medical bills
Just what the heck does that mean? I suppose if I were Canadian, British or Norwegian, or lived under some other full-on socialist system, I could have the satisfaction of having all my neighbors foot the bill for my dumb-a blowing my own hand off... nice.. :cool:

scrat
September 2, 2008, 03:48 PM
Ok i can tell you that i dont shieeeet about emergency flare guns. Just never used one or even really looked at one. In fact i am kinds suprised to hear that the gun is plastic. That just doesnt seem to smart. As for the instalation of an adapeter to shoot real ammo. Well if a flair gun was made out of arsonal steel and made to higher standards i guess it would be pretty cool to have. However i was pretty suprised to learn that they are made of plastic. Any how i agree with everyone else. DO NOT DO IT

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