BATF Admits NFRTR Database Is Flawed


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Bubbles
December 31, 2005, 08:26 AM
A while back Rep. Jim Gibbons requested the Congressional Research Staff to put together a memo concerning the NFRTR (NFA database) and reported abuses, missing information, etc.

The CRS compiled the memo and Jim Gibbons has released it. It is a long document available at CRS NFRTR Memo (http://www.nfaoa.org/documents/CRSmemoNFRTR0001.pdf). Again, this is a big download (20+ MB) and contains a lot of information never before released.

This document shows coverups, deliberate illegal changes to the NFRTR database, and brings to light questionable practices of the BATF. It has also been sent to a email list for defense attorneys. After reviewing it, many believe that it shows grounds for appeal for every NFA-related conviction since the 1986 machine-gun ban was enacted (over 13,000).

Constitutional attorneys Halbrook & Jeffries have seen it and they are salivating. The ACLU may also get involved - not over RKBA issues - but because they are big on "false imprisonment" cases.

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El Tejon
December 31, 2005, 09:18 AM
FINALLY! Hooray! Huzah!:D :cool: This is going to be good.

I don't know about "all" convictions? Think that may be overstatement, but more than a few will be overturned.:)

Politically, we need to milk this. Time for amnesty and federal preemption.

Firethorn
December 31, 2005, 09:47 AM
Federal Pre-emption? Isn't that where we got the who NFA mess from in the first place?

I want to see the '86 ban on new registrations thrown right out.

Then we can work on the rest of it.

El Tejon
December 31, 2005, 10:19 AM
Fire, no, the NFA did not preempt the states thus the California, etc. bans. We need preemption to void state law.

I do not think this report will thaw the May '86 "freeze", but it is one more spear in the NFA's flank.:)

txgho1911
December 31, 2005, 12:53 PM
Could a federal Premption throw out every states statute against the ownership and carry of firearms? I bet it could if it was worded correctly.
I doubt it would make it out of commitee in the current legislature.
Not with it's current makeup of RINOs.

Bubbles
December 31, 2005, 03:57 PM
I don't know about "all" convictions? Think that may be overstatement, but more than a few will be overturned.


Actually, yes, that's the current thought considering that in all NFA cases there has been testimony given by the BATF that the NFRTR was highly-accurate or 100% correct.

Crosshair
December 31, 2005, 07:55 PM
OOO, I love karma.:) Is there going to be a collection for some of those that want to apeal, but need money for legal fees?

Link apears to be broken?

Johnnybgood
December 31, 2005, 08:11 PM
They have an article in which they state that they with our help hope to put the BATFE out of buisness. Long reach? Maybe. But we won't know unless we try.

AZRickD
December 31, 2005, 10:47 PM
Yep, that jpfo.org site is fun (in a sad kind of way). Makes me glad I'm a member.

The BATF(E) was, is and always will be a pathetic organization run by thugs.

I wish jfpo.org much luck in ending the fed.gov funding of that pathetic group of twits.

Rick

The Freeholder
January 1, 2006, 10:45 PM
Just bumpin' it back to the top. This one needs to be seen by all.

AZRickD
January 1, 2006, 11:22 PM
Prediction: Heads will *not* roll at BATF&E.

Rick

txgho1911
January 2, 2006, 10:11 AM
Heads will only roll from a constitutional correction.

LAK
January 2, 2006, 10:19 AM
The tax collection agency otherwise known as the BATFE needs to be abolished. It serves no useful purpose and is a waste of an enormous amount public money. Not to mention some other issues.
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Old Fuff
January 2, 2006, 11:32 AM
The tax collection agency otherwise known as the BATFE needs to be abolished. It serves no useful purpose and is a waste of an enormous amount public money. Not to mention some other issues.

Yes, but the anti-gunner's both in and out of Congress see the agency as a valuable tool. If you combine the radical-left Democrats and RINO it becomes clear that we don't have the numbers we need to do what you (and most of the rest of us) would like to see. This is one reason that the BATF&E behaves the way it does.

jpIII
January 2, 2006, 10:05 PM
Bubbles,

Thanks for posting this. I plan to read it front to back.

jpIII

NorthernExtreme
January 2, 2006, 10:12 PM
10 to 1 nothing happens to any government official (jail / fired / resign). And 10 to1 says the BATFE will get more money, power, and people to help correct the problem. :what:

Just you wait and see.

Regards,

LAK
January 4, 2006, 10:24 AM
Yes, but the anti-gunner's both in and out of Congress see the agency as a valuable tool. If you combine the radical-left Democrats and RINO it becomes clear that we don't have the numbers we need to do what you (and most of the rest of us) would like to see. This is one reason that the BATF&E behaves the way it does.
Certainly. This is just another of the many manifestations of the two-headed beast known alternately as the "democratic" or the "republican" party.
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Old Fuff
January 4, 2006, 12:04 PM
Looking back over 50 years it's always been that way. The Republicans are made up of "Conservatives" and "Progressives" (which are names they pick for themselves). The Democrats are divided between "Liberals" and "Conservatives." Obviously the Republican and Democrat Conservatives have more in common with each other, as do the Republican "Progressives" and Democrat "Liberals." All of this hasn't affected the Republicans very much, although we dearly wish the RINO would get lost. The Democrats however have lost their standing as a national party because their Liberals have driven Southern (Conservative) Democrats into being Republicans. I can remember when the Democrats controlled Congress with big majorities and held the White House too (As with Roosevelt and Truman), and partly because of the influence of Southern and Southwestern Democrats they didn't have any kind of anti-gun agenda. That started with Lyndon B. Johnson, and has cost the Democrats dearly.

As an ultra-Liberal Texan, L.B.J. would be spinning in his grave if he knew hed set the stage to get three Republicans, Reagan and Bush (father & son) elected president many years later. :evil:

LAK
January 5, 2006, 04:52 AM
... As an ultra-Liberal Texan, L.B.J. would be spinning in his grave if he knew he’d set the stage to get three Republicans, Reagan and Bush (father & son) elected president many years later. :evil:
I would think John F Kennedy would be astounded were he alive to see what both parties have turned into, and where they have taken us.
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No_Brakes23
January 5, 2006, 04:56 AM
partly because of the influence of Southern and Southwestern Democrats they didn't have any kind of anti-gun agenda. That started with Lyndon B. Johnson, and has cost the Democrats dearly.

As an ultra-Liberal Texan, L.B.J. would be spinning in his grave if he knew hed set the stage to get three Republicans, Reagan and Bush (father & son) elected president many years later. :evil: Actually some trace the Anti-Gun movement to Southern Democrats who tried desparately to keep blacks from being armed.

http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/cramer.racism.html

Krenn
January 5, 2006, 06:57 AM
isn't this information about ten years old? what's changed recently?

Old Fuff
January 5, 2006, 12:16 PM
Actually some trace the Anti-Gun movement to Southern Democrats who tried desparately to keep blacks from being armed.

There is some truth to that, but this discussion was more centered on the political consequences of today's gun control movment that is mostly centered in the Democrat Party. In particular they, and certain "Progressive" Republicans (a.k.a. "RINO's") provide the political support that sustains the BATF&E. You can't lay that at the doorstep of Southern (Conservative) Democrats, most of whom are now Southern (Conservative) Republicans, and this has had a major effect on the national prospects of the Democrats.

saltydog
January 5, 2006, 02:40 PM
The tax collection agency otherwise known as the BATFE needs to be abolished. It serves no useful purpose and is a waste of an enormous amount public money.

Thats what most Govt agencies were intended to do. Its called "Justifing a Budget" and a big one at that!:barf:

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