did i see a glock in a fobus on FOX?


April 9, 2003, 04:41 PM
watching this morning during the CENTCOM briefing. fox does that splitscreen thing, you know.
there was an officer standing behind a vehicle coughing. then the rear of the vehicle opened up and 3 other guys came out, all in uniform. the one guy w/ the flipped up goggles LOOKS like he has a glock in a fobus on his hip. anybody else see this?

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April 9, 2003, 04:56 PM
Could be special forces. My old roommate was ex-Air Force Commando and carried a G19 into Somalia. Saved his *** more than once.

April 10, 2003, 12:25 PM
Given the combat tolerances, Glocks probably do well in desert country.

AJ Dual
April 10, 2003, 02:02 PM
Could be special forces. My old roommate was ex-Air Force Commando and carried a G19 into Somalia. Saved his *** more than once.

What's an "Air Force Commando"?

April 10, 2003, 02:07 PM
Glocks probably do well in desert country.Sand is actually one of the things Glocks don't do well. The trigger gets sand in the mechanism and has trouble resetting. Dead Glock.

- Gabe

April 10, 2003, 02:22 PM
What's an "Air Force Commando"
Probably PJs (Pararescue). Referred to in BHD as "Shake and bake commandos" because their SpecOps training is really short, like 6-8 weeks.

April 10, 2003, 02:57 PM
I beg to differ! The Airforce PJ's go through 2 years of intense qualifing training from weapons training, scuba/ water rescue, to CQB training, to Advanced Paramedic training. These guys may go through it quick but there is a 10% pass rate from the start to finish of the training. As with most special ops forces, you cont. to train to better sharpen your skills and still they pick up new skills such as vertical mountain rescue and extreme cold wheather survival training. These guys are not soft. They can hang with the best of 'em and in alot of cases out perform. No they don't place demo charges, take airfields, use a mini sub to take out several enemy soldiers. They have their purpose in the grand scheme of GWB's military like SEALs, Delta/USASF, Marine Recon, Ranger and the like. Not trying to sound like a rant and rave, but just don't count those guys out to come save your *** when you need it the most.:) :D

April 10, 2003, 04:30 PM
From what I'v seen of PJ training, it is less combat oriented than other spec ops. They seem to train more on their medical, technical and survival skills. They seem to have some sniper training, if the FNC reports about them using Barret M82s are correct.

Discovery did a show on them about 6 months ago, otherwise I'd never heard of them before. Probably not the sexiest unit.

Lone Star
April 10, 2003, 05:05 PM
Combat Control Teams might fit in here, as would certain Security Police elements.

Air Commandos traditionally are special air war personnel, dating back to Col. Phil Cochran's people, who supported Gen. Wingate's British troops operating against the Japs in Burma.
In Vietnam, they tended toward close support of clandestine ops, etc.

They often inserted and withdrew special ops teams, sometimes under very heavy fire.

Lone Star

George Hill
April 10, 2003, 05:08 PM
When it comes to the Air Force, the PJ's are the cream of the crop. They are good soldiers and I wouldn't cross one. They are an Elite group. But they have a very different mission than other special operation groups... I wouldn't put them toe to toe against a Ranger or GB... but they are certainly a cut above your average target rifle packing airforce grunt.

April 10, 2003, 05:23 PM
With all due respect I wouldn't put a Ranger toe to toe with a ASF member or SEAL either. If a good way to get the poor guy hurt. :D

April 10, 2003, 07:04 PM
i cross trained w/ some of the pararescue guys in san antonio. pretty rough for fly boys, i'll give 'em that. and i dont give much.
semper fi

April 10, 2003, 07:33 PM
we had seals drop out of pre ranger.187

Don Gwinn
April 10, 2003, 07:54 PM
Why were SEALs training to be Rangers?

April 10, 2003, 08:46 PM
lots a people go to ranger school. marines , brits, rok marines. two pakistni drop out first day. 187 ranger11b1v. rangers lead the way!!

April 10, 2003, 09:18 PM
You should give Gonzo his credit for your SIG line.;) :neener:

Dave R
April 11, 2003, 12:45 AM
Did i see a glock in a fobus on FOX?

Geez, for a minute I thought Dr. Seuss had become a gun writer.

April 11, 2003, 01:15 AM
Sebastian Junger covered PJ training pretty extensivly in "The Perfect Storm" (book, not movie). It sounds like it's just as ruthless as any other spec. ops. regiment... High drop out rates, massive endurance tests, lots of swimming. It actually sounds kind of fun.

Can the Coast Guard go out for ranger training?? I'm thinking of joining in a year or so.

Lone Star
April 11, 2003, 07:05 AM
Those wanting to know more about USAF spec ops can go to the thread here on British Army pistols. Scroll down to the links to the special ops site, then click on US Forces and when that comes up, click on AF units. Some Security Forces units have had Ranger and other training, and some have jumped with the 82nd Airborne in joint ops. Well worth a read.

By the way, in a photo in the section on 77nd(?) Security Police special response troops, one man seems to have an H-K P-7. He's part of an entry team about to assault a house.

Lone Star

April 11, 2003, 08:37 PM
USAF has spec ops? :what:
Next thing that someone is gonna say is that the Coast Guard has a top secret unit. (Coastie Killers?) :neener:

but they are certainly a cut above your average target rifle packing airforce grunt. USAF has grunts? Man, I better get with the program. I been out of the loop too long. :evil:

Number 6
April 11, 2003, 08:56 PM
Popular Mechanics did a piece on the Air Force special forces back in April of 2002. Like all of popular mechanics articles they are brief and not as technical as you would want them to be. This article states,

"The Job of AFSOC "operators" is to quickly turn a patch of hostile terrain into a fully functional airfield. Sometimes this means a stealthy attack by motorcycle and ATV. Other times it means cleaning out hostile forces by scouting locations for the delivery of 15,000 pound BLU-82 Daisy Cutter bombs."

Later in the article it says that the Air Force special forces tends to draw their operators from the SEALs, Rangers, and Force Recon. It also points to their role of using laser designators to mark targets for air strikes.

April 11, 2003, 09:48 PM
I sure hope the PJ's (yes, I've heard of them before) can shoot a little better than the Air Force SP's. WOW!

KY Moose
April 12, 2003, 12:03 AM
Combat Control:

Combat Controllers (CCT) are ground combat forces assigned to Special Tactics Squadrons within the Air Force Special Operations Command (AFSOC). The mission of a Combat Controller is to deploy by the most feasible means available into combat and non-permissive environments. Combat Controllers are Special Tactics Operators who establish assault zones, while simultaneously providing; Air Traffic Control, Fire Support and Command and Control communications in the joint arena. Additionally, Combat Controllers expertly employ all-terrain vehicles, amphibious vehicles, weapons and demolitions. Functions include assault zone assessment and establishment; air traffic control; command and control communications; special operations terminal attack control; and removal of obstacles with demolitions. The CCTs provide a unique capability and deploy with joint air and ground forces in the execution of Direct Action, Counter-terrorism, Foreign Internal Defense, Humanitarian Assistance, Special Reconnaissance, Austere Airfield, and Combat Search and Rescue operations.


A Pararescueman is basically a Special Operations Medic. They are trained in EMT/Paramedic skills. They have jobs like the US Navy Rescue Swimmers, and SEAL Team Corpsman. Pararescueman are trained in rescue and recovery operations. They serve on Special Tactics Teams with Controllers, as well as Rescue Squadrons. You will see Pararescueman working as crew members in rescue squadrons on the big MH-53 Pavelows and MH-60 Pavehawks. If I recall correctly, the crew of a Pavehawk and Pavelow is made up of a pilot, copilot, crew chief, and two Pararescuemen. Pararescue also provides rescue and recovery support for NASA Space Shuttle missions.

Both career fields start out at the same point. They start at the Lackland AFB Annex in San Antonio, TX. This is called the Indoctrination Course or IDOC. IDOC is a 8 or 10 week course. If you survive it, you then move onto what is called the Pipeline schools. Both career fields attend the same Pipeline schools, with the exception that Pararescue attends the Navy Underwater Egress School where they teach you to get out of an aircraft that has crashed in the water. After completing the basic Pipeline schools, Pararescue recruits head out to Kirkland AFB to learn their trade and medic skills, and Combat Controllers go to Keysler AFB to take Air Traffic Control class, then to FT Bragg to take the Small Unit Tactics Combat Controller Class.

Here is a list of the basic Pipeline Schools.

Special Forces Combat Diver at NAS Key West Florida.

US Army Basic Static Line Jump School FT Benning.

Military Freefall School Yuma Arizona for HALO and HAHO.

USAF SERE at Fairchild AFB in Washington State.

Then your separate Combat Control & Pararescue schools.

Combat Control and Pararescue deploy with other SOCOM units such as SEAL Teams, Delta Force, Green Berets, and Rangers. They both jump/dive/shoot & loot with all the above.

KY Moose
April 12, 2003, 12:22 AM
Everyone in these pictures are either a Combat Controller, or Pararescueman.








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