How Do Marines Choose Weapons?


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Mizzle187
March 9, 2006, 07:53 AM
Ive always wanted to know this but never really had anyone to ask and this site should be able to help me! I figured Marines would be the best example. Who and how do Marines choose the configuration,grips,sights,etc.. on their M14 type rifles? Do they get what ever they want? Can or would they need to put personal(paid for by the soldier) accessories on their weapons? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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fistful
March 9, 2006, 08:24 AM
Yeah, when you go to a new platoon, they give you a card for the arms room, you go to the arms room and decide what you want and put it all on the card. You can choose between m14s, m16s, m60s or a shottie. Most marines pick one of the SOCOM 16 M1A's with an red dot site, and get a collapsible stock on that peice, know what I'm sayin? They also got a whole lot of handguns you can pick, like anything from HKs to revos, and you can get one or two of those, like a high-cap foty and a revo for back-up. You gotta say how many grenades you want to and then how much ammo you want for a mission.

Whenever you need some of your gear, you use your card to open the arms room door. We always get a gat or two before we leave base, just in case.:evil:

HankB
March 9, 2006, 08:36 AM
fistful: ROTFL

kframe357
March 9, 2006, 08:47 AM
I always grabbed me a SAW, or a Ma Deuce on my bad days. :evil:

Kharn
March 9, 2006, 09:15 AM
"Gunny, can I take the 240 today? My back is feeling really good this morning." :neener:

Kharn

MrTwigg
March 9, 2006, 09:29 AM
The U.S.M.C. armory is not a toy store. :banghead:

iamhistory
March 9, 2006, 11:13 AM
We pick whatever we think will kill you the best.

Semper Fi.

(just kidding obviously)

XDKingslayer
March 9, 2006, 11:37 AM
I spent 8 years in the Marines and never saw a Marine with an M-14.

The only ones that use the M-14 are the Spec-Ops units. Recon, SOG, Mt. Warfare, etc. Your everyday grunt doesn't get an M-14.

Now the Navy still has M-14's that they use to shoot string canisters across to another ship during underway refueling or replenishment. We would usually end up taking the rifle away and shooting it ourselves after the Navy guy failed to hit a freaking 500 ft long, 8 story tall naval vessel from 50 yards...

MICHAEL T
March 9, 2006, 11:42 AM
Mizzle187 All Arms room have a pink one waiting for people like you:D They come with flowered mags and lots of tracers.
You get what your assigned. This ain't the Air Force Marines are the real Military

V4Vendetta
March 9, 2006, 12:12 PM
"when you go to a new platoon, they give you a card for the arms room, you go to the arms room and decide what you want and put it all on the card. You can choose between m14s, m16s, m60s or a shottie. Most marines pick one of the SOCOM 16 M1A's with an red dot site, and get a collapsible stock on that peice, know what I'm sayin? They also got a whole lot of handguns you can pick, like anything from HKs to revos, and you can get one or two of those, like a high-cap foty and a revo for back-up. You gotta say how many grenades you want to and then how much ammo you want for a mission."


:eek: That's my kind of store!!!! I can see it now in my dreams.

Me: Come on. Gimmee the MP5SD with plenty of ammo, lots of frag grenades & 2 .45 revolvers.

Guy in charge of armory: No. The last time I gave you frag grenades you used them as fireworks.

Me: Isn't that what they are meant for?:evil:

Guy in charge of armory: Get out before I article 16 you.

Me: Is that the "Field & Stream" article with Lake Tahoe on the cover?

crazed_ss
March 9, 2006, 12:16 PM
I spent 8 years in the Marines and never saw a Marine with an M-14.

Same here.. but I saw a M-14 ONCE.

In bootcamp. They were did a demonstration for us on how ineffective flak jackets are and how your head will explode like a watermelon if a bullet were to hit it.

They fired a M-16 and M-14 through a flak and then through a ammo can filled with water. They also fired them at sandbags to demonstrate how packed sand can help you keep your head :)

I spent a few days on a ship and the Navy guys had an whole bunch of M-14's. They fired them off the side of the ship.

crazed_ss
March 9, 2006, 12:23 PM
Ive always wanted to know this but never really had anyone to ask and this site should be able to help me! I figured Marines would be the best example. Who and how do Marines choose the configuration,grips,sights,etc.. on their M14 type rifles? Do they get what ever they want? Can or would they need to put personal(paid for by the soldier) accessories on their weapons? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

The vast majority of Marines are issued weapons. They're called "T/O" weapons. Basically Generals have decided that who gets what weapon depending on their rank and job.

For example, I was an electronics repair guy.. So they issued me a M-16. Everyone in my shop SGT and below was issued a M-16. Staff NCOs (E-6+) and officers were issued M-9 pistols.

In garrison, if you put some super cool tactical EOTeach sight on your M-16, someone would probably yell at you and say "Who told you to put that on there.. take it off!"

Maybe over in Iraq they're more lenient with aftermarket accessories.. I doubt it though. If you get killed with some wierd sight on your weapon, some officer might decide "See, this Marine died because he modified his weapon!!!!! .. you're only allowed to use issued equipment!"

I dunno.. I never got to go to the sanbox.

V4Vendetta
March 9, 2006, 12:42 PM
So you don't get to pick your gun that you must defend YOUR life with, let alone modify your gun?:banghead: I guess that making bullets like Chief Brody did in "Jaws 2" would be a major no-no also?

crazed_ss
March 9, 2006, 12:52 PM
Yea.. they issue the ammo too.
Snipers obviously use precision ammo.
The only people who might get to "pick" their weapons are hardcore spec-ops types. Even then, the person in charge might dictate to each guy what to bring depending on the mission.

El Tejon
March 9, 2006, 01:07 PM
The process is fairly straight forward.

"Marine, you choose this weapon."
"Yes, Gunny."
"Outstanding."

:D

Turk
March 9, 2006, 01:24 PM
Lets see your platoon has been in a major firefight and you need re-supply. But what does supply send? Let see did Joe take a M-14 or a M-4 today or maybe a SAW. Think about what kind of nightmare that would be. You carry what is assigned to your particular slot and I’m quite sure today it is as it was in Vietnam you weren’t allowed a personal handgun and or gadgets.

Turk

Remember to pray for our troops.

1 old 0311
March 9, 2006, 01:36 PM
Now me and Chesty Puller would just stroll into the armory and yell " Officers on deck" help ourselves, and stroll out:neener: :neener: :neener: :neener:

Kevin

Mizzle187
March 9, 2006, 03:44 PM
Was this not a legit question? I wanted to know how your configuration came about. Becuase with all the media attention our boys are getting these days I see umpteen different configurations when they show a group of our soldiers? Not everybody is super secret 007 navy seal like you are Michael T. Somebodies been spending to much time at ARF.com. Did you have alot of friends growing up? Or will you when you do? Thanks to all that gave me legit help!

XDKingslayer
March 9, 2006, 04:49 PM
Yes this was a legitimate question.

The simply answer is you don't get to chose your weapon. You don't get to put special stuff on it in the Marines. Most of the M-14's you see on TV are used by Special Operations units. Most of the custom looking M-16's you see are held by the Army. They get special sights and front pistol grips and even special slings. They get special goggles and special helmet chinstraps. They get night vision holders that attach to their helmets.

Like I said, I never saw a single Marine with an M-14. The only special weapon a grunt got was the M203. I never saw a single Picatinny rail mount on anything. If you wanted a flashlight on your gun, you did it the old fashioned way, 100MPH tape and parachute cord. Your basic Marine doesn't get these high speed, low drag gimmicks. We don't need them. We've been kicking ass and taking names going on 231 years with half the crap the Army has.

And you know what? That's the way we like it!

nadeem
March 9, 2006, 04:57 PM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact :fire: :cuss:

Kodiaz
March 9, 2006, 05:07 PM
General we have 2 Army companies with every after market doodad on their weapons sir. They are ready to go. "Sargeant out of curiosity what other assets are available?". Sir two platoons of marines just got back from liberty 6 of them are throwing up and another dozen have hangovers. "Sargeant I'm feeling particularly unmerciful towards the enemy this morning send the Marines give them 2 extra grenades a piece and tell them I don't want them to bring any back". "Sir, Yes Sir"

TarpleyG
March 9, 2006, 05:16 PM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact
Them's fightin' words, newbie!

Greg

Jim K
March 9, 2006, 05:21 PM
Just in case this whole thread is not a joke, the answer is that Marines, like Army troops, damn well take the weapon they are assigned under the Table of Organization and Equipment. Period.

Jim

AJ Dual
March 9, 2006, 05:24 PM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact :fire: :cuss:

Too bad THR dosen't have a "I'm going to eat popcorn while I sit back and watch the show" smiley...

:rolleyes:

MrTwigg
March 9, 2006, 05:48 PM
"Marine, you choose this weapon."
"Yes, Gunny."
"Outstanding."

All I could hear was the voice of R. Lee Emery !

V4Vendetta
March 9, 2006, 05:52 PM
"Too bad THR dosen't have a "I'm going to eat popcorn while I sit back and watch the show" smiley..."


+999999999.:D

Freelance Tax Collector
March 9, 2006, 05:52 PM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact

Speaking from your vast array of both Marine corps and SAS combat experience, I presume?

Go back to counter-strike. It sounds like the hard, intense, and patient work of any special operations personell is not right for you. As Gunny Hathcock said, "the job picks you, you don't pick the job".

And tell the rest of your CS clan as well.

Nashmack
March 9, 2006, 06:41 PM
...wow. Former Army grunt here, HU?

Mizzle187
March 9, 2006, 07:20 PM
Thanks for the edit Fistful! Its appreciated!

XDKingslayer
March 9, 2006, 07:33 PM
Speaking from your vast array of both Marine corps and SAS combat experience, I presume?

Just one more person trying to get a rise out of us jarheads. Fortunetly we're above that. Unfortunetly there is yet a cure for diarrhea of the mouth.

scout26
March 9, 2006, 07:49 PM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact
:rolleyes:

V4Vendetta
March 9, 2006, 08:35 PM
"Just one more person trying to get a rise out of us jarheads."


That's another thing. Why do you guys call yourselves "Jarheads"?:confused: Why not something that sounds tough & dangerous like "The 9mm Killers" or "Deaths Associates". Just a though you might want to take up with your boss.:)

mustanger98
March 9, 2006, 08:58 PM
Well, I'm not a Marine, but some of my friends and relatives are currently active or former Marines. IIRC, I heard the "jarhead" tag comes from a feature of an older uniform style that made their heads look like they were screwed on like a jar lid.

Another thing I've heard Marines called is "Uncle Sam's Misguided Children". When you see it along with that mean looking graphic, it looks pretty "macho".

"Death's Associates"... well, as I recall Jim Land was over the sniper program in Vietnam and he said bystanders outside the services as well as servicemen outside the sniper program... they tended to call snipers "murder incorporated". That was before snipers started being respected for their ability to save our guys' lives by taking out key enemy combatants.

All I could hear was the voice of R. Lee Emery !

:D I thought so too, but his name's "Ermey" and not "Emery".

And who the hell is this "nadeem" character? Sounds like something Gunkid would say.:barf:

Turk
March 9, 2006, 09:20 PM
The post.

"""""We've been kicking ass and taking names going on 231 years with half the crap the Army has.

And you know what? That's the way we like it!""""""

My, My, times haven't changed the ego is still there

Turk
173rd Abn. Bdge (seperate)
RVN 68-69

Sgt Stevo
March 9, 2006, 09:21 PM
I have never been a Marine. But I have worked with them, in the course of my time in the army.

very good troops. No problem with them working right next to us in some bad places.

brave in OEF. That is from someone who has been there. Too insult the people who defend you is weak and silly.

The only weapons I saw on the USMC guys was sorta the same as we carried.

Some type of M-16 A3 or m-4 types. I did see scopes of some types on some guys weapons. The 0 types had m-9s.

Then there was on crew, that had Barrett 50 cals , and some kind of 308. Also crew served stuff. Saws, etc. Never saw .40 anything in two tours.

Bopleo
March 9, 2006, 09:27 PM
You dont have a choice.

You take what you are issued, like it or not.

Farnham
March 9, 2006, 09:45 PM
Us pogue types got whatever was in the TO. Somehow I ended up carrying a SAW along with my field desk, the Colonel's tent, some weatherguy antenna, and Sharpies. No customized HS/LD M4 for the map reader, I got a #$%ing sorry @#&ed piece of $*&T ungodly heavy automatic piece of #@*&.

Pay no attention to the fact that I was the ONLY knucklehead in my section with "Expert" on my alphas, please just notice I'm bigger'n everybody else. Here's yer sling, son, come back with your shield or on it.

That's how Marines issue weapons.

S/F

Farnham

oneshooter
March 9, 2006, 09:57 PM
We always refered ourselves as "Uncle Sugars Mouldy Crotch", and you took what you were issued, you loved it and treated it right, and it would save your life.:evil:

Oneshooter
Livin in Texas

BigRobT
March 9, 2006, 09:57 PM
HEY NOW!! Don't be pickin' on my Sea Going Bellhops !!! :D
http://www.improvresourcecenter.com/mb/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

Euclidean
March 9, 2006, 10:04 PM
My good friend is a Marine.

He shoots the M16, the M16, and the M16.

He gets to pick any M16 they give him.

Sinsaba
March 9, 2006, 10:06 PM
I've read some posts on sites that were spposedly first hand that indicated that sometime soldiers would pick up ... uh ... found weapons for use. BS??

Furncliff
March 9, 2006, 10:12 PM
Who ya gonna call?








......................http://www.samizdata.net/blog/~pdeh/f16_bomb.jpg

................heads down people, pickles on the way

mustanger98
March 9, 2006, 11:07 PM
I hadn't heard about the Marines being in the F16 business.

I've read some posts on sites that were spposedly first hand that indicated that sometime soldiers would pick up ... uh ... found weapons for use. BS??

I'd heard about that too. The accounts I read were about outfitting personel not usually armed with rifles, such as tank crew members, with AK's in absense of more M16's. I thought it plausible in Iraq since the place is covered up in AK-47's and it's ammo. It don't mean it's not against regulation.

Hey, Gunny Hiway had an AK-47... you know, the one that makes a distinctive sound when fired... yeah, I know.

Powderman
March 9, 2006, 11:27 PM
First of all....

marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact

I double dog dare you to walk up to ANY Marine--active, reserve, or retired--and say that to them. That includes the females. :evil:

From my son, who returned last June from Fallujah:

1. Marines are issued M16A2's.
2. Some of them had ACOG's. He carried one for a while.
3. Some are issued night vision scopes, too. He also carried one of those.
4. For a couple of house clearing parties, he carried a captured PPsH Russian sub-gun, in 7.62x25. He liked it, but prefered his M16.
5. He hated, with a passion, the M9 pistol. Wanted my .45, but could not take it with him. Told me, in passing, that it "would have come in handy a few times". :eek:

That being said, nadeem, since the Marine Corps are such pansies, why don't you just run down and volunteer? I'm sure you'll sail through Boot Camp. When you get finished, let us know how easy and low stress it was. :evil:

V4Vendetta
March 9, 2006, 11:33 PM
"I double dog dare you to walk up to ANY Marine--active, reserve, or retired--and say that to them. That includes the females."


We can sell tickets to the fight.:D :neener:

cane
March 10, 2006, 12:23 AM
Actually USMC stands for the Univerisity of Science Music and Culture as any graduate will tell you.

Hoploholic
March 10, 2006, 12:32 AM
Mizzle187 All Arms room have a pink one waiting for people like you They come with flowered mags and lots of tracers.
You get what your assigned. This ain't the Air Force Marines are the real Military


Yeah, you'll be thinking pogue as some Zoomie boot gets buried in your ever expanding backside. I was also under the impression that the pink rigs were reserved for arm chair commandos...with ever expanding backsides. :neener:

MSgt B
March 10, 2006, 12:39 AM
The air conditioning in my tent broke three times in one month!!

Sheesh!

Talk about roughing it!

(Most Marines are just guys that wish they'd joined the Air Force)

usmarine0352_2005
March 10, 2006, 01:02 AM
1.) Marines are issued there weapons per their position and/or rank.

(Ie...I was a TOW Missleman, so being in the turret I didn't have lots of room, I carried a 9mm Beretta and a total of (3) mags. When I was in Afghanistan......If we had ever gotten into a firefight....I could possbibly be very dead.

You will of course have your gunner, rifleman, grenadier (M203), and so forth.

I NEVER saw a regular Marine with Special sights or equipment. All GENERAL ISSUE. Thus the name G.I. - GENERAL ISSUE.

Special Forces: Those guys had some nice toy. And the Army gets a lot of cool stuff, even for there regular guys.

2.) JARHEAD: Moniker came about because the MASON JAR company started making their helmets for them in WWII.

BullfrogKen
March 10, 2006, 01:12 AM
but, I doubt things have changed much, the Marines being so traditional . . . and poor.

I was a heavymachinegunner. First year in I spent in Cuba, probably saw the most variety there I ever saw in an armory. We had a 1911 and a Remington 870 in the armory; never saw either one of those outside Gitmo. Being an island far removed from the "system" of the FMF; whatever we needed had to be shipped in . . .by SHIP. Did I say something about tradition, sea service tradition, that "Anchor" part of the Eagle, Globe and . . . Whatever came our way, we kept and never gave up, because the tap there kinda came up dry for most needs. Those were the toys of whoever was Sergeant of the Guard that day, and they rarely left the switch unless strapped to him. We had a tanker holster in the armory for it, too. That made the new squids squirm when we ate at their chow hall.

Intel also had an arms room of their own. Now, they had some WILD stuff in there. AK-47s, AKMs, soviet bloc pistols. Hell they ever had some wierd, short Chinese belt fed machine gun that was permanently mounted to a steel wheeled chasis. It was actually "cute". Never saw anything like it ever since. I'll have to get a Jane's one day and find out what the hell that was. Most of this stuff was "acquired" from defecting Cubans, some like that machine gun, who knows . . . I wouldn't be surprised if something from Teddy's Rough Riders was in there. One day the company used some funds to buy some ammo for this stuff and we had a field day with it. One of my best memories . . . But, NONE of this stuff was available to issue. Once we were done, we cleaned it all, and back into hiding went.

In the Fleet, I had an issued M16A2, no matter what my billet was. Every Marine is a rifleman, even a Marine with a machinegun. No "choosing" from a bunch of configurations. The only difference between them were serial numbers. A few had M203's, usually the squad leader - for marking targets for air strike with smoke or to direct the rest of the squad's fire, or flares to illuminate the target so the rest of the squad could see the target better, but that's it. And he had no choice in the matter, either. The explosive rounds . . . they were available, but the intent is to function as a unit, so leading the team was his first priority, so those don't have as much importance to him as the neophyte might think.

At various times I was assigned as gunner for the team. When I was, I got the "gunner's T/O list" of equipment. I was responsible for the squad's .50 cal, M60 (M240G's get issued now), Mark19, and the tripod, spare barrels, T&E mechanisms, toolboxes, ALL that crap. It was never my decision what to hump that day, and I never got to go check it out whenever I wanted. It was either, "go get the guns, its weapon's maintenence day", "go get your .50 cal today, we're going to the field", or whatever the Gunny said. And the gunner got a Beretta, in 9mm, on top of it all. It sounds like a cool promotion; in reality, its a big responsibility and meant for late nights keeping everything maintained.

I never saw an M-14. Even our Scout/Sniper teams, who you think being a unit that operates in areas forward of the main body and might have an actual need for ammo resupply concerns, didn't have any.

That's another thing. Why do you guys call yourselves "Jarheads"? Why not something that sounds tough & dangerous like "The 9mm Killers" or "Deaths Associates". Just a though you might want to take up with your boss.

V4 - That term comes from a uniform "accessory" Marines serving aboard ship wore during the days men still fought with swords. They affixed high leather collars around their necks to protect that area from sword slashes. The affectionate term "Leatherneck" arose. Those looking for a bar fight called them Jarheads, saying it made them look like their heads were screwed onto their necks.

As far as coming up with your own "super-cool, ultra macho" label. Its passe. The Germans took to calling us a term roughly translated to "Devildog" after we kicked their asses in a little corner of France named Belleau Wood. The Chinese instructed their armies during the "Korean conflict" not to engage Marines, but to instead seek out Army units, and that they could recognize the difference between the two by the distinctive (and useless) uniform leggings Marines of that era wore. But, I guess if it meant I was less likely to have some Chinese peasant taking a shot at me, I might reconsider their usefulness. Those were, as most things in Marine life are, not optional clothing attire.

As far as I'm concerned, when the President tells a nation's leader he's sending in the Marines, that phrase alone is quite sufficient to inspire awe. They either quake with fear of the impending ass-kicking their army's about to recieve, or they're grateful as hell he didn't send in the Army to help with whatever domestic problem they're having. They usually arrive late, without all their gear, and handcuffed.

But Marine doesn't sound tough and dangerous enough? That's a first . . . Any time I come across fellas who need to come up with labels to broadcast how tough and dangerous they are . . . aren't. Kinda reminds me of the brash young punk in Clint Eastwood's movie "Unforgiven" who called himself "The Scofield Kid" . . . and I roll my eyes just the same.

DRZinn
March 10, 2006, 01:17 AM
Most of the custom looking M-16's you see are held by the Army. They get special sights and front pistol grips and even special slings. They get special goggles and special helmet chinstraps. They get night vision holders that attach to their helmets.You're a little behind. Now those things are everywhere - including in the Corps.

USMC: U Suffer, Motrin Cures.

BullfrogKen
March 10, 2006, 01:39 AM
marines suck major ass. The SAS are the best. that is a well known fact

nadeem, go find a Royal Marine and tell him that. You'll sound real tough pronouncing SAS with a whistle through a maw missing a few front teeth.

RevDisk
March 10, 2006, 01:57 AM
I was Army, not the Marines. But being a grunt, I like my weapons. So when I chatted with the Marines, naturally the subject of weapons came up. The basic gist was you have a wide choice. M16 or M16. A couple M203's and a few M240's and SAW's. Unless you have a shiney collar, then it's an M9, a coffee mug and a cell phone.

Naturally, they asked what I had been issued in the past. Not much, of course. Just a plain M16 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/MyM16.jpg), M240 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/IrishMG.jpg), M249 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/FreehandSAW.jpg), M249 Para (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/MicroSAW.jpg), M2 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/M2.jpg), M82A1 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/Casper50cal02.jpg), G36 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/HK36.jpg), SC-70/90 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/ItalianRifle.jpg), Bofors AK5 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/AK5.jpg), Rk.95 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/SakoAK47.jpg), some handbuilt Sako sniper rifle (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/FinnishSniperRifle1.jpg) (maybe some kinda of whacked out Mosin?), Steyr AUG (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/IrishUS.jpg), MG3 (http://www.revdisk.net/photos/SpanishMG.jpg) and this piece of junk called the L85. I'm probably forgetting a dozen, but that was a couple of the pieces I was handed at one point or another.

(I got a suggestion for replacing that 'Army of One' logo. How about 'The Army has nifty toys' ? )

Edit : I have actually seen some M14's being used as 'designated marksmen rifles'. Not many, but they're out there. Usually an M14 with some optics and a bipod.

Powderman
March 10, 2006, 02:04 AM
RevDisk:

In your picture with the bolt action rifle, THE MUZZLE OF YOUR M16 WAS TOUCHING THE GROUND. :what: :eek: :what: :eek:

You will now push ALL of the pine trees off of Fort Lewis, WA. Push until I get tired!

It's a question of mind over matter. I don't mind, and you don't matter.

(Brings back some flashbacks, now, doesn't it?:neener: :D )

RevDisk
March 10, 2006, 02:16 AM
In your picture with the bolt action rifle, THE MUZZLE OF YOUR M16 WAS TOUCHING THE GROUND.

Tsk, tsk. It was not touching the ground, it was touching the shooting mat.


For lack of situational awareness, drop. Push until *I* get tired. Up, down, up, half way down. Circles to the left. Circles to the right. Now let that marinate for a while! Gods, that was the most horrible phrase I ever heard. By the end of Basic, I was never dropped by the drills. I'd realize I messed up, and just drop myself. We were so brainwashed, if we saw someone ELSE screw up, we'd drop too. If a drill from another company threatened to drop us, we'd drop always.

1 old 0311
March 10, 2006, 06:55 AM
SAS? Isn't that SQUAT ASS SISSY:neener: :neener:

Kevin

V4Vendetta
March 10, 2006, 10:20 AM
Revdisk, could you get me one of those G36's?? Pretty please.:)

crazed_ss
March 12, 2006, 01:35 PM
FYI..

Here's some cool stuff Marines and Army are getting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Marine_Corps_Squad_Advanced_Marksman_Rifle

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Squad_Designated_Marksman_Rifle

I love this pic...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Marines-with-sniper-rifle-3.jpg


M-16 w/ leather sling.. too cool :D

kentucky_smith
March 12, 2006, 03:24 PM
The Marines I have seen around the world have the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps!

— Eleanor Roosevelt, First Lady of the United States, 1945

phonesysphonesys
March 13, 2006, 11:29 AM
I was issued a nice pretty M1 in boot camp. They told me it was mine and I could clean it all I wanted to. God help if the DI thought it was dirty. Later on in the 3rd Mar Div. they gave me a custom BAR. It had nice accesories, bipod,
mag loader, sling, flash suppresor. K-bar, extra mags and a ammo humper.
That baby was fun to shoot. Then at MCRD San Diego, they gave me this nice M14. I had a choice of a plastic stock or wood stock depending on what the sargent handed me. Made me qualify and made me a range instructer.

Taught all you guy's to shoot M14's then they gave you M16's in Nam.
I hope I taught you well and you did a lot of killing.

phonesysphonesys

PS: You use what you are giving

Semper Fi

pcf
March 13, 2006, 02:17 PM
Bootcamp: M16A2 #6583902
Fleet:
-M16A2 and a tripod
-Then a 240G and M9.
-Then a different M16A2 (the silver rifle) and a base plate :(
-Then knee surgery and dropped the basplate.
-Then a M16A4 with an ACOG.
-Became the CO's driver and picked up an M9.
-Then back to the M16A2

Never had any choices, got whatever I was given.

Dmack_901
March 13, 2006, 11:10 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SquadDesignatedMarksman.jpg

It may just be me, but I figure a rear sight would be included in the must haves; that and a magazine.

entropy
March 14, 2006, 10:28 AM
Gee, my Arms Room was like the one in The Matrix :neener: That's just for all the 'deagle' totin' CounterStike types.

You use what you are issued, unless you know your way around the supply system well enough to get want you want without getting caught. ;)

I know of Armorers who 'embellished' M16's for certain units and certain missions with commercially bought components, and more than one SAW gunner who bought the 90 round drum as a backup to the three issued 200 round boxes.(this was before BETA-C's exsisted) Usually as long as the embellishment was to expidite the mission, CO's would turn a blind eye.

I had an M60 'on reserve' in one Arms Room, and an M249 'on reserve' in another, in case my Sgt., who was "co-issued" my rife, decided she really wanted it in a combat zone. (Thank God I never went to war with the 56th Med. - I would have 'defected' to an infantry unit...:p

nadeem, lemme guess, 125th SAS Regiment, right?


I had a very fun afternoon with some Marines from the Force Recon element at Twentynine Palms when they came up to our MOUT to 'play'....practicing building clearing with MP5SD's, and these, nor any other Marines I've met- did NOT suck [expletive deleted], they kicked it!

nvshooter
March 14, 2006, 02:26 PM
There is a manufacturer of AR-type weapons not far from here. Two Marines have had weapons made that they will take with them to Iraq. The rifles are semi-auto here because the manufacturer is not a Class III operation; the rifles will have the full-auto machining done there and the owners will take them into the field. I recall at least one being equipped with a holographic sight. Not issue, by any measure. I hope them boys git them a good bunch of dead terrs to their credit.

Teufelhunden
March 14, 2006, 02:28 PM
"Marine, you choose this weapon."
"Yes, Gunny."
"Outstanding."

This type of exchange summarizes many decisions in the Corps ;)

-Teuf

Correia
March 14, 2006, 02:50 PM
I just searched nadeem's posts. He is a 15 year old English cadet.

Please, Devil Dogs, let the education begin. :p

DRZinn
March 14, 2006, 03:54 PM
Please, Devil Dogs, let the education begin.He's not even worth my time.

sterling180
April 11, 2006, 06:41 PM
Im a navy man myself and Iv'e met a few British,Dutch and US Marines, during my service career so far-so don't assume that we navy or marine boys are all SILLY SISSY SAILORS, because we are trained to be one of the toughest breeds of fighting-machines on THIS PLANET.

Make that comment to a US Marine or a Royal Marine and you will be in hospital for a good few weeks-AT LEAST.:) :) :)

Marines are part of the Navy as are Navy-Seals and their British equiverlents-The SBS-, so don't diss us PLEASE. I might consider joining the SBS selection soon, if I really work at it and it is part of the Royal-Marine Commandos.Us sailors are entitled to be commandos too.

Fire4Effect
April 11, 2006, 07:26 PM
Nadeem, Playstation does not constitute experience. You shouldn't make statements like that about U.S. Marines. They may be the ones saving your butt one day...

DRZinn
April 11, 2006, 07:32 PM
Marines are part of the NavyNot over here.

mp510
April 11, 2006, 07:32 PM
Sterling, they let you Royal Marines into the SAS too, don't they?

AndyC
April 11, 2006, 07:45 PM
Yeah, unfortunately - they'll let just anyone join these days :rolleyes:

RocketMan
April 11, 2006, 08:36 PM
Marines are part of the Navy

Not over here.

What part of "over here" are you?
Last I heard, the USMC is part of the Department of the Navy.
At least the Corps I served in was...

DRZinn
April 11, 2006, 09:31 PM
Last I heard, the USMC is part of the Department of the Navy.Which is NOT the same as being part of the Navy. The Commandant of the Marine Corps sits as one of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, along with the chiefs of staff of the other services. In fact, the current Chairman of the JCS is a Marine.

The Marine Corps hasn't been part of the Navy since 1947.

RocketMan
April 11, 2006, 10:19 PM
Splitting semantic hairs.
Went to read the enabling legislation; talk about dank, dusty, and utterly boring.

DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY

SEC. 206. (a) [50 U.S.C. 409(b)] The term "Department of the Navy" as used in this Act shall be construed to mean the Department of the Navy at the seat of government; the headquarters, United States Marine Corps; the entire operating forces of the United States Navy, including naval aviation, and of the United States Marine Corps, including the reserve components of such forces all field activities, headquarters, forces, bases, installations, activities and functions under the control or supervision of the Department of the Navy; and the United States Coast Guard when operating as a part of the Navy pursuant to law.

[Subsections (b) and (c) were repealed by the law enacting titles 10 and 32, United States Code (Act of August 10, 1956, 70A Stat. 676)].

TITLE 10 > Subtitle C > PART I
PART I—ORGANIZATION

DRZinn
April 11, 2006, 10:29 PM
Splitting semantic hairs.Not at all.

Walter
April 11, 2006, 10:51 PM
nvshooter
Senior Member


Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: somewhat east of Reno, NV
Posts: 109

Thumbs up
There is a manufacturer of AR-type weapons not far from here. Two Marines have had weapons made that they will take with them to Iraq. The rifles are semi-auto here because the manufacturer is not a Class III operation; the rifles will have the full-auto machining done there and the owners will take them into the field. I recall at least one being equipped with a holographic sight. Not issue, by any measure. I hope them boys git them a good bunch of dead terrs to their credit.
nvshooter is offline

I have to call "BS" on that one. In the first place, Marines are not allowed
to carry privately owned weapons into a combat situation (unless the law
has been greatly changed, lately), and secondly, who is gonna do the
"full-auto machining" there. The Marine Corps? I doubt that!
I think this post has a little bit of "urban legend" instilled in it.

Walter

mp510
April 11, 2006, 11:04 PM
An attorney wrote an article in Hook And Bullet after Operation Iraqi Freedom began, when he was confronted by local Marines who had been autherized to carry 1 personally owned handgun in theatre, but could not acquire one due to our states purchase laws.


I have to call "BS" on that one. In the first place, Marines are not allowed
to carry privately owned weapons into a combat situation (unless the law
has been greatly changed, lately), and secondly, who is gonna do the
"full-auto machining" there. The Marine Corps? I doubt that!
I think this post has a little bit of "urban legend" instilled in it.

Walter

DRZinn
April 11, 2006, 11:08 PM
In the first place, Marines are not allowed
to carry privately owned weapons into a combat situation (unless the law
has been greatly changed, lately), and secondly, who is gonna do the
"full-auto machining" there. The Marine Corps? I doubt that!
I think this post has a little bit of "urban legend" instilled in it.You'd be right in 99% of all cases, but sometimes Marines with connections get away with doing things they shouldn't. I knew Marines who took their personal M92's instead of the issue ones. They took the risk of not being able to bring them back. That's why my 1911 didn't go with me. As for the "full-auto machining," if they were pretty close to some armorers they could do it, but we'd be talking full-auto only. Installing a new selector switch and all the other necessary parts would go far beyond the scope of what could be done "under the table."

CPLofMARINES
April 11, 2006, 11:18 PM
Hey, guys! I think that's nadeem pictured in the far right of the photo in reply #31.


Semper Fi

BullfrogKen
April 11, 2006, 11:26 PM
Last I heard, the USMC is part of the Department of the Navy.

Yep, we're the Men's Department . . . .


Sorry Doc . . . any opportunity I get to use that zinger, I will . . . I couldn't pass up this one. :)

DRZinn
April 11, 2006, 11:52 PM
Sorry DocYou don't have to apologize to me:

D R Zinn 091xxxxxxx 0311
Sgt USMC

carlrodd
April 12, 2006, 12:07 AM
Yes this was a legitimate question.

The simply answer is you don't get to chose your weapon. You don't get to put special stuff on it in the Marines. Most of the M-14's you see on TV are used by Special Operations units. Most of the custom looking M-16's you see are held by the Army. They get special sights and front pistol grips and even special slings. They get special goggles and special helmet chinstraps. They get night vision holders that attach to their helmets.

Like I said, I never saw a single Marine with an M-14. The only special weapon a grunt got was the M203. I never saw a single Picatinny rail mount on anything. If you wanted a flashlight on your gun, you did it the old fashioned way, 100MPH tape and parachute cord. Your basic Marine doesn't get these high speed, low drag gimmicks. We don't need them. We've been kicking ass and taking names going on 231 years with half the crap the Army has.

And you know what? That's the way we like it!



wow. lots of testosterone there.....hoooooahhh or whatever. how did that post turn into an army bashing fest? the United States Army had to do two MAJOR reliefs in place for marine units when i was in Iraq. once in Fallujah, and once in An Najaf. most of the soldiers in my unit had very little high speed gear...they were just well-trained.

Sgt Stevo
April 12, 2006, 01:33 AM
The marines in OEF carried the same stuff as we did in OEF. freaken posers are starting to annoy me.

I would never insult the MARINES, OR NAVY,or who ever. As long as they are on our side.

Whats that about? I dont get it. We could mount scopes. we did buy a ton Of our own gear. But we got The M-4 rifles and the MARINES got longer M-16 types. All the inter service heckling stops in the CZ.

As far as some turd from another country insulting ANY of our services. I say.

Dont let the little weasel , get the satisfaction of sitting in his room of his moms house, Alone late at night. getting a rise out of men who have the balls to do what he never could.

I have insulted MARINES, in a bar in SC, but I did it face to face, and we both bleed that night. If you want to talk trash. Grow some testes and do it in person.

You are insulting your betters. And they deserve better.

sterling180
April 12, 2006, 08:33 AM
In the UK the Royal Marine Commandos are part of the Royal-Navy,Okay,so I apparently don't know that much about the US Marine Corps or what Navy seals are part-of, I thought it was the same senior-service-but apparently not according to one, but Im sure the word MARINE-Meaning a SEA-SOILDER-Would be part of the Navy.I will research this subject properly on the internet and will appropriately ammend my post-if I have to.I thought that for one moment, thatI had made the fatal A-word,-assumtion, but I doubt it. I was only just annoyed that some kid,A BRITISH KID could say some insulting things about marines and not know how hard and intensive the actual training is or can get, or what hell-holes they are sent to around the world-in order to preserve democracy.

When he says MARINES SUCK, he probably meant all Marines in all countries- or did he mean specific Marines from specific countries?

What about those Cockleshell heroes at Dieppe,Royal-Marines and SBS personnel who were captured,tortured and were subsequently killed by the Nazis?those men died in preserving the meaning of what it is to be free and civil-for the UK and Europe.The same could be said about the sacrifices that individual US marine corp members made on the sands of the shores, of the south-Pacific Islands and elsewhere, they were fighting the Japs.The US Marine Corps, who fought the Veitcong insurgents in the jungles and flat-plains of Vietnam and in operation Desert Storm(1991) and in the current Iraqi campaigns that started a few years ago-where both Royal and US Marines fought Iraqi insurgents,soilders and vigilanties that lurked in awkward places in various towns and cities of Iraq.

I'll tell you something NADEEM, try joining the Royal Marine Commandos, by enlisting at your nearest Naval careers office and experiance how hard life really is, when they push you to your absolute limits and expect you to accomplish things that would make the ordinary,average guy wince with fear. You may or may not last that long anyway-or myself included.But at the end of the day, if you tried your hardest and you have failed, people will respect you for doing it and believe me, iv'e seen it happen.Ordinary ratings and officers can apply to join the Royal Marine Commandos and SBS (Special Boat Service.) The Marine training is hard and intensive and lasts approximately between 28-30 weeks.Officer candidates would stay another four-weeks because they are officers and will learn extra skills.SBS selection almost equals that of the SAS and is as hard as SAS selection-which at this stage I may or may not pass, when I first apply.You have to really focus because any slip-ups and the instruction-staff will remove you from the selection-process.


Oh and by the way,if you have decided to pluck up the courage and be a real-man, by enlisting please keep your mouth shut whilst at Lympstone, otherwise you will be made to walk the streets of Lympstone,Devon with your birthday-suit on and bruise marks on your butt.



Yes to those of you posters, who said ordinary sailors can join the SAS.In Chris Ryan's autobiography-Bravo Two-Zero , it says that whilst he was training to be a full SAS Trooper,there was a guy with him called Barry who came from the Navy and Ryan himself came from the Territorial Army.T/A is the UK version of the National Guard.Now because both of them didn't have any parachuting experiance, they had to join the Parachute-regiment as their Parent-Unit to gain the neccessary experiance of parachuting and some soildering-if any candidate lacks it.In Barrys case, he lacked discipline, because he refused to have their extremely-short haircut.By Barry's irresponsible actions, Barry got Chris into a huge amount of trouble and later Barry insulted the Parachute-regimants training,etc-in front of the commanding-officer.If any of you have read Chris Ryan's version of Bravo-Two-Zero, then you would know what I am talking about.

Okay as I said before I will research properly before I post on other countries military units-taking care not to offend some.By the way,I heard that a few-decades or so ago an American Marine Sergant was visiting a Royal Marines base and remarked that the Royal Marine organization was similar to that of the USMC.Can anyone varify this?


Now Folks back to Nadeem:

I dont know how you son, can hold mocking-contempt for one of the world's elitist specialist military-units/divisions,from two great countries:The USA and the UK and from other countries that have similar functioning marine-units.

YOU NEED TO SHOW SOME RESPECT FOR OTHERS AS IM SURE YOU WERE TAUGHT IN THE ARMY CADET FORCE.

Now to put us out of our misery, Im going to ask you a question.
Did you say what you said, because you were kidding or were you really serious and meant everyword that came out of your mouth?

NOW TO THE REST OF YOU GUYS:

By the way has the British reality tv show,SAS:Are you tough enough, been shown in the USA and will it be shown at all?

sterling180
April 12, 2006, 11:52 AM
Kevin QUINLAN

If Andy Macnab,Chris Ryan, John "Mack" Mackerleese(I think thats how his name is spelt.)EX-SSGT Eddie Stone, Robin,(All From the Iranian Embassy Seige of 1980, exept for Ryan and Macnab)and finally Thomas Palmer,found this website and saw you make those funny- comments on this thread about the SAS-you would get a lifetimes-worth of hatemail. If you are joking then hahaaha, good-one,but watch out Eddie is an extremely good interrogator and he will make you talk.

Iv'e met Eddie Stone and Mack on an Airsoft CQB battle-simulation range and they sure are battled-hardened tough-guys.Stone and Mack are also on the UK reality tv-show:SAS:Are you tough enough?:) :)

8Balls
April 12, 2006, 01:16 PM
>Naturally, they asked what I had been issued in the past. Not much, of >course. Just a plain M16, M240, M249, M249 Para, M2, M82A1, G36, SC-
>70/90, Bofors AK5, Rk.95 , some handbuilt Sako sniper rifle (maybe some >kinda of whacked out Mosin?), Steyr AUG, MG3 and this piece of junk called >the L85. I'm probably forgetting a dozen, but that was a couple of the >pieces I was handed at one point or another.

Thats not hand built. Thats Valmet TAK-85, which is Finnish army sniper rifle model 1985. It has floating barrel and can shoot half-inch group to 300 meters. The scope is the crappier of two possible scopes: Smith-Bender 4x. We used Zeiss Diavari scopes. It's based on Mosin-Nagant. Bolt-actions were modified and barrels manufactured 1984 by Valmet, rifles were assembled 1984-85 by FDF Asevarikko 1 (Gun depot 1) in Kuopio, Finland.

BTW, where were those pics taken? I'd guess you had rangetime with Finnish peace keepers in kosovo... I know US army or marines dont issue RK95s because they DONT have them.

Finnish army sniper rifles:
http://www.mil.fi/maavoimat/kalustoesittely/index.dsp?level=64&equipment=48

Creeping Incrementalism
April 12, 2006, 02:05 PM
I was only just annoyed that some kid,A BRITISH KID could say some insulting things about marines and not know how hard and intensive the actual training is or can get, or what hell-holes they are sent to around the world-in order to preserve democracy.
sterling180, I didn't read the post in question, but don't get upset when some random person on the Internet insults your service. They're usually trolls, they get a kick out of your reaction, and no one really listen to them anyway.

But when someone says something like this I never saw a single Picatinny rail mount on anything. If you wanted a flashlight on your gun, you did it the old fashioned way, 100MPH tape and parachute cord. Your basic Marine doesn't get these high speed, low drag gimmicks. that sounds like its coming from the real deal, when in fact anyone with two eyes can see Marines on the news (or read about it in books, or see pictures in any medium) with all those gadgets, should be held to account.

Sgt Stevo
April 13, 2006, 03:29 PM
the USMC has just bought 104,000 ACOG scopes. Pretty soon the army will follow.

Also, The US gov is buying back, m14s from lithuania. :neener:

sterling180
April 13, 2006, 05:59 PM
Creeping Incrementalism

I guess that your right, its just unfortunate that this has been said about the Naval/Marine service, by someone who knows very little about it or its vast traditions and excellence.Now back to this kid.His statement is a joke and is very much untrue and it doesn't bother me or others in the Navy in the least-but on one hand he could have posted it as a harmless-joke, but
We will never know for sure whether or not that he meant his little insult as a joke or as a genuine insult,....but its very likely that he had insulted the Marines,because he has had the opportunity to counter-post and defend himself from us cynical posters-by justifying the reasons for posting-to us and we could have called it quits on his vulgar comments.

Kevin Quinlan made an insulting comment about the SAS-but was probably joking.I would love to see him tell that joke to Chris Ryan and Andy MacNab::) :) :D :D hahaaha.Anyway back to this forum.

Sas,Sbs,Royal-Marines,Para-pathfinders in the UK don't always use the SA80, they tend to prefer to use the American-made M16A2 M203, instead or the newish H&K G-36 Assault Rifle.I hope we either get the G36 or the M16 as a standard-weapon, for all personnel and we can finally scrap this unreliable-shoddy excuse for a rifle-THE SA80.

For second-line troops and for tank-crews and reserves I wouldn't mind issuing them with the FN90, because this is such a slender,neat little submachine gun that is good weapon-from what I have heard-and has that classy look about it, like the Glock 17 did when it was first manufactured, for military and civillian use.

Watching Stargate SG1 and seeing it strapped across Colonel Jack O'Neills chest,said to me:"Yeah, this thing is at the right size-dimentions and packs sufficient firepower,to offer persons adequate protection-in addition to a pistol."

RocketMan
April 13, 2006, 07:02 PM
Splitting semantic hairs.

Not at all.


Regardless, it does allow us to say that squids are a lower form of Marine life.:neener:

LawDog
April 13, 2006, 07:12 PM
Or shut the f*&* up.

I don't care who you are, which branch you served in, or what rank you achieved.

You listen to me, and you better listen well:

This. Is. The. High. Road.

Do you understand that? Is that clear to you?

This is not a bar, it is not a whorehouse, and it bloody well isn't your barracks.

The next peson who even thinks of telling another High Road Member to STFU will be out sailing out of here with my boot six feet up his fourth point of contact.

You have a problem with another Member? You take it to e-mail. Period. Full stop.

This is going to stop, and it's bloody well going to stop now.

This board has become a cess-pool of bitchiness, veiled insults, general discourtesy and incivility and I am tired of it.

I did not help Oleg start this board just to see it wallow in the cyberspace version of pig slop.

The Members of this board will straighten up and fly right if I have to hare-lip ever sodding pygmy in the Congo, so help me God.

Civility. Courtesy. Politeness.

Or get out.

Am I crystal clear here?

CLOSED.

LawDog

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