1911 Grip safety stuck!


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TexAg
January 14, 2006, 04:23 PM
Went shooting my 1911 Springfield GI today, and after about 40 rounds I noticed the grip safety was stuck in. I gripped it, let go, pushed it, wiggled it and it seems firmly stuck depressed. I have only shot about 200 rounds through this gun, this does not make me happy. The gun seems to function fine in every other aspect, but you can pull the trigger without touching the grip safety now and the hammer will fall. I don't want to do a full detail strip to find out whats wrong as I feel I should just send it to Springfield since its a brand new gun. I will call Springfield Monday, but anyone know what might be wrong?

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EllisWyatt
January 14, 2006, 04:39 PM
Went shooting my 1911 Springfield GI today, and after about 40 rounds I noticed the grip safety was stuck in. I gripped it, let go, pushed it, wiggled it and it seems firmly stuck depressed. I have only shot about 200 rounds through this gun, this does not make me happy. The gun seems to function fine in every other aspect, but you can pull the trigger without touching the grip safety now and the hammer will fall. I don't want to do a full detail strip to find out whats wrong as I feel I should just send it to Springfield since its a brand new gun. I will call Springfield Monday, but anyone know what might be wrong?

Detail stripping isn't hard. Might as well have something to *tell* them when you call. Keep a digital camera handy.

palerider1
January 14, 2006, 04:44 PM
i would take it back to the gun dealer.

TexAg
January 14, 2006, 04:47 PM
Bought it at a gun show from a dealer who is over an hour away.

1911Tuner
January 14, 2006, 05:34 PM
Howdy Tex,

A couple questions.

Will the thumb safety move freely?
When you move the thumb safety in and out of engagement...can you see the grip safety trying to move...even a little?

This is likely a simple issue that you can correct in just a few minutes.

TexAg
January 14, 2006, 05:45 PM
Howdy Tex,

A couple questions.

Will the thumb safety move freely?
When you move the thumb safety in and out of engagement...can you see the grip safety trying to move...even a little?

This is likely a simple issue that you can correct in just a few minutes.

Yes, the thumb safety moves freely and yes the grip safety does seem to want to move as the thumb safety is moved.

WarMachine
January 14, 2006, 06:29 PM
Well, just remove the grip safety, and check to see if there is any debris causing it to stick. There are a number of tutorials online, and even a novice can detail strip a 1911 in under 15 mins. Skip the sear/disconnector disassembly, and putting it all back together will go even quicker.

1911Tuner
January 14, 2006, 06:39 PM
Yes, the thumb safety moves freely and yes the grip safety does seem to want to move as the thumb safety is moved.

Aha! The thumb safety pin is binding in its hole in the grip safety. May be a clearance issue...May be dirty or dry...may be a touch of rust. Remove the thumb safety and use a little fine paper and oil on the crosspin. Watch the plunger as you remove the thumb safety. It may fly out. Hammer must be cocked to remove and reinstall the safety. Push it toward the engaged position as you pull outward on it. It helps to use the opposite thumb to push the pin on the right side of the frame. it should wiggle ot...or pop out...when it's about halfway between ON and OFF. Same to go back in, but you'll have to depress the plunger with a suitable tool in order to reinstall.

TexAg
January 14, 2006, 07:06 PM
Aha! The thumb safety pin is binding in its hole in the grip safety. May be a clearance issue...May be dirty or dry...may be a touch of rust. Remove the thumb safety and use a little fine paper and oil on the crosspin. Watch the plunger as you remove the thumb safety. It may fly out. Hammer must be cocked to remove and reinstall the safety. Push it toward the engaged position as you pull outward on it. It helps to use the opposite thumb to push the pin on the right side of the frame. it should wiggle ot...or pop out...when it's about halfway between ON and OFF. Same to go back in, but you'll have to depress the plunger with a suitable tool in order to reinstall.
OK, I think that worked, but what prey-tell is a suitable tool to depress that plunger?
And thank you VERY much for your help so far Tuner.

Old Fuff
January 14, 2006, 07:16 PM
Slip a small, thin-bladed screw driver between the safety and the frame and use the edge of it to depress the plunger. Then push the safety into place while withdrawing the screwdriver. If you don't have anything else, a firing pin (or something similar) will also work.

TexAg
January 14, 2006, 07:36 PM
OK, thanks, a knife blade seems to work. The grip safety is definitely unstuck, but it still kinds of "clicks" in when its fully depressed, which it did not do before. I only cleaned and oiled the pin, so maybe it does need a little fine paper rubbing. I will pick some up. Strange thing is that after the first 150 rounds it worked just like it did NIB unfired. Then today after about 40 rounds, it stuck. Now it seems to be different alltogether with that little "click" at the end. It wasn't rust, didn't appear to be dirty, so I can only think it is clearance...but why did it wait to show up after its been shot some?

1911Tuner
January 14, 2006, 07:47 PM
Howdy again Tex,

A little dirt or grit...tool marks in the hole...Who knows. The hole in the grip safety seemed to be a trifle undersized on the GI Springfield that I bought and tried to destroy. After I upgraded to NOS GI small parts, I used it in one of my range guns and had the same thing happen. A quick pass through the hole with a .156 reamer cleaned it up and took care of the problem.

The click may be due to a burr or rough edge where the sear spring contacts it.

Old Fuff
January 14, 2006, 08:08 PM
The front might be rubbing the on trigger bow as the safety pivots because the safety is slightly repositioned after you cleaned out the hole. If so it may leave a little mark on the trigger bow that will give you a clue.

If you don't have a reamer, I'd wrap a little 300-grit emery paper (available at a hardware store, or "Mart" hardware department) around a small punch or wood dowel and polish out the hole in the grip safety a bit. Also check the front of the safety and trigger bow for signs of marks, and deburr the sear spring where it rubs on the grip safety.

Be sure the "click" you are hearing isn't the disconector, rather then the grip safety...

Isn't this fun... :rolleyes:

1911Tuner
January 14, 2006, 08:50 PM
Good point Fuff my man. Don't reckon it could be one of those perfect high-tech new age disconnects...do ya?:p

Tex. Remove the slide and see if the click goes away. If it does, it's the disconnect hitting the top of the timing slot. Do NOT file on it to shorten it.

TexAg
January 14, 2006, 11:56 PM
Oh yeah, fun :rolleyes:

Took slide off, still a little click. Grip safety pushes in 80% of the way and then a final little click as it goes the rest of the way in, like there is some minor resistance at the end. Guess I get to learn more about disassembly, sooner than I thought!

Old Fuff
January 15, 2006, 12:46 AM
If you can, grasp the fingerpiece of the trigger between a thumb and forefinger, and pull the trigger forward and hold it while you wiggle or push the grip safety to see if the click goes away. The idea is to hold the trigger far enough forward so that if the nose on the grip safety is rubbing or binding on the trigger and them making a click when the nose is lifted above the trigger bow you'll be able to identify it. After that, if it is the case, we'll come up with a solution.

What I think may be happening: When the grip safety is "out" or in the safe position the nose rest just back of the trigger bow on the right hand side. Thus the nose blocks the trigger so that it can't be pulled. When you push the safety inward the nose rotates upward, until the trigger is no longer blocked. I think the "click" is happening just as the nose is lifted enough to free the trigger. So long as the safety works this is frustrating, but not serious, and once we know where it's happening it should be easy to correct.

Check the search feature. Somewhere Tuner has a thread explaining how to detail strip and reassemble the pistol. It may be in the gunsmithing section.

Tuner should be back sometime during the morning. I won't be around until later tomorrow afternoon.

1911Tuner
January 15, 2006, 09:05 AM
When you push in to the clickin' point...can you feel a hard resistance, or just hear the click? Does it get worse if you pull the trigger a little, or no difference whether the trigger is pulled or not?

Got a feelin' that it's the sear spring snagging on a burr or rough spot in the safety.:scrutiny:

Old Fuff
January 15, 2006, 10:34 AM
The spring could also be a little wide or off-located and rubbing on its seat in the frame. Slightly narrowing one or both sides of the spring might cure it.

Either that, or possibly the hammer strut is rubbing. It's really hard to tell when the pistol in question isn't on the workbench.

Now I got'ta run. See you guys later. :)

TexAg
January 15, 2006, 02:53 PM
When you push in to the clickin' point...can you feel a hard resistance, or just hear the click? Does it get worse if you pull the trigger a little, or no difference whether the trigger is pulled or not?

Got a feelin' that it's the sear spring snagging on a burr or rough spot in the safety.:scrutiny:

Well, it was more of a resistance...I say was because I kept messing with it last night, took the slide off again, put it back on, thought about taking the mainspring housing off, but didn't and I noticed there was more resistance when the grip safety was pushed to the left as it was pushed in. I pushed it to the right as I pushed it in and there was no resistance. I dry fired it a few times, racked the slide a few times, dry fired it some more and it went away! Still not there this morning. Cocked and unlocked, cocked and locked, hammer down, it has no resistance now. Maybe the small amount of oil got around enough that its moving now just fine.
Thank ya'll very much for your help, its been great! And I am not too dissapointed in the pistol as the problem only disabled the grip safety, but was still able to shoot.

1911Tuner
January 15, 2006, 03:08 PM
See? Me and ol' Fuff can just THINK about a problem pistol and it's fixed like magic! Uri Geller ain't got a thing on us. All he can do is bend spoons...:D

TexAg
January 15, 2006, 05:43 PM
:) lol, thank you 1911 Jedi Masters!

Old Fuff
January 15, 2006, 10:15 PM
Great minds may think alike, but my ego is way ahead of Tuners ... :neener:

Anyway I'm glad thing worked out. Sometime when you have the gun apart, or if the "click" comes back, remove the hammer & hammer strut and then wiggle the grip safety back and forth, and from side to side, and see if the "click" is gone or not.

Experiments will eventually produce answers. :)

saltydog452
January 16, 2006, 07:27 AM
I'm missing something here. Exactly what was wrong with the pistol... Mis-matched, mis-mated parts, re-assembly woes?

It would seem that if a 'wiggle' is the fix, then the pistol does its own 'wiggle dance' in recoil and the problem could re-appear in use.

Problems that magically go away w/o any corrective action taken can just as easily come back to haunt you later.

Whoop!

salty.

1911Tuner
January 16, 2006, 09:20 AM
Howdy salty,

We nailed the "stuck" part of the problem. The "click" part showed up later.
Still tryin' to figger it out. ;) Stand by...

Old Fuff
January 16, 2006, 10:48 AM
In a day and age when manufacturers are not always careful about how they put something together, and inspections are a lost art, sometimes simply detail stripping a gun and putting it back together may cure a minor problem that was caused when something was slightly misaligned. If a little deburring and a gallon of slurry is added to this the results may be outstanding. :eek:

When one has a pistol "on the bench" little, (as well as major issues sometimes) can be spotted pretty quickly because as firearms go the 1911 pistol is very simple (unless somebody has messed with it by adding questionable upgrades). Nailing something based on a description in a post over the Internet can be a lot harder, but given time and additional information Tuner usually gets there. :)

saltydog452
January 16, 2006, 01:09 PM
Hello Fuff,

Indeed he does. As do you both.

I guess I just missed out on some stuff. Couldn't figure out what the problem was..what was causing it..or what the fix was.

I guess 'occasional problems' would be more difficult to follow than 'repeatable problems'.

If wraping the slide of an assembled 1911 in a towel and smacking it up against a tree makes a problem go away, even if done by Jim Clark Sr., I'd still like to know what caused the difficulty and what can be done to prevent it in the future.

Just trying to understand the problem, the cause, and the fix.

salty.

1911Tuner
January 16, 2006, 01:15 PM
Howdy salty,

The original problem was the thumb safety crosspin binding in the grip safety hole that the crosspin goes through. Sizing/tolerance stacking, and probably a spec of rust or grit was the likely problem.

Old Fuff
January 16, 2006, 06:24 PM
If wraping the slide of an assembled 1911 in a towel and smacking it up against a tree...

Ah............ You've been spying on me again... :neener: :D

1911Tuner
January 16, 2006, 06:34 PM
Ah............ You've been spying on me again... :neener: :D

Whew! I thought he was talkin' about ME!:uhoh:

saltydog452
January 16, 2006, 06:41 PM
Nope, Jim Sr...It happened at the Dallas Pistol and Revolver Club..about 68-69.

salty.

1911Tuner
January 16, 2006, 07:08 PM
Nope, Jim Sr...It happened at the Dallas Pistol and Revolver Club..about 68-69.

salty.

Too early to have been an Officer's Model....Hmmmm:scrutiny:

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