NFA discussion and questions?


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k_semler
February 19, 2006, 05:23 PM
Before I do so, what is the board policy of discussing NFA regulated conversions to firearms? I have a question under this very topic, but I don't want to violate any board policies, (unwritten or otherwise).

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TexasRifleman
February 19, 2006, 05:25 PM
Before I do so, what is the board policy of discussing NFA regulated conversions to firearms? I have a question under this very topic, but I don't want to violate any board policies, (unwritten or otherwise).

As long as we're not talking about HOW to do it.

How meaning details on making a new one. Since you can't do that under NFA anyway, the only thing left to discuss are parts that already exist.

Shouldn't be a problem approached that way.

What's your question?

Hkmp5sd
February 19, 2006, 05:50 PM
You can talk about anything that is legal. Illegal activities are prohibited.

k_semler
February 19, 2006, 06:02 PM
As long as we're not talking about HOW to do it.

How meaning details on making a new one. Since you can't do that under NFA anyway, the only thing left to discuss are parts that already exist.

Shouldn't be a problem approached that way.

What's your question?

I don't know if this will be OK, but since you asked, here is the question.

It has to do with the secondary sear on the AK varient rifles. (Not the auto-sear). When I operate the FCG manually, I notice that if the trigger is depressed when the hammer returns to the "locked" position after a discharge of a round, the primary sear, (hook) on the trigger is too far forward to catch it, but the secondary sear, (disconnecter), catches it with a miniature hook. If I remove it, I would have no safety. That is simply not an option for me. If I were to grind off that hook on the secondary sear to make it flush with the front of it, so it would not interrupt the bolt from falling when the hammer remains depressed, would this convert the AK to FA, but still allow the use of the safety, (observing that the safety blocks the rear of the secondary sear)? Also, would this not cause the rifle to discharge out of battery? Granted, the rifle would be FA or "safe", but beggers can't be choosers, can they?

EDIT:

Note that I live under the jurisdiction of the 9th Cirucut Court of Appeals. ]US v. Stewart (http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:UXndlDGiaU8J:caselaw.findlaw.com/data2/circs/9th/0210318p.pdf+%22US+v+Stewart%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1) has ruled that since no interstate commerce would be involved, I would not be in violation of any federal statutes.

MGshaggy
February 19, 2006, 06:28 PM
I don't know if this will be OK, but since you asked, here is the question.

It has to do with the secondary sear on the AK varient rifles. (Not the auto-sear). When I operate the FCG manually, I notice that if the trigger is depressed when the hammer returns to the "locked" position after a discharge of a round, the primary sear, (hook) on the trigger is too far forward to catch it, but the secondary sear, (disconnecter), catches it with a miniature hook. If I remove it, I would have no safety. That is simply not an option for me. If I were to grind off that hook on the secondary sear to make it flush with the front of it, so it would not interrupt the bolt from falling when the hammer remains depressed, would this convert the AK to FA, but still allow the use of the safety, (observing that the safety blocks the rear of the secondary sear)? Also, would this not cause the rifle to discharge out of battery? Granted, the rifle would be FA or "safe", but beggers can't be choosers, can they?

EDIT:

Note that I live under the jurisdiction of the 9th Cirucut Court of Appeals. ]US v. Stewart (http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:UXndlDGiaU8J:caselaw.findlaw.com/data2/circs/9th/0210318p.pdf+%22US+v+Stewart%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1) has ruled that since no interstate commerce would be involved, I would not be in violation of any federal statutes.

(sigh...) :banghead:

Yes, you would.

If you're going to rely on legal cases, you should really read the entire proceedural history and related cases. If not, you can really get yourself in deep sheep dip. You are absolutely, 100% dead wrong about the final outcome of Stewart. The case was remanded back to the 9th circuit for reconsideration in light of Raich v. Gonzalez. (I don't suppose you read Raich or any of the other related cases like Wickard?) It IS interstate commerce and regardless of whether you are in the 9th circuit or not, its still a felony.

As for grinding of the disconector and other tricks from the Wiley E. Coyote School of Gunsmithing, it won't make the gun full-auto, but it will make the gun a bomb. The gun might fire full-auto a little bit, but it will eventually and unexpectedly fire out of battery and have a KB. Make sure you're wearing your ACME flak vest along with the rocket skates.:)

k_semler
February 19, 2006, 06:50 PM
Hmm, I don't think I'll do that then. :( Would modifying a auto-sear to mount onto the cross-pin work reliably? I figure if it's enough to retain the shepard's hook, it would have no problems with supporting the weight of a DIAS. It woudn't be that hard to make it a drop in, given two pins, and 2 shepard's hooks. Another thing I thought of was to make a switch that would depress the secondary sear on the rear of it, (where the ladder is), so it would compress the spring and effectivly disable the secondary sear. It would be select-fire, but just a little mor complicated to use then a 3 position selector, (not to mention figuring out how it could be manufactured). How about those "Hellfire Trigger attachments"?Are those worth the $39.95, or should I stick to bumpfiring? Is bump-firing easier with the Tapco G2 fcg then the stock fcg is? I noticed that firing it normally is, but I haven't bumped with the new FCG.

I want to "rock and roll", but I don't want to kill myself in the process or get locked away for 10 years for some fun. Yes, I was aware of Wickard v. Filburn, but I didn't think it would apply in this case, because it wouln't have any effect on interstate commerce. It's not like I could legally buy it across interstate boundries anyway. Granted, the steel in the manufactured part came from interstate commerce, but I would be doing the manufacturing, and not offer it for sale.

EDIT:Regarding Raich v. Gonzalez., what ever happened to the tenth amendment?

ctdonath
February 19, 2006, 06:57 PM
When it comes to NFA guns:

1. Making new machineguns is illegal. Period. Full stop. We think you're a planted federal agent trolling for suckers just by asking.
2. If you haven't paid the $200 tax and gotten written permission from the BATFE to make an NFA gun (machinegun or not), it's illegal.
3. Yes, there are some things that look like loopholes & favorable rulings in the law. You're wrong; they're illegal.
4. There are people who DO know what they're doing with machineguns, both mechanically and legally. They don't do what you are suggesting - for a lot of reasons. If experts aren't doing it, you shouldn't.
5. People who do stupid things with hazardous materials & machines often die.

Please excuse the harsh, even snotty, tone you'll get from others when you ask such questions. The tone reflects how legally & mechanically bad the suggested activity is.

ctdonath
February 19, 2006, 07:07 PM
I want to "rock and roll", but I don't want to kill myself in the process. "Rock and roll" has a $3200 entry fee - as in: the cheapest machineguns (MAC-10) start around $3000, and prices rapidly head for 5 digits.
Would modifying a auto-sear to mount onto the cross-pin work reliably? I figure if it's enough to retain the shepard's hook, it would have no problems with supporting the weight of a DIAS.A legal DIAS is rare and expensive (around $8000). An unregistered (thus illegal) one is far more expensive ($25,000 fine (or am I missing a 0?)).

k_semler
February 19, 2006, 08:22 PM
"Rock and roll" has a $3200 entry fee - as in: the cheapest machineguns (MAC-10) start around $3000, and prices rapidly head for 5 digits.
A legal DIAS is rare and expensive (around $8000). An unregistered (thus illegal) one is far more expensive ($25,000 fine (or am I missing a 0?)).

:what: I have better things to blow my money on then that! :eek: I think I'll just stick to bump-firing then. $3,200 for some fun? I DON"T THINK SO!! So, is it easier to bump-fire with the G2 trigger set? That's completly legal, (at least at last check).

@ctdonath:

I wish I were a plant! I would be making decent money for once. But I would probably have better things to do than troll internet forums. I would want to be on the MG import team, (if they have one), but only if I got an FA MP5. :) And I wanted to know, that's why I asked before I did it. I didn't want to be in BubbaButtPounder Prison for some fun, (or have a gun blow up in my face and kill me).

Art Eatman
February 19, 2006, 09:11 PM
That seems to cover it pretty well. Thanks, all.

Art

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