Who'd have thought: a revolver with a Picatinny rail


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doublebarrel
February 11, 2006, 11:37 AM
Kudos to Smith, what a revolutionary concept!...

http://www.gunblast.com/images/SHOT2006/Day2/DSC07764.jpg

It's called S&W Performance Center's 8-shot .357 "Tactical" revolver, from Gunblast.com (http://www.gunblast.com/SHOT_2006_2.htm). Looks high tech, doesn't it? Too bad it has performance center name on it, which means limited production and expensive like hell(normal Smith models are expensive ENOUGH). But, it's still the first railed wheelgun I know of. I guess they will try to build a plastic wheelgun next, and call it "Glith", for "Glock Smith"...;)

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kevin387
February 11, 2006, 11:56 AM
I want one.

rbmcmjr
February 11, 2006, 12:50 PM
I keep looking at that and thinking that if it had a flashlight on the lower rail and lost the top rail, it would look like Turner's gun from _Count Zero_.

Rick

Stasher1
February 11, 2006, 07:54 PM
Man, I'll be glad when this light rail trend dies. :barf:

mattz357
February 11, 2006, 08:46 PM
If that were stainless and pre-lock, I'd buy one without question. Truth be told, it's VERY likely stainless under that black finish, so only the lock would stop me. They need to take that scope and rail off though, they look a little ridiculous.

Deer Hunter
February 11, 2006, 08:47 PM
I knew I liked Smith for a reason.

I'm planning on getting a 627 8-shot this summer when I earn enough money. Now, I don't think I'll be getting that model, but it's nice to see some variation with the average DA revolver lineup. They havn't really had much innovative designs since they came out.

Nightcrawler
February 11, 2006, 09:35 PM
Did I not say a few weeks ago that Smith oughta make a revolver with a rail?

Now they need to make one in .45ACP, since they're reading my threads anyway. :cool:

Now, the trick is...where do you find a holster for it? It probably won't fit a normal N-Frame holster with the squared-off barrel, and with a light attached?

mattz357
February 11, 2006, 09:38 PM
I wasn't looking all that closely before, but I now notice that it looks like an 8 shot. Can anyone confirm this is an 8 shot N frame? Thanks!

ChristopherG
February 11, 2006, 10:44 PM
Yeah, they've been making 8-shot N-frames in .357 and .38 super for several years now. It's a lotta gun.

mattz357
February 11, 2006, 11:32 PM
Chris, I'm aware of that, I was just hoping it might have been an L frame. The N frames are a little large for my liking, and everything I have now uses the same grips (all K/L frame) so that would throw off everything. Oh well, I still want one. :)

ChristopherG
February 12, 2006, 08:11 AM
Ah--sorry I misunderstood. I don't think they could jam more than 7 .357's in an L-frame. On the other hand, if what you want is an L-frame .357 with a rail, it seems probable that they'll offer it on more than one model if it proves popular. Don't give up hope!

BlkHawk73
February 12, 2006, 08:18 AM
Oh look a rail...that makes it tactical! Oh Boy! :barf:

Wonder how many that swore they'd never own a lockable gun will say "I want one"

mattz357
February 12, 2006, 08:18 AM
We don't even have CCW here in IL, so 7 (or even 6) would be fine with me. I just think it looks cool! :)

Kaylee
February 12, 2006, 10:11 AM
I dunno -- looks like it'd make a right handy house gun.. perfect for those who want a weapon-mounted light and such but don't want an auto for whatever reason.

I don't see the point to griping about light rails and such on general principles... they're a tool and fit a niche. Don't want one, don't buy one.

Now, in this case, I'm curious how the light's supposed to be activated. Since the rail is way up under the barrel, it looks like the little finger levers used on dustcover-mounted lights wouldn't be accessible. Perhaps a little wire-and-button arrangement like some lasers used to use?

357wheelgunner
February 12, 2006, 10:35 AM
It makes sense for people who keep a wheelgun for home defense and want a light mounted on their handgun, but wow does that look ugly.

I'm getting a sig P226 with a rail for my home defense gun, and one without a rail for my CCW, but I'll still shoot and carry my wheelguns from time to time.

That revolver looks ugly, my eyes hurt. Would someone please post a pic of what a revolver is supposed to look like? (hint blued/nickel, pinned and recessed K-frame)

mbartel
February 12, 2006, 10:54 AM
IIRC Smith made the PC X-frame 10.5" 500 with the rail about 2 years ago.....

IV Troop
February 12, 2006, 11:10 AM
Been there Done That already.

I mounted a rail under my full lug 629 comp gun for an M3 flashlight for hunting at night a while ago.

The M3 light on bottom and a Holosight on top is ugly but very effective on fast moving targets at nights.

Killer running jackrabbit gun

Ohen Cepel
February 12, 2006, 11:14 AM
I think it's a great idea!

Will have to wait for other makers to catch one though since I'm not buying a Smith with that freaking lock hole in the side!!!!!!!!!!!:banghead:

doublebarrel
February 12, 2006, 11:34 AM
Now, in this case, I'm curious how the light's supposed to be activated. Since the rail is way up under the barrel, it looks like the little finger levers used on dustcover-mounted lights wouldn't be accessible. Perhaps a little wire-and-button arrangement like some lasers used to use?

I think so too. It'd have to be a wired remote, like a button taped to the grip with a tether routed to the light. Not very neat, but it will work. Maybe in the future they'd invent a wireless remote controlled tac light, like using Blue Tooth technology or something...:cool:

Kaylee
February 12, 2006, 12:51 PM
Maybe in the future they'd invent a wireless remote controlled tac light, like using Blue Tooth technology or something.

Perhaps... I'd sooner see embedded wire in the frame with contacts in the rail and in the gripframe. Then put the button arrangement of your choice in the grip, and the attachment of your choice (with its power supply) on the rail. All the gun has to do is hold the wiring.

:D

pauli
February 12, 2006, 01:09 PM
so, who's gonna be the first one to clamp on a vertical foregrip? ;)

LoadedDrum
February 12, 2006, 01:49 PM
so, who's gonna be the first one to clamp on a vertical foregrip? ;)

Ignoring the the legal issues, call me a wuss but I wouldn't want my forearm that close to the blast from the cylinder gap.:uhoh:

Any Cal.
February 12, 2006, 08:02 PM
I asked my smith about something similiar for a Redhawk. If that comes out in a 329 I am selling my soul to get it. Something about hearing assorted grunts and snuffles in the night outside your tent and slapping a weapon light on the bottom of your .44.:evil: :D :D :D Sorry, just can't quit smiling.:D
If that one wasn't an N frame I would be more interested. Size does matter!

Nightcrawler
February 12, 2006, 08:30 PM
How can you guys not like N-Frames?

Personally, I'm addicted to the things. Especially with 5" barrels. :D

Heathens. Grumble grumble...

P. Plainsman
February 12, 2006, 08:45 PM
You know, that's kind of interesting. Not my cup of tea, but interesting. Eight rounds of .357 isn't bad, either. More power to 'em.

Highland Ranger
February 12, 2006, 09:05 PM
3" barrel is more my style . . . . . perfect symetry . . .

Redhawk1
February 13, 2006, 07:45 AM
Like posted before, S&W has had a rail about 2 years ago on the 500 Mag out of the Performance center and I have 2 460 Mags with a rail, they are the OC model 7.5 inch barrels. So it is nothing new. :D

IV Troop
February 13, 2006, 10:36 AM
Wha...?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How can you guys not like N-Frames?

Personally, I'm addicted to the things. Especially with 5" barrels.



My sentiments exactly. The 5" N frame is my perfect wheelgun. I have a 5" 29 that I think is the perfect all around packin pistol for when I am in the mountains or desert.

jerkface11
February 13, 2006, 11:48 AM
Why are so many people mad about the lock on the side of the gun? I've never seen the taurus guys complain about the locks on theirs. The bersa shooters don't seem to mind either.

doublebarrel
February 13, 2006, 12:34 PM
Why are so many people mad about the lock on the side of the gun? I've never seen the taurus guys complain about the locks on theirs. The bersa shooters don't seem to mind either.

Because many many people have been driving for a whole life time and never have a single accident as little as a parking lot fender bender. Yet, they still drive with full insurance. There's a chance all mechanical devices can fail, and when two devices are combined into one, like a gun and a lock, as an integral unit, the failure of one can cause malfunction of the other. So it's a matter of whether we're willing to accept that kind of possibility. Here's a documented example:

There has been some discussion of these safety locks engaging when they shouldn’t. In the January 2005 issue of American Handgunner, Massad Ayoob published an article about three instances he knew of in which the internal locking device had failed and two of the failures caused the gun to lock up. All three cases were instances in which extremely hot ammunition, such as +p+ and .44 Magnum, were fired from ultra-light scandium and titanium revolvers. Ayoob’s analysis was, “This is not necessarily an indictment of Smith & Wesson, nor even of the integral lock system that company uses. It may be more of a lesson that extraordinarily light handguns firing extremely powerful ammunition can be damaged by the battering of constant, extreme recoil forces. Still, it gives us pause.”

Here's the link (http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/review/Model_60-15.htm) to that article. And here's link to the original Ayoob artical titled, "Gun lock failure" (http://newssearch.looksmart.com/p/articles/mi_m0BTT/is_173_29/ai_n7578382). I'll quote some of it. You can read the whole article by going to that page...

For many years, these integral gun locks have upset firearms purists in the theoretical sense, but caused no actual mechanical problems. However, I've recently run across three cases where these devices failed during firing. Two spontaneously locked themselves during firing at a commercial shooting range, and one lock managed to depart from the gun while its owner was shooting it.

All three were ultra-light Smith & Wesson revolvers firing very hard kicking ammunition. At the Manchester (NH) Indoor Firing Line, reports owner Jim McLoud, a Model 342 Titanium AirLite being fired with powerful .38 Special +P+, and a Model 340 Scandium AirLite being shot with full power .357 Magnum ammo both locked-up tight. McLoud determined the parts in their integral locks had shifted under the heavy recoil and locked up. In Rochester, Indiana, detective Dennis Reichard was firing his personally owned service revolver, a Model 329 Scandium with full power .44 Magnum, when the lock's flag mechanism flew out of its slot in the frame alongside the exposed hammer. While the .44 continued to fire, Reichard was less than thrilled with his duty weapon literally falling apart while he was shooting it, and has gone back to his old all-steel Model 629 without the integral lock mechanism.

Boats
February 13, 2006, 01:11 PM
I have more fundamental objections to Taurus revolvers, so Smith takes all of the "lock heat" in my book.

Smith's lock is or has:

Self actuated on end users.
Located in a fugly spot.
Visually ruins every revovler it is drilled into.
A visual reminder of the Clinton Administration.
A symbol of corporate cowardice in that they dare not offer even special runs without it.
A symbol of corporate arrogance in that if they feel they must keep it, that they don't redesign it to get it further from recoil and block the mainspring or something and get the eyesore below the grips.

Ohen Cepel
February 13, 2006, 01:25 PM
The Taurus system just isn't as fugly, and I can take the hammer out and throw it (and the lock ) away to be replaced with one of my liking.

The whole lock thing is just wrong and S&W have found a way to be more wrong than the rest.

At least Ruger hid their under the grip frame and it's only visible if YOU cut a hole in the grip to get to it.

revolvergeek
February 13, 2006, 01:41 PM
I keep looking at that and thinking that if it had a flashlight on the lower rail and lost the top rail, it would look like Turner's gun from _Count Zero_.

Rick

:D EXACTLY what I thought when I first saw it. If they had made it in 10mm I would think that somebody at S&W had read the book.

mfree
February 13, 2006, 02:00 PM
Augh! Problem!

Most flashlights require you extend your finger and press the back of the switch to activate.

I *really* don't think I want to be stretching my finger out past the cylinder gap, do you?

rbmcmjr
February 13, 2006, 11:03 PM
Like posted before, S&W has had a rail about 2 years ago on the 500 Mag out of the Performance center and I have 2 460 Mags with a rail, they are the OC model 7.5 inch barrels. So it is nothing new. :D
I ignored you last time because it didn't seem worth correcting. Now that you've said it again, I must respond. Those models that you mention have the rail on the top of the receiver, not the bottom of the barrel. That is the element that is new.

Technosavant
February 15, 2006, 10:15 AM
What is that thing? Are some SWAT teams switching to wheelguns? The ultimate home defense revolver (looked to be .357 Mag).

It looks really cool, but wow... that's going a bit far (especially when taking the red dot into account).

MCgunner
February 15, 2006, 10:46 AM
No worse than the rail on the new KT pocket pistol. :scrutiny: I fail to comprehend the rail thing, anyway. I don't need no stupid flashlight on my gun. I don't like electronics on my gun. I don't want no wires hangin' off my gun. The ONLY guns I add stuff to is my Contender barrels, nice optics for killin' deer and hogs. A contender looks naked without a scope. :D

Now, I expect someone's going to build a single action 1873 Colt clone with a friggin' rail on it. :rolleyes:

progunner1957
February 15, 2006, 12:31 PM
Who is gonna make a holster for it? A holster would help conceal the butt ugliness of the thing...:D

357wheelgunner
February 15, 2006, 04:03 PM
I think so too. It'd have to be a wired remote, like a button taped to the grip with a tether routed to the light. Not very neat, but it will work. Maybe in the future they'd invent a wireless remote controlled tac light, like using Blue Tooth technology or something...:cool:

Wires running through a wheelgun?!?

..:barf: ..must..:barf: ..purge..:barf: ..disgusting...:barf: ..thoughts..:barf: ..

KMD
February 15, 2006, 10:53 PM
What is the barrel length on this?

farscott
February 16, 2006, 07:05 AM
Does it use a steel or Al/Sc frame? If the former, I might consider one for a HD nightstand gun for my wife. She loves S&W .357 Magnum revolvers, is a crack shot with her M65LS, and wants a dedicated nightstand gun with a light. The N-frame trigger reach might be an issue, but we can check that out in person.

ChristopherG
February 16, 2006, 07:56 AM
Appears to be all steel.

farscott
February 16, 2006, 12:26 PM
Since I was curious, I did some digging. The model number is 327 TRR8, meaning the frame is not steel. The frame is alloy (Al/Sc), the cylinder is stainless steel, the barrel length is five inches, the front sight is interchangeble, and the rails (both top and bottom) are detachable. The MSRP is $1260, and the SKU is 170269.

Interesting, but not what my wife wants.

gazpacho
February 16, 2006, 01:21 PM
Would a recoil compensator or muzzle break that could reach under and clip onto the rail work?

doublebarrel
February 16, 2006, 01:40 PM
Since I was curious, I did some digging. The model number is 327 TRR8, meaning the frame is not steel. The frame is alloy (Al/Sc), the cylinder is stainless steel, the barrel length is five inches, the front sight is interchangeble, and the rails (both top and bottom) are detachable. The MSRP is $1260, and the SKU is 170269.

Interesting, but not what my wife wants.

Yup, you're right. I used the SKU number you provided and searched Smith's web site. It came up with this PDF file:

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson/upload/other/2006_SW_Handgun.pdf

It listed all their new 2006 handguns, with this railed six shooter in it. Here's all of the write-up on it:

--
Model: 327 TRR8
Product Code: 170269
Frame Size: Large
Caliber: .357 Magnum®/
.38 S&W Special+P
Action: Single/Double Action
Capacity: 8 Rounds
Barrel Length: 5”/12.7 cm
Front Sight: Interchangeable
Rear Sight: Adjustable
Grip: Rubber
Overall Length: 10.5”/26.7 cm
Weight: 35.3 oz./1,000.7 g
Frame Material: Scandium Alloy
Cylinder Mat’l.: Stainless Steel
Finish: Black Glassbead
- Includes Tactical Rails

Model: 327 TRR8
Tactical Rail Revolver
SKU: 170269
MSRP: $1,260
--

What's more? They listed this new 460 Magnum revolver, 460V, a 5" barrel version of the 460XVR. Nice!

http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/6596/111ys.jpg

Model: 460V
Product Code: 163465
Frame Size: Extra Large
Caliber: .460 S&W Magnum®
Action: Single/Double Action
Capacity: 5 Rounds
Barrel Length: 5”/12.7 cm
Front Sight: Red Ramp
Rear Sight: Adjustable
Grip: Rubber
Overall Length: 11.25”/28.57cm
Weight: 62.5 oz./1,771.8 g
Frame Material: Stainless Steel
Cylinder Mat’l: Stainless Steel
Finish: Satin Stainless

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