Full Auto Handguns?


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DMK
April 3, 2003, 03:19 PM
CZ-75 Auto, Beretta 93R, Broomhandle, Scorpion, etc. What others are there?

What is the purpose of these?

Does anybody (police, military) use them effectively?

It seems to me that they would be very hard to control (anybody ever bump fire a handgun or have one slam fire?), and they would burn up ammo very quickly with only 15 to 20 round mags.

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Archie
April 3, 2003, 03:35 PM
Someone makes an attachment for a Glock converting them to full auto.
There was a Mexican 45 Auto, Mendoza, I think... was select fire.
The Mauser Broomhandle had a select fire variant.
H&K VP70Z. Lord have mercy!

The purpose of these has always been to increase "firepower" while avoiding bulkiness and weight. I don't think any of them have been considered "sucessful", either tactically or commercially.

Not to my knowledge. Then again, I'm not omniscient. The Nazi army issued the Mauser "Schnellfeuer" to motorcycle messengers. They seemed to have functioned as a rather poor submachinegun. Look really cool, but just don't cut it. There were one or two Police Depts used some kind of machine pistol in their SWAT teams. They put a lot of rounds into the air. Or ceiling.

You are correct. I'd rather have a short barreled semi-auto, or even a pistol caliber lever gun. Something with control.

ACP230
April 3, 2003, 03:55 PM
Last fall, I got to shoot a Glock 17 converted to full auto by a licensed smith. (He was right there so there was no unlawful transfer in case anyone is wondering.)

The gun was the factory ported 17 (the 17C maybe). It was loud but not uncontrollable. Over the last 10 years I've done some full auto shooting so have a fairly "educated" trigger finger. I shot three and four shot bursts and had a lot of fun.

SDC
April 3, 2003, 03:59 PM
They're a lot of FUN to shoot (and that should be enough reason for anyone), but I think the main "purpose" is more of an assassination tool than anything else; if you hose down a target at arm's length with 15 rounds or so, there's not too much likelihood that they'll survive.

M2HMGHB
April 3, 2003, 04:10 PM
I believe the stechkin(sp?) was also full automatic.

cratz2
April 3, 2003, 04:30 PM
I think the purpose may be as much for bodyguards to protect against assassinations in countries that don't value the lives of citizens too highly. Read another way, an assassin spotted in a crowd could be mowed down rather quickly, along with some of the crowd too. ;)

If I could have one to play with, I'd probably go for the Stechkin as it is supposed to be very controlable. The Glock is supposed to have quite a bit of rise as is the Beretta if not for the little flip down foward handle.

Schuey2002
April 3, 2003, 05:29 PM
What others are there?
The Glock 18 is another.;)

Hkmp5sd
April 3, 2003, 06:36 PM
I really, really, really want a G18!!


Glock on Full Auto (Quicktime) (http://www.starsol.org/ericl/g19-18.mov)

Nero Steptoe
April 3, 2003, 06:51 PM
With a little practice, the G18 is controllable.

hksw
April 3, 2003, 07:29 PM
The Beretta 951 or the Egyptian copy had a full or burst version.

BlkHawk73
April 3, 2003, 07:46 PM
The HK VP70Z was not full-auto. That was the VP70 and VP70M. They were semi-auto but with the attatchment of a butstock they could be switched for full-auto fire.

hksw
April 3, 2003, 08:14 PM
IIRC, the VP70M was 3 round burst at a rate of 2200 rpm but not full auto.

Hkmp5sd
April 3, 2003, 08:36 PM
The VP-70 and the VP-70M (for "Military") were the same gun. This gun could be fired semi-auto or 3-round burst by the addition of the stock. The selector switch was actually located on the stock, which also doubled as a holster.

The VP-70 was renamed VP-70M when H&K introduced the VP-70Z (for "Zivil"). This model was semi-auto only. It had the 3-round burst mechanism removed and did not have a stock.

blades67
April 3, 2003, 10:16 PM
The HK MP5K is one of my favorites.

seeker_two
April 3, 2003, 10:46 PM
VP-70 was full-auto only w/ the buttstock attached.

Beretta 93-R is 3-rd. burst only. No full-auto capability.

Stechkin is full-auto.

rick_reno
April 3, 2003, 11:02 PM
SAR (Small Arms Review) ran an article (might have been two (?)) on some 1911's that were converted to FA. They had detailed photo's and drawings showing how they worked.

ACP230
April 4, 2003, 12:11 AM
Small Arms Review did an article on a full auto CZ pistol too. I don't recall what issue it was, but the index is on the SAR website, www.smallarmsreview.com.

Seeker
April 4, 2003, 02:06 AM
Seems I read somewhere that there was a BHP varient that was F/A.

WonderNine
April 4, 2003, 02:18 AM
I really, really, really want a G18!!

Your government masters have decided you cannot have one.

DMK
April 4, 2003, 01:13 PM
Seems to be a popular topic! I guess every one of us yearns for a little full auto action now and then.

I always thought that little CZ vz.61 Skorpion would be fun. It's a fairly large gun for that little 32ACP round.

http://www.the22ndsas.com/Weapons/non_permitted/vz61.jpg

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