Vepr K 545.39 Legal to own in NJ?


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MinMAN
February 17, 2006, 01:57 PM
I have read through the state laws, and am having a hard time coming to a definitive answerer. Any help would me much appreciated.

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TrekkieFromHell
February 17, 2006, 04:30 PM
Heres what NJ considers "Assault Firearms"


w. "Assault firearm" means:
(1) The following firearms:
Algimec AGM1 type
Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder such as
the "Street Sweeper" or "Striker 12"
Armalite AR-180 type
Australian Automatic Arms SAR
Avtomat Kalashnikov type semi-automatic
firearms
Beretta AR-70 and BM59 semi-automatic
firearms
Bushmaster Assault Rifle
Calico M-900 Assault carbine and M-900
CETME G3
Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88 type
Colt AR-15 and CAR-15 series
Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max 1 and Max 2, AR 100
types
Demro TAC-1 carbine type
Encom MP-9 and MP-45 carbine types
FAMAS MAS223 types
FN-FAL, FN-LAR, or FN-FNC type semiautomatic
firearms
Franchi SPAS 12 and LAW 12 shotguns
G3SA type
Galil type Heckler and Koch HK91, HK93,
HK94, MP5, PSG-1
Intratec TEC 9 and 22 semi-automatic
firearms
M1 carbine type
M14S type
MAC 10, MAC 11, MAC 11-9mm carbine type
firearms
PJK M-68 carbine type
Plainfield Machine Company Carbine
Ruger K-Mini-14/5F and Mini-14/5RF
SIG AMT, SIG 550SP, SIG 551SP, SIG PE-
57 types
SKS with detachable magazine type
Spectre Auto carbine type
Springfield Armory BM59 and SAR-48 type
Sterling MK-6, MK-7 and SAR types
Steyr A.U.G. semi-automatic firearms
USAS 12 semi-automatic type shotgun
Uzi type semi-automatic firearms
Valmet M62, M71S, M76, or M78 type semiautomatic
firearms
Weaver Arm Nighthawk.

(2) Any firearm manufactured under any designation
which is substantially identical to any of
the firearms listed above.


Sorry man, looks like you can't get that new toy. You gotta love terms like "substantially identical" though. :cuss:

Nathaniel Firethorn
February 17, 2006, 04:35 PM
That term is so vague as to be meaningless. I believe I remember someone selling a Vepr with hunting-rifle-style wood furniture and it was OK. But now I can't dig up the link.

- NF

TrekkieFromHell
February 17, 2006, 04:44 PM
That term is so vague as to be meaningless. I believe I remember someone selling a Vepr with hunting-rifle-style wood furniture and it was OK. But now I can't dig up the link.

- NF

Intentionally vague. People do that so that nobody knows what to do. Some days I miss NJ, but other days I am just happy I can have my guns.

(Right now I don't have any guns that are banned in NJ, but that will change shortly.)

And Nathaniel, what exit is 8A again? It's been a while. I used to be 14A.

MinMAN
February 17, 2006, 04:47 PM
I saw one for sale in a New Jersey gun shop. It was too hard to pass up.:eek:

Nathaniel Firethorn
February 17, 2006, 04:49 PM
8A is around Hightstown. The closest one to me.

BTW, what I was thinking of was (likely) a WASR-10.

- NF

TrekkieFromHell
February 17, 2006, 04:55 PM
I saw one for sale in a New Jersey gun shop. It was too hard to pass up.:eek:

I guess you might be ok then. However, I still don't know what a cop would say about it if one saw you at the range with it.

Nathaniel Firethorn
February 17, 2006, 05:04 PM
I guess you might be ok then. However, I still don't know what a cop would say about it if one saw you at the range with it."Can I shoot it a little?" :D

In my experience, the cops that actually put in time on a civilian range are OK. There are exceptions (like the police cheif who thought he could violate a club's rules... :mad: )

- NF

MinMAN
February 17, 2006, 05:06 PM
:confused: :barf: :cuss: :banghead:

Getting mixed messages from Cherry Ridge Gun club.

TrekkieFromHell
February 17, 2006, 05:13 PM
"Can I shoot it a little?"

In my experience, the cops that actually put in time on a civilian range are OK. There are exceptions (like the police cheif who thought he could violate a club's rules... )

- NF

I had the joy of dealing with one of the sheriffs out here in my area. They aren't very well liked out here beacuse they tend to think they are superior.
This guy was giving me and CommissarGribb a hard time because somehow our rounds were ricocheting into the police only range.
(Only way I could see them even going near where they were shooting was if after it hit the berm it deflected up and fell down over the 20 foot dirt walls to either side.)

Guess I delt with one of those exceptions. :cuss:

DontBurnMyFlag
February 17, 2006, 05:54 PM
my gun store sells a ROMAK. And a gun dealer I know was selling 1 to. I think they are the ones that ONLY except 10 rd mags though. One was 800 dollars!!! In PA, a regular AK47 with 75rd drum was 300:cuss:

MinMAN
February 17, 2006, 06:04 PM
I just have three 10rnd, and two 5rd mags for it. I sure hope I can keep it.
A very well made rifle, good for target shooting, maybe Varmint hunting too.

Kodiaz
February 17, 2006, 10:52 PM
Hey I used to shoot at Cherry ridge. My dad still does. We'd go early go shoot skeet and then walk thru where grass at the range and pick up all the unbroken skeet. Cherry ridge oh that brings back memories.


If my dad saw my new toy he'd fall over.

Hey Minman not only can I own an Evil Black Rifle but I get my ammo through the mail saving me time and trouble. It's good to be a citizen of the U.S. of A.

beerslurpy
February 17, 2006, 11:03 PM
Sorry mate, the NJ DOJ specified the meaning of "substantially identical" back in 1996. This is still current I beleive.

A semi-automatic firearm should be considered to be "substantially identical," that is, identical in all material respects, to a named assault weapon if it meets the below listed criteria:

A. semi-automatic rifle that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of the following:

1. a folding or telescoping stock;
2. a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
3. a bayonet mount;
4. a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and
5. a grenade launcher;

B. a semi-automatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of the following:

1. an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
2. a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;
3. a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;
4. manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and
5. a semi-automatic version of an automatic firearm; and,

C. a semi-automatic shotgun that has at least 2 of the following:

1. a folding or telescoping stock;
2. a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
3. a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and
4. an ability to accept a detachable magazine.

Lion_dog
February 17, 2006, 11:18 PM
I saw one for sale in a New Jersey gun shop. It was too hard to pass up.:eek:

If you didn't identify yourself as LEO, how did this FFL sell you this? I haven't been to every NJ FFL but the ones that I have only sell or carry legal product for their customers (the NJ resident) to own.

Kodiaz
February 17, 2006, 11:23 PM
Minman if you are buying dangerous assault weapons you obviously work and support the 2A. You should move to a free state like Fl and purchase any weapon you like. Without having to beg the state for permission.


Also no state income tax in Fl either. Stop paying NJ to oppress you, move out.

beerslurpy
February 17, 2006, 11:49 PM
I just sent my AK off to tromix to get it de-bannified. I'm hoping to get a 308 suppressor for it when I get back. If the 86 ban went away I would be set for life.

For some reason, I really want a belt fed MG, but not enough to pay 40 grand for one. A 308 caliber MG42 would be awesome.

gunsmith
February 17, 2006, 11:57 PM
move to Reno NV, here you don't need a permit to carry open or concealed in your car, though you need ccw to carry concealed just walking around.

Palm Beach is too humid in the summer:neener:

also you can have your rifles in the car too! I carry an AR15 sometimes, you just can't have one in the pipe. Also unlike florida you can go to a nightclub to see your favorite punk rock or tony bennet type music and if your in a bar your still legal to ccw. printing isn't a problem here either...I was wearing my glock with a tee shirt over it, very obvious I was packing...my tee shirt read "guns dont kill people. people with mustaches kill people"...

I have a mustache, the cops looked at me, read the tee shirt, saw I was packing and just smiled and said "hi"...

but please move out of NJ and live free, it's worth it!

beerslurpy
February 18, 2006, 12:24 AM
Car carry doesnt require a permit in FL either.

MinMAN
February 18, 2006, 12:30 AM
Posted by "beerslurpy"

A semi-automatic firearm should be considered to be "substantially identical," that is, identical in all material respects, to a named assault weapon if it meets the below listed criteria:

A. semi-automatic rifle that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of the following:

1. a folding or telescoping stock;
2. a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
3. a bayonet mount;
4. a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and
5. a grenade launcher;


My Vepr only has item #2. So according to that, it's legal.

beerslurpy
February 18, 2006, 01:48 AM
Youve found low-cap mags for a 5.45x39 AK?

MinMAN
February 18, 2006, 08:49 AM
Youve found low-cap mags for a 5.45x39 AK?

Yes, robarm.com has them. They are not listed on their site. But If you call, they have a few.

Dead
February 18, 2006, 11:43 AM
MinMAN,

VEPR-K is Legal BUT you can NOT have a threaded barrel, flashhider, or folding, telescoping stock.. If you get the basic no extra model you are ok.. oh and no >15 round mags.

MinMAN
February 18, 2006, 12:09 PM
MinMAN,

VEPR-K is Legal BUT you can NOT have a threaded barrel, flashhider, or folding, telescoping stock.. If you get the basic no extra model you are ok.. oh and no >15 round mags.

On that note, I think I will polish up the trigger contacts with my dremel tool, and see if I can get a better two stage trigger out of it. It feels like a four stage trigger the way it is.:D

Thank you for all your responses. They have been very helpful.

geekWithA.45
February 19, 2006, 11:21 AM
The "substantially identical" phrase was shot down in court as being unconstitutionally vague.

This was one of the _few_ progun court rulings in the state.

IIRC, it turned on the notion that "post-ban" models of banned guns did NOT have all the evil features of their pre-ban predecessors, and therefore where NOT identical in form or function. Unfortunately, it left the loophole that "post-ban" models bearing the same _name_ as their preban predecessors where still banned, even though their form and function was no longer identical.

Go figure.

Subsequently, the AG issued a letter clarifying that for NJ, an AW is one of the listed models, or an unlisted model having more than 2 "evil features".

gunsmith
February 21, 2006, 04:38 AM
while fl does not require a permit for car carry NV is still better.

in FL if you don't have a permit you need to have "two steps" to get to your handgun, and it can't be loaded.
in NV you can conceal or open carry in your car any loaded handgun without a permit.
I also can have an AR15 with a loaded clip (no rounds in the chamber) inserted in my vehicle, like in my lap or passenger seat...at least in Reno, Vegas is a little different with respect to long arms I think....:D

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