I bought a Hi-Point 9mm Carbine


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Doug S
February 11, 2006, 06:49 PM
I can't believe that I bought a Hi-Point 9mm carbine today. I had a couple of Mosin carbines sitting in the safe unused, and I thought I'd take them to a local shop to see what they could do on a trade in. I traded the two Mosin Nagant carbines for it, plus a few dollars. It is about the ugliest firearm that I have ever seen (next to a Hi-Point handgun). It came with a compensator, scope mount, a sling, and surprisingly, a laser sight. I took it to the range not expecting much, but to my surprise, the little carbine ate through 100 rounds without a single glitch. To top it off, it was accurate to boot. I don't like the crappy cheap low cap magazine, but otherwise, it seems like it might be a decent firearm if you're looking for a cheap 9mm carbine. The 9mm Beretta next to it was $600 in comparison, but I suppose you must get something more for your money.

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Car Knocker
February 11, 2006, 07:03 PM
I don't believe that I've ever heard or read a valid negative comment on the Hi-Point carbines other than, of course, regarding esthetics. They do exactly what they are supposed to do and do it well.

Don't Tread On Me
February 11, 2006, 07:53 PM
Only negative is lack of a high-cap magazine. :D

Doug S
February 11, 2006, 08:35 PM
The magazine is a disappointment, and given the choice I probably would have bought a Kel-Tec because of this. The shop only had the Hi-Point and the Beretta, and I don't think I could of got the $600 for the Beretta out of my two Mosin carbines;) .

Spot77
February 11, 2006, 09:02 PM
There is a 15 round magazine available now; I can't recall if it's a High Point factory mag or not.


Had conventional weapons been used in Star Wars you can bet that Han Solo would've used the High Point carbine.


The gun will certainly put 10 rounds through the same hole at 75 feet.

Crosshair
February 11, 2006, 11:17 PM
There is a 15 round magazine available now; I can't recall if it's a High Point factory mag or not.

DO NOT use the Pro-Mag 15 round mags for the Hi-point. I was an idiot and bought three of them and they do not feed correctly.:(

kennyboy
February 11, 2006, 11:28 PM
I can't stress it enough. High Points are cheap junk. Spend a little more and get a better gun like a Glock.

Ridge
February 11, 2006, 11:35 PM
And exactly what is your expert opinion then kennyboy?

Have you ever owned one?

Have you fired one?

My advise is know what you're talking about before you give a knee jerk reaction like that,try one out,you just might be suprised.

Car Knocker
February 11, 2006, 11:45 PM
I can't stress it enough. High Points are cheap junk. Spend a little more and get a better gun like a Glock.

And how many Glock carbines have you seen in gunshops lately???:neener:

Doug S
February 11, 2006, 11:52 PM
I can't stress it enough. High Points are cheap junk. Spend a little more and get a better gun like a Glock.

I own three Glocks, and love them. I don't think I would buy a Hi-Point handgun, mostly because of the looks. That said, I bought the carbine on a whim, and was very impressed. I put 100 rounds through the carbine without a single failure. This included some rapid fire strings. The gun was extremely accurate, I think because of the peep sight.

Here is a picture of my model, although I haven't yet installed the compensator and laser sight on mine. I may decide not to install them, as I don't think they would be very useful.

The only thing that really bothered me about the gun, was that the 10 round mag seemed cheap. Have any of you had any issues with the factory magazines? The bullets sometimes seemed to point down until I pushed on the back of the round to tip them up. Still this didn't seem to cause any functioning problems. Also wonder if the mag springs are of decent quality?

SpookyPistolero
February 11, 2006, 11:58 PM
I've had one for several years and they're great. I'm not sure what there is that a person could knock on. They're accurate and reliable, quite simply. They won't win a beauty contest, but I'm willing to accept that.

Mine literally has not jammed to my reccolection. If it were re-made to take a double stack of some kind, it'd be even better.

R.W.Dale
February 12, 2006, 01:07 AM
I love mine blus Hi-Point will really stand behind their product http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2189944#post2189944

In a few months the .45 carbine will be out :evil:

Koobuh
February 12, 2006, 01:36 AM
I'm really getting annoyed with the long wait for those .45 hi-points. I've been waiting to get my hands on one since early last year.
For this long of a wait I really would hope they offer a 1911 magazine version or conversion kit, but I don't hold any hope of that. It would be too good to be true. :(

Optical Serenity
February 12, 2006, 01:44 AM
Does anyone have any ballistics results with the same exact ammo out of a Hi-Point carbine and a fullsize handgun like a Glock 17?

craig
February 12, 2006, 01:55 AM
i have a high point carbine and a kel tec sub 2000(beretta version). both are reliable, FUN guns. both have worked flawlessly and are very accurate. i like the high point better comfort wise, but as has been pointed out here the lack of hi cap magazines limits the fun. wish they made 20 and 30 rounders for it like i got for my sub 2000.

R.W.Dale
February 12, 2006, 02:16 AM
Does anyone have any ballistics results with the same exact ammo out of a Hi-Point carbine and a fullsize handgun like a Glock 17?

I've found that you usually gain about 100 to 150 FPS over a handgun

OEF_VET
February 12, 2006, 02:17 AM
I can't stress it enough. High Points are cheap junk. Spend a little more and get a better gun like a Glock.

Yeah, sure, and then try to get 100 yard groups with your GLOCK. If you can get something resembling a group, at 100 yards on a B-27 silhouette, I'll be shocked. After you're done attempting to accomplish that feat, go ahead and actually do it with a Hi-Point carbine.

Yeah, GLOCKs are well thought of, popular, and more expensive than Hi-Point carbines, but there are somethings GLOCKs don't do well. Like shoot 100 yard groups.

BTW, I've shot both Hi-Point carbines and GLOCK pistols. I can't say as I'm willing to rush out and buy either one, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate the good points of either of them.

The Hi-Point carbines are inexpensive, read that as affordable self-defense measures to lower income households, and they are reasonably accurate at pistol-caliber carbine range.

One more thing, kennyboy, what, exactly, is your level of experience that gives you the insight to offer your esteemed opinion? (Me, I'm an eight year veteran of the U.S. Army (Infantry and Field Artillery Forward Observer), with combat experience in Afghanistan and I'm also an NRA certified handgun instructor.)

orangeninja
February 12, 2006, 02:24 AM
I can't stress it enough. High Points are cheap junk. Spend a little more and get a better gun like a Glock.


Don't feed the trolls.

grimjaw
February 12, 2006, 03:06 AM
Yeah, sure, and then try to get 100 yard groups with your GLOCK.

Forget 100 yards. Try to get tight groups standing with a Glock, rapid fire, at 50 yards.

The attached target photo was done in just that fashion, using 115gr Fiocchi FMJ, from a Ruger PC9GR (http://www.ruger.com/Firearms/FAProdView?model=4751&return=Y); two magazines, 34 rounds fired. It clocks 1300-1350 fps. The same ammo out of a Browning Hi-Power clocked ~1200 fps.

The pistol caliber carbine chambered for 9x19 extends your accurate range, mostly because of the extended sight radius. It doesn't do much for your ballistics, especially with heavier bullets. The numbers I've seen show 115gr gaining more velocity on average than 124gr/147gr loads.

As a self-defense gun, I think it's marginal. But it's rugged, reliable, accurate up to the practical limits of the cartridge, and fun. It's also 10X easier to find ammunition than 7.62x39, and cheaper. It will feed just about anything, and no worries about +P+ loads if you choose to go that high. I chose it over the other inexpensive carbines mainly because of the name. I have no notion that the KelTec or HiPoint carbines are lesser weapons.

jmm

dfaugh
February 12, 2006, 10:48 AM
Anyone that says they are junk (are you listening kennyboy) has never shot one, long term. I bought one when they first came out, and its now sent at least 5000 rounds downrange, with NO malfunctions, ever. None. Nada. Zip. And in most cases that was using the cheapest ammo (lots of Wolf and Blazer) ammo I could get. I've never dissasembled it for cleaning, and probably won't until until it starts giving problems. I just clean the bore and action area, as much as possible, without major dissasembly.

Yes, they're kinda ugly, but in a funky sorta way. And did I mention reliable?

355sigfan
February 12, 2006, 11:03 AM
And exactly what is your expert opinion then kennyboy?

Have you ever owned one?

Have you fired one?

My advise is know what you're talking about before you give a knee jerk reaction like that,try one out,you just might be suprised.

I got Kennys back on this one. Their pure crap. I have shot a few and all of the pistols were jamamatics with god awful triggers. Some are down right unsafe. Their the modern saturday night specials. Pure crap. Never tried their carbines but I have no use for pistol caliber pop guns anyway. If I did I would not waste money on a junk gun maker.
Pat

Doug S
February 12, 2006, 11:30 AM
I don't plan on buying another Hi-Point, so it's not like I have a biased interest in defending this gun. That said, I do find it interesting, that at least in regard to the carbine, that most all who have owned or shot one (carbine), have nothing but praise for this model, while only those who have never handled one have made negative comments. I do understand not buying a firearm based on a negative opinion of a manufacturer, but personally, I try to keep my uninformed opinions to myself, and make it a point not to speak so assertively about something with which I've had no firsthand experience. This post is not intended for any person in particular, just as a general observation based on this thread, and on a number of others I've been reading elsewhere. I guess, the point that I'd like to make is this, that the Hi-Point carbine seems like a viable choice for anyone with limited funds, or those who just appreciate a decent bargain.

gonzo_beyondo
February 12, 2006, 11:41 AM
Another happy/satisfied Hi-Point owner here...

The bashers should take a flying leap.

Crosshair
February 12, 2006, 11:43 AM
Does anyone have any ballistics results with the same exact ammo out of a Hi-Point carbine and a fullsize handgun like a Glock 17?
With 115 grain Winchester white box ammo I get about 1300 FPS out of my 995 carbine. However I got over 1400 FPS with 7.5 grains of Blue Dot powder under a 115 grain Winchester bullet. Max load is 8.5 grains IIRC so there is great possibility with slow burning powders. Weather is crap up here so I have not been able to develop loads further.

BillinNH
February 12, 2006, 12:40 PM
I love mine blus Hi-Point will really stand behind their product http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2189944#post2189944

In a few months the .45 carbine will be out :evil:

Could someone tell me the official word from Hi-Point/MKS on this product? Availibility, specs, mag size, MSRP, etc. I want one of these really bad.

As to Hi-cap mags for the 9mm , I assume their feeding problems can be fixed by a little work on the spacing of the forward portions of the feed lips. Anyone tried this?

As to people knocking the HI-POINT carbines, I can only conclude that their knowledge is not first hand. These are very reliable, accurate guns with excellent ergonomics (for me ,at least) and a great price point. What's not to like? Well, OK, the looks, but they grow on you.

Bill

Doug S
February 12, 2006, 01:22 PM
This is the only one I could find easily. I've seen another reviews which list the OAL as 31.5 and the barrel at 16in. I'm not sure which is most accurate. The carbine is quite a handy size. Comparable to an AK, but more comfortable in regard to buttstock and length of pull. MSRP ranges from $199 to $280 depending on configuration. The one I picked up came with, among other things, a laser sight. The manufacturer lists this particular configuration at $275 in black, & $280 in camo. Seems they can be found for much better prices, and you probably should not pay much more than $200. Mine was at a small shop not known for having the best prices, and they had a price tag of $235 on it.

Model 995 Carbine
Caliber: 9mm Parabellum (also called 9mm Luger, 9X19mm)
Barrel Length: 16.5"
Overall Length: 32.5"
Weight: 5.75 to 6.75 Pounds (depending on accessories)
Stock: All-Weather, Black, High Impact Polymer
Finish: Blued or Chromed Receiver and Barrel Shroud
Sights: Fully adjustable rear Peep sight (Windage and Elevation adjustable)
Magazine: 10 round capacity.

OEF_VET
February 12, 2006, 01:53 PM
I got Kennys back on this one. Their pure crap. I have shot a few and all of the pistols were jamamatics with god awful triggers. Some are down right unsafe. Their the modern saturday night specials. Pure crap. Never tried their carbines but I have no use for pistol caliber pop guns anyway. If I did I would not waste money on a junk gun maker.
Pat

This thread, however, is about the carbines. Therefore, your defense of kennys' back is irrelevant. They (the Hi-Point carbines) are not pure crap. Yes, the pistols are pretty much an abomination upon the sense of sight. They (the pistols) do tend to work. (My first handgun was a Hi-Point 380.) Now, as ugly as the carbines are, and they are quite ugly, they are fully functional.

Of course, if we were going to judge based on looks, the Beretta Storm and the Walther G22 are also pretty dang ugly, as is the Kel-Tec SU-16.

If we're going to judge based on the previous track record of some of the companies' other products, let's look at Beretta, Walther, and Kel-Tec. The Walther P22's are fairly well known for the early models needing repairs. The Kel-Tec P11, chambered in .40 S&W? Would anyone actully be willing to defend this pistol? The P32's are also well known for having issues such as needing a fluff and buff and also they're known to have issues with hollowpoints. Beretta's M9 had a lot of problems with the safeties when they were first sold to the U.S. Army. I personally had a trigger spring on an M9 break while I was using it in Kosovo. That was a pistol which MIGHT have seen a grand total of 2,000 rounds through it during its lifetime.

So, it's pretty obvious to me that you can't judge a product solely based on some of the other products made by the same manufacturer. You also shouldn't judge its functionaltiy based on appearance. Most importantly, you shouldn't pontificate about a products quality if you have ZERO experience with it. It simply makes one look foolish.

BillinNH
February 12, 2006, 02:31 PM
[QUOTE=Doug S]This is the only one I could find easily. I've seen another reviews which list the OAL as 31.5 and the barrel at 16in. I'm not sure which is most accurate. The carbine is quite a handy size. Comparable to an AK, but more comfortable in regard to buttstock and length of pull. MSRP ranges from $199 to $280 depending on configuration. The one I picked up came with, among other things, a laser sight. The manufacturer lists this particular configuration at $275 in black, & $280 in camo. Seems they can be found for much better prices, and you probably should not pay much more than $200. Mine was at a small shop not known for having the best prices, and they had a price tag of $235 on it.

If this was in reply to my request for data, let me apologize for not being clear. I wanted the info on the 45acp version of the carbine. I already have a 9mm.

Thanks.

Bill

bowfin
February 12, 2006, 10:52 PM
I very much like the Hi-Point's sights, but I really need to sit down and figure out how to get a better trigger pull on mine.

I have heard of people being able to clean up and lighten the trigger, and if anyone has any particulars or successful experiences on Hi-Point triggers, I would like to hear what they have to say.

loose cannon
February 13, 2006, 12:39 AM
i shot a friends hp carbine it fed everthing we put in the mags and ejected it smartly to forward right unlike the sub2000 which throws it straight back.

this southpaw would bet the farm on a hp.

50caliber123
February 13, 2006, 03:40 AM
word I received from mkssupply.com, the hi-point website, said first quarter of 2006 it would be available. Also, the magazines are going to be those 9rd magazines their .45acp pistol takes.:( I'll probably pick one up anyways.


While on the topic of the kel-tec 2000, I heard you should not use non-foreign fmj (no cheap target loads) or hollowpoints. No aluminum/steel cased ammo either

Sharpdogs
February 13, 2006, 07:38 AM
Don't forget the Hi-Point carbine makes a good newbie training tool. It's a great step up from the .22 rifle. I often take it to the range when I am taking a new shooter with me.

foghornl
February 13, 2006, 11:45 AM
I don't own any Hi-Point firearms, but I have shot a couple of the 9MM carbines, and one of the .45ACP pistols.

At one of my recent range sessions, guy in the next lane was shooting a Hi-point .45ACP, and was keeping his shots in the 8-ring @25Yds

Hi-Points are certainly NOT the most AP {Aesthetically Pleasing} *** firearms out there, but they are reasonably accurate, and go Bang! when needed.


***Loosely translates to "Man, this is one pig-butt ugly gun".

Crosshair
February 13, 2006, 11:46 AM
Good news. I loaded up some 9mm for my Hi-Point 995. 30 rounds total, 10 each with either 7.5, 8, and 8.5 grains of Blue Dot powder. I will also bring along some winchester white box as a bechmark. I'll shoot them through my chronograph and post the results when I get out to the range. I really think that the slow powder will improve the performance out of the carbine as compared to a pistol.

Mikee Loxxer
February 13, 2006, 02:14 PM
I don't believe that I've ever heard or read a valid negative comment on the Hi-Point carbines other than, of course, regarding esthetics. They do exactly what they are supposed to do and do it well.
Here's one for you. They have firing pins that are not heat treated. The one on my carbine broke after about 700 rounds. I will send it back to have it fixed under the lifetime warranty and will then sell it. I have no use for a firearm with such poor durability. There is a good reason why they have lifetime warranty. They need it.

Another problem with the carbine is the lack of rigidity in its stock. The thing flexes when fired which can be unpleasant to the shooters cheek. I would rather shoot a Remington 700 in 30'06 with 180 grain hunting loads, for me it is less painful.

jerkface11
February 13, 2006, 02:33 PM
Here's one for you. They have firing pins that are not heat treated. The one on my carbine broke after about 700 rounds. I will send it back to have it fixed under the lifetime warranty and will then sell it. I have no use for a firearm with such poor durability. There is a good reason why they have lifetime warranty. They need it.

Another problem with the carbine is the lack of rigidity in its stock. The thing flexes when fired which can be unpleasant to the shooters cheek. I would rather shoot a Remington 700 in 30'06 with 180 grain hunting loads, for me it is less painful.


Odd i put about 50 rounds of hirtenberger thru mine and it NEVER flexed. I can't even see how one could.

Mikee Loxxer
February 13, 2006, 02:41 PM
The stocks on the carbine are not very rigid at all. When I mention them flexing I am not talking about movement of a dramatic degree but just enough to feel it in your cheek. In fact I would suggest that you grab yours with one hand on the barrrel and the other on the buttstock and try and flex it. I think that you will find they flex quite easily.

Doug S
February 13, 2006, 04:32 PM
I did notice a slight sting on the cheek when shooting. Long-term durability is a concern, but from what I've read, many claim that Hi-Point makes a durable carbine. I will be able to compare it side by side with the Kel-Tec Sub 2000 hopefully this weekend. I put one (Sub 2000) on order today. It should arrive in a couple of days according to the dealer. Only $275 for the G17 version. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if it is out performed by the Hi-Point. The reason why I want one is the larger capacity magazines.

hkmp5g17
February 13, 2006, 04:41 PM
I bought one a few years back for $90. My friends made fun of it because it was ugly compared to my AR's Sig's etc. Put about 1000 rounds through it without a jam (mainly ball but some hollowpoints) Sold it to a friend who wanted a defensive carbine but didn't have much cash.

Despite what you read on the net- there are some few firearms out there that are reliable-AND cheap.

Anthony

BloodyRAzorBlades
February 13, 2006, 06:20 PM
I like that gun, my friend's dad has one and ive shot it a few times. I might buy one in the near future if i get the money and am willing to blow that money off for it.:D :p

Cliff
February 13, 2006, 07:05 PM
I've had my Hi-Point carbine for about two years now. It eats all the 9MM I feed it,and it has given me zero problems. A nice little plinker. True,the 10 round mags suck,but so what. Like Defaugh, I have never taken it apart. I also clean the bore and action,and that's it. I suggest you shoot it for awhile,before you form a opinion on it. If they ever come out with some reliable 12-15 round mags for it, I'm buying a bunch. Regardless of what the gloom & doom naysayers are bitchin about:rolleyes: :neener: this little carbine is a keeper.

Doug S
February 13, 2006, 07:53 PM
I've been doing a little reading over on the KTOG forums. Many malfunctioning Sub 2000's over there. Kinda scarey, maybe I should have just stayed with the Hi-Point:uhoh: . No, I'm looking forward to having two 9mm carbines for plinking, and the Kel-Tec, if reliable will be a good companion to my G17 with a couple of 33 round magazines.

BillinNH
February 13, 2006, 09:20 PM
word I received from mkssupply.com, the hi-point website, said first quarter of 2006 it would be available. Also, the magazines are going to be those 9rd magazines their .45acp pistol takes.:( I'll probably pick one up anyways.



Thanks for the info. The mag sounds disappointing but like you I will probably still get one. Someone will eventually come out with a bigger mag for it. But 1911 compatibility would have been nice.

I have a Camp Carbine in 45 but it is getting so valuable now I'm reluctant to use it as a knock-around gun.


More quote: While on the topic of the kel-tec 2000, I heard you should not use non-foreign fmj (no cheap target loads) or hollowpoints. No aluminum/steel cased ammo either

Here's the deal. Kel-Tec has become very conservative in their disclaimers in recent years and they want to avoid any complaints or suits so they take stronger stands than necessary on some things. The current Sub2Ks have +P+ rated springs so they say weak target rounds may not cycle the gun. Well, try it and see. I betcha they cycle OK after the spring wears in a little bit. They say aluminum Blazers stick a little and impede extraction. Well, maybe some do in some guns but check yours oui first to see if you have a problem. I don't know what the issue is with steel cases. In fact I haven't heard any caveat from KT on them. My Sub2k has successfully fired all types of ammo and WWB type ammo is what I tend to use most.

Bill

loose cannon
February 21, 2006, 06:01 AM
for lefthanded shooters the hipoint wins over the keltec 2k.reason is the kel2k
ejects brass almost straight back,whereas the hipoint throws em forward right.

i purchased a 2k in the g17mag format,it was a really cool concept till i fired it and it fed me a brass snack.as i posted before the hipoint i tryed worked great for me.i eventually ended up trading the 2k off.

dfaugh
February 21, 2006, 10:03 AM
Here's one for you. They have firing pins that are not heat treated. The one on my carbine broke after about 700 rounds. I will send it back to have it fixed under the lifetime warranty and will then sell it. I have no use for a firearm with such poor durability. There is a good reason why they have lifetime warranty. They need it.

Another problem with the carbine is the lack of rigidity in its stock. The thing flexes when fired which can be unpleasant to the shooters cheek.

I guess you better tell that to mind, because, as mentioned, its got about 5000 rounds through it. And I personally, nor anyone else that's shot it (that's ALOT of people, see below), have ever had an issue with the stock flexing.

I second the opinion that its a great "starter" gun...I've taught several people using it...in fact that accounts for about 1/3 of all rounds fired. I start 'em with a bolt action .22, then move to the Hi-point...Every one that shoots it, thinks its "neat"...

hkmp5g17
February 22, 2006, 05:06 PM
Anyone see the new Guns magazine? There's an article on the Hi Point .40 carbine- they liked it. ALSO- they claim it's in use with-

Homeland Security:eek:
Tampa (FL) P.D.
Texas Dept of Prisons
and others.

Thoughts?

Adviser 1
September 28, 2009, 02:44 AM
Advanced Technologies makes a conversion kit that makes the hi-point look just like the Beretta...Cheap 50$ or so...hassle to put on but better than spending all that money you sawn the shelf...the differences are so minimal it is amazing.

Good Luck

nwilliams
September 28, 2009, 03:30 AM
Wow, Feb 2006.

Bit of a necrothread:rolleyes:

rhinoh
September 28, 2009, 05:02 AM
Yup and the .45 HP promised in 2006 still isn't out:p

cchris
September 28, 2009, 07:11 AM
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_iC_4-H2MHfI/Se6BxyKI7zI/AAAAAAAAAMM/_h_J-THlgPs/s400/newstock.jpg

Apparently, this was also supposed to come out in August '09 - a less ugly manufacturer stock. It's now almost October and no sign as of yet on the website.

Also, price check on these things, anyone?

dispatch55126
September 28, 2009, 08:31 AM
I sound like a broken record whenever I say this. Hi-Point carbines are fine rifles all of the detractors are either stating:
1. They've never shot one,
2. They're going off of looks only,
3. They're tried one using a pro-mag magazine.

Yes, the firing pins are not heat treated and they also are the ejector (gasp). However, there are plenty of hardened steel firing pins that are breaking out there and there are plenty of hi-point firing pins which never suffer a problem so that isn't an argument.

Secondly, the cheap and flimsy stock is by design. Being a blowback design and how the receiver is screwed into the stock, the stock is meant to flex to absorb the recoil of the action. The ATI stock is very sturdy and looks good but the rubber recoil pad that you put at the rear of the receiver does not fully absorb the recoil and you can damage the receiver.

I was hesitant when I first bought my 995 because of all the "complaints" but I quickly learned that the complains were not based on any facts.

shane8769
September 28, 2009, 11:06 AM
Hey guys, I am new to this forum but I was reading all your guys stuff. I am from Central New York and went to Herb Phillipsons Army store and they have one of the new 995 rifles with the new stock. It is $249.99 there. Hope this helps

loose cannon
October 7, 2009, 12:09 AM
when i last posted i was still married and living in the country and could shoot on my own range.

boys i do miss my range,lol!

PT1911
October 7, 2009, 12:18 AM
I am happy with my mech tech... thank you very much.

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