Gun store employees...they just don't get it.


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OH25shooter
November 22, 2005, 03:08 PM
With my card in hand and in search of another handgun I visited three different gunstores. One local and two in different cities. In short, I found the gun(s) I wanted. But the staff employee had such an arrogant, carefree, and opinionated attitude I left with nothing. I know the 'gunstore employee' problems have been addressed, but what is their problem? Is it just me, or do the stores focus on selling to novice 'first-time' buyers more?

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P0832177
November 22, 2005, 03:37 PM
I think that some perspective gun buyers are just as slanted in their opinions as the putz behind the counter. Of course customer satisfaction is not always a top priority, but there some customer service reps are interested in getting the right gun for the buyer especially the noob!

There are many people that are experienced shooters are just out to chisel themselves the best deal. Some are just tire kickers, and they just want to fondle a particular model with no intent of ever buying that gun. I have some mixed thoughts about tire kickers. They suck the life out some customer service reps. They go on and on about this or that feature.

It is simply put a very mixed bag with both the customer attitude and sales staff arrogance!

Henry Bowman
November 22, 2005, 03:40 PM
You say you found the gun(s) you wanted. Was there a disagreement as to price? Were you willing to pay their price but they said , "No, I won't sell you that"? Or did they do the, "What you really want is this..." routine?

R.W.Dale
November 22, 2005, 03:42 PM
I think that for the most part they all suffer from the "Where else are you gonna go" syndrome especally in more rural parts of the country,they just don't understand that good CS is all that is keeping the internet from puttin them out of buisness.

Atticus
November 22, 2005, 03:44 PM
Good for you. Sometimes you need to just walk out. Now give the Mgr. a call and tell him why.
I remember the time when I called around asking if store had left handed '06 bolt guns in stock. Finally found one 50 miles from here that had several brands in stock. He confirmed that he had Rem 700's, Winchester 70's and Savages in stock. I drove there with the money in hand and walked to gun counter. Three idle clerks stared at me, but continued to tell each other jokes and talk about what they were going to do on the weekend. After a couple of minutes of waiting patiently, I told the guy that I'd like to see a left handed Remington 700 and a Winchester model 70. He looked at me like I was from Mars and shouted " REMINGTON MAKES THE MODEL 700 AND WINCHESTER MAKES THE MODEL 70!!" All three clerks burst out laughing. I calmly stated, "that's exactly what I just said". He then told me that I DID NOT SAY that. I pulled a wad of cash out of my pocket and told him, "I just drove 50 miles to buy what I already know you have in stock...but (rhymes with Duck) You. I called the Mgr. the next day and told him the story. I recently saw the same clerk working at Dick's Sporting Goods. How appropriate, I thought.

nfl1990
November 22, 2005, 03:46 PM
I think that for the most part they all suffer from the "Where else are you gonna go" syndrome especally in more rural parts of the country,they just don't understand that good CS is all that is keeping the internet from puttin them out of buisness.

Yeah that and the need for an FFL.

R.W.Dale
November 22, 2005, 03:49 PM
Yeah that and the need for an FFL.

I don't use gunshops for FFL transfers I use Pawnshops unlike gunshops they love to make a quick $10 for 5 minutes of paperwork

c_yeager
November 22, 2005, 03:50 PM
I walked out of a local store today because the guy at the counter was too busy chatting with one of his buddies to actually sell me a gun. He probably thought I was tirekicking, but I had $500 in cash in my pocket and had every intention of walking out the door with one of three possible handguns. While I was handling the second one, the salesman started jabbing with his buddy, I set it on the counter he put it back and just ignored me to talk to the guy. So here I am wanting to look at one more gun before I decide on which to purchase and now he is too busy to help me. I gave him five minutes and walked out.

Firearms are just expensive enough to be a difficult purchase and it doesnt take much to convince a person to change their mind. I have a hard enough time justifying the scratch to add one more to the collection without having to put up with that garbage. The thing that bugs me is that this is typically a pretty good shop and I have previously been happy to spend my money there. Now I feel compelled to make all my future purchases elsewhere just because of the bad taste they left in my mouth.

Cosmoline
November 22, 2005, 03:54 PM
I've been to more than a few gun shops that left me wondering if they weren't just tax writeoffs for the owner. I've even been in shops where the owner not only ignores me, he starts screaming arguments with his staff/family members about unrelated issues right in front of me. There's one store where I've experienced this three times. I finally wised up and stopped going back.

This is why I am always willing to pay more to have good customer service.

Captain
November 22, 2005, 03:55 PM
I worked in a retail gunshop for 2 years, so I may be able to add something here.

First off, too many "clerks" don't have a clue. They are familiar with one or two types of guns/shooting. If a competitive shooter is working there and you're looking for hunting stuff, you'll get very little help....usually.

There's usually one or two "regulars" who hang out there and tie up the clerk with their BS.

Then there's the (arrogant ?) customer. That might be you and I. We are knowledgable in our area of interest (defensive/hunting/target) and know what we want. Then they try to extoll on us their enlightenment in this area. It's very easy for me to get frustrated with these kind of clerks and I feel like walking away. Usually I just buy what I'm there for and smile at them as I leave. It's just not worth the aggravation sometimes!

If I have a persistent problem, then I will usually let the manager know there's a problem. It's happened a coouple times and the problems were always remedied.

Have a nice day!!

Majic
November 22, 2005, 04:16 PM
In short, I found the gun(s) I wanted. But the staff employee had such an arrogant, carefree, and opinionated attitude I left with nothing.
Did you go in the store to buy a gun or make friends?

R.H. Lee
November 22, 2005, 04:19 PM
It's amazing how pleasant the people at the local gunshop became after a second gun store opened up in town. Life is too short to deal with nasty people. ;)

Spot77
November 22, 2005, 04:27 PM
I'm quite fortunate I guess - the local store that gets a lot of my businss treats me like royalty, even when they KNOW I'm not buying anything.

M-Rex
November 22, 2005, 04:28 PM
To hell with them. They get one chance, and one chance only. You should never have to force anyone to take your money.

lawson
November 22, 2005, 04:30 PM
i'm pretty lucky, there are several gunshops within a couple miles of my apartment, and most of them have very friendly and knowledgeable staff. there have been times where a salesperson sees a young guy, and tries to sell me the most expensive thing in the store, but that's a rarety.

it's also nice that it's more convenient to buy ammo at a ma-and-pa gun shop than going to walmart. i like to support local business.

now, the sportsman's warehouse, that's another story. i was in there a while back, and told the guy behind the counter i was looking for a lever action .30-30, and he decides to show me bolt-action synthetic rifles, because apparently, he knows what i want better than i do.

Correia
November 22, 2005, 04:33 PM
I agree with all of you guys.

So that is why Iím opening my own. :)

Mornard
November 22, 2005, 04:35 PM
M-REX HAS IT EXACTLY RIGHT...

OH25shooter
November 22, 2005, 04:40 PM
Did you go in the store to buy a gun or make friends?
I'm sure not going to drop $500 on the counter of an employee who acts like I'm a bother to him. No, I don't haggle over the price or ask stupid questions. I'm focused on a particular maker, style and caliber. Like many on this forum, probably including yourself, I'm knowledgable with handguns. Especially, a specific brand. When the employee cuts on the maker, design, cost, etc., why give him any cash towards his salary. If he were smart, he'd shut up, take my money, then talk about the sale behind my back. But, he can't even figure that out.

Declaration Day
November 22, 2005, 04:47 PM
Whether it be guns, cars, or equipment for my lawnservice business, I have had salesmen try to sell me things that I did not want.

I think, in some cases, there is an ulterior motive for this. Maybe it's a product that they have too many of. Maybe it's been in stock forever and they really, really want to get rid of it.

This is when it pays to do your homework, because a salesman may try to convince you that the product they want you to buy is superior to another, even though it may not be.

In any case, if the salesman is pushy, I'm taking my business elsewhere.

MrDig
November 22, 2005, 07:39 PM
Most of the Sporting Goods Stores, Cabela's, Gander Mountain, Dicks, Sportsmans Warehoue, don't pay enough to get, let alone retain Knowledgable staff. They are usually idiots who don't know how to find their butts with both hands free. I generally don't spend my money there. A good Gun Store is always better but try to find one without encountering what you did. Once you get through the "Expert" opinions you have found a place worth the mark up from what you would pay at a discount store.
An Ex is a Has Been, and a Spurt is a drip under pressure. Put them together and you get an Expert. The Reason most Expert Opinions are free is that most expert opinions are worthless.

Lupinus
November 22, 2005, 08:43 PM
I agree. It doesn't matter if it is magazines, lawnmowers, or cigs if I am buying I want what I want and I want good customer service. Of those three I have sold two of them. Cigs, I don't smoke personally but I know enogh to knwo the difference between regular light and ultralights, Im polite you get what you ask for if someone was bothering me while I was with a customer I politely told them to shut up. Same with magazines I did a stint with a telemarketing (dont be a telemarketer it is hell) company that sold magazines. Now they had a few decent magazines and a few I recognized but 99% I knew squat about. I answered your questions tried to sell you something and did so in a polite way giving you what you wanted if you decided you wanted to buy after I gave my sales pitch. If you didn't know exactly what you wanted I helped you to the best of my knowlage but was not afriad to say Im not sure.

Point is, you don't have to like, use, or be an expert on a product to sell it. Youu just have to be polite and have a basic knowlage of the product so that you know what someone is talking about. To many though try to pretend they are more knowing then you because they work there and you don't and thats annoying and I will take my buisness elsewhere and esspecialy if it was a big purchese make sure to call the manager afterwards and let them know the sale they lost cause of their idiot employee.

And day-
Why salespeople try to push certian products they sale can be for a number of reasons. When I sold magazines (the reading kind;) ) there were sometimes magazines we were told to push for several reasons. One of the main one was certian publishers paid the company money to push their product, we read you a list of magazines and would put their magazines at the top of that list. Another was because we struck a deal with the company for a lower rate if we were able to sell a certian number of their magazines so the profit margine was higher because it cost us less per magazine while you still pay the same package rate. Also we threw in a third magazine and often times we would throw in one of the magazines we were supposed to push into the package since we had to pick one anyway a pushed magazine usualy filled the spot. So normally it is either they have paid to have their product pushed or they have struck up some sort of deal that they will lower the price on each item to you if you sell enough of their product.

Kurt_M
November 22, 2005, 09:18 PM
The pendulum swings both ways guys. I work at a locally owned sporting goods store that sells quite a few guns. It doesn't pay well, I've made better money working at Wal-Mart. But I like guns and I get a good discount, so I stay. I go out of my way not to push my favorite guns on customers and to help the newbies who walk in off of the street. I dislike Glocks, but if someone wants to buy one, well a sale is a sale, I'll go get the paperwork. I work with a pushy a-hole like many of you have described, and those guys give us all a bad image. On the other hand, a lot of the customers I deal with make me want to explode. Either they think they know everything and get ticked when I can't follow what they're talking about (sorry, antique guns aren't my thing) or they ask for my advice and get ticked when I tell them you can't buy a quality handgun for $100. Stop and examine your own attitude and behavior sometime before you automatically blame all of your problems on someone else. There's no excuse for bad customer service (if you're being ignored or talked down to you should absolutely walk out and bring it to management's attention) but for every rude and arrogant salesmen there are just as many rude and arrogant customers. Some of us try to do a good job all the same.

Jet22
November 22, 2005, 09:56 PM
Yeah that and the need for an FFL

Thats the attitude my local gunshop has...the all mighty FFL. Thats why I don't buy guns at gunshops anymore. Haven't been in his shop in over two years. There is nothing "new" that I want and if I do it will show up at a gun show soon enough. Do you know how many 500 S&Ws or 300 Ultramags I've seen being carried around at gunshows in the last year??? Those and everything in between. And all you have to do is beat the "FFL holders" trade in offer...which is about half of what they would sell it for. I would rather buy direct and pay the half without the attitude.:neener:

Harry Stone
November 22, 2005, 10:14 PM
There are some real winners on both sides of the counter.

Just today I was at a local shop and a guy walks in. No hello, no greeting at all just asks the guy at the bench mounting a scope if he had a 700 in some caliber. Asked him the price, then asked for $25 off. Then asked for a box of ammo thrown in. Again asked if they had it in stock. Bench guy says yeah, right over there in the rack. Customer says "all right" and turns and walks out. Right after he left one of the other clerks said that was the third time he'd come in and asked about that rifle and haggled on the price.

At this same place a couple weeks ago a guy came in while I was there and asked if they had any used rifles. The clerk said not many, and asked what he was looking for. The guy said something cheap for deer, like a 22. The clerk looked at him like he just sprouted a third eye. Clerk says, ".22 rimfire?" and the guy says yeah. I couldn't help it, I said "It's all about shot placement!" The clerk grabbed the counter like he was on a circus ride and it was going to throw him off and explained that .22 LR wasn't only inhumane to shoot deer with but illegal. Eventually the guy left empty handed.

You can buy guns cheaper on the internet than what you can buy them at this shop, and you can buy ammo cheaper at wal-mart. Because of the stupidity they have to put up with, I try to give them a break. Lately I've gone in there about twice a week to see if a gun I have on order is in. I'm usually only there about a half hour and almost every time something stupid like this happens. There's no excuse for bad customer service but I understand how it can happen.

f4t9r
November 22, 2005, 10:31 PM
I think that some perspective gun buyers are just as slanted in their opinions as the putz behind the counter. Of course customer satisfaction is not always a top priority, but there some customer service reps are interested in getting the right gun for the buyer especially the noob!

There are many people that are experienced shooters are just out to chisel themselves the best deal. Some are just tire kickers, and they just want to fondle a particular model with no intent of ever buying that gun. I have some mixed thoughts about tire kickers. They suck the life out some customer service reps. They go on and on about this or that feature.

It is simply put a very mixed bag with both the customer attitude and sales staff arrogance!

Thats the way it works you try to get the best deal. I must be a tire kicker in some ways because I like to look and check out the guns. I do not believe I have sucked the life out of some Rep. I have bought plenty of guns and they sure do not have a problem taking my money. Maybe I took this response wrong but the customer Rep is there to take care of the customer and but up with the good and the bad (within reason) . Thats the way sales work. I deal with it everyday.

DorGunR
November 22, 2005, 10:35 PM
I'm quite fortunate I guess - the local store that gets a lot of my businss treats me like royalty, even when they KNOW I'm not buying anything.
Same here Spot.........and you know the store I'm talking about. :)

Declaration Day
November 22, 2005, 11:15 PM
The pendulum swings both ways guys. .....but for every rude and arrogant salesmen there are just as many rude and arrogant customers.

I disagree. For every rude and arrogant salesman, there are 100 rude and arrogant customers.

When I go out to stores, be they gun shops, grocery stores, or Wally World, I am appalled by the number of people who think that being a customer excuses them from their manners.

MachIVshooter
November 22, 2005, 11:54 PM
Then they try to extoll on us their enlightenment in this area. It's very easy for me to get frustrated with these kind of clerks and I feel like walking away.

I recently was contemplating a new Remington 7400 in '06 ( I have plans for one:evil: ). The counter boy did his darndest to convince me it was some kind of recoil monster. I mentioned to him that I hunt elk with a .375 Ultra mag. He looked at me blankly for a few seconds and then continued to tell me how brutal the 7400 was on shoulders:rolleyes:

I guess my question is not why he was so clueless, but why he would try to dissuade someone from a purchase, regardless of what it was:confused:

aaronrkelly
November 23, 2005, 12:18 AM
Im pretty lucky in the gun dept. I buy most of my guns at Scheels or Sportsmans Warehouse in Des Moines. They dont care if your just looking, they dont BS you if they dont know the answer and they dont ignore customers. If they got what I want, I buy it there.

My local shop in Ottumwa is also pretty decent. Hes an older guy and you can get ahold of him on some bad days but you cant fault a guy for that....everyone has bad days. Hes opinionated about a few different manufacturers but he has a decent selection of handguns from $120 to $1200 and twice as many rifles. Good guy on most days.

sm
November 23, 2005, 12:42 AM
What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach, so you get what we had here last week which is the way he wants it. Well, he gets it. And I don't like it any more than you men.- Strother Martin as Captain in Cool Hand Luke

Been on various sides of counters, be it retail, whsle, or shopper.

Though times have changed - some basics have not. Common Courtesy and Respect. Being Polite, and the biggest skill - Communication. Makes no nevermind what role one is playing.

Business Attitudes have changed. Part of it is simply because folks asked for what they wanted. Careful what you ask for - you may get it.

Folks wanted less prices. Folks were willing to give up services for price.

Scares the hell out of me. Reminds me too much like folks willing to give up Liberties for Freedom

This has nothing to do with free markets...it is about the differences of in the old days business wanted repeat customers and those from word of mouth.

We have some business now that are happy with the "one time only" customer. These folks like to share how they really screwed the customer over..
For a few cents a gallon less folks did away with most full service gas stations.
Well folks ran off the Informed , Educated, Polite, Courteous , Service Oriented Sales Staff, Businesses and continue to do so.
Not only because they buy from box stores, internet...

No...add folks not getting out to vote and being active in legislative matters and laws enacted put a crimp in the Mom& Pop ability to sell firearms , San Francisco anyone?

How about simple politics like zoning laws..."sorry gun store, we zoned this for a parking lot for the Sheeple Retirement Home."

Anyone taken a look at liability insurance of late? Go ask your local gun club...maybe that is the real reason dues went up.

We did have shipping increases due to high gas prices...guns were not the only thing that has a price increase to cover CODB ( cost of doing business).

Businesses have a hard time with today's laws, taxes, insurance...

Customers want everything yesteday - and for less monies than the dealer has to pay.

Customers only think about "service" when in Business suit , or Funeral clothes they need gas..."why don't they have someone to pump gas, I'll smell like gas for the funeral , job interview...

Only think about 'service' when they want a FFL transfer, a scope put on at closing time day before deer season, or their dog found a baggie of gun parts in his food bowl.

Many of the older experience business folks retired, sold the business. Old gunsmiths, forget the hassle of .gov and whining. New folks...well in the old days folks apprenticed. Now-a-days a gunsmith tell his kids, get a real job and do gunsmithin' for yourself, as a hobby - "You want to eat, or mess with guns...eating means getting into something else".

Three factors determine the price of all goods and services. GREED, GREED, and GREED.

.gov
.taxes
.liability
.overhead

Folks asked for and received what they have it seems.

In the old days, if a business and consumer did not get along, did not communicate. WEll many a time I said to a customer.

I am sorry, we seem to have a communication problem, may I suggest my Competitior Mr. Smith. See we may have been competitiors, we were freindly competitiors.

Ma'am, I do not carry that product,- or
Do the fact I am not an authorized dealer Please see Mr. Jones

Smith and Jones sent me folks they could deal with, or did not have product lines of, or I was the authorized dealer.

Folks dealing with the public can spot someone a mile away that does not, or never has.

WE can also spot how someone was raised.

One teaches one how to treat them

Business does not want your business - buy elsewhere.

Customer being a jerk - the business owner does NOT have to sell to that customer.

You got a grudge against another man, you fight him Saturday afternoon. Any man playing grab-ass or fighting in the building spends a night in the box.-Carr, Floorwalker, Cool Hand Luke;)

R.W.Dale
November 23, 2005, 01:13 AM
What we've got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can't reach, so you get what we had here last week which is the way he wants it. Well, he gets it. And I don't like it any more than you men.- Strother Martin as Captain in Cool Hand Luke

Been on various sides of counters, be it retail, whsle, or shopper.

Though times have changed - some basics have not. Common Courtesy and Respect. Being Polite, and the biggest skill - Communication. Makes no nevermind what role one is playing.

Business Attitudes have changed. Part of it is simply because folks asked for what they wanted. Careful what you ask for - you may get it.

Folks wanted less prices. Folks were willing to give up services for price.

Scares the hell out of me. Reminds me too much like folks willing to give up Liberties for Freedom

This has nothing to do with free markets...it is about the differences of in the old days business wanted repeat customers and those from word of mouth.

We have some business now that are happy with the "one time only" customer. These folks like to share how they really screwed the customer over..
For a few cents a gallon less folks did away with most full service gas stations.
Well folks ran off the Informed , Educated, Polite, Courteous , Service Oriented Sales Staff, Businesses and continue to do so.
Not only because they buy from box stores, internet...

No...add folks not getting out to vote and being active in legislative matters and laws enacted put a crimp in the Mom& Pop ability to sell firearms , San Francisco anyone?

How about simple politics like zoning laws..."sorry gun store, we zoned this for a parking lot for the Sheeple Retirement Home."

Anyone taken a look at liability insurance of late? Go ask your local gun club...maybe that is the real reason dues went up.

We did have shipping increases due to high gas prices...guns were not the only thing that has a price increase to cover CODB ( cost of doing business).

Businesses have a hard time with today's laws, taxes, insurance...

Customers want everything yesteday - and for less monies than the dealer has to pay.

Customers only think about "service" when in Business suit , or Funeral clothes they need gas..."why don't they have someone to pump gas, I'll smell like gas for the funeral , job interview...

Only think about 'service' when they want a FFL transfer, a scope put on at closing time day before deer season, or their dog found a baggie of gun parts in his food bowl.

Many of the older experience business folks retired, sold the business. Old gunsmiths, forget the hassle of .gov and whining. New folks...well in the old days folks apprenticed. Now-a-days a gunsmith tell his kids, get a real job and do gunsmithin' for yourself, as a hobby - "You want to eat, or mess with guns...eating means getting into something else".

Three factors determine the price of all goods and services. GREED, GREED, and GREED.

.gov
.taxes
.liability
.overhead

Folks asked for and received what they have it seems.

In the old days, if a business and consumer did not get along, did not communicate. WEll many a time I said to a customer.

I am sorry, we seem to have a communication problem, may I suggest my Competitior Mr. Smith. See we may have been competitiors, we were freindly competitiors.

Ma'am, I do not carry that product,- or
Do the fact I am not an authorized dealer Please see Mr. Jones

Smith and Jones sent me folks they could deal with, or did not have product lines of, or I was the authorized dealer.

Folks dealing with the public can spot someone a mile away that does not, or never has.

WE can also spot how someone was raised.

One teaches one how to treat them

Business does not want your business - buy elsewhere.

Customer being a jerk - the business owner does NOT have to sell to that customer.

-Carr, Floorwalker, Cool Hand Luke;)


DO WHAT!!! That makes no sense what so ever. I've read tax codes that easier to follow than that post. Bottom line there is NO excuse for rude behavior from sales persons be it back in "the good ol days" or today.

Atticus
November 23, 2005, 01:59 AM
I understand what SM is saying and agree with most of it...but I rarely shop at the big retailers, and my worst experiences have usually been with the one owner, <5 employees, gun shops. They can't compete with Wallyworld prices, so you would think they would know the value of service...but I have yet to meet one who does.

rmgill
November 23, 2005, 03:22 AM
I sent a co-worker out to get his first gun, a Mossberg 590. He'd used mine to get a feel for it and I sent him to two shops that I normally frequent. One the range was kind of iffy on it. The other was downright lazy. They more or less tried to dissuade him from getting it from them. I think he eventually bought it from a third store. I'm still contemplating what I'm going to say to them the next time I'm there. I know I need to say something. I mean come on, I send them a customer with his mind made up on his first brand new gun and they try to send him away. Thing is, I know these guys really well. I don't know what they were doing which is why it surprised me so much.

mindpilot
November 23, 2005, 07:19 AM
Some of the guys there are such LEO wanna bees it makes me sick. they cant recommend let alone help you with any ballistics info

DirksterG30
November 23, 2005, 10:33 AM
I've had some good experiences at local gun stores, and a few bad ones. One small store I went to (store was probably 300 sq. foot) - they are local, so I thought I'd give them a try. First time I went there, the 2 employees are stuffing their faces with cinnamon rolls, and ignoring me, even though I'm the only one in the store. I finally get one of them to help me, and he doesn't even stop stuffing his face to talk to me. :banghead:

The next time I went in, I asked if the gun I had bought was used (I didn't look it over that closely when I bought it, and it had some wear on the finish.) He said they don't sell used guns - right behind me on the wall are beat-up old SMLEs, M1903s, even a Kar-98K. Never went back.

I had an more unpleasant experience last week - I took the wife to Gander Mountain to look at pistols. The clerk who helped us informed me that 9mm is worthless; we should look at .40cal (he's getting a .40cal XD for Christmas.) That nonsense I can deal with, but his gunhandling was atrocious. He didn't seem to care where the muzzle was pointed, and he swept us a number of times, as well as the people behind us. Needless to say, the management was informed of this, and we won't be returning there if he's on duty. :banghead:

peteinct
November 23, 2005, 10:39 AM
Hi all, I'm in the process of looking for a new gun. I want a pistol caliber carbine for a plate shooting competition. So I went to Newington Gun exchange to see what they had. The guy behind the counter let me hold they different types they had and gave me a spiel on setting up an AR with different uppers which was interesting. They didn't have anything in stock that really grabbed me so I thanked him for his time and left.

That's me a "tire kicker". But that interaction is as much a part of the sale as when he collects my money because if he treats me lousy I'll go elsewhere to buy my guns. Who knows maybe I'll buy an AR set up like he was talking about which hadn't entered my mind before. His courtesy to me will push me to his store even though it is farther away and I would buy from him even if it was a little more expensive. I have also recommended his store to others.

How are you supossed to buy a gun without holding it first? I have a couple that I bought because they looked fine but didn't fit me or were uncomfortable to shoot. Guns can be so expensive and you lose so much money on trade ins that it is only smart to check your purchase out any way you can before you buy.

With the internet and WalMart nipping at their heels gunshops have to realize customer service may be their only niche that keeps them in buisiness.

pete

Creeping Incrementalism
November 24, 2005, 06:25 AM
It troubles me that gun store clerks aren't better. They should be better than used car dealers.

Even though Al Gore once said the internal combustion engine was the worst thing ever invented, there's not even a joke of cars being banned. Even in Berkeley, where I went to college, the idea of banning all cars on city streets one day a year has been passed around in city council meetings and local newspapers, and is still a complete pipe dream (I'd like to watch these tattooed t-shirt store clerks haul their merchandise from the Port of Oakland). But banning guns isn't a pipe dream.

So even if a gun store clerk is a complete a-hole, it doesn't really bother me. And if I was a retail gun store clerk, which I'm not (but I've worked grocery store retail before, which I gauran-gosh-darn-tee-ya is worse), the rudest customer wouldn't bother me the slightest bit. Guns aren't just metal, wood, and/or plastic, they're freedom.

That being said, the rude clerks shouldn't be there, considering how they're likely to dissuade potential shooters from joining the "cause".

jashobeam
November 24, 2005, 08:40 AM
I love showing guns to customers. I get excited for the customers as they look at and handle the handguns. I know exactly what it's like to go to a gun shop and want to check out all the guns. When I was about 14 years old I'd have my grandma drive me across town so I could just look at all the guns at Reed's Sporting Goods store in San Jose, CA.

I've learned so much from frequenting THR. I've learned that not all people like the same guns, and that a certain gun might meet a certain need for a certain person. The store I work at does not sell any junk guns. If someone was looking at a particular gun but looked undecided and asked if we had anything similar but different, I'd do my best to show whatever I thought might meet the given criteria.

I don't fault anyone for wanting to handle the guns, whether there exists a chance for a sale or not. I always tell the customers to enjoy the gun-shopping process; there's just something exciting about choosing and buying a gun.

When someone is actually about to buy a gun, I get happy. That lucky dog! I wish it was me deciding to lay down some money on a new gun.

There is one employee who's sort of a know-it-all type. He's cool, but he's a kadet for some LE agency (that didn't really come out right.."He's cool, but he's a kadet for some LE agency"--whatever that's supposed to mean). He LOVES the Beretta, and the .40 S&W round. He's not exactly pushy, but his opinions do shine through. He is quite knowledgeable about firearms, but one other thing I've learned here at THR is that gun knowledge and personal opinion are often times indistinguishable and inseparable. I can't say he does anything wrong; he's not condescending or snobby. Customers who want a 9mm are probably asked if they've considered the .40, and are then enlightened about its superiority over all other defensive rounds. Which is something else I've learned here: While some folks are convinced of the superiority of one caliber or firearm, others are unconvinced, and still others are convinced of something else.

I have a good grasp of what it means to serve customers: be kind, friendly, attentive, and considerate and give them what they want as long as it doesn't compromise or conflict with the business's interests. The customer ceases to be 'right' pretty much only when proposing something morally/legally wrong or financially inaccurate, relative to the business at hand.

Atticus
November 24, 2005, 11:56 AM
My most memorable bad experience was the time I went into the local gun store to buy a Colt 1911 they had on display. I'd looked at this gun for weeks and finally had the cash in my pocket to buy it. I stopped at the shop right after they opened that morning - I had just finsihed working a long third shift with only a few hours sleep (I'll admit that I probably looked pretty haggard).
The owner was the only one there. He was an old, heavy set guy, who's attitude made Colonel Jeff Cooper seem warm and fuzzy and un-opinionated. I asked him to see the Colt one more time. He looked me up and down and told me, "We don't let 'lookers' handle our guns...we feel that they should remain pristine for the buyer." :confused: :eek: :fire:
It took me a minute to even reply. I simply told him that I would have been the 'owner' in about 5 minutes, and that I was a lifetime member of his range, but you can keep your pristine gun. I never bought another thing from that shop. I'll never forget that.

Rich K
November 24, 2005, 12:08 PM
I have to say that the gunshop I deal with has nevertreated me anything but nicely and fairly.Now that being said,I will say that I have also run into the opposite,as well.One shop here in Warren,Mi,on 9 mile rd and Ryan rd,has the most arrogant and ignorant(as far as how to treat people)attitude I have ever run into.You go into the shop for gunsmithing work,and the gunsmith asks you what you need,and then proceeds to tell you why he won't do what you want him tp do.(It was a matter of sights on a box stock 45 auto).It seems that his problem was he just didn't want to do the machine work involved,a dove tailed front sight.Also the owner thinks he is doing yo u a favor even taking to you.,so I don't go in there any more.I spend my money where it is appreciated by the owners,and they treat me right.

Cosmoline
November 24, 2005, 02:32 PM
Those who rude to me never get my money. Those who provide good customer service do.

There is an attitude among some gunstores that letting customers shop in their stores is a privilege. The local stores that haven't snubbed me or regarded me as a "looky look" have gotten tens of thousands of dollars from me over the years. Though I often look like a scruffy homeless guy I spend a huge portion of my income on firearms. The stores that snubed me have paid very dearly.

MachIVshooter
November 24, 2005, 03:14 PM
is something that gun stores ought not condemn. I had a friend of mine who owned a gunshop tell me once that the average gun buyer will come in to look at the gun 3-5 times before buying it. Of course, many of us on this board are not "average" gun buyers and have a specific model and price range in mind before we ever set foot in the shop, but many folks new to the world of guns have a very difficult time dropping hundreds of dollars on a small item with no screen or microchip. I get a lot of strange looks when I tell non gun savvy people how much I've spent on certain firearms, scopes, etc., and I can see why. for a newcomer, it could be difficult at first to understand why a firearm costs so much more than, say, a drill or saw. They often do not understand the difference in craftsmanship, a concept very much forsaken in todays consumer world. Gun shop staff need to remember this and act accordingly.

geegee
November 24, 2005, 03:31 PM
Did you go in the store to buy a gun or make friends?
That to me is such a ridiculous response it defies reason, but nevertheless gets to the heart of why service in America is so lacking. Try these on for size:

My wife and I waited in a restaurant for twenty minutes before a waitress approached our table. When she finally talked to us, all she said was "What'll it be?"

Did you go in the restaurant to buy a meal or make friends?

I walked into the electronics store to buy a plasma TV, but the salesman there didn't want to stop playing a Playstation game with another salesman, so we had to wait for 15 minutes until he was finished. When he finally came over to us, his greeting was "Know what you want?"

Did you go in the store to buy a TV or make friends?

Who in their right mind would ever put up with such terrible service, or be willing to shop there again? For some reason however, this is more the norm than the exception. Gun shops are much smaller in number than restaurants or electronics stores unfortunately, so there are fewer competitors from which to choose. They're out there however, and a motivated buyer will find one, while the retail business who puts such a low value on customer service will eventually be forced to close it's doors. And in a market economy, that's how it should be.

JMusic
November 24, 2005, 04:45 PM
I'm a gun nut. My father was a gun nut. Every weekend we would go to a gun show and mingle with other gun nuts. With that said Firearms have been my thrill, joy, whathaveyou, since I was 6 years old. I can recall visiting gun stores in the late 60's early 70's. Many were so rude that I was intimidated by them. As I aged they just pissed me off. When we all almost lost our rights to own a firearm I saw the industry change to service first. I think what has happened now is just plain ignorance. Stores are going up quickly and the skill and knowledge is not there. I have found most receptive to discussion and advise. Those who are not I don't go back. Owners of gunstores are the ones I have issues with. If a firearm does not work they act like IT guys (what did you do to it or you are doing something wrong. I have had to prove myself to a few owners lately and they were not pleasant discussions. Though they were dead wrong and eventialy made it right it was a fight. I buy firearms now where ever and don't expect any customer service. If I need repair or fixing of a new firearm I send it to the factory. If I want advise I research on line.
Jim

sm
November 24, 2005, 04:56 PM
krochus,

Bottom line there is NO excuse for rude behavior from sales persons be it back in "the good ol days" or today.

Nor is there any excuse for customers, or manufacturers to be rude or behave in a rude condecending manner.

Communication is the key.

I do not like the service I have "yet to receive", from any business - I have the right to leave. I have and will continue to do so.

In retail, wholesale, any business or service dealing with the public - one has a right to 1) not do business with a customer, 2) ask the customer to leave, or 3) suggest another place for conducting business or seeking service.

Again - having been on that side of the counter - I have done so, and reserve the right to NOT do business with anyone in the future.

I am in AR, born and raised here. I refuse to do business with Wilson , Walmart, and a host of folks based here.

Folks wanted cheaper prices and got them - in exchange customers recieved less qualified sales persons, and services.

Jerks are not just folks behind counters in Gun Stores. Some of the biggest Jerks are the ones coming in the front door.

The customer is always right- Bull-hocky!!

See, I don't care one whit what folks think of me. I am centered enough to not need anyone's compliments.

I am good at what I am good at. I am a great customer, I am a great salesperson/ serviceperson. Either side of the counter - I am that good. In either role - I am free to NOT interact and do the role that particular role may require of me.

I have walked into a Gun store with Thousands of Dollars in pocket, and left with nothing because I was not getting the common courtesy and respect.

I have chosen to NOT sell something worth $10k - hell even $100K to a customer - simply because I did not want to be "married to" that obnoxious of a customer. Just because you have $10k or more in cash [Yes one did have $100k in cash on person] does not mean you have the right to NOT be courteous and respectful to a salesperson.

I had/have folks that only spent small sums on purchases. We developed a relationship, we communicated, and respected each other. More than once I have bought a steak dinner for a customer, had a deli tray sent to a Gun Shop, or similar.

Recipricosity was done to me, my meal paid for , or a gunshop/pawnshop knew I was looking for something, called me first. Some gunshops and Pawnshops knew I worked with new shooters and kids - they called and held back stuff, and donated ammo, eyes and ears to me and them.

Two way street, this exchange of goods and services.

Fact of the matter is- I do not want some folks breathing my air, that is right - MY air. One reason I smoke, upsets folks and they don't breathe MY air.

Now we have a neat feature here on THR - called the Ignore feature
"sm" is only two letters and both in lowercase. I like simple.

Regards,

Steve

jashobeam
November 24, 2005, 05:29 PM
I've only been working at this gun store for about two weeks, at two days per week, but I've had the opportunity (or should I say privilege?) to refer customers to this forum about a dozen times. Most people simply come in to shoot at the indoor range and maybe rent one of our rental guns. Others come in to see about purchasing a specific make and model. But the ones who come in and do not know which gun may best fit the intended purpose are the ones I tell to join THR so they can ask the many knowledgeable and considerate members here about their experiences with that manufacturer or model.

I had two different customers looking at and considering the S&W 649 "Bodyguard". This occurred on the same day that I had read a thread praising this snubbie. I related this information to the customers and told them that people seem to love this gun.

If I have read negative reviews about a brand or model, I don't pass that along (I haven't yet, anyway). After reading the thread entitled "What brands do you avoid?", I have learned that EVERY brand has those who hate it.

I don't want to be one of those "I think I know everything" super-opinionated, wanna-be-LEO, snobby, pushy, only-buy-a-Glock, never-buy-a-Glock, type of gun counter person.

Most people DON'T want advice; they want options, or just someone to listen to their opinions. They want to feel good and confident about whatever they purchase; if I remain silent and unopinionated, I don't undermine their confidence in the product of their choice and they will be happy customers. I wouldn't, however, just nod in agreement if someone looking for a good HD weapon asked me about .22's, or anything like that.

If I don't know an answer to a question that is semi-opinion-oriented, I don't refer to them to another clerk, I refer them to The High Road, where they can weigh out the various comments and opinions and make a decision after becoming aware of the pros and cons and the experiences of others.

Zach S
November 24, 2005, 05:54 PM
I disagree. For every rude and arrogant salesman, there are 100 rude and arrogant customers.

When I go out to stores, be they gun shops, grocery stores, or Wally World, I am appalled by the number of people who think that being a customer excuses them from their manners.
+1

sm
November 24, 2005, 06:54 PM
I refer them to The High Road, where they can weigh out the various comments and opinions and make a decision after becoming aware of the pros and cons and the experiences of others.

Oh Goody!

So how is your inventory in regard to 28 gauge shotguns? :D

MNgoldenbear
November 24, 2005, 10:27 PM
Most people DON'T want advice; they want options, or just someone to listen to their opinions. They want to feel good and confident about whatever they purchase; if I remain silent and unopinionated, I don't undermine their confidence in the product of their choice and they will be happy customers. I wouldn't, however, just nod in agreement if someone looking for a good HD weapon asked me about .22's, or anything like that.
Great statement and philosophy. Giving the customer options and information, rather than telling them what they have to get, can help them to make their best decision ('people like this about this gun/type because of ...'; 'people dislike this about this model because of...'). You don't necessarily want to change anyone's mind, but try to help them purchase something that they'll be happy with and that will serve the purpose that they have in mind. Gee, that sounds like customer service to me! :) My family and I have patronized businesses (gun shops, restaurants, etc.) that had higher prices than other places, but had excellent service. We weren't looking to make 'friends' (as mentioned in some other posts), but we WERE looking to be treated as customers whose business was valued. We try to make a point to tell service people, managers, and owners exactly how their service has impacted our likelihood of doing more business there, whether it had a positive or negative effect.

iamhistory
November 25, 2005, 12:08 AM
There is a pretty decent variety of small shops around me and of course Wal-mart and Gander Mountain.

I guess I'm pretty fortunate to have two particular shops near me that I deal with regularly. We have some real doozies that fit every description I've read here tonight from just plain dumb to arrogant pricks.

The two shops I deal with will get you about anything you want and give you a fair price without having to haggle. Hell, my family and I have been dealing with both fellas so long one guy has even taken me upstairs of his shop and showed me his personal collection......pretty impressive. It also helps that he is one of, if not the best gunsmith and custom builder around.

The women in our family can go to either shop and receive helpful advice and be treated with respect when going in to buy gifts, pick orders up, or whatever. We are all on a first name basis and it feels good to walk in their doors. Those are pretty much the only two places I go anymore for serious purchases.........I've done all the looking around at the others and I know by now who's going to take care of me and what deals can be made. There's just no point in literally wasting my time anywhere else.

Considering today is Thanksgiving............I'm thankful for that. Good people working in good gun shops.........doesn't get any better.

c_yeager
November 25, 2005, 04:38 AM
For every rude and arrogant salesman, there are 100 rude and arrogant customers.


This is almost certainly true, however a salesman will meet thousands of customers, while those customers will only meet a small handfull of salesmen. A single poor salesman poisons a much larger pool than even 100 terrible customers. Furthermore one end of that relationship is getting paid and the other is doing the paying, the fact is that it isnt a realationship that has actual parity, so the comparison is moot.

TrapdoorBilly
November 25, 2005, 06:41 AM
Maybe you are the problem.

redneck2
November 25, 2005, 06:56 AM
+1

There is a shop not too far from my house where the owner is the ultimate rude jerk. Many of the shooters I know will not do business with him. Unfortunately, he carries a good selection of reloading stuff so I end up buying stuff once in a while if I'm in the area and need it quick.

While I too have been treated rudely, I find it unusual that no one in any of three stores would be willing to help. I've worked in a gun shop. You may show 200-300 guns a day and sell one or two. You usually have a pretty good idea the guy isn't going to buy when he's been in 10 times, looked at 100 different guns, and never bought anything

Also, the poor guy behind the counter is stuck there. There were times we'd see the gun shop commandos come thru the door. We'd hit the door for the back room. The poor slob that was last would have to stand there and listen to endless stories of how one caliber is better than another, or brand X is a total piece of crap and something else is the best thing ever.

I'd start by saying "I'm going to buy a gun today, if I can find what I want". I do this when buying a car. It's amazing how nice the attitudes are when the guy that's selling knows you're not another waste of time like the last 40 guys that came in.

FWIW...don't tell me how salesmen ought to act. I sell industrial products for a living and I'm in the top 3% of my company worldwide. Not all shops are worth dealing with. Not all customers are worth dealing with.

1911Tuner
November 25, 2005, 08:40 AM
This takes me back a long ways. I've been in shops once that I won't visit again...and I've been in a few that I'll drive 100 miles to spend money in.
The shop that I worked in for a while was one that drew people from two states regularly, and was often so crowded that sometimes you had to elbow your way in. The owner's cardinal rule was:

If a customer walks in the door, I want two people standin' ready and willing to show him whatever he wants to see. If he doesn't buy, and comes back the next day...I want two people standin' ready again.

The guy made a small fortune in that shop.

benEzra
November 25, 2005, 09:34 AM
Regarding tire kicking...

When I bought my S&W 3913, I handled one two or three times before I bought it. It's a big investment, and I wanted to think about it.

I'd do the same when buying a car.

Declaration Day
November 25, 2005, 10:27 AM
Has anyone ever given a gun shop a second chance?

A few years ago I stopped by a local gun shop (at the time I lived several miles away from it) to find a buyer for my SPAS-12. The salesman, who was very condescending, said "Huh, if you can find somebody to give you more than $400 for it, take it and run." Even if he was right, his attitude completely sucked.

I walked out, and ended up making an even trade for a brand new M1 Garand that weekend at the local gun show.

Normally I would never set foot in such a place again.

I moved about a year ago, and I now live less than a mile from that shop. The next shop is six miles away and is way overpriced. The one after that is much farther. So I decided to give them another try.

It was worthwhile; I don't remember that salesman's face, but he must not be there any more.

Whether I am buying or just "tire kicking", the owner and his employees are great. Very respectful, very helpful. Most of their prices are about $50 above what I can find at a gun show, but considering drive time and gas, it balances out. I'm glad I gave 'em another try.

JohnBT
November 25, 2005, 11:11 AM
"Maybe you are the problem."

That's me. Bad customer, bad, bad, bad. :)

About 2 Wednesday afternoon my dad and I went into the shop near his house to do our usual walkaround. I was halfheartedly looking for a gas-operated shotgun for geese and before I knew what hit me the owner gave each of us a Beretta keychain and lapel pin. Then he fetched a copy of the Beretta episode of Tales of Gun and told us to bring it back next week.

Well, the 26" 391 was really pretty and the gunsmith recommended the Super Black Eagle for waterfowl and someone else showed us some other guns (the 4-pound Franchi 28 ga. autoloader was really nice and that's another story), but they were really busy being short-staffed right before Thanksgiving and all. After a bit of poking around in the racks I spotted what I wanted.

So how was I a bad customer? After all the trouble they went to showing and selling the Beretta/Benelli line I bought a used Winchester SX2 3.5 with Shadow Grass camo.

That reminds me, I need to mail my dad a check. I'd left my checkbook at home and had to borrow some money to do the deal. (Of course I have a credit card, but I didn't want to lose the cash discount.)

John

c_yeager
November 25, 2005, 11:26 AM
Has anyone ever given a gun shop a second chance?


Gun shops around here have a pretty high turn around it seems, so I always give em another chance, with one singular exception; Butch's Gunshop in Seattle. If that shop were to burn to the ground and a whole new shop with new owners and new employees were placed in it's previous space, I still wouldnt walk through that door out of a belief that the very earth itself were poisoned against all decent humanity.

redneck2
November 25, 2005, 11:26 AM
"Lookers" are fine. You can stay hours and look to your heart's content.

The problem comes when you have a shop full of customers and one guy wants to see that one...and that one....and that one....and that one. For maybe 45 minutes or an hour.

Now, if you kinda "fill in" between guys that are standing at the register holding 4 boxes of ammo waiting to be checked out, that's fine again. He's made his decision. Let him get out.

If the shop's empty, I'll take all the time I need to show you whatever you want.

Just because the cleck is trapped behind the counter doesn't give you license to hold him hostage

Now, if I'm the customer and there's two guys behind the counter just BS'ing, that's when I get blunt. "Could I get some help here?" clears that up pretty quick. Actually a good solid stare usually works wonders

willp58
November 25, 2005, 10:30 PM
I have a few thoughts on this. I'm the gunsmith for the biggest sporting goods store in our area and at times people DO ask questions that tell me that they are fairly new at the gun stuff.
They ask my opinion on which gun or model I think is best. If it's a shotgun for deer, I'll tell them one thing. If it's a handgun for deer hunting, I will have a particular gun in mind...etc...

For instance if a person comes in and wants to start shooting trap or skeet, I'll steer him away from a mossberg 500...Now if this SAME guy wants to hunt some small game and maybe deer, I MIGHT suggest the mossy, because he's told me he doesn't want to spend a lot of money and wants a "fairly" good shotgun.

If he picks up a Winchester 1200, and asks me, "Is this one any good"? I'll kinda mumble and get coffee.

Ok what I'm trying to say is that we see ALL kinds come in the store. Usually we can tell a "shooter" from a neophyte, not always.
Are we opinionated as to which gun is better than others?? You bet..
I see certain guns come in for repair more than others. We get brand new guns from certain makers that do NOT function. We try to steer people away from them.

If a guy comes in and says, " I want a new Remington 11-87 for rabbits"!! I say YESSIR..

Knowing it'll be too heavy for him in the long run, but if I try to dissuade him, he'll likely get irate.

We get people all the time that don't really know what loads to buy for their 30-06 for example. One guy said he wanted some 120 JHP's because they shoot "fast"..He did say he was a little dissapointed in the accuracy but he thought a 5" group/100yds was probably ok.

Now could you stay quiet when someone tells you that?? And hand over the 120 grainers without ANY advice?

Be a little patient with the gunshop guy...He sees all kinds and I do mean ALL kinds..You tend to burn out just a tad.

Dionysusigma
November 25, 2005, 11:23 PM
If a large store (say, the size of Outdoor America) has only four salesmen behind the counters (which it does), then there's nothing we can do. It's not easy when you're filling out four 4473s, grabbing ammo, dealing with constant pages from the office/ warehouse, and trying to be polite with the other ten people waiting on you to finish.

I get paid $7.00 an hour. Comission is .3%--meaning thirty cents for every hundred dollars' worth of stuff I sell. I don't make a lot of money.

But I try. Even to the jerks that think they're God (whether they're other employees or they're customers), I try. If I walk past you and don't so much as acknowledge your presence, I'm sorry. I genuinely am. If I come off as some sort of jerk myself, I really don't mean it--it's just that there are several customers who see me not doing anything (not doing anything includes filling out 4473s, etc.) and they get P. O.ed since I'm "not helping them." Occasionally, customers are polite enough to let others go before them if all they want is a box or two of ammo. I appreciate that.

Give us a break. Hunting season is still on. Distributors and other shipping companies (FedEx, UPS, DHL) are trying to keep up. Christmas is in a month. Our massive sale is next week (no matter how unprepared we are). And no, not all of us are stupid. I am a salesman. I am not John Moses Browning, Buddha, Carlos Hathcock, or Col. Cooper. I am myself.

PS It doesn't matter if you have $5.00 cash or $5,000.00 cash with you. I showed a guy with a wad of fifties in his hand everything he wanted to see and he still didn't buy squat. So it doesn't matter. A decent attitude from both ends does. Even if you wish to God I'd drop dead, and I'd like to see you do the same, let's both act nicely. Pretend, lie through our teeth if we have to. That's what manners are. Respect for another human being...

I'll be quiet now. It's been a long day. If anybody needs me, I'll be at The Biting Sow. :banghead:

Cosmoline
November 26, 2005, 12:48 AM
I get paid $7.00 an hour. Comission is .3%--meaning thirty cents for every hundred dollars' worth of stuff I sell. I don't make a lot of money.

But I try. Even to the jerks that think they're God (whether they're other employees or they're customers), I try. If I walk past you and don't so much as acknowledge your presence, I'm sorry. I genuinely am. If I come off as some sort of jerk myself, I really don't mean it--it's just that there are several customers who see me not doing anything (not doing anything includes filling out 4473s, etc.) and they get P. O.ed since I'm "not helping them." Occasionally, customers are polite enough to let others go before them if all they want is a box or two of ammo. I appreciate that.


I've thought back on it, and I can't recall a single instance when some issue I had with a store employee actually caused me to blacklist a shop. I will only do it when the OWNER or someone setting policy is to blame. And believe me the owners tend to be far, far ruder and nastier than any clerk. The owner of Northern Security set a policy where no returns for exchange could be made, and refused to alter that policy even when a clerk actually remembered me buying the holster, and even when the holster was in original packaging with their tag on it. He essentially accused me of theft, which is way over the line. I stormed out and wish all the ills of the world to befall that nasty, putrifying snake pit. I send all the business I can to the excellent folks at Grubin's Great Guns--the older store Northern Security is competing with for the LEO and security market.

But I've never raised the black flag because one clerk was having an off day. It's a tough, low-paying job. In my experience the owners are the only ones who ever get so inbred, ingrown and arrogant that they earn the black stamp.

Poul D'eau
November 26, 2005, 04:00 AM
Today, I went to my local gun store with a great reputation for their gunsmithing abilities. I was planning on getting a Para Ordnance LTC and getting an ambi safety installed. (I have the south paw curse) early next month I was planning on getting a beater 1911 either a SA GI or RIA commander.

I told the first salesman what I was looking for and he said I'm not the one you need to speak to you would have to talk to him. (ok so far so good)

I repeated what I was looking for and the first remark out of the "experts" mouth was "why the hell would you want that...." kind of stunned me a little, its not like I asked to order a jennings. This shop is listed as a dealer for Para (which may not mean much now that I think about it) but the shoe was on the wrong foot. He asked "LDA?" which its not and I told him so. He went to the back to find some information and came back and confirmed that he was not up to date on that pistol and before he started the ball rolling he wanted to talk with the gunsmith who would be in next week so he asked that I check back on Monday and Tuesday.

Shoe is back on the right foot at this point I asked if he could guess what it would be dollar wise under similar situations. He said that a $1000 dollar gun....:what:

Shoe headed south again....

MSRP is $900.00 with gunbroker going for ~$650 for those who want to know. I pointed that out and he said you can take that to a pawn shop....:what: :what:

This guy was pushing me to go to another store.... Now I know that I was not going to get out of there for $650 since it was not in stock but with $250 worth of wiggle room between the MSRP and the smith being in house which I told him..... Silly me I was looking to get out the door for ~$900.

This guy is one that I try to use when I go here and even when I "kick the tires" I pick up some primers or a pound or two of powder, I try to give him my business because of a previous gun purchase.

I look at several other guns and after a bit of head scratchin I decide on a Kimber pro raptor II (new model with the internal extractor) He did not push or encourage me to get this pistol all did was pull it out of the case for me. I thought for a bit and by the time I would get the Para with an ambi safety plus night sights and front strap work I would be forking over more than the cost of the kimber.

I made sure the guy I had been working with got the sale...call me stupid, loyal, whatever. But I took myself to that gun not him. He threw in a box of Golden sabers for free (I was getting 2) along with 1k of primers and 1# of win 231.

Did I get what I wanted when I walked in? No.
Am I happy with what I got? yes.
Could the process getting what I got been better than my trip to walmart on the day after Thanksgiving?

Yep.

Sorry for the long rant.
Now I can enjoy my kimber.

Nematocyst
November 26, 2005, 04:45 AM
...OH25Shooter, for starting this thread.

I've experienced this, too.

But for now, I've just discovered your thread,
am too tired to read all of it, yet,
so will postpone substantial comment for another day
{with confidence that, having posted this,
i'll be reminded of new posts,
and thus stimulated to re-read it, & post again later.}

just this comment for now:

like high school teachers, college teachers & university professors,
once a 'gun shop' employee is 'hired',
he (almost inevitably 'he' {which is part of the problem, eh, Pax?}
thinks he is smarter than those who come in.

Example: yesterday afternoon, a gunshop employee
told me that semi-auto 'jam' problems were 'caused' by
holding the pistol incorrectly.

I don't believe that, at this moment.

But, it IS a testable hypothesis.

Prof Nem,
THR University

:neener:

willp58
November 26, 2005, 08:52 AM
~~~~~Example: yesterday afternoon, a gunshop employee
told me that semi-auto 'jam' problems were 'caused' by
holding the pistol incorrectly.

I don't believe that, at this moment.~~~~~

Sir this is called "limp-wristing" and yes it does cause malfunctions. When you hold the pistol loosely, it has an adverse effect on the recoil operation of the firearm.

Our deer season opened Saturday Nov 19th this year so the 2 or 3 weeks prior are our very busiest. You really *should* hang out at a sporting goods shop all day for several days at that time.
You will get an education in temper control I assure you.
I can't tell you how many come in a cab...Cannot spell the street they live on...Have not taken a shower in weeks...etc...

One guy came walking in with an Ithaca model 37 on a sling. He wanted to know why the reciever bolt would not come out..It looked like he had been at it with a butter-knife...it was MANGLED..
I said he had to remove the stock first. (Yes he was drunk) &&**$($$

He said WHAT?? I have another one of these home and I never took the stock off!!!
I took a deep breath and said, " Sir, next time you come in, please bring it along, I want to see it"..

I explained the way this gun is made and it made no difference..He just couldn't see why he had to "Go thru all THAT sh1t" to get 'er apart...

Please guys - have some compassion for the gun shop guy..

mrmeval
November 26, 2005, 09:06 AM
It's very hard to buy from enemies. I won't tolerate bad service from anyone and beyond that you can easily push me into being actively against your store.

Did you go in the store to buy a gun or make friends?

mrmeval
November 26, 2005, 09:13 AM
Rewrite this as a question they need to answer, include your name and address. Then follow up later in person.

I sent a co-worker out to get his first gun, a Mossberg 590. He'd used mine to get a feel for it and I sent him to two shops that I normally frequent. One the range was kind of iffy on it. The other was downright lazy. They more or less tried to dissuade him from getting it from them. I think he eventually bought it from a third store. I'm still contemplating what I'm going to say to them the next time I'm there. I know I need to say something. I mean come on, I send them a customer with his mind made up on his first brand new gun and they try to send him away. Thing is, I know these guys really well. I don't know what they were doing which is why it surprised me so much.

The_Antibubba
November 26, 2005, 09:24 AM
Having worked in retail and sales,I know what it's like to work with rude or (seemingly) stupid customers. I've resolved not to be one. If I'm looking at a gun, and I'm not at the buying stage, I'm going to let the clerk finish his sale or pitch or educating before I make him stand there while look a gun over. And you know what? When I wait my turn, or when I tell them I'll wait til they're done with the other guy, I almost always get better service.

stratus
November 26, 2005, 09:25 AM
I treat people the way I'd like to be treated, regardless of which side of the counter I'm on (I don't work at a gun store, but it applies to any retail store pretty much). There are an abundance of customers who wouldn't recognize good customer service if it bit them in the rear. Or worse, they know that they are being treated with respect, they just don't care enough to reciprocate that respect. I've dealt with a few surly clerks in my life while shopping for a gun (or for ammo at Wal-mart), and it doesn't matter how warm and friendly you are, it just doesn't reach them. I treat such clerks in a matter-of-fact and unapologetic way. But, there are also the ones who are polite and informative, and I make sure that they know I appreciate the job they are doing. They probably have so many customers dragging them down that it definitely helps to be built up by a few customers - a feeling of being appreciated has a lot to do with a good work ethic.

Nematocyst
November 26, 2005, 09:43 AM
Sir this is called "limp-wristing" and yes it does cause malfunctions. When you hold the pistol loosely, it has an adverse effect on the recoil operation of the firearm. Ah ha!

Excellent. :)

You know the name.

Good.

Now, please explain this phenomenon, and how to prevent it, in 200 - 500 words so that we can all understand it.
Then, fewer of us will do it, and all those drunks won't come in your store smelling bad and all.

Limp-wristing.

Hmm. Let me take a crack at it. Here's the hypothesis: If one doesn't keep one's wrist and elbow relatively rigid upon firing, there is so much recoil, that the gun flies up at a velocity/acceleration in such a way as to retard brass ejection, jamming the gun.

How'd I do?

Did I get at least a 'C'?

:p

Thanks.

Look forward to learning more about 'limp wristing', and how to prevent it.

Nem

JMusic
November 26, 2005, 09:57 AM
Guys take your pretty bride with you and have her ask some questions. I've found they go out of their way to help the women, especially if they ask pertinant questions. It helps to have a bride that does not mind doing this. Yes men I am blessed. Today we are going to a gun show in Knoxville and it was her idea. Yes she has sisters for a small fee I will forward their numbers.
regards
Jim

redneck2
November 26, 2005, 11:07 AM
another thought for "all salespeople are stupid"

had a guy come in that wanted to get a CCW for his wife (so he said). Started looking at full size S&W's in .40. These were full size auto pistols and she had small hands. He's drooling over them, and she's rolling her eyes and giving me this "please help me" look.

There is no way in hell she's going to carry a full size. I "accidentally" came up with a Kel-Tec in .380. She lit up and really liked it. Could have dropped it in her coat pocket and at least had it with her.

He had a hissy fit, and ended up getting the S&W that he "knew" she had to have

Until you've worked behind the counter, you can't believe the number of stupid people you'll encounter. Not beginners or newbies (everybody has to start somewhere), not people unfamiliar with shooting or even a particular firearm or shooting sport (nobody knows everything about everything)

I mean flat stupid people. And it seems the more stupid they are, the more stubborn they are

Declaration Day
November 26, 2005, 11:30 AM
another thought for "all salespeople are stupid"


Nobody here said that all salespeople are stupid.

redneck2
November 26, 2005, 12:08 PM
Some of the guys there are such LEO wanna bees it makes me sick. they cant recommend let alone help you with any ballistics info

Geez, sorry if I don't know the trajectory of every bullet caliber, brand, and weight out to 500 yards

Most of the Sporting Goods Stores, Cabela's, Gander Mountain, Dicks, Sportsmans Warehouse, don't pay enough to get, let alone retain Knowledgable staff. They are usually idiots who don't know how to find their butts with both hands free.

Yeah my mistake. Not stupid. Arrogant and rude would be a better description

I'd agree that some sales people are in need of a "tune-up". Then again, if you get a chance to work the other side of the counter for a day or two, you'll see my side...guaranteed. I had co-workers tell me this before I started but I had a hard time believing it. I sure do now

migoi
November 26, 2005, 01:04 PM
I'm fairly lucky. There are 5 gun shops on the island plus Sports Authority has a small selection of long guns and ammo. Of the 5, I am on first name basis with the owners of two. I regularly visit those two, the other three I'll stop in if I'm in the neighborhood.

I've always been treated fairly by both the owners and the employees of both the shops I frequent. Both have given me better deals than I've asked for on occasion and thrown in free stuff.

As far as the kicking tires thing. If I'm out kicking tires to look for a gun to fill a need (but not quite sure which one I exactly want), I will always buy something (even if it's just 50 rounds of 9mm) before I leave the shop. There is always something you need: bottle of Hoppes, 50 rounds of ammo, etc. The order you do things is important also... pick up the small item, gaze into the case, ask to see whatever it is you're interested in. If you are not decided you can leave without anyone feeling their time has been wasted with the following: "Yeah, I just ran in to pick up (whatever it was you have in your hand), I better keep myself out of trouble and just stick to this." I've also found that if I decide to go ahead and buy a gun that day...whatever the small thing I was picking up suddenly becomes gratis.

I'm not sure how things are on the mainland, but here it is in my best interest to develop a good relationship with the gunshops and support them enough to keep them in business.

migoi

TheEgg
November 26, 2005, 05:32 PM
I sympathize with the gun store folks who have to deal with strange customers all day long.:rolleyes:

However, here are some rules to follow if you want my business -- they should not be hard to follow:

1. Talk to me within, say, five minutes after I enter your shop, even if it is to say "Sorry, we are really swamped today, it will be a while before I can help you. Please feel free to browse around, until we can talk."

2. Don't be afraid to say "I don't know, but I will try to find out".

3. Don't ignore customers in favor of gossiping with your friends.

4. If I want a .45 acp handgun, don't try to sell me a .500 Nitro Express safari rifle.

5. Don't argue with me and tell me that there is no such thing as (whatever) when it is on the shelf behind your head.

6. I am not interested in your politics, your social life, your sexual expoits, or how much you had to drink last night. Please leave such out of our conversation.

7. Purchasing a $2,000 firearm from you 2 days ago is probably a pretty good indication that I am not trying to just waste your time when I ask to look at another gun. Go ahead and make believe that you are happy to show me that gun, even if you are not.

8. If a customer makes you a price offer, even if you think it is ridiculous, don't get mad: You can just say "no, thanks".

There, now we can all be happy.:D

charliemopic
December 26, 2005, 11:40 PM
I've been into several gun stores, gun shops, whatever around here and the employees act like security people. Here you must to have your IL. FOID card on the counter when you handle a gun. Sales ppl houver around you as you examine a firearm. Their eyes dart around the room as they sort of half way pay attention to you.
I do my own research and when I make a purchase I know exactly what I'm looking for and what to look for.

IndianaDean
December 26, 2005, 11:53 PM
Here in Indy, Plainfield Shooting Supplies is absolutely the best. Bob, the owner, is the greatest guy in the world. Everyone there is very friendly, Bob offers great prices, very good prices on trades. And they always treat their customers with respect. I always see the same coming from customers toward them.
I see the same guys hanging out in there. They remind me of Hank, Dale, etc on King of the Hill.
So I count myself lucky to have one of the good shops.

dodge
December 27, 2005, 10:34 AM
My son (22 yrs old) went into my favorite gunshop to handle some rifles and a new clerk told him he didn't know how to handle a rifle which p.o.'d him right off but another clerk there who knew who he was straighted the first clerk out in no time. The first clerk just seen a young man that has tattoos and wears his hat backwards. My son has been going into that store with me every since he was 2 or 3 and able to walk.

1911 guy
December 27, 2005, 11:09 AM
We had two good shops here, now we got one. Both are "mom & pop" affairs, concrete floors and all. But, several years ago, "Pop" from one shop had a VERY massive heart attack and died. "Mom" kept the store, but now stocks frilly doo-dads and will order firearms if you pay in full when you order. A couple boxes of ammo on a shelf, some oddball reloading stuff that quite literally has dust on it. The other shop, named "Stockers", is owned by an opiniated, overweight, cigar smoking retiree who will bend over backward to make a sale, will hang up on vendors to talk to a new customer, knows guns, knows people who know what he doesn't, always has a good selection of new and used stuff and treated my wife like a queen when she was shopping for a CCW pistol. My wife was looking for snap caps for her .380 ACP, couldn't find them anywhere (req'd for the CCW course she took). This guy made phone calls, drove to another shop, bought them, and GAVE them to my wife because she was taking the course at his shop and he didn't stock what he said she needed. It's been a long time since I've been to the other shop.

Kurt_M
December 27, 2005, 11:58 AM
I sympathize with the gun store folks who have to deal with strange customers all day long.:rolleyes:

However, here are some rules to follow if you want my business -- they should not be hard to follow:

All right, fair enough. Here's a few rules to follow if you don't want those gun store folks cursing you under their breath as they fill out your 4473.

1. I'm a fellow citizen, not your servant. A little bit of courtesy goes a long way.

2. Don't be surprised or get angry if I don't know everything about every firearm ever made. If I don't know something, I'll be happy to find it for you if you'll have a little patience.

3. You are NOT the only customer in the store, especially the week before rifle season starts here in NW Pennsylvania. If you wait until the day before the season starts, don't be surprised if you have to wait 45 minutes to get a hunting license.

4. Yes, I'm a college age kid. That does not mean that I know nothing about the guns that I'm selling. I'm also not your kid, so don't talk to me as if I am.

5. Don't get angry at me because you have to provide ID and fill out two forms to buy a handgun. If you want this to change, then write to your congressman. In the meantime, here's a pen, let me know if there's anything on the form you don't understand.

6. Also, don't get angry at me because your background check takes a while, or is delayed. Again, I don't make these rules, I just make sure the paperwork is filled out properly.

7. Knowing the name of the store's owner doesn't make you royalty. If you want to be treated as such, go marry a princess.

8. Don't abuse the store's firearms. Again, don't abuse the store's firearms. That means don't dry-fire them without at least asking first, don't drop magazines on the floor or counter, and don't snap the cylinder closed on revolvers. Capiche?

9. Don't hover around asking stupid questions and second-guessing everything I do while I mount a scope on your rifle. It's not helpful, in fact it's quite distracting.

There, now we can all be happy. :p ;)

Arkie
December 27, 2005, 12:22 PM
I've been to a few stores in this part of the country and I have settled on one. Really nice folks and they really know their guns. They have never tried to push something on me that I didn't like.
"cept that S & W .500 which I couldn't even hardly hold up" :) He said it would make a good CCW gun for me. LOL.

Everytime I go in to look they always ask me which one I want to take home and act like they are going to ring it up. :p

I went to one and he did have a great selection but he was too busy with his burger to help anyone and his wife was too busy watching you to see if you were going to take something. I hate to even touch something in stores like that.

allmons
December 27, 2005, 12:45 PM
Why customer service really matters. True automobile story - I was in College in the 70's, also working full time after classes. Spent 3 years saving money for a new car. Went to BUY one of the new, fast selling Honda cars. The salesman was rude and condescending, but I really wanted a new Honda.
Remember, CASH in pocket, I tried to negotiate with him.

I don't know if he was having a bad day, didn't like the way I looked or thought my questions were stupid - and I DON"T CARE. All I know is that I will still not buy or even look at a Honda vehicle more than 30 years later.

It is also telling that the Dealership went out of business in the early '80's

This one rude salesman cost Honda my business for more than 30 years. I have bought many cars since then, but not a single Honda.

Hate your customers all you want, salesmen - consider them rude, ignorant or a waste of your time - but some of us will not ever buy from you or your company. If your job is important to you, the customer is the ONLY thing that matters.

With three large, well stocked gun stores in my area, I spend my money with the store that treats me best.

:)

Zundfolge
December 27, 2005, 12:46 PM
...for every rude and arrogant salesmen there are just as many rude and arrogant customers...
I've worked in retail before (not firearms, but in many ways retail is retail). Sure there are rude customers, but its not the customer's "job" to be nice ... it is the salesman's, however.

Did you go in the store to buy a gun or make friends?
Do you work in a gun store to make friends?

This is a simple business transaction, person A wants person B to give them money for product. Simple. It is primarily the responsibility of the salesman to facilitate this transaction and it is the salesman (and his boss the shop owner) who suffer most if the transaction doesn't happen.

I can surely sympathize with those who work behind a counter in retail, its not the easiest or most glamorous job, but when it comes to gun shops I think the percentage of bad sales people vs. bad customers is MUCH less balanced than other retail businesses.

Part of the problem is that a large percentage of gun shops are run by guys for whom guns are their hobby ... they are not business men, but are hobbyists with a store front. Also, just because you know something about something doesn't mean you can sell it ... sales is a specialized skill (doesn't matter if its guns, cars, home electronics or hamburgers), its a skill I recognize that I don't posses, which is why I don't do it professionally.

Of course for me living here in Colorado Springs, I'm spoiled ... we have several good gun shops with friendly, helpful people behind the counters.


I still find these kind of threads ironic since there are so many "Buy at your local shop to avoid the idiots behind the gun counter at [insert big box store name here]" threads here :p

VinnyT
December 27, 2005, 01:01 PM
Here in Roanoke, Va, there are several good dealers. As I was browsing, two young guys already in the store was asking tons of questions to the clerk. They're all nice guys and was politely answering them. I was talking to another guy there about Houge grips. The guys then asked if they are having a CCW soon(they also have defense classes). "Yup, 2 weeks". Guy one:"Cool, we would like to sign up". Clerk:"Have a pistol?" Guy two:"Nope, we're both 19 years old". The poor clerk explained that you need to be 21 to legally own a pistol and to be part of the class. The guys then left. The clerk just shakes his head. I guess I can understand the frustration on the clerks part. Some people should have some sort of a clue before entering a gun store. The guy I was talking with said "All the time". Apparentlly this happens a lot. But they all are still friendly. Oy vey!

Kramer Krazy
December 27, 2005, 01:18 PM
We have a bunch of decent shops in our area, but we frequent them a lot, so they recognize us when Missashot and I walk in. Our recent problem was yesterday. We had some Xmas money that was burning a hole in our pocket and most of the shops were closed because of the Holidays. One shop won't even reopen until the 2nd, so.....we'll have to hang on to the money a little longer.

Nematocyst
December 27, 2005, 01:40 PM
There are actually two shops in my town, but one is so far from me that I rarely go there. And that one rarely if ever has what I'm looking for anyway. (It's actually an indoor shooting range with a gun shop on the side. "We don't have it but can order it for you," is a frequent refrain that I hear when I call up to ask if they have a particular gun.)

So, the one I do frequent is just up the street from me. I often bike there.

They've been in business there for over 30 years. It's owned by an older fellow, sometimes nice, sometimes sort of flippantly crusty - the only one of the bunch that sometimes seems a bit impatient with my questions - but he's only there (or at least only seen) during about 40% of my visits.

The remainder of the ten or so guys (why so few women in gun sales?) who work there (~five at any one time) are ostensibly experienced, knowledgeable, patient & trusting. At least three are down right kind & friendly; the others are mostly professional. All are 30ish or older.

They NEVER rush me, demonstrate impatience (with the one exception noted above) or hard sell me on guns. (Ammo is different for some reason; they seem to have favorite brands, loadings & strong opinions about ammo. Funny that.)

With guns, I'm allowed to take as much time looking and handling as I wish. They never run short of patience when I ask to see 'that other gun that you just put back in the case one more time', even during busy times. They patiently allow me to ask for differences of opinions among the different employees about makes, models and such. In fact, they seem to enjoy it when differences of opinion pop up.

I've learned that the best times to get good service are NOT Saturdays & weekedays after 5 when the 9-5 crowd pours in after work. (They're open until 6.)

Their prices may be a few bucks above Wally World & Bimart, but I've yet to buy a any of my four guns at the latter two. I'd rather pay extra for the help, advice & selection they offer at my store.

I did buy my shotgun from an out of state dealer, but only because the specific model with the specific features that I was looking for was unavailable for months through their distributors. I gave them the FFL.

Overall, I couldn't ask for a better shop. I congratulate them on their professionalism & knowledge.

Nem

Essex County
December 27, 2005, 02:37 PM
One shop I frequent has expanded dramaticly. It's a rare occaison when the owners present or even the manager, who is bussier than a beaver. The three new counterpersons have limited knowledge and will freely admit it. They will go way out of their way to get the answers, check price and availability, etc. I have a lot of respect for these guys. I do a lot of my shopping over the phone and my calls always get returned, with an answer. I'd be pleased to have any of them an employee. It's called attitude and they will go the extra mile. In a former lifetime I've been a stocking dealer and had to put up with the pompus and arrogant to make a sale. Sometimes it's not easy to bite your tongue..............Essex

Demariana
December 27, 2005, 02:46 PM
I am really new to shooting. I have been to the range 3 times and only to a gun store about 5 times. Usually with a guy friend. I know I am still learning and tire kicking. I will back off asking to see a gun if someone else is around because I know at this point I do not have the funds to purchase a gun.

I finally went into a local store by myself. It actually took for me some courage to do this. Only people there were the 2 employees and they were filling out forms for something. There was a nod or 2 of hello, but no acknowledgement. I wandered around and kept coming back to one gun in the front case right beside where the 2 guys were. I bent down to get a better look. Nothing from these 2. Then a male customer walks in they said hi to each other. He basically mimicked what I was doing but in front of a different case. One of the salesmen was then over there going did you want to see anything? I just turned and gave a look that said what am I? I watched the clerk's face suddenly fall and when the other customer was like no just browsing, he turned to me and said, "Can I show you anything?" Finally I got to handle the CZ I was looking at. *grins*

I will probably go back to the store. He did apologize and we had a good talk after that. He even said he could work with me on the price since it was a used gun.

Demariana

Phantom Warrior
December 27, 2005, 04:18 PM
1. Talk to me within, say, five minutes after I enter your shop, even if it is to say "Sorry, we are really swamped today, it will be a while before I can help you. Please feel free to browse around, until we can talk."


Yes, yes, YES. This is my number one pet peeve w/ gun shops. I walked around Bill's Gun Shop and Range for 20 minutes. All around it, including downstairs to the range and police supply store. No one even said one word to me. I definitely walked out. I stole some free catalogs though.

georgeduz
December 27, 2005, 05:07 PM
i good salesman sales you everything he can,the gunshops here are very good.maybe because jersey people are so nice.

V4Vendetta
December 27, 2005, 05:50 PM
"I see the same guys hanging out in there. They remind me of Hank, Dale, etc on King of the Hill."

You probably don't know this, but I'm the real life Dale. I wear glasses & a hat, I drink Mountain Dew by the ton, I say crazy stuff about the government & love guns. Want my autograph?:D

VinnyT
December 27, 2005, 05:53 PM
"I see the same guys hanging out in there. They remind me of Hank, Dale, etc on King of the Hill."

You probably don't know this, but I'm the real life Dale. I wear glasses & a hat, I drink Mountain Dew by the ton, I say crazy stuff about the government & love guns. Want my autograph?:D
Uh, should we tell him about Red Corn? :p

Working Man
December 27, 2005, 06:00 PM
Uh, should we tell him about Red Corn? :p

He's been around so much bug spray he'd just forget by tomorrow.

fizzy
December 27, 2005, 08:04 PM
and still couldn't get any questions answered. :-)

V4Vendetta
December 27, 2005, 08:29 PM
"Uh, should we tell him about Red Corn?"

"He's been around so much bug spray he'd just forget by tomorrow."

Actually one of the few differences between me & Dale* are: I'm not married & never will be. I make leather products instead of exterminating. For $50.00 + expenses however, I will dispose of used mice traps. I don't smoke.

*Fox had to either makes some differences between us or pay me money. They went with the former.:(

Nanook
December 27, 2005, 08:55 PM
I must be blessed. No complaints with gun shops in my area. In fact, Gander Mountain just opened a store near me, and the other gun shops have gotten even nicer to people.

I walk into the biggest of the independents, and they've never tried to talk me out of or into another gun. I recently bought a Para Ordnance .45, and I looked at about 10 other models and brands. The guy patiently showed me every gun I pointed at, explained the features, and then went on to the next one. I thanked him, said I'd be back the next day. He probably said to himself, "sure you will."

The next day I did return and bought the Para. I made sure to ask for the same guy, but he wasn't in and they don't work on commission. But I'm sure the message got back to the clerk.

The next size gun shop was opened by former workers at the shop mentioned above. They always have used guns on consignment, milsurp rifles, and will order anything you want. They also carry reloading supplies, magazines, and once in a while a Barrett .50 caliber. Good people to deal with here too.

There's a smaller, newer gun shop in the town next to mine. He's been open a couple of years, and I just bought a Savage bolt gun from him. He will show you anything in his rack with no problems. Also carries the odd milsurp and used guns. A good guy too, but seems to have a couple of 'commandos' hanging around. I had one tell me what junk Dillon stuff was, I had to laugh at that since my friend and I reload with ours constantly. But the owner is a great guy to work with, no problems.

I guess I'm just lucky, or maybe it's how you hit it. I have heard the occasional horror story, just haven't experienced it yet.

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