Anyone carry w/o a holster?


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Northslope Nimrod
January 20, 2006, 05:43 PM
The local Drug Strike Force agents carry their pistols IWB with no holster. I tried carrying my Mak that way and it seemed fine but answer me this:

Does that type of carry cause more wear on the blueing/finish of my firearm? (ie: Are clothes harder on the finish than leather?) Only in the summer am I concerned about sweat. Will sweat make it worse. If I don't sweat or no sweat reaches the gun, will it wear better or worse than if it is in a leather holster.

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1 old 0311
January 20, 2006, 05:57 PM
Sweat can cause rust. If you really want to carry this way, use a Car Wax on the finish. It will protect it, and also helps keep the fingerprints from showing.

Kevin

middy
January 20, 2006, 06:18 PM
I wouldn't want my pistol slipping down my pants leg to be accidentally kicked across the pavement, or falling out onto the floor when I sit down... but maybe that's just me. :uhoh:

Guntalk
January 20, 2006, 06:24 PM
With whatever holster you like, or no holster, put your gun on, put your magazines in their holders (or a pocket), and then roll around on the ground for one minute. Do a sumbersault. Flop like a fish.

Now, get up and look at the ground.

The equipment that's on the ground is the stuff you may find that you do not have in a fight.

Ever been in a fight of any kind? Ever end up on the ground?

1911Tuner
January 20, 2006, 06:56 PM
I don't get into fights. That's why I carry a gun. Too old to fight...Too tired to run.;)

Guntalk
January 20, 2006, 07:05 PM
Me too. Last fight I got in was in junior high. I learned that I didn't enjoy it.

1911Tuner
January 20, 2006, 07:24 PM
Me too. Last fight I got in was in junior high. I learned that I didn't enjoy it.

Yeah. Hurts...don't it?:D

EddieCoyle
January 20, 2006, 07:47 PM
Ever been in a fight of any kind?

I've been known to throw down on occasion but never when I'm carrying a gun.

I've also carried without a holster but never with a gun tucked into my waistband. I have a 642 that I carry unholstered in my pocket for most of the summer.

jonnyc
January 20, 2006, 08:08 PM
OK, new test.
Put the gun in your waistband and throw yourself down a flight of stairs. If it falls out, get a holster.
Holster-less carry really isn't the smart way to go.

Seven High
January 20, 2006, 08:09 PM
Many years ago, when I was still a LEO we would wrap multiple rubber bands around the grip of our snubnose revolvers before sticking them into our waist bands. We did not use a holster at all. It worked very well. Kind of like a hip grip. :)

trickyasafox
January 20, 2006, 08:15 PM
OK, new test.
Put the gun in your waistband and throw yourself down a flight of stairs. If it falls out, get a holster.
Holster-less carry really isn't the smart way to go.


if you actually do throw yourself down a flight of stairs, remove the gun after and repeat untill you lose all ability to taint society with procreation:neener:

JMusic
January 20, 2006, 08:34 PM
I use to carry a BHP in the small of my back without a holster. I shoot left handed and at that time it was hard to find an appropriate holster. I never lost the pistol but always worried about it. I finaly found a pancake that fit for a lefty. I also do not believe gettin grass stains on my pants but... One night while wearing the pancake I hit a unusually obnoxios individual with a three cell mag light. He proceeded to beat me up and down a brick wall for about a minute and a half before running out of air. (I had him in a choke hold:neener: ) After the watussi was over he had ruined one side of the grip and broken the rear sight off my BHP. I wore holsters religiously ever since.
Jim

CajunBass
January 20, 2006, 08:50 PM
I carry my Mak, or my Kel-Tec P-11 in my jacket pocket during the winter. Pistol on one side. Spare magazine on the opposite.

I don't see any difference in the wear.

BillinNH
January 20, 2006, 11:31 PM
I'm a firm believer in beltclips. I got one for my Keltec P11 and it made me a convert. When a got a P32 and subsequently a P3AT I automatically installed the belt clips. I bought a Cobra Patriot 45 to have something to carry in 45acp and in the keltec DAO polymer school of design. It didn't have a belt clip but I got a universal Clipdraw and installed it on the frame so that it rides just under the top of my waistband. So I carry my semiautos IWB on my strong side hip with a beltclip. The only time I actually use a holster is for pocket carry.

If I rolled around on the ground with one of these I imagine my hip would be sorely bruised but I don't think I would lose the gun.

Maybe I'll get one of my friends to try it. :)

Bill

Mad Magyar
January 21, 2006, 12:11 AM
The "Mexican carry" looks great with no complaint by the "action heroes" in the cinema, pulling pistols from everywhere with no holsters in sight; but I tried and couldn't get the hang of it....Different body types, and varying tolerances to being uncomfortable leaves me out of this league.:banghead:

1911 guy
January 21, 2006, 01:36 PM
I've carried sometimes with no holster, but for me the discomfort and inconvenience aren't worth the money you might save by skipping leather (or plastic). The only semi-comfortable way I found to carry my pistols without holsters is tucked into my waistband in the small of my back. I much prefer holstered behind my hip bone.

Jammer Six
January 21, 2006, 02:11 PM
Triggers need to be covered.

trickyasafox
January 21, 2006, 03:31 PM
i'd do belt clip, but i'd probably do it with an empty chamber

mbs357
January 21, 2006, 04:47 PM
OK, new test.
Put the gun in your waistband and throw yourself down a flight of stairs. If it falls out, get a holster.
Holster-less carry really isn't the smart way to go.
For best results, go to a Japanese shrine to do this test.

rero360
January 21, 2006, 05:21 PM
I've carried my 1911 just behind my hip sans holster, its ok, I just don't like using public restrooms while carring, other than that no probs. still looking at getting a good holster, without waiting half a year for it

taliv
January 21, 2006, 05:41 PM
a) i know, concealed means concealed
b) i know, i'm stereotyping


if i see someone carrying (which i do fairly frequently in TN), and it's in a iwb or other holster, I think "cool, another CCW"

if i see someone with a pistol shoved into their belt sans holster, i'm going to assume a lot about that person, none of it good, including

they've probably never had competent instruction (formally or otherwise)
good chance they've never fired the gun and probably owned it less than a week
good chance they aren't carrying legally

i'm not saying you should or shouldn't carry a particular way, just that, when i'm jawing in the gun store and someone comes in carrying like that, i usually leave, because in my experience, the odds of are entirely too high of them pulling it out and covering everyone in the room two or three times in the process of trying to show off their new toy

JMusic
January 21, 2006, 07:05 PM
taliv they had to fire something at least 60 times to get their permit.:rolleyes:

Jammer Six
January 21, 2006, 07:18 PM
taliv they had to fire something at least 60 times to get their permit.:rolleyes:
Not here.

I'm not as kind as Tally is.

The Real Hawkeye
January 21, 2006, 08:10 PM
For many years I carried a Kahr P-9 IWB without a holster, and never had it come loose. It worked perfectly, and was extremely comfortable, but drawing the gun is faster in a properly constructed IWB holster, which is how I carry now. Another great gun, however, for no holster IWB carry is the 1911. I still occasionally carry one like that, though I prefer the IWB holster for the 1911 too. I only do the Mex carry when I am taking it from the car to the house or visa versa, when I don't already have a holster on. On rare occasions, if the holster is not handy, I will also go out with the 1911 in the Mex carry position. It's much rarer nowadays, though. I almost always carry in a holster now.

usp9
January 21, 2006, 08:48 PM
Yes, often I throw my Seecamp in my coat pocket or front pants pocket for a quick trip.

Manedwolf
January 21, 2006, 09:00 PM
Here in the northeast at least, it's sometimes unavoidable in the winter to step on a patch of slick ice and at least do a bit of wild interpretive dance, if not actually going down.

I'd think it'd be better if one's weapon did not go skidding away as part of that...especially if it happens in front of a mall or supermarket, panicking the blissninnies who see A GUN!...and causing you to have to possibly have to explain things to police or end up on the evening news. Holsters are good.

Manedwolf
January 21, 2006, 09:08 PM
Yes, often I throw my Seecamp in my coat pocket or front pants pocket for a quick trip.

Even for a little BUG like that, I still use a holster. My 950 has a Kramer non-printing rectangular leather and an Uncle Mike's Sidekick (for coat pockets) that it just pops out of smoothly as it's supposed to, but doesn't wander, turn upside-down, or get lint in the barrel. Holsters for tiny pocket BUGs keep them right-way up for an effective draw, I think.

The only problem with the Kramer was that it needed to be filed...the molding caught the barrel tip-up release on draw and could have caused the barrel to, well, tip up, sending the chambered round flying, which wouldn't exactly impress a BG. The Uncle Mike's neoprene had no such issues.

usp9
January 22, 2006, 10:40 PM
Even for a little BUG like that, I still use a holster. My 950 has a Kramer non-printing rectangular leather and an Uncle Mike's Sidekick (for coat pockets) that it just pops out of smoothly as it's supposed to, but doesn't wander, turn upside-down, or get lint in the barrel. Holsters for tiny pocket BUGs keep them right-way up for an effective draw, I think.

The only problem with the Kramer was that it needed to be filed...the molding caught the barrel tip-up release on draw and could have caused the barrel to, well, tip up, sending the chambered round flying, which wouldn't exactly impress a BG. The Uncle Mike's neoprene had no such issues.


Most of the time I use a OWB holster or sometimes a IWB. For a quick walk around the neighborhood with my wife, or a trip to the store for a gallon of milk I just grab and go though. That's the beauty of a gun such as the Seecamp. BTW, the only time I've ever dropped my Seecamp :o was while using a Uncle Mike's IWB holster.

birddog
January 22, 2006, 11:48 PM
I almost always use a holster (IWB & OWB) BUT in the interest of answering the question, just this morning I dropped my Taurus 651 snubbie into a deep coat pocket (with a flap and a snap) before going out for an early morning walk, sans holster.

Ala Dan
January 23, 2006, 12:13 AM
Some member's of my old departments drug task force carried their
firearms this way, but this was with Glock's only. The "tennifer" process
used by Glock was (and is) condusive too this type of carry. I would
not have tried it with my standard, blued West German .45 caliber
SIG-SAUER P220A~!:uhoh: :D

Jammer Six
January 23, 2006, 04:47 AM
I would have thought that Glocks, having no safety, would be the last weapon to carry without the trigger protected.

Ken Rainey
January 23, 2006, 03:27 PM
It seems that a lot of people have the idea that a Glock is more susceptible to a negligent discharge because it doesn't have an external (other than the one on the trigger!) safety when carried without a holster....when, in actuality, it's not. I have carried for years IWB without a holster with different handguns; revolvers, 1911's, BHP, Kahr, Glock...in different circumstances without problem. I've even found the safety off at times when carrying the BHP IWB and never had a problem there either !

When you think about it, there is nothing inside of a waistband that will pull the trigger...some people seem to "think" that their shirt will get inside the trigger guard and pull the trigger when they are either placing the pistol or removing it ??? when in actuality, it don't happen. Paying attention to what you are doing will insure your safety. I've "heard" of retention straps on holsters getting into the trigger guard when trying to holster a pistol and causing them to discharge but again, if you pay attention to your actions, that should not happen either.

The trigger finger has caused all of the negligent discharges (in other words, a lack of attention to what they were doing) that I personally know about.

Carrying IWB without a holster isn't for everyone or every situation, but it does work well for many people. Having a snug waistband (belt) to hold the weapon more securely is a large part of it.

As always, YMMV.

MCgunner
January 23, 2006, 03:31 PM
I don't even pocket carry without a holster except for my little NAA .22 which does have its "holster grip". I'd NEVER carry IWB without one. The thing a holster does beside RETAIN the weapon in strenuous exercises is keep the weapon in the same place so that when you need to draw, muscle memory can find it. Besides, wearing a holster IWB is MUCH more comfortable!

MCgunner
January 23, 2006, 03:34 PM
Oh, btw, if you carry a loaded Kahr or Glock without good leather, you must be looking to shoot you butt off...:rolleyes:

1911 guy
January 23, 2006, 05:36 PM
Hate to rain on the Glock parade, but they are indeed the last handgun I'd consider carrying without leather. Even some leather is iffy. There was a line of holsters recalled due to AD's upon holstering. If it can happen with a holster, it can happen with a shirt tail. Glock's aren't bad pistols, just don't think they're Uber-safe when they're not.

Ken Rainey
January 23, 2006, 06:07 PM
See what I mean.....: :confused: :rolleyes: :)

Back to the original question....some peoples sweat will attack a guns finish worse than others. I have carried blued steel without problems from sweat..I'd wipe it off and all was well...but I also cleaned my handgun every week or two after firing (or as needed) so I made sure it was always in good condition. I've seen another guys blued gun rust from a days sweat no matter what he put on it, a charter arms revolver I believe. Of course, other finishes like stainless steel and Glock's tennifer finish are much more resistant to corrosion. Wiping it off with a little WD40 after sweating on it should keep it in good shape.

As always, YMMV.

MCgunner
January 23, 2006, 06:18 PM
The Kahr and Glock have very light, short trigger throws. That's why I don't own either, leather or no leather, but if you're going to carry one, for Christ's sake get yourself good trigger covering leather. On a 1911, especially with the later firing pin stop designs, you have three redundant safeties. If the safety gets swiped off (it won't in good leather) you have the grip safety and the firing pin block backing you up from an AD. I don't often defend the 1911, but it is safer IMHO than carrying a Glock or Kahr without leather.

This is the reason I carry revolvers or DA/DAO pistols with revolver like triggers. I STILL, however, carry in good gun leather. I mean, I don't really care usually about opinions on these boards, they're like, well, you know, everybody's got one. However, when it comes to safety, excess is a virtue.

Ken Rainey
January 23, 2006, 07:17 PM
Agreed ! I think the 1911 is one of the safest pistols you can carry inside or outside the waistband - firing pin block or not (I prefer not)...mechanically speaking, of course. True gun safety is between the ears. However, I don't think the Kahr and Glock pistols have very light, short trigger throws - like the 1911 does. As a matter of fact, I think the Kahr trigger is more like a nicely tuned smooth revolver pull (around 7 or 8 lbs) and the Glock can be made revolver like also - I have my G26 set up that way...around 6 or 7 lbs of pull....as they come from the factory the Glock trigger is at least 5.5 lbs except on the competition models (34 & 35).

Northslope Nimrod
January 23, 2006, 07:38 PM
I too feel safer holstering my Hi-power cocked and locked than a Glock or similar action. A local female cop shot herself in the rump at a qualification. She became frustrated during the shoot and slammed her gun into her holster....Bang. They said she bled pretty bad as they had her half stripped laying on the asphalt in the middle of the winter.

denfoote
January 23, 2006, 08:08 PM
The only time I don't use a holster is when I slip the mouse into the pocket to go outside to smoke!!

bpisler
January 23, 2006, 08:52 PM
I carry my 642 in my right front pocket
without a holster.But i have the outline
if the pistol stiched in the pocket.It stays
in place just fine and is easy to draw if
i ever need it.Everything else i carry goes
into a holster,years ago i watched a guys
ruger fall out the back of his shirt.All he
was doing was getting out of a booth
at the denny's and walking away.

MCgunner
January 23, 2006, 09:35 PM
Agreed ! I think the 1911 is one of the safest pistols you can carry inside or outside the waistband - firing pin block or not (I prefer not)...mechanically speaking, of course. True gun safety is between the ears. However, I don't think the Kahr and Glock pistols have very light, short trigger throws - like the 1911 does. As a matter of fact, I think the Kahr trigger is more like a nicely tuned smooth revolver pull (around 7 or 8 lbs) and the Glock can be made revolver like also - I have my G26 set up that way...around 6 or 7 lbs of pull....as they come from the factory the Glock trigger is at least 5.5 lbs except on the competition models (34 & 35).

Yeah, if I decided to carry a Glock, the "New York Trigger" would go in it. It would definitely be in a good holster which covered the trigger completely. There are some nice Glocks like the G30 and the G19 I wouldn't mind owning. The New York trigger would give me some piece of mind carrying one.

The Kahr's I've tried felt lighter and much shorter than a good revolver, almost like a creepy single action. A good revolver will have a fairly long travel and around 10-12 lbs wt. The best of the best I've ever tried was a room mate's Colt Python. It was glass smooth, but still felt 10 pounds or so. I didn't measure it.

RiverwinoIA
January 23, 2006, 10:08 PM
The Kahr and Glock have very light, short trigger throws.

This is the reason I carry revolvers or DA/DAO pistols with revolver like triggers.

i dont know alot about pistols, but one thing i do know is that kahrs do not have light short trigger pulls, far from it. they are very revolver-like.

Dreamer
January 24, 2006, 02:58 PM
If I were so poor and broke that I couldn't afford even a cheap holster, maybe I would carry without one. Maybe?:)

Inline_6
January 24, 2006, 03:19 PM
I've been known to throw down on occasion but never when I'm carrying a gun.


I don't think the point he was making has to do with "choosing" to get into a fight. When some criminal or other low life targets you, things may turn into a rumble - gun or not. There are plenty of other situations that could lead to a gun falling out (slipping on ice, stairs or wet floors, etc.).

There are countless reasons why carrying w/o a holster is a very bad idea IMO. The only "excuse" I could ever think of would be that you are given a gun by someone bcz things look ugly, or you are undercover and no self-respecting drug dealer uses a holster.

trueblue1776
January 24, 2006, 03:22 PM
If the gun stays where I put it, I say save 70 bucks.

kent m. lane
January 24, 2006, 08:09 PM
Just think if you went in a bank [for banking olny] and your heater falls on the floor. :uhoh:

Richard.Howe
January 24, 2006, 08:14 PM
I was sitting in a meeting the other day and shifted my weight from one side to another. My keys shifted too, and somehow (still don't know how) my panic button on the keychain was pushed with predictable results.

If my trigger was inadvertantly pushed because I failed to properly secure my firearm while carrying it, that would be a real panic scenario.

Spend the extra $20 at least.

Rich

trueblue1776
January 24, 2006, 08:17 PM
If the gun stays where I put it, I say save 70 bucks.

It works for some and not for others

MadMercS55
January 25, 2006, 12:50 AM
In the warmer months when I've had to go out on a quick errand, I've stuck a Beretta or Glock IWB under a light t-shirt with a spare mag in my left pocket. Worked well short-term, never tried it all day though.

Fred Fuller
January 25, 2006, 01:05 AM
Used to carry a lightweight Commander w/o holster, outside the pants but under the belt, with the muzzle in the watch pocket of my jeans. Didn't carry a pocket watch so I figured to get some kind of use out of that pocket. Untucked tee shirt or tucked tee with untucked shirt (often a 'pickle suit' jungle fatigue shirt) on top covered everything. Worked for me then, fwiw, but that was decades ago and there was less under my belt then too.

Mostly pocket carry something smaller these days (642 and/or a P3AT) though, but with a proper pocket holster.

lpl/nc

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