[dfariswheel]

Sad news.
Colt will apparently no longer make double action revolvers.

The famed and fabled Colt Python appears to be no more.

http://members.aol.com/lmanwebdesign/ColtTour.html

[TexasRifleman]

Well, Colt has pretty much put a big flashing billboard on it's head screaming

"Only want to sell to government agencies"

Look and see where you end up if you put "colt.com" in your web browser.
It ain't a web page full of SAA's and 1911's :)

They've hidden the "civilian" stuff in a completely different place.

I am not surprised to see a slow move towards eliminating all the other product lines. Everyone wants to get a suckle on that "Homeland Security" nipple.

That kind of thinking can be dangerous however.

Look what GM and Ford did when SUVs became the hot thing. They closed car plants right and left, or converted them to SUV production. Then gas hit 3 bucks a gallon and no one wanted a Hummer anymore.

Colt is chasing what it sees as a gravy train. Hope the gravy doesn't run out.

[Monkeyleg]

:(

US gun manufacturing seems headed in the wrong direction.

[JMusic]

Yep they are except for Smith. Glad I kept my Python.

[McCall911]

[Oops! Sorry for the double post!]

[McCall911]

Yes, bad news indeed.
:(

First Winchester. Now Colt.
Hey, they say bad news comes in threes! Wonder what's next?
:uhoh:
:scrutiny:

[hillbilly]

Uh, didn't Colt pretty much get rid of all the rest of its DA revolver production several years ago?

Colt has been going down for years and year.

hillbilly

[denfoote]

So much for my dream of getting a new Magnum Carry!! :( :mad: :banghead:

[trbon8r]

So all that BS about a pause in double action revolver production to install new tooling was just that, BS.

[Standing Wolf]

Mark made it clear that at least in the short term, double action revolvers (Anaconda, King Cobra, Python, Detective Special etc.) were not being produced, and if they ever were to become available again, they would be made in such a way as to take advantage of advances in manufacturing technology. Mark admitted that given the means of production currently available to Colt, they would have to charge so much for a Python that its price would necessarily limit the number Colt would sell.

Some of us would have paid premium prices for premium quality revolvers. Once again, Colt misunderestimates the market.

[trbon8r]

"take advantage of advances in manufacturing technology"

TRANSLATION: Make them cheaper with piss poor tolerances, dull blueing, gritty actions, no hand fitting, and wood not fit for a mop handle.

This country is going to hell in the name of the mighty dollar. Colt, Winchester, GM, Ford will all wind up on the ash heap of history soon. Just make it cheaper and get it out the door. Gotta make next quarter's profits one penny higher than last year. :rolleyes: :banghead:

[Flatfender]

Yes, bad news indeed.
:(

First Winchester. Now Colt.
Hey, they say bad news comes in threes! Wonder what's next?
:uhoh:
:scrutiny:

wouldn't the first one be Ithaca closing?

[EghtySx]

Colt hasn't made 'em for years. Those elite things weren't anything like real Pythons to me.

They were double action revolvers, but not Pythons...

[Zundfolge]

"take advantage of advances in manufacturing technology"

TRANSLATION: Make them cheaper with piss poor tolerances, dull blueing, gritty actions, no hand fitting, and wood not fit for a mop handle.

Bovine Scat.

Smith & Wesson are capable of turning out very nice high end double action revolvers from their "Performance Center" and they sell quite well.

This country is going to hell in the name of the mighty dollar. Colt, Winchester, GM, Ford will all wind up on the ash heap of history soon. Just make it cheaper and get it out the door. Gotta make next quarter's profits one penny higher than last year. :rolleyes: :banghead:
Are you suggesting we nationalize these manufacturers and force them to continue running at a loss? :scrutiny:


Some of us would have paid premium prices for premium quality revolvers. Once again, Colt misunderestimates the market.
Exactly. Colt has proved over the last 3 decades that its not run by competent managers and businessmen.
Ya know, I think if the boys overseas at Korth had half a brain they'd open up an operation here in the states to rake it in, in what I believe could be a lucrative high end revolver market.

[tulsamal]

US gun manufacturing seems headed in the wrong direction.

Yep they are except for Smith. Glad I kept my Python.

The "biggie" in the US is Ruger and they don't seem to be going anywhere. Their guns have always been designed with ease of manufacture as a prime requirement. Look at the Ruger MK I/II/III. The receiver is made out of a steel tube. The Security Six showed how to make a revolver without the whole sideplate and be stronger to boot. They went to casting the frames long before most other companies. And, much more than S&W or Colt, they have done market research to find out what shooters actually want and then they make it! The new 50th Anniversary Flattops show that as well as anything.Or the new Vaquero with SAA size grips. Or the new 345 that corrects the handling flaws of earlier Ruger autos.

As others have said, Colt has been a big nothing in civilian sales for years now. And S&W can't seem to listen to their customers and make new guns without a hole in the side. Ruger makes their guns in a modern way and they make them in the US. They deserve to be given some credit for that.

Can't wait to buy a new 50th Anniversary .44 Magnum Flattop later this year!

Gregg

[tulsamal]

Some of us would have paid premium prices for premium quality revolvers. Once again, Colt misunderestimates the market.

US Firearms has proven that. And they proved it making Colt designs like Colt used to make them!! They are just totally beautiful. And they sure aren't cheap.

Gregg

[McCall911]

wouldn't the first one be Ithaca closing?

:what:

OK, now we have three!

:(


So grandma was right: Bad news does travel in threes!

[1911Tuner]

Just a hunch...but my bet is that Colt anticipates a military contract for the
1911...and is toolin' up for what they hope is a repeat performance.

[SouthpawShootr]

I think they'd be anticipating wrongly. I doubt the military would adopt a single action design after having so many years of TDA. Now if they "update" the design and come up with something like the 1911 but with a double action capability, then they'd get some takers. Now don't get me wrong, I love the 1911 design (my 3 Colts, 2 Kimbers, and Para P13 are going nowhere), but I think something different would get the contract.

Last round, Beretta was selling the 92FS to the government for something like $200 a copy. Sig, Ruger, and H&K would likely participate in the next round. Is it really possibly to manufacture a 1911 for $200 or less. Especially given that Colt's pistol manufacturing capacity amounts to a small time operation?

Give the civilian population what they want. Pythons, Diamondbacks, Detective Specials (or Magnum Carrys). Update the designs to reduce fitting if you must, but bring them back.

[kentucky_smith]

Next carry pistol will be a cz85 in .40. SA/DA/Ambi/ can be mass produced cheaply and will pass any test the 92fs/Glock will.

[adaman04]

Yep they are except for Smith. Glad I kept my Python.

I hope you don't mean Smith & Wesson. Ever hear of internal-lock? :cuss: Most idiotic feature every put on a handgun. When "safety" interferes with reliability, I say no thanks. Pre-lock for me.

Bummer man. But, Colt has been a sellout for a long time.

[No_Brakes23]

Next carry pistol will be a cz85 in .40. SA/DA/Ambi/ can be mass produced cheaply and will pass any test the 92fs/Glock will. The CZ85 might make sense, I wouldn't mind having one, but "Will pass any test..." is not a shoe-in. Many folks believe the SIG226 beat the Beretta Model92 in tests, but we see who got the contract.

As for Model 92s for $200? Wow, I sure would like to have one of those. It ain't my fave design, but when brand new, they certainly shoot straight enough. Who knows what they will go for when they become surplus, though.

[SouthpawShootr]

As for Model 92s for $200? Wow, I sure would like to have one of those. It ain't my fave design, but when brand new, they certainly shoot straight enough. Who knows what they will go for when they become surplus, though.

Local PD that issued Beretta 92s didn't supply duty guns to auxilliary officers, but allowed them to purchase on the department's account. Price was $290 IIRC. That was just buying in small quantities (maybe 3-4 at a time). Think what the volume discount would be if you buy a half million of them.

[1911Tuner]

I think they'd be anticipating wrongly. I doubt the military would adopt a single action design after having so many years of TDA. Now if they "update" the design and come up with something like the 1911 but with a double action capability, then they'd get some takers. Now don't get me wrong, I love the 1911 design (my 3 Colts, 2 Kimbers, and Para P13 are going nowhere), but I think something different would get the contract.


Wouldn't be the first bad call they made about an anticipated military contract. They did it in '45-'46.

[IndianaDean]

The Colt rep at their factory (story over on www.1911forum.com) said the revolvers were hand made, therefore very expensive. They simply were not selling them at any quantity any more. They couldn't justify keeping the equipment, etc around when there was not much demand anymore for new revolvers.
Lack of demand, losing money.

[SouthpawShootr]

Kind of a catch-22 situation here. They have really made revolvers in any substantial quantity in quite sometime. Maybe they're overlooking a simple rule of commerce. In order to sell one must produce.

Like I said, they should have updated their designs so that they could manufacture them almost entirely on CNC machinery. I'm sure a clever & talented firearms designer could come up with something where the basics would be there if somebody wanted to spring for custom work. The days of $1000 Pythons would be gone. Anacondas never were $1000 guns (regardless of what Colt thought they should sell for), even when they were produced by the custom shop. Additionally, I thought the Magnum Carry was a redesign of the DS and superior (from Colt's point of view) b/c it didn't require the extent of handfitting the older design did.

Was any mention made of the SAA? At nearly 2 grand a copy, I'll bet that paid the bills.

[Standing Wolf]

The Colt rep at their factory (story over on www.1911forum.com) said the revolvers were hand made, therefore very expensive. They simply were not selling them at any quantity any more. They couldn't justify keeping the equipment, etc around when there was not much demand anymore for new revolvers.
Lack of demand, losing money.

If Pythons had been made—by hand or otherwise—to worthy tolerances, I'd have bought them. The sad sorry simple fact of the matter is that Pythons haven't been Pythons since at least the early 1990s. They included lawyer triggers, then worse triggers, as well as fit and finish problems that wouldn't have been allowed out of the Ruger factory.

I think Colt is in the excuses line of work, not firearms.

[SouthpawShootr]

I think Colt is in the excuses line of work, not firearms.

Exactly. The reasons they give don't wash.

[trbon8r]

x

[trbon8r]

Bovine Scat.

Smith & Wesson are capable of turning out very nice high end double action revolvers from their "Performance Center" and they sell quite well.


Are you suggesting we nationalize these manufacturers and force them to continue running at a loss? :scrutiny:



Exactly. Colt has proved over the last 3 decades that its not run by competent managers and businessmen.
Ya know, I think if the boys overseas at Korth had half a brain they'd open up an operation here in the states to rake it in, in what I believe could be a lucrative high end revolver market.

Yeah S&W makes some fine weapons, complete with the stupid cylinder lock, internal firing pin, actions that go out of time after 1000 rounds, and blueing that looks like it should reside on one of their south of the border Llama cousins.

Regarding your second point. Colt doesn't need any help from outside sources to run at a loss. They seem to be doing a good job of that themselves, including Chapter 11. Could that be because they don't offer anything that is particularly appealing?

Colt might be able to make a top end 1911 if they wanted to but they either cannot or choose not to. They are suffering the same fate as many of their counterparts in American industry by cheapening things year after year in the hope that customers won't notice. They are wrong.

[palerider1]

well , at least they are not closing plants..........colt needs to come back with the colt mustang series...people are screaming for those.

[cbsbyte]

People seem to complain about the "lawyer" proof design on many gun these days. Well the reason those things are on the guns is because many states require them to have the heavy tigger, trigger locks etc on them to be sold in the state. It is alot easier to make one product for all markets, than vice versa. Sorry, in todays society this is the name of the game, if they did not do this most manufactures would be banned from selling any of their products to several states, and have mulitable lawsuit that would probably put them out of business.

Ruger will also have a locking device on all their handguns by the end of next year, and I believe Sig will also.

[loud-mouth shnook]

A previous poster mentioned that these things occur in threes and wondering what no.3 will be. I'm curious as to whether we shouldn't factor the untimely demise of Ithaca into the equation.

[Lucky]

The sad part is that they don't just SELL the rights and the equipment to manufacture the revolvers. That's what's wrong there.