housing discrimination due to gun ownership!


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gunsmith
December 29, 2005, 05:22 AM
I had rented a studio here in Reno (yesterday) and was going to move my stuff in today.
I gave the managment company a check for all the cost of moving in plus a credit check fee. I was told I could move in today, so when I get there the manager said her supervisor needed to talk to me (about why I needed guns!) at nine tomorrow ...and I couldn't move intill then!!!
I had asked about security and if they had trouble or break ins, I was wearing an NRA hat and the subject came up:banghead:
I told her I was expecting to move in now, and I don't have time to talk to anyone at nine in the moring without a weeks warning and I better be getting paid for it as well. She went on about how her boss wanted to make sure I had a license and stuff (I was begining to have steam coming out of my ears)
I told her that in NV the Constitution is my license & that I now want my checks back, & told her she just lost a great tenant who has passed numerous background checks...she was shocked and said "oh ok please move in...& then told me that the studio I had agreed to was rented but there was another smaller! unit I could have:fire: for the same price!!!:fire: .......can you bring a lawsuit over this kind of thing??

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Mad Chemist
December 29, 2005, 06:05 AM
If you signed any lease or contract then you should start looking for a lawyer.

bowline
December 29, 2005, 07:26 AM
If they cannot return your check, they cashed it. The company accepted money for the transaction. Odds are you have a contract.
Don't know if you would have the time to find another place, but darned if I'd want to live in that studio now anyway.
I think it would be worth finding a lawyer, and another apartment, in that order. Lessee....
Original monies paid
Nonperformance (delayed allowing the move, and denied the original lease)
Time lost (time is money)
Damages
Court and legal fees

Good luck!

DunedinDragon
December 29, 2005, 08:48 AM
This is a civil contracts case. No need for a lawyer if you want to settle it in small claims court. You didn't say whether or not you accepted the smaller apartment. If you did, then you accepted the terms of the new contract and you no longer have a cause of action.

If, on the other hand, you did NOT accept the smaller apartment, then they are guilty of breaking the contract and you can receive any damages that resulted from that. Certainly you are due your deposit back, it's questionable whether or not you can get time lost from work unless you had to re-schedule a new day off in order to move to a new place. Basically, it's whatever money you are out because of their failure to abide by the contract. No pain and suffering or aggravation in a contracts case.

It doesn't really matter if it's actually written into the contract about the specific apartment. If they represented that apartment as being the one you would move into, then that was part of the verbal contract that existed between you. IF, and that's a big IF, you can prove fraud (they NEVER intended to rent you that apartment even though though they represented they were) then you can get punitive damages. But that would be pretty hard to prove.

If you win in court you get court costs.

Bubbles
December 29, 2005, 09:13 AM
Check your state laws. IIRC in some states it's illegal for landlords to put "no guns" clauses in the lease.

Firethorn
December 29, 2005, 09:33 AM
So they gave out the apartment they had agreed to rent you, on the day you were to move in? A conversation with a guy wanting to talk about "licenses"?

Sounds almost like somebody is a california transplant and found somebody willing to pay more money.

HankB
December 29, 2005, 09:47 AM
IANAL but if you signed a contract for an apartment, and they decided to rent to someone else after the contract was signed, just mention the term "specific performance."

It sounds like they're going to owe you some money.

Master Blaster
December 29, 2005, 10:09 AM
Get a copy of the landlord tennant code for your state, call the division of consumer affairs. It will tell you what to do to file a complaint.

In my state this violation of the code, would be a slam dunk for the tennant, and the landlord would be required to pay triple damages.
That means he would have to return the money and pay three times the amount you gave him.

Make the landlord put in writing his offer for the smaller place and notify you in writing that he leased the apartment he rented you to someone else.

Send him a registered letter today documenting what happened and requesting a written response within 24 hours. That is to cover your tail so he cant turn this into a he said deal. Knock on the door and see if someone is in your apartment. Document.

Lupinus
December 29, 2005, 10:15 AM
Take him to Judge Judy :neener:

ARperson
December 29, 2005, 10:21 AM
As a landlord of many units, I can say that it is NOT illegal for landlords or apartment complexes to deny tenants gun ownership on the property. Owning a gun is not one of the protected classes and it is private property; the owners can dictate who and/or what lives on it up to the point where they start discriminating based on the protected classes. But up to that point, anything goes.

Your only hope is that you didn't accept the smaller unit and you had a contract specifically stating you were to rent the larger unit (a specific address would be your best defense). Then you have a chance. You'll need to know what the small claims court maximum dollar amount is in your city/county/state because depending on what you ask for, you may have to go into the regular (called superior courts here) court system.

Additionally, unless you know that the judge is pro-RKBA, I wouldn't bring up the reason they tried to rent you the smaller unit instead of the larger one. As we all know, judges can let their personal feelings get in the way of their rulings, and if he agrees with the apartment complex, then he's likely to rule against you based on his RKBA opinions rather that the actually law. Besides, since they CAN discriminate based on gun ownership, it doesn't matter if that was the reason.

Now, if you can make a case that they were discriminating against you because of some other reason, say one of the protected classes (race, color, religion, creed, age, handicap, sex (not to be confused with sexual orientation), you might get a little farther. Of course, if you're a healthy white male, you're hosed. :neener:

mbt2001
December 29, 2005, 11:00 AM
Well, at you have THE HIGH ROAD... :what: nice pun.... :)

Anyway, that loser of a landlord is going to have to live with his sissy self for the rest of his life. Every time he jumps in the night because he hears a strange sound and every time he makes his wife go check on strange noises it will come to him... that he is a sissy... and you are not... and it will never change...

So he will hate himself more and take it out on other folks MORE and enventually get in trouble, because no one likes sissies... Yeah we laugh at them at parties, but no one really likes them. :evil:

Guy B. Meredith
December 29, 2005, 01:21 PM
Uh, bait and switch? Not legal in most commercial pursuits.

gunsmith
December 29, 2005, 04:03 PM
I got my checks back & refused to move into the smaller unit, now I've got all my clothes in the back of the pick up, it's thursday and I've got to be out on new years day:cuss: I hate moving
I was hoping I could say it was political discrimination, I guess it's ok to discriminate against independent conservatives who vote Republican.
If I am ever in the position to rent apt's I'm going to have to insist that only gun toting conservatives may move in.
Anyway on top of the million other things I've got to do like move, get a new job, get a new computer I've also got to look into small claims

Standing Wolf
December 29, 2005, 08:30 PM
If you go to small claims court, you should bring along receipts for all the additional expenses you incurred as a result of the landlord's breach of contract.

Best of success, eh?

F4GIB
December 29, 2005, 08:49 PM
As a landlord of many units, I can say that it is NOT illegal for landlords or apartment complexes to deny tenants gun ownership on the property.

Maybe in Indiana. But have you seen Minnesota Statutes section 624.714, subdivision 17 (e) which says "A landlord may not restrict the lawful carry or possession of firearms by tenants or their guests" ?

odysseus
December 29, 2005, 08:53 PM
OK, well it seems it may be resolved since they gave money back and the deal seems closed. You might still get something in small claims court for expenses (damages) this debacle entailed, but you might not get anything and it might not be worth much. Anyway - who would wants to live with them.

A couple of points anyway for the disussion:

You say "about why I needed guns!". So did they ask you before hand? How did they know you had them? (BTW when I rented, it never came up, it never mattered, so it was private). If I were ever asked I would simply just not answer.

I am a some-time landlord for investment properties on the side, and I have been a renter too. I know both sides of this. Bottomline, it is true as someone mentioned here that a landlord could clause "no guns" and get away with it since it is not worth anyone's time fighting it, BUT it HAS TO BE in the contract. Just like any rule preventing something that is legal, but prohibited by the management. It's a DEAL MADE between two parties. That's why there are clauses in there about pets, noise, additions, etc. All my contracts I give or was given has these - it's the only legal way a landlord can do this since , it is a DEAL made. Of course, state laws trump any deal specifically addressed.

Sounds like what they did to you was bait and switch, with an "excuse" based on a flimsy claim of a "no gun" clause which I assume from what you wrote was no where on the contract, which I also assumed you and them already signed a contract since you were on your way to moving in. Bad business.

It's BS, but can happen. Sounds like it turned into a PITA, but renting can be this way.

gunsmith
December 30, 2005, 08:57 PM
the only way to get a place before new years was to offer 1st, deposit & febuary rent!!!....
next week I will go to small claims and file and post the phone number here so you guys can tell them what for.

hillbilly
December 30, 2005, 10:04 PM
Once you get moved somewhere, and get this thing settled, I think you should post the name of the landlord, his address, his email address, and complete list of the properties this loser rents out.

I think you should, at the very least, contact the NRA about this and see what legal advice you get there.

Make this loser pay, big time.

hillbilly

ARperson
December 31, 2005, 09:36 AM
Maybe in Indiana. But have you seen Minnesota Statutes section 624.714, subdivision 17 (e) which says "A landlord may not restrict the lawful carry or possession of firearms by tenants or their guests" ?

I guess I forgot to add the UNSPOKEN caveat that individual governmental entities may have seen the light; but as a rule, it is not illegal. Not like race or religion or similar classes.

AirForceShooter
December 31, 2005, 10:54 AM
How does the LandLord know???

AFS

CAnnoneer
December 31, 2005, 12:07 PM
+1 Standing Wolf

Breach of contract, incurred expenses, harassment, mental anguish, discrimination, etc. Get a good lawyer and hammer them the way they deserve.

whm1974
December 31, 2005, 01:59 PM
Bottomline, it is true as someone mentioned here that a landlord could clause "no guns" and get away with it since it is not worth anyone's time fighting it, BUT it HAS TO BE in the contract. Just like any rule preventing something that is legal

How does the LandLord know???

In areas where gun ownership is very common how does a landlord expect to enforce this? This has to be one of the most inorged clauses.

-Bill

odysseus
December 31, 2005, 06:31 PM
In areas where gun ownership is very common how does a landlord expect to enforce this? This has to be one of the most inorged clauses.

-Bill

Agreed. And personally, I have never seen one with a clause like this against guns nor have known of anyone who has seen them. However I have heard of them. Must be rare from what I can tell. It's ridiculous anyway.

whm1974
January 1, 2006, 04:15 PM
Agreed. And personally, I have never seen one with a clause like this against guns nor have known of anyone who has seen them. However I have heard of them. Must be rare from what I can tell. It's ridiculous anyway.

When I signed a rental contract last year it did have a clause that my landlord isn't responable for any AD or misuse of firearms I may have on the property.

His mother put it in due a section 8 tenten that had a habit of threatening people by claiming she had a gun.

-Bill

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