[Orange]

Hi, it's my first post here. I collect WW2 era weapons and I need advice about my newly acquired Garand. Here are my babies by the way:

http://www.orange1942.com/images/family-pic.jpg

The Garand shoots very well, that's not the problem. The thing is when I manually cycle cartridges, like I did when I tested the action when I first got it, the firing pin marks the primers a little. I cycled like 5 full enblocs already and no round has went off but I'm still concerned about it, I wouldn't want my Garand to go full auto :evil: at the range or accidently fire a round. Here is a pic of a few round that went through it (unfired).

http://www.orange1942.com/images/hmmm.jpg

I don't have the nifty tool to strip the bolt assembly nor am I very knowledgable about Garands. I'd very much appreciate your input on what could be causing that and possible solutions.

Thanks and all the best,
Orange

[Jim K]

It is caused by the inertia of the firing pin and is normal. It happens to be more noticeable with commercial primers, which are a bit softer than military primers. It is not enough to set off a primer unless something else is wrong.

If you are reloading, you can buy military type primers, or you can buy GI spec ammo through CMP.

(I wouldn't keep cycling rounds through the rifle, though. If you hit the same primer over and over again, it could let go.)

Jim

[3 gun]

+1 to what Jim has said on all points.

Welcome to THR.

Nice looking set you have so far. Still looks like you need a 1911 and a Webley and something Russian to round out the set. Not sure what the Russians used for a sidearm. Of course you could add a PPK, Nambu, Arisaka, M1 carbine, 03, 03a3, Colt and S&W etc into the set. Period sets are such a downward spiral :D

[cracked butt]

I don't have the nifty tool to strip the bolt assembly

Sure you do, its called a flat screwdriver:D

All you have to do is use a screwdriver to pry the extractor straight out of the bolt or better yet, use a pin punch to drive it out from the backside. One the extractor is out, the ejector will come right out or fly out depending if you had the presence of mind to put your finger over it while removing the extractor:o And the firing pin will drop right out.

[Steve in PA]

Unless you are at the range "checking the action" with live rounds is a disaster waiting to happen and not a very smart move.

[Run&Shoot]

In the Kuhnhausen shop manual he says exactly what Jim posted, but also mentions that a less common issue could be a firing pin that sticks out too long. A knowledeable gunsmith could check it out if it becomes more of a problem, but in general a light pinging of the primer is fairly normal.

Some more background. Part of the reason for this is that the M1 does not have a spring in the bolt to counteract the forward momentum of the firing pin. In fact, most military semi-autos do not have such a spring, although most sporters do. This is supposedly because a spring in the bolt would just make it easier to for crud to clog up in there and jam the firing pin.

The old Army field manual for the M1 emphasizes that you should never ease the bolt forward on a round to avoid this dimpling of the primer as that could cause the bolt to not go quite all the way into battery and that could result in a much bigger bang between your hands! Always let the bolt slam forward. So keep that muzzle pointed down range when loading a round into the chamber.

[Hawk]

(I wouldn't keep cycling rounds through the rifle, though. If you hit the same primer over and over again, it could let go.)

This has happened...

[Sheldon]

There is no spring to keep the firing pin back, it freefloats. The AR15/M16 and M1A/M14 rifles are like that as well and also leave the dimple on the primers. It's normal.

[ScottsGT]

If you're new to the Garands, be careful with your selection of commercial ammo. It can bend the op rod. No more than 150 grain bullets. If you enjoy the Garand, invest the time to be eligable to purchase from the CMP and get some of the surplus ammo they have.

[Onmilo]

What nobody bothered to tell you,,,,,
NEVER, EVER, repeat, NEVER,
Hand feed a cartridge into the chamber of an M1-M14/M1A-M16/AR15-AK47/Mak90-SKS-M1/M2 Carbine and the list goes on.
Those inertial firing pins can and do cause that single cartridge to detonate once it seats into the chamber.

The enbloc clip or magazine feed lips slow the bolt velocity down enough to prevent this from happening.
If you just drop a cartridge into the chamber and let the bolt go there is nothing slowing the forward momentum down.

If you must load a single round always do so from the clip or magazine or buy one of the special single loading devices available for some models of rifles.

[cracked butt]

What nobody bothered to tell you,,,,,
NEVER, EVER, repeat, NEVER,
Hand feed a cartridge into the chamber of an M1-M14/M1A-M16/AR15-AK47/Mak90-SKS-M1/M2 Carbine and the list goes on.

I've heard this internet story a few times, it ranks right up there with the NEVER, EVER, repeat, NEVER reload for military semiauto article on the Fooled You Armory website. http://www.fulton-armory.com/ReloadingThoughts.htm


Its not hard or even unsafe to single load an M1.
1. put round in chamber.
2. keeping the edge of your hand behind the charging handle, press down on the magazine follower with your thumb.
3. Ease the bolt 1/2 way down, then let it fly the rest of the way home by rotating your hand up and out of the way- you've just put more resistance on the bolt that an enbloc clip would.
4. tap the back of the charging handle with the palm of your hand to make sure the bolt is locked all the way shut.

Alternatively, you can let the bolt down with your fingers holding the charging handle *palm up* so that in the extremely rare chance that it slamfires, it doesn't break your thumb.

[Orange]

Thanks for all the quick replies and tips. I'm happy to hear that my Garand is behaving normally. By the way I was indeed at the range when I cycled the ammo, poiting the muzzle downrange aswell, I might be new here but I'm not a careless newbie. In fact I'm pretty intransigent when it comes to firearm safety and trigger discipline.

Period sets are such a downward spiral :D
I know :evil: ... The enfield was my second buy and supposed to be the last for a while, bought the m44 & Garand plus both pistols within a year afterward. And I already feel the urge to get them some company. Maybe some modern stuff too, likely going to snatch an AR15 soon.


I heard about the CMP before, unfortunatly I'm not an American citizen. Greetings from your friendly northern neighbors eh!

And Onmillo, I wasn't loading single rounds in the chamber, I was manually cycling full enblocs to check the action.

All the best,
Orange

[Bridger]

What nobody bothered to tell you,,,,,
NEVER, EVER, repeat, NEVER,
Hand feed a cartridge into the chamber of an M1-M14/M1A-M16/AR15-AK47/Mak90-SKS-M1/M2 Carbine and the list goes on.
Those inertial firing pins can and do cause that single cartridge to detonate once it seats into the chamber.

The enbloc clip or magazine feed lips slow the bolt velocity down enough to prevent this from happening.
If you just drop a cartridge into the chamber and let the bolt go there is nothing slowing the forward momentum down.

If you must load a single round always do so from the clip or magazine or buy one of the special single loading devices available for some models of rifles.


I don't think that's true, since at an NRA/CMP High-Power clinic I was taught by extremely good shooters to single load the Garand. In fact over 150 shooters there that day were single loading Garands and AR-15s for the slow-fire portions.

I definately wouldn't load live rounds in my own home though, save that for the range.

[AZ Jeff]

Its not hard or even unsafe to single load an M1.
1. put round in chamber.
2. keeping the edge of your hand behind the charging handle, press down on the magazine follower with your thumb.
3. Ease the bolt 1/2 way down, then let it fly the rest of the way home by rotating your hand up and out of the way- you've just put more resistance on the bolt that an enbloc clip would.
4. tap the back of the charging handle with the palm of your hand to make sure the bolt is locked all the way shut.

Alternatively, you can let the bolt down with your fingers holding the charging handle *palm up* so that in the extremely rare chance that it slamfires, it doesn't break your thumb.
Cracked Butt is right on with this recommendation for single loading the Garand. Many high power shooters over the years have used this method for the slow fire stages quite sucessfully.

It's letting the bolt go battery from full retraction while a round is in the chamber that's a bit more risky. Cracked's method slows the bolt down considerably, and removes most of that risk.

[Onmilo]

Alternatively, you can let the bolt down with your fingers holding the charging handle *palm up* so that in the extremely rare chance that it slamfires, it doesn't break your thumb.

I'm sure super experienced shooters do a lot of things they figured are OK right up to the point that something goes wrong,,,,

I am one of those in the camp of don't reload for military battle rifles if you are no more than a casual reloader too.

Beware the advice that just sounds risky:)

[Swampy]

onmilo,

When you think about it..... between 1937 and the 1970's, literally MILLIONS of US military recruits were taught to shoot the M1 rifle. They were taught to load single rounds as well as full en-blocs. The military did not supply SLEDS to recruits. How do you think they were trained??? With the very method lined out by Cracked Butt. Why??? Because that is a safe way to do it. It works.

Personally, I prefer a SLED when I have one, but if I happen to forget or mislay it (read: it's still in another rifle back in the safe) I have no qualms about single loading DONE CORRECTLY.

Best to all,
Swampy

Garands forever

[The Real Hawkeye]

Nice collection, and welcome to the forum. Looks like you still need a Springfield 03-A3, a 1911A1 and an M1 Carbine, just to name three. Good start though. Just means there's still more fun in store for you.