[trooper]

Allright guys, that's it.

I just found the draft version of the new German firearms regulations that go together with the new weapons law.

The new law says that private firearm ownership is basically only legal for hunting or sporting purposes. Now, that's nothing new.

But the new draft states that ALL FIREARMS THAT ARE OR ONCE WERE IN USE BY A MILITARY OR SECURITY FORCE SHALL NOT BE ALLOWED FOR SHOOTING SPORTS!!!

Reason: those evil service weapons and their derivates don't "meet the accuracy requirements for sporting, thus being unnecessary." Ever heard of such an idiocy?

This basically puts an end to all shooting and private firearm ownership except for small-calibre and maybe muzzle-loaders if the draft passes as it is...

I'm embarassed and scared of my own country.

Now, the only thing I wonder... is there any need for another cop who is serious about his work somewhere across the pond? ;)

(just kiddin', first I'll see how this thing turns out...)


Regards,

Trooper

[NonServiam]

Sorry to hear it, trooper. We're slightly better off up here in Norway, but there are definitely forces here who are looking for an excuse to tighten the laws. I hope the German shooters are organised and ready to fight the passing of this law.

[trooper]

I put my hope in the big shooting associations ripping it apart in court. My own organization, the Military and Police Shooter's Association has only disciplines that involve service arms.

Actually, you'd think a law that stupid and shortsighted could never ever pass... but then again I've heard heard people say a lot dumber things about gun ownership.

It's nothing short of disgusting.


Regards,

Trooper

[Peetmoss]

What would that leave 22's and I dought they havn't been used in someones military somewhere. Sounds to me like they want to ban all guns. Heck there even banning Mossie and Rem shotguns with that.:banghead:

[trooper]

No kidding. Pump-action shotguns with a pistol stock are already illegal here.

They were put on the index when it became known that the guy who committed the Erfurt school massacre used such a devilish device...

I fear to see where this ends.


Regards,

Trooper

[mussi]

Who has voted the socialists into power for a second consecutive term in Germany?

Those who did should know the old adage: "Wir wurden verraten, von den Sozialdemokraten."

(The translation of above sentence is left as an exercise to the interested reader.)

[MeekandMild]

Trooper,

If I were you I'd not be at all optimistic about this. Historical precident is solidly set against you. According to historian Stephen Ambrose, when the WW-II commander of the 506th Regiment requested the German Army in occupied Bavaria turn over its arms they stripped the countryside of all the hunting rifles as well. Ambrose discussed how this had never occurred to the Americans, who have never had a tradition of government control of civilian arms.

When you move, you'd probably enjoy living in the South. There are substantial ethnic German populations scattered about. (The two I'm familiar with are in Texas north of San Antonio and also in Alabama in the town of Huntsville.) So you could conceivably find a place which could give you plenty of support for the move.

I know the climate of the Northeastern US is colder and more like Germany, but the right to keep and bear arms is more endangered.

[cordex]

What would that leave 22's and I dought they havn't been used in someones military somewhere.
.22s are used, or have been used by most armies as training rifles.

Sounds like a pile of fun over there, but of course they aren't taking guns away from the sportsman ... that would just be silly.
(and they'll repeat that right up until they grab the last weapon).

Come on over. You could probably find something to do over here. Maybe look into larger cities needing bilingual officers or consultants.

[trooper]

Mussi,

gotta agree with you...

For all non-German speakers it means "We were betrayed by social democrats."

The problem is that the conservative side doesn't seem to offer a better alternative over here. I've heard that the first sketches and drafts of the new law have already been planned under the Kohl administration.

While some conservative politicians used the opportunity to exclaim that they support the sports shooters' interests I'm not willing to trust them on this issue. On the other hand I probably don't have much of a choice.


Regards,

Trooper

[WonderNine]

I don't know why this surprises anyone. Germany doesn't even have free speech.

[trooper]

Hmm. I wonder where you got that from. Except if you mean that certain extremist viewpoint that advocate ethnic hatred are not published over here...

[TallPine]

What about Border Patrol?

Sky marshall ...?

I have no clue what hurdles you would face getting a work visa.

Of course, you could always take a vacation to Mexico and just walk into the US. :D

[cordex]

Except if you mean that certain extremist viewpoint that advocate ethnic hatred are not published over here...
Well, see ... that's the thing.
Most people around these parts believe that if one doesn't defend the rights of the most ignorant, hateful, disgusting individuals to spout their ignorant, hateful and disgusting viewpoints to their heart's content, you really aren't defending "free speech". Anyone will defend the right of others to agree with them. There's nothing special or free about that. Free speech means that the local sheet-wearing nincompoop gets to print up or talk out about his racial or religious superiority just as much as it means you get to voice your own (far more intelligent, I hope) opinion.

That said, I understand why Germany has enacted those restrictions. I disagree with them, but I understand.

[NonServiam]

The problem is that the conservative side doesn't seem to offer a better alternative over here.

Ditto here in Norway. Our largest "conservative" newspaper orchestrated the registering of magazine (pump and semi-auto) shotguns in the 80s, building up under the fear that the communists would commit a revolution with pump-action shotguns. (Following an article in a communist newspaper stating that the working classes should take back the sport of hunting from the capitalist swines and that the pump action shotgun was a working man's gun.) They are still at it, presenting rather flawed criminal statistics when it suits them to blame it all on the legal gunowners.

Our conservative parties are not to be trusted at all, they wouldn't hesitate to sell us out at all if votes were to be gained from it. And then there is an unholy alliance of socialists and "christian democrats" who would "do it for the children". No parties are explicitly on our side, but we get support from the strangest places sometimes. A party mainly fronting the farmers' special interests are rather pro-hunting. Also, due to the fact that that we have a huge rifle-shooting organisation with about 180 000 members (out of country of 4.5 million) doing a lot of really good stuff for the local communities, we sometimes get support from the Labour Party. They'd sell out the pistol shooters in a heartbeat though. Funnily enough, we get the most support from a small party called "Left", which describes itself as a "social-liberal"-party and is really one of the more freedom minded parties around. Shows that words can have different meanings depending on the context, no? :p

Ooops, sorry. Didn't mean to hijack your thread, trooper. Just thought I'd share some more info on how things are this side of the pond.

On the bright side, the company I'm hoping to get employed by these days (expecting to hear from them in a week or so) has HQ in Houston :D. Not that there aren't enough computer geeks in the US already ...

[trooper]

That said, I understand why Germany has enacted those restrictions. I disagree with them, but I understand.

Well, yeah, I see your point, too. You guessed right, it's a history thing. But imagine now, let's say, a national-socialist party being allowed to spread their filth. What would you think if you saw people in brown uniforms being allowed once again to demonstrate in Germany's streets? Truly scary...

But back to topic...

The regulation first has to pass a hearing in the Federal Council, which is the assembly of the state governments. So I decided to do my part and write an email to my state's prime minister's office that I would base my future voting decisions on his party's support for legal gun ownership (not that I voted for them in the first place :-))

The response I got this morning was the expected thank-you-blablabla.

BTW, thanks for your advice about immigrating... right now I'm not really planning to leave Germany (I was kinda kidding in my first post) but who knows what will be in a few years...

Anyway, America is the country I'd be living in if it weren't for Germany :)
I've spent some time there as an exchange student before and really enjoyed it.


Regards,

Trooper

[Glock Glockler]

Trooper,

I think you'd be welcome in "live free or Die" NH. Comprable to weather to Germany, but we have our guns firmly in our hands.

If you do decide to come here, I'l even help you move in.

Good luck

[MeekandMild]

Don't listen to him Trooper.:D One step in any direction and you're out of New Hampshire and into another one of those little tiny states. Down South you might sweat a little, but you can drive more than two blocks without CCW reciprocity.Texas for instance has counties bigger than New Hampshire. :p

[Marko Kloos]

What would you think if you saw people in brown uniforms being allowed once again to demonstrate in Germany's streets? Truly scary...

Freedom of speech is only free if you grant it to the most vile and despicable segments of society. At least that way they're out in the open. I've lived in Germany for a long time, and just because the neo-Nazis are not allowed to demonstrate doesn't mean they're not there. They're still holding their speeches and their recruiting drives, and thanks to the German State they can feel and act like persecuted martyrs. That alone gets them a good number of members every year.