proper term for assault rifles?


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p35bhp09
February 18, 2006, 07:27 AM
Just what is the correct way to generalize the ar-15, ak-47, sks type rifle. While I'm big into gun rights hearing someone call them assault rifles just doesn't bother me. I mean a bolt action is a bolt action, a pump is a pump, so what are they? Not trying to make anyone mad this early in the morning I'm just uninformed on the matter and need educating. thanks

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355sigfan
February 18, 2006, 07:33 AM
I have no problem with the term assault rifle. The only feature their missing is a rock and roll switch. I don't play the name games that some gun owners get into. There is nothing wrong with owning real assault rifles with the full auto switch in my opinion. No need to demonize them.
Pat

Chawbaccer
February 18, 2006, 07:58 AM
I believe the term you want is semi-auto or self loading. But I like to call them assault rifle too.

Kodiaz
February 18, 2006, 08:15 AM
How about "high volume anti looter device"

Evil Black Rifle is a good one though.

Ad Astra
February 18, 2006, 08:21 AM
"Military-style semi-auto rifle?"

A GP WASR-10 isn't an AK-47, a Mini-14 can't take a bayonet, an SKS doesn't take a detachable mag (reliably :rolleyes: ).... the definitions get complicated.

The great unwashed public believes "assualt weapons" are machineguns, and *somehow,* maybe through NRA membership, they can be bought at the nearest gunstore.

I was in a newspaper office once where the classified ads had a policy of "no assualt rifle ads"... the proofreader, a non-shooter, didn't have a clue...

thatguy
February 18, 2006, 08:35 AM
An assault rifle is a long arm chambering an intermediate cartridge capable of fully auto fire. Some people took to calling the semi-auto versions of these guns AWs but when the political storm erupted in 1989 over these guns the anti-gunners in the legislature and the press latched onto the term to make them more dangerous sounding to an uninformed public. It would help if we didn't contribute to this propaganda so we should simply call them what they are which is semi-auto rifles.

1911 guy
February 18, 2006, 08:50 AM
An assault weapon is the weapon you happen to have with you when you need to assault someone or something. The venerable M-1 Garand does not fit the description of assault weapon in most minds, yet it worked just fine for thousands of men in Normandy. My .36 caliber flintlock is by no means an assault weapon, until you put it in the hands of a torqued off farmer who isn't going to take it any more and joins the Continental Army. Or defends New Orleans (in 1814 we took a little trip along with Col. Jackson down the mighty Mississipp. We took a little bacon and we took a little beans and we fought the bloody British at the town of New Orleans). Is a bolt action an assault rifle? No, until you put it in the hands of a U.S. Cavalry soldier who happens to be following a dude named Roosevelt up Kettle Hill. '03 Springfield? Tell it to the Doughboys. I've made my point.

FPrice
February 18, 2006, 08:54 AM
I have a rather unique name for them.

I call them..... rifles.

If anyone tries to go overboard with "demonizing" or "overly-technical" names I usually just smile and calmly correct them as necessary.

Chipperman
February 18, 2006, 09:06 AM
"Homeland Defense Rifle"

1 old 0311
February 18, 2006, 09:09 AM
Liberal pisser offers:neener:

Kevin

355sigfan
February 18, 2006, 09:14 AM
Semi auto rifle does not quite cover it. As a Marlin tube fed 22 is a semi auto as is a Browning BAR in 338 win mag. I believe the military style semi auto is a good compromise. I love these guns their fun and I am not ashamed to own them.
pat

bakert
February 18, 2006, 09:16 AM
I've always thought "assault rifle" is a term thought up and used by media types and antis to describe anything that looked different (pistol grip, black, plastic or long magazine extending from the bottom) . Also used for guns involved in a crime. The term could also be substituted for "evil". I've also read and heard of "assault pistols" but have no idea what they are. One of the many media terms that P---me off!!

dfaugh
February 18, 2006, 09:18 AM
thought about putting military in there, then thought through it...

But I don't get my panties in a bunch when people call them "assault rifles", simply because, right or wrong, that's become a commonly used term, and most people understand the type referred to.

Hkmp5sd
February 18, 2006, 10:14 AM
The current definition of "assualt weapon/rifle" is any firearm that is used in a crime, fired at a police officer, fired within 10 miles of an elementary school or playground, recovered by the LEOs on Cops, Dallas SWAT or any other current "follow the cops around with a camera" TV shows, and/or held by Diane Feinstein (usually violating most firearm safety rules) at a political rally.

hksw
February 18, 2006, 10:17 AM
Call them what they are:

I mean a bolt action is a bolt action, a pump is a pump,...

...and a semi-auto is a semi-auto.

M92FS
February 18, 2006, 11:29 AM
semi auto/self loading rifles. :)

ctdonath
February 18, 2006, 11:33 AM
The term "assault rifle" IS a proper term - for military-style SELECT-FIRE (aka full-auto, machineguns) weapons.

The term "assault weapon" is a derrogatory term made up by gun-grabbers in a profoundly failed attempt to categorize & demonize weapons that remind the ignorant of "assault rifles" but without the select-fire or full-auto capability.

"Assault weapon" was the basis for the 1994-2004 ban on certian ugly/scary guns. It failed miserably because there is no sane way to legally & effectively define the category; attempts to do so revolved around cosmetic features common to but not neccessary for such weapons. Such guns commonly have pistol grips, flash suppressors, detatchable magazines, etc. ... but are practically just as effective without them.

The only proper term to use would be "military style semiautomatic" - which are considered "bad" by many only because they're scary ugly.

boofus
February 18, 2006, 11:35 AM
What about "semi-automatic clone"?

"Assault rifle" or "automatic rifle" makes more sense in the military definition-> a select-fire weapon chambered for an intermediate cartridge.

ctdonath
February 18, 2006, 11:36 AM
While I'm big into gun rights hearing someone call them assault rifles just doesn't bother me.A rose by any other name may smell as sweet, but calling a rose "dung" will only make people look at you funny and not take you seriously.

Unless actually talking about military full-auto-capable intermediate-caliber military rifles, use of the term "assault rifle" usually means the speaker is ignorant and should be ignored.

Euclidean
February 18, 2006, 11:36 AM
+1 on "rifles"

An AK47 clone is an AK47 clone in my terminology.

An AR15 is an AR15.

etc. etc.

The term does have meaning, but it refers to a gun with select fire capability. I prefer not to misuse words on purpose.

The other thing is, "assault" is a behavior not a descriptor. The shooter determines what the rifle is used for not the other way around.

mattf7184
February 18, 2006, 11:42 AM
Damn, all those handguns I have since they are used by militaries are military styled handguns!!! :what:

I like the term Homeland Defense Rifle, however we can just call guns such as non assault rifle ARs what they are.....semi automatic magazine fed rifles...

How many here would get pissed if someone used clip and magazine interchangeably, but not assault weapon, assault rifle, etc?

The terms were blurred together by the antis to give a bad image to all magazine fed rifles with pistol grips. Not all of these semi automatic, magazine fed, pistol gripped rifles are military rifles either. Any time the media mentions assault ~insert flavor of month here~ people think fully automatic firearms. The general public believes the rhetoric to how readily available they are and how the NRA is about owning machine guns, grenades, RPGs, tanks, and nuclear weapons...

azrael
February 18, 2006, 11:42 AM
I call mine


MY PRECIOUSSSSSSS

OR

The SIN EATER:evil:

Zen21Tao
February 18, 2006, 04:40 PM
I, like some others, hate the terms "assault rifle" and "assult weapon". The term assult rifle was used to classifly a type of selective fire battle rifle where as the term assault weapon was made up for the some purpose of demonizing a type of sporting rifle that "ressmbles" a military assault rifle. In fact, the similiarity in the terms was designed for the sole purpose of gathering support for the ban through fear and deception.

My pet pieve is when gun owners that say they support the second amendment allow the press to get away with using these terms inapporpriately. Granted many reporters do this because they "don't know any better" not because they are out to support the anti-gun agenda. But, the anti-gun crowd preys on this type of ignorance to further their cause. When we fail to call the media on their irronsability and ignorance we allow gun-control to further its reach towards our beloved rights.

nipprdog
February 18, 2006, 04:45 PM
Assault is a behavior, not a device.

;)

Srigs
February 19, 2006, 02:03 AM
"Homeland Defense Rifle"

I like it!:D

I also like "Semiauto rifle with a high capacity mag!"

Tony Williams
February 19, 2006, 04:32 AM
The term "assault rifle" IS a proper term - for military-style SELECT-FIRE (aka full-auto, machineguns) weapons.

The term "assault weapon" is a derrogatory term made up by gun-grabbers in a profoundly failed attempt to categorize & demonize weapons that remind the ignorant of "assault rifles" but without the select-fire or full-auto capability.
Agreed. I would add that the military term 'assault rifle' tends to be popular rather than official. The two classic examples of the breed - the M16 and the AK 47 - are not officially called 'assault rifles' by their main users.

The gun which kicked this all off was of course the German Stg 44, the term 'Sturmgewehr' being translated as 'assault rifle'. It was unofficially adopted as a handy shorthand to describe the new breed of selective-fire rifles firing cartridges much less powerful than the classic .30 calibre full-power rifles, but much more powerful than pistols.

Ironically, of the very few military rifles officially designated 'assault rifles' (or equivalent) since WW2, one is a Swiss Sturmgewehr in full-power 7.5x55 calibre - and thereby doesn't qualify by the normal definition...:rolleyes:

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

marklbucla
February 19, 2006, 01:27 PM
Sport Utility Rifle.

Assault Rifle is a term with a very bad connotation now. I refuse to call my AR an Assault Rifle.

444
February 19, 2006, 02:47 PM
This has been discussed countless times before, but..........

I enjoy using the correct terms for things if I know the correct term. I personally can't understand why anyone who knew better would use the wrong term if they knew better.

The correct definition of an assult rifle has been given several times in this thread already. Note that an assult rifle and a battle rifle are NOT the same thing. An FN-FAL, or an HK G3, or an M14 are not assult rifles: they don't fire an intermediate sized cartridge. They are battle rifles. An SKS is not an assult rifle by the original definition either. A true assult rifle has to have a detachable magazine and be capable of select fire (not just full auto, but select fire). An M1 is a battle rifle: the definition of a battle rifle does not include having a detachable magazine.

I personally call them rifles the vast majority of the time. If I need to get more specific, I will call them by their proper name (AR15, AK or whatever) or I will put them in the class of semi-auto rifle.

thatguy
February 19, 2006, 04:17 PM
335sigfan- I don't like to put "military style" in there because this is a favorite scary phrase the antis use. Military style mean full-auto to the uninformed who unfortunately elect idiots who then ban military style rifles.

There is no difference between a Marlin 60 and an AR15. They are semi-auto rifles. To make any distinction at all helps the gun banners.

dimmak
February 19, 2006, 06:02 PM
As long as you use the word "tactical" in your description, it really shouldn't matter. I think we all realize that if something is "tactical" then it will make the user invisible, bullet proof, more accurate, shoot faster, etc....
;) :D

355sigfan
February 19, 2006, 06:34 PM
335sigfan- I don't like to put "military style" in there because this is a favorite scary phrase the antis use. Military style mean full-auto to the uninformed who unfortunately elect idiots who then ban military style rifles.

There is no difference between a Marlin 60 and an AR15. They are semi-auto rifles. To make any distinction at all helps the gun banners.

I understand where your comming from. But I like the fact their military style guns and I am not ashamed of it. If an anti said those guns were made for killing people I would say so whats your point.
Pat

GTSteve03
February 19, 2006, 06:56 PM
"Homeland Defense Rifle"
+1

Or "Homeland Security Rifle." :D

Although I'm sure the "real" Department of Homeland Security doesn't really like the thought of a large portion of the citizenry running around with those "assault weapons."

half elf
February 19, 2006, 06:56 PM
I use the term "Sport Utility Rifle" when describing my collection.

k_semler
February 19, 2006, 07:52 PM
Just what is the correct way to generalize the ar-15, ak-47, sks type rifle. While I'm big into gun rights hearing someone call them assault rifles just doesn't bother me. I mean a bolt action is a bolt action, a pump is a pump, so what are they? Not trying to make anyone mad this early in the morning I'm just uninformed on the matter and need educating. thanks

Assault rifle: Any military carbine that discharges a medium caliber cartrage capable of select fire, or automatic fire. Semi-automatic weapons ARE NOT assault rifles.

Assault Weapon: Any semi-automatic firearm the anti-gunners deem to be "scary", (not P.C. in apperance).

Zen21Tao
February 19, 2006, 08:03 PM
I understand where your comming from. But I like the fact their military style guns and I am not ashamed of it. If an anti said those guns were made for killing people I would say so whats your point.
Pat

Did you like not being able to have a telescoping stock or foward grip under the Clinton AWB? The whole reason the ban was allowed to pass in the first place was based on convincing average citizens it was targeting a specific especially dangerous type of weapon not fit for civilian use. I know you like the idea of having a weapon that instills fear in the hearts of mear mortals but its that same misguided fear that is used to ban us from having them.

k_semler
February 19, 2006, 08:07 PM
Agreed. I would add that the military term 'assault rifle' tends to be popular rather than official. The two classic examples of the breed - the M16 and the AK 47 - are not officially called 'assault rifles' by their main users.

The gun which kicked this all off was of course the German Stg 44, the term 'Sturmgewehr' being translated as 'assault rifle'. It was unofficially adopted as a handy shorthand to describe the new breed of selective-fire rifles firing cartridges much less powerful than the classic .30 calibre full-power rifles, but much more powerful than pistols.

Ironically, of the very few military rifles officially designated 'assault rifles' (or equivalent) since WW2, one is a Swiss Sturmgewehr in full-power 7.5x55 calibre - and thereby doesn't qualify by the normal definition...:rolleyes:

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)


Strum = Streamed, Sturm= Storm, Angriff = Assault, Gewehr = Weapon. strumgewehr= Streamed weapon, sturmgewehr = Storm weapon angriffgewehr= Assault Weapon. If you want to go with German, it would be appropriate to call select-fire weapons "Weapons designed with the purpose of raids or "storm operations" in mind."

Tony Williams
February 19, 2006, 09:58 PM
Strum = Streamed, Sturm= Storm, Angriff = Assault, Gewehr = Weapon. strumgewehr= Streamed weapon, sturmgewehr = Storm weapon angriffgewehr= Assault Weapon. If you want to go with German, it would be appropriate to call select-fire weapons "Weapons designed with the purpose of raids or "storm operations" in mind."
True, but 'storm rifle' is ambiguous - it might just mean a rifle for use in bad weather :) 'Assault rifle' is I think a better translation of 'Sturmgewehr' as it conveys the sense more accurately.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website (http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk) and discussion forum (http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/messages/)

355sigfan
February 20, 2006, 04:15 AM
Did you like not being able to have a telescoping stock or foward grip under the Clinton AWB? The whole reason the ban was allowed to pass in the first place was based on convincing average citizens it was targeting a specific especially dangerous type of weapon not fit for civilian use. I know you like the idea of having a weapon that instills fear in the hearts of mear mortals but its that same misguided fear that is used to ban us from having them.

Actually the forward grip applied to pistols not rifles. With rifles you could have a pistol grip or a flash hider not both. At least on domestic rifles. But the problem is not nomenclature but rather educating the public. Also I had what I wanted during the ban with preban and leo stuff.
Pat

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