Shooting Guns Underwater?


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1911JMB
December 20, 2005, 08:29 PM
What guns work underwater? There is the self explanitory issue of rapid velocity loss, but what guns and what types of ammo work underwater, and how well? I have no intention of trying this, but I am simply curious.

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jerkface11
December 20, 2005, 08:44 PM
I don't know about conventional guns and ammo under water but here are some special ones.

http://world.guns.ru/assault/as69-e.htm

http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg140-e.htm

HK also makes an underwater pistol.

Azrael256
December 20, 2005, 09:56 PM
Anything that uses cased ammo which is properly sealed will at least fire underwater. You might have to beef up whatever spring pushes the hammer to overcome extra water resistance, but other than that, it should work.

Getting it to work reliably might be another issue. I could see a semi-auto jamming from the water resistance against the slide, and I guess there might be a problem with anything gas-operated.

Revolvers should do reasonably well, though.

Can'thavenuthingood
December 20, 2005, 10:02 PM
My dealer has 3 photo's of a couple guys shooting a Glock under water this last summer. Wanted to see if it worked. Worked fine.

Vick

Steve499
December 20, 2005, 10:19 PM
The pressure generated by the round moving down a water filled bore is greater than the normal pressure when a round is fired. It would be possible to shoot underwater but probably inadvisable to do so since pressure spiking could well cause a blow up unless the particular firearm has enough of a safety factor built in or has been designed to be used that way.

Steve

eab
December 20, 2005, 11:19 PM
One of the supposed selling points I have heard for a Glocks are that you can fire them underwater.

oneslowgun
December 21, 2005, 01:39 AM
One of the supposed selling points I have heard for a Glocks are that you can fire them underwater.

This requires "special" water-proof cups for the firing pin,( so the firing pin isn't slowed by the water ) and as far as I know, are only available for the 9MM full, and mid-size Glocks ( G17 and G19.) As a side note, you REALLY want your head to be OUT of the water when firing a so equiped Glock! :)

jtward01
December 21, 2005, 02:04 AM
Supposedly any of the so-called underwater guns are meant to be fired from just below the surface at a target above water so a diver can sneak up on a sentry or such and pop him with the sound being kept underwater. Shooting at an underwater target is almost useless because the effective range is so limited, or at least that's what I've been told.

chopinbloc
December 21, 2005, 02:19 AM
The pressure generated by the round moving down a water filled bore is greater than the normal pressure when a round is fired.

well, yes and no. water doesn't weigh nearly as much as lead so the pressure difference isn't likely to be that big of a deal with low velocity rounds.

i was dumb enough to try this with three handguns: a g27, a kimber bp ten II and a ruger sp-101 in .357, though i used .38 loads. all three functioned perfectly. i used the g27 mostly and found that after about ten minutes under water the ammunition i was using would no longer funtion. i presume that cartridges with sealed primer pockets would have faired better. any military surplus or wolf ammo would probably last quite a while under water. the maximum depth was about three feet. i would absolutely NOT recommend trying this with any rifle as the pressures are much higher to begin with. it's also probably not a good idea to try with hollow point or magnum rounds. for fun, i put on goggles and tried to hit a soda can full of rocks and sand at about five feet - i couldn't see any further. if i hit it, it didn't notice. i am confident that if someone dragged me into a pool to drown, my pistol would work. at contact distance, i'm sure there wouldn't really be any difference in penetration.

Quote:
One of the supposed selling points I have heard for a Glocks are that you can fire them underwater.


This requires "special" water-proof cups for the firing pin


nah, i think that might have been true of older glocks but mine had no problems. if you look at the underside of the slide when it's disassembled, you'll see a small hole just behind the breechface and off to the side of the firing pin channel. this hole goes through to the firing pin and it allows water to flow out when the striker is relaesed. this may be unique to the newer models, it may not, but the pistols - the .40 cal subcompact, anyway - work just fine underwater.



in the tradition of box 'o truth, what did we learn?
handguns work just fine underwater.
underwater marksmanship is not easy.
shooting stuff is fun.

steveno
December 21, 2005, 05:50 AM
here we go again. if you want to shoot under water get a spear gun

DevLcL
December 21, 2005, 06:08 AM
Right then. On to the next question, where can one get a semi-auto spear gun?

-Dev

1 old 0311
December 21, 2005, 06:44 AM
Gun battles under water? Hell it happens to me ALL the time:neener: :neener: :neener: :neener: :neener: :neener:

Flipper

jerkface11
December 21, 2005, 04:13 PM
The S might HTF while you're at the pool. Or snorkling in the bahamas. I suggest that everyone get a SHTF speargun and snorkle.

Gunpacker
December 21, 2005, 04:29 PM
I'm taking my Gold Cup in case I meet Jaws. :D

Arethusa
December 21, 2005, 04:34 PM
As a side note, you REALLY want your head to be OUT of the water when firing a so equiped Glock!
Definitely. I've seen it in bad action movies and I've seen it talked about. People never seem to realize what sound is and what that means in a nerly uncompressable medium like water. Fire a gun underwater and you will go deaf.

.45Guy
December 21, 2005, 04:36 PM
There is an out of print magazine entitled "Gung Ho," that did a write up on this subject in the early eighties. Even a S&W .357 worked without a hitch submerged. I'll attempt to scan and post the article.

waterhouse
December 21, 2005, 04:49 PM
chopinbloc, were your ears underwater when you put the goggles on and tried this? If so, what did it sound like and was there and damage to your ears?

just curious.

Mot45acp
December 21, 2005, 05:43 PM
According to the Brady Bunch The 5.7 will penetrate the body armor worn by the president while inside his tank/limo while being fired from a depth of 20,000 leagues under the sea in the pacific by a child who picked the lock on the gun,and gunsafe:evil:

rwc
December 21, 2005, 11:02 PM
Some "freedivers" carry Glocks as a defense against shark attacks. These are the guys with long spear guns who go "snorkling" to spear fish. Really, really, really big fish. The rules of the game are no supplemental air, a speargun, and a float. They routinely dive in the 60- 100' depth range. Death from blacking out on the way to the surface is not uncommon. Freedivers have been eaten. They also carry bang-sticks which are 12 ga. shells rigged to discharge when pressed against a shark.

Lucky
December 21, 2005, 11:16 PM
Supposedly any of the so-called underwater guns are meant to be fired from just below the surface at a target above water so a diver can sneak up on a sentry or such and pop him with the sound being kept underwater. Shooting at an underwater target is almost useless because the effective range is so limited, or at least that's what I've been told.

Doesn't light get refracted so that where you would be aiming wouldn't be where the guard is?

Definitely. I've seen it in bad action movies and I've seen it talked about. People never seem to realize what sound is and what that means in a nerly uncompressable medium like water. Fire a gun underwater and you will go deaf.

Are you sure? In the air it's gas-on-gas action, maybe the rules change when it's in the water.

chopinbloc
December 22, 2005, 05:06 AM
waterhouse,

yes, my head was completely underwater. it was loud, but not nearly as loud as out of the water. this may have been because there was air trapped in my ears and the water was not acting directly on my ear drums but i wouldn't presume to know. the recoil impulse against my hand was much sharper. i hypothesize that while shock waves may be more powerful underwater, they don't travel nearly as far. btw, when my head was above the water and the gun below, it was much quiter than normal. i doubt the sound would carry very far.

C-grunt
December 22, 2005, 06:37 AM
Another thing to worry about. My step father did this and was peeing blood for three days because of the pressure waves hitting his kidneys.

shermacman
December 22, 2005, 06:47 AM
It was on a hot day, this past August, when I jumped into the shallow end of our pool. I was wearing my trusty black, tacticle Speedo and my S&W .357 wheelie. The first six rounds were .38 wad cutters. All fired, all traveled about 6 feet and dropped to the pool bottom. The bullets exhibited no expansion. The second six were full party house hand loaded .357 rounds. Same deal, they traveled a couple of feet farther but no more than eight total.

My head was out of the water, the sound was like a thump, no one in the house heard a thing. I was underwhelmed.

I had better never catch my kids trying some stoopid stunt like that!

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