Heard at the gunshop yesterday


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Richard.Howe
January 8, 2006, 09:23 AM
I stopped by the gun shop yesterday for a box of Gold Dots after hitting the range.

Me: "Do you have a holster for a Glock model 34?"

Him: "What kind of holster do you want?"

Me: "Don't know, just wanted to take a look at what you have"

Him: "Well I don't know what we have unless I know what you want."

Me: "I don't really know -- maybe a leather OWB?"

Him: "Hmm, let me go see what we have." (all holsters are on a rack in the public area) "Here you go" (hands me a Blackhawk! kydex IWB)

Me: "OK, thanks. Look, here's a Galco Yaqui slide holster for the model 17"

Him: "Thought you wanted one for a 34, thattun won't fit." :rolleyes:


Then -- to another sales guy -- having learned my lesson:

Me: "Do you have any Talley rings/mounts for a Winchester model 70 rifle?"

Him2: "Talley who? Never heard of 'em."


Then -- to a third fellow:

Me: "That's a nice used 686. What dash number?"

Him3: "What what?"

Me: "May I see the firearm? Nice, it's a dash-3. Man I love 686's."

Him3: "Naw, I really like the 586's, stainless but fixed sights."

Me: "Hmm, I thought 586's were blued?"

Him3: "Naw, those are the 585's."


I swear not to go back into these places immediately after I leave them, but always find myself wandering back. I bought two pistols at this place once -- a P220ST and P245 in the same transaction, so I'm not a non-pay troller. Bit frustrating.

Still in search of the competent non-attitude gunstore in Houston...

Rich

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jungle
January 8, 2006, 09:37 AM
If you know what you want and what it is worth a sellers ignorance can be a good thing. Gunshops are not the place to learn about guns, but they can be a source of amusement.

PvtPyle
January 8, 2006, 09:54 AM
We had a customer come in and tell us that he was just over at Cabelas. He ask if they had anything in the 41 AE. The salesman replied "We can't stock everything you guys see on the net and want to come in and play with."

While I didn't have any 41AE either, I made a customer for life. And now I am doing sales training for them as part of our firearms instruction deal. I am going to make sure I point out that if that had been said on my sales floor, the salesman would now be taking orders at Taco Bell. Then again, maybe I wont.....:evil:

NavajoNPaleFace
January 8, 2006, 10:06 AM
If you know what you want and what it is worth a sellers ignorance can be a good thing. Gunshops are not the place to learn about guns, but they can be a source of amusement.

There used to be a time when you could learn quite a bit from those who worked the smaller mom and pop gun stores, especially those small shops that also had a gunsmith around.

Now, I guess, with the monsterous numbers of firearms it'd be nearly impossible to have a good working knowledge of ALL of them.

Also in this day and age of stores such as Big 5, Wal-mart, Bass Pro Shops, Sportsman's Warehouse, etc. where they have such a vast inventory and young and inexpereienced help that basically only know that a gun goes 'boom' there aren't many that you can walk into and ask a question and get an intelligent answer.

MuzzleBlast
January 8, 2006, 12:39 PM
This is a simple fact of life that all of us who spend countless hours on the web researching gun esoterica have to face. The chances on encountering a normal person with anything approaching the same level of knowledge on gun stuff is remote. As long as you approach any conversation about guns with this in mind, your level of dissappointment will be diminished.

progunner1957
January 8, 2006, 12:45 PM
I swear not to go back into these places immediately after I leave them, but always find myself wandering back.
Ah, the irresistable lure of enlightened conversation...:D

rust collector
January 8, 2006, 12:53 PM
Knowledge is power.

While you might once have been able to rely on good info from small dealers, they have always had to stock what they believe will sell and sell whatever they had in stock to stay in business.

Consumers have never had access to so many resources for information, but you have to appraise the motivation, experience and honesty of whatever source you are using. Do your due diligence, and you are ahead of the game. Get lazy enough to simply do whatever the clerk suggests and you may regret your purchase. You had your information, so no harm.

Just remember, power corrupts. Jungle's observation is valid. Don't go over to the dark side. Very far. Or you'll become a gun trader.

MachIVshooter
January 8, 2006, 01:16 PM
Also in this day and age of stores such as Big 5, Wal-mart, Bass Pro Shops, Sportsman's Warehouse, etc. where they have such a vast inventory and young and inexpereienced help that basically only know that a gun goes 'boom' there aren't many that you can walk into and ask a question and get an intelligent answer.

Perhaps it has been the exception here, but there are three Sportsman's warehouse locations in the Denver area (sort of, anyway; Aurora, Thornton, Loveland) and all have two or three employees who are fairly to very knowledgeable. The remainder of the counter jockies seem to be runners for these more intelligent folks, fetching things from the back or finding specific items on the floor (with instruction). Of the half-dozen smaller gun shops I frequent, only a couple have employees that can tell me something I don't already know.

On a side note, anyone in the Denver area looking for more old-school gunshops should check out Rob's (Parker Rd. and Dayton). Rob himself is usually there and is a very friendly and helpful individual. It is a small outfit and does not carry a massive stock, but he often has some of the less common stuff and can order anything. One of the few remaining shops with a truly friendly atmoshphere where you don't have to hold up a wad of C-notes to get service.

Sulaco
January 8, 2006, 01:32 PM
Lots of good advice here. I have 4 local shops I frequent. One is a large shop with an indoor range, one is a pawn and gun and the other two cater mostly to law enforcement. I like the pawn and gun the most. While the selection may border on used and abused, my best deals are gotten there and he can order anything any of the others can. The other shops run the gamut from nice and informed to mega a**holes and ill-informed. I just maintain a nice attitude and usually do ok.

Most of my purchases are used and while each sells used, I find that to get the best deals, I have to stop in each one fairly frequently. However, my pawn and gun guy is giving me some spectacular deals of late so I may have to lessen my visits to the others.

Preacherman
January 8, 2006, 01:42 PM
But then, sometimes this ignorance works in your favor - for example, see this thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=175453)! :D

I haven't had any spectacularly good finds like that, but I have scored on some other deals. Just this past week, I was picking up some WWB range ammo at our local Wal-Mart, and instead of the WWB ball, the sales associate brought out boxes of Remington JHP's. I pointed out his error, but he insisted (repeatedly) that these were in "the WWB place" in the storage area, therefore they must be the WWB ammo! I ended up paying about half-price for the JHP's, and he was adamant that this was correct. I wasn't going to argue any longer... :rolleyes:

hksw
January 8, 2006, 01:48 PM
Although it is funny to hear of some folks (from both sides of the counter) expound on incorrect information they take for gospel, IMO, I don't think it's right to ridicule someone who simply doesn't know particular details and/or products and says so (e.g., the Talley mount/ring question). With the very high number of different makes/models/revisions of various guns/parts/accessories/ammo/etc. out there, it is impossible to keep track of everything.

GEM
January 8, 2006, 01:50 PM
On the flip side, I was in Sportman's Warehouse the other day and I wanted a speed loader than was behind the counter. The clerk was wrapped up with some old fart (not that I'm not close to that) that wouldn't shut up with his tall tales and expertise about how they made the Glockenspeil 7.6 mm DasFirecrapper in 1908 and he wanted a clip for it. Blah, blah.

I actually had to interrupt!

22-rimfire
January 8, 2006, 02:48 PM
Some gun shops are better than others when it comes to holsters. There is one in my area that is excellent. Only the most knowledgeable of shop employees will know much about holsters. The other problem is you look at their stuff and buy on the internet. Save $5.... what a deal.

bubbaturbo
January 8, 2006, 03:06 PM
I was in the OKC Sportsman's Warehouse last night and listened to a salesboy demonstrate an XD40 to a man and woman. The woman cringed as he pointed the gun at himself while demonstrating the trigger and grip safety. He told her it was OK because he had guns pointed at him frequently over the years and he used to work for a gunsmith. He was so full of himself I had to leave.

Mizzle187
January 8, 2006, 05:19 PM
Wow! I guess I dont know how lucky I am to live 10 minutes from Clarks Custom Guns! I garuntee you will learn something new everytime you talk to the employess there! There is actually another great small gun store close to me that has a super helpful father and son duo but still cant compete with Clarks knowledge!

Mizzle187
January 8, 2006, 05:19 PM
Sorry! Duplicate post!

Richard.Howe
January 8, 2006, 05:58 PM
IMO, I don't think it's right to ridicule someone who simply doesn't know particular details and/or products and says so (e.g., the Talley mount/ring question).

On the topic of Talley rings, it's akin to heading to a high-end used car dealership and asking if they happen to have any Porsches, and having the sales guy ask "Porsche who?"

That is not acceptable in a store half of whose inventory is comprised of hunting rifles, many custom.

Having said that -- I didn't mean to ridicule (never justified), but express extreme surprise at the degree to which these folks didn't know their product world.

Many would make fun of my lack of knowledge regarding modern battle rifles...then again, I don't work in a store selling them...if I ever start, they would have the right.

cortez kid
January 8, 2006, 07:20 PM
My favorite gun shop is a dream. I learn something new every time I go there. My dealer always has time for me. Huge selection of hand guns. Always lots of police and troopers around. Gun smith on call. Just a great place to hang out and do the gun thing.
kid

MICHAEL T
January 8, 2006, 08:16 PM
Hey everybody needs a job. They can't help they failed the "Do you want fries with that" test and all those old people got the Door Greeter jobs at Wal Mart So whats left a gun shop I mean anybody can sell a gun.

grimjaw
January 8, 2006, 08:28 PM
Glockenspeil 7.6 mm DasFirecrapper

The quest is on for my new gun! :p

jmm

IndianaDean
January 8, 2006, 09:01 PM
This one gave a good laugh!

f4t9r
January 8, 2006, 09:21 PM
I would supose that depends on what shop you go to.
I have been to shops where they seem to not know what one would expect from a shop. The one I go to the most has a good group that knows what they are talking about. So some are very good. You just need to find one that knows how to treat a customer.

Wheeler
January 8, 2006, 09:41 PM
A few months ago, I was preparing for a technical shooting class put on by Dave Harrington of Martial Gun. (Free plug, Dave puts on an excellent class). I had purchased a G17 and wanted to make sure I had some spare parts in case I had a SNAFU of some sort. I figured if anything was going to break, it would be the extractor, so I went to one of the local gunshops that has one of the better gunsmiths in my area, thinking I could get a spare part or two.

When I asked, they said they didn't have any spare extractors, the guy behind the counter then asked why I needed one. "In case mine breaks" I replied. "I've been selling Glocks since they came out, I've never seen one break!" he declared. "I have." I replied. "What were they doing to break a Glock? They must have been doing something wrong." He said. "Just shooting it in a match." Says I.

The conversation continued on in the same vein for a few more minutes after wich I finally said; "Look, it's a mechanical apparatus, anything mechanical can and will break at some point and time. I don't care if it's a Glock or a Wilson 1911 or a Ford truck." To which he replied once again, "I've never seen a Glock break."

For what it's worth, I went through approximatly 1200 rounds in two days, had some issues with the Geko ammo, (light loads sonding remarkably like squibs), but the gun ran fine, which merely lives up to their advertising. Next time there is a GSSF match, I intend to put on my body armor and get some spare parts. Glock is supposed to be pretty good about handing out the goodies.

I'm no expert on guns but, I do know a little bt more than the average joe, when someone starts to ask me something, then starts telling me what the nice guy at the gunshop said, I prepare myself for a load of horse hockey. :)

Wheeler

Sulaco
January 8, 2006, 11:14 PM
A few months ago, I was preparing for a technical shooting class put on by Dave Harrington of Martial Gun. (Free plug, Dave puts on an excellent class). I had purchased a G17 and wanted to make sure I had some spare parts in case I had a SNAFU of some sort. I figured if anything was going to break, it would be the extractor, so I went to one of the local gunshops that has one of the better gunsmiths in my area, thinking I could get a spare part or two.

When I asked, they said they didn't have any spare extractors, the guy behind the counter then asked why I needed one. "In case mine breaks" I replied. "I've been selling Glocks since they came out, I've never seen one break!" he declared. "I have." I replied. "What were they doing to break a Glock? They must have been doing something wrong." He said. "Just shooting it in a match." Says I.

The conversation continued on in the same vein for a few more minutes after wich I finally said; "Look, it's a mechanical apparatus, anything mechanical can and will break at some point and time. I don't care if it's a Glock or a Wilson 1911 or a Ford truck." To which he replied once again, "I've never seen a Glock break."

For what it's worth, I went through approximatly 1200 rounds in two days, had some issues with the Geko ammo, (light loads sonding remarkably like squibs), but the gun ran fine, which merely lives up to their advertising. Next time there is a GSSF match, I intend to put on my body armor and get some spare parts. Glock is supposed to be pretty good about handing out the goodies.

I'm no expert on guns but, I do know a little bt more than the average joe, when someone starts to ask me something, then starts telling me what the nice guy at the gunshop said, I prepare myself for a load of horse hockey. :)

Wheeler

I've never broken a Glock extractor but I have broken an ejector in a 1st gen. G17 and an early 3rd gen. G21. I've also had the feed lips in an early G21 mag fail and was unable to rebend them. Anyone who hasn't seen a Glock break just hasn't shot enough.

Check glockmeister.com for spare parts and save yourself some hassle. Ben is great to deal with. Or, like you said wait for a GSSF match and hope one of the armorours will give up the goods. ;)

Kodiaz
January 9, 2006, 12:13 AM
If the average gunstore employee is the average american. Then this is what they know about guns.

1. You should hold a pistol so the sights are to the side of the magazine instead of above the magazine.

2. Couches are bullet proof look at all the people that dive behind a couch that gets shot a hundred times during a movie and they come out unscathed.

3. Interior walls are also bulletproof thats why it's called sheetROCK it's rock bullets don't go through rock.

4. A 1911 style pistol holds 20-30 rounds in a magazine a 9mm holds 50 - 60 rounds in a mag. Ar uzi's hold hundreds of rounds in a mag.

5. Shooting someone will send them flying at least 3 ft. backwards

6. People with guns start shaking uncontrollably when they confront a criminal and have them at gunpoint.

I could probably write a book about this. A lot of people that work in these places selling guns is just their job. They don't know any better especially at the big stores. Face it you will find a clown in every business. And a huge percentage of the population knows nothing about guns except for what they see in movies or video games. If you go to an indoor range just look at some of the people shooting pistols. No push pull and they move a gun a mile after a shot because that is what they see on TV. Or they flinch in expectation of
recoil. My father didn't teach me how to use a pistol I bought one when I came here to Fl. And I asked around and I learned at a gunshop how to use my pistols accurately. And when I have the chance I try and help the next person out when I hit the range. Sometimes you'll go to a store and get a really knowledgeable person to help you and sometimes your going to know more than anyone in the store. I've been shooting pistols 5 years now and it amazes me how I'm almost always the best shot in the place. I've only been outshot at the range 1 time this guy shooting a 1911 put 3 .45 rounds in a 1" hole at 15 yds.

Rem700SD
January 9, 2006, 03:08 AM
Rich,
Let me know when/if you find one, because I'm still looking for my dream store in Houston, as well.

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