Concertina wire?

[JE223]

What experiences do you have with concertina wire/razor ribbon?

Is it really as effective as people say it is? My application involves a rural setting in which I wish to discourage access to my house. I have lots of scrubby bushes at the base of my fence - what about painting the wire OD green and fit the wire into the bushes?

Would this mangle up the wrong people more than the 'right' people, like a burglar?

Thank you.

JE223

[Daniel Flory]

WAY too indiscriminate IMHO. You could catch anything from a crackhead to the UPS driver to wild animals. As a property owner you can be liable for injuries sustained. So unless you live at the DMZ between North and South Korea, I would recommend against it.

[Thin Black Line]

+1 on liability. There are also many states that have fencing laws and
even if you have rural zoning it must be barb wire of the livestock type.

Also, by putting it up you actually garner more unwanted scrutiny.
For example, this last weekend some friends and I travelled across
our fair state. Along the way we saw a house that had been
surrounded by a 5' dirt berm except for the driveway entrance
from the main road. We LOAO.

So you have to ask yourself if you really need your own FOB? ;)

[calzoom]

Are you nuts? Or another one of those city folks that buy a place in the country and try to make a fort out of it.

Look around at your neighbors, how do they protect their own? Blend in and no one will even notice you unless you are running a meth lab or such.

[MrTwigg]

Seriously, find some nice thick brambles or anything with lots of thorns and dig 'em up. (Wear gloves!) transplant them where you need them. You can take cuttings and dip one end in a "rooting powder" and grow many little thorny plants. They grow pretty fast once they have roots.

I do this to keep unwanted visitors off my land. I've been planting brambles whenever I find "party spots". :evil: Works good for me. :D


I will add when I lived in Queens N.Y.C., folks used to top off the chain link fencing in the back alleys with broken glass bottles.:what: :eek: :what:

[lawson]

painting the wire green would definitely get you in trouble if someone got hurt, as would just hiding it in bushes.

plus, if you ever had to defend yourself, having concertina barricades on your property would make it real easy for the prosecution to paint you as a survivalist wacko.

[Justin]

Only place I've ever seen concertina wire on private buildings was in Newark, NJ.

Suffice it to say, if I ever found myself in a position where fortifying my residence with concertina wire started to sound like a Good Thing™�, I'd start looking for a new place to live.

[AJ Dual]

I agree. Concertina wire is too indescriminate.

You need to get some ditching dynamite and make yourself a couple fougase that cover all your approaches.

That'll teach em. :D

Seriously though, +1 on the thicket. If you research on the net, you can find the nastiest and spikiest one that will live in your climate zone. Not quite poison ivy, but some even secrete irritating chemicals on thier thorns.

The best part is that they'll never rust.

[Devonai]

Concertina wire is very nasty stuff. It will snag on anything other than fine mesh chain mail, and if you don't carefully remove each point one by one from your clothing/flesh you will just make things worse.

I've been on wire detail in the Army, and even with chain mail gloves I got all cut up. The uniform I was wearing would never past inspection again either. It took us all afternoon to load twenty spools from a five-ton to the ground. They are like a demonic Slinky.

The others are right about a lawsuit. If anybody ever stumbled onto your property and got caught in the wire you will be in serious trouble. Even a burglar with a full lockpick kit, watch cap, and Zorro mask would probably have a case in today's world.

If you're trying to discourage trespassers, why in the world would you paint it green?

[ID_shooting]

+100 Devonai

Man, I have stretched more coils of that crap than I ever care to remember. Tripple strand the entire perimeter :barf: I have ruined boots, gloves, BDUs, gortex, rain gear and a even a GP medium.

We had a clumsy kid trip and land in it, He spent two days on bed rest after getting stitches all over his body. Man, never again will I touch that stuff!

[JE223]

Thanks for all the great replies. Devonai, ID_shooting, et all, I've heard that was some bad stuff, but the examples really bring that idea home.

The thorns sound like a good idea - basically, I don't like fences and want to take mine down. But I would like to balance openness with security ... it seems that if I could keep animals/harmless people away from the wire that the wire would stop people being where they have no business being. I.e.... wandering around in underbrush 40 feet from my house...?

JE223

[RyanM]

Even if you put the wire out in the open, it would be easy to stumble into at night. People get lost sometimes. The only place to put any kind of barbed wire, outside of a war zone, is at the top of a fence above head height. Or regular barbed wire on cattle fences.

[Darth Ruger]

Man, I have stretched more coils of that crap than I ever care to remember. Tripple strand the entire perimeter I have ruined boots, gloves, BDUs, gortex, rain gear and a even a GP mediumDitto. In boot camp I also had the pleasure of crawling under it on my back with live fire overhead when it was hanging too low to crawl under. By the time I got to the other side I looked like I just climbed out of a blender.

Even if you put the wire out in the open, it would be easy to stumble into at night. Yep, I've walked into it in the dark before, when it was out in the open. If you think it's hard to see it in the dark, just try getting out of it in the dark... :banghead:

[1911user]

It would work as you ask, but I'd store it safely (your problem) until the collapse of civilization. Then you couldn't be sued for it and its value would be much more than you paid so stock extra rolls :evil:

[meef]

Hey, I live in oregon. If you want something even nastier than concertina wire - plant blackberries all around your place.

If course, if you aren't careful, in a season or two you might not be able to get in or out.

:D

[Jubei]

Hey, I live in oregon. If you want something even nastier that concertina wire - plant blackberries all around your place.

Hey meef,

I planted my Blackberry in the yard, and now I can't hear it ring. Maybe I shoulda turned on the Bluetooth headset first.:D

Jubei

[Shotgun12]

As stated above - not a good idea. With its potential to harming wildlife, such as deer .... I'm sure it would be frowned upon.
As far as two-legged intruders in general, I believe that if your property is "legally posted" .... which means proper placement of - No Trespassing signs (as per law), your a$$ would be covered, in the event someone were to "trespass" onto your property, and be injured in some way. IMO, use of "briar bushes" wouldn't be the route to go either (unless maybe right up against your house) .... keep the field (yard) fairly clear, and just go with some sort of (discrete) detection/alert system for your outer perimeter.

[carpettbaggerr]

http://greenwoodnursery.com/page.cfm/19790
http://greenwoodnursery.com/page.cfm/10356

[eastwood44mag]

Just put an electric wire fence around your property, and keep a cow inside it. The cow is to keep your lawn from over-growing, and the wire keeps it from getting away.

[grimjaw]

Honey locust trees. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honey_locust)
Blackberry bushes. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackberry)
Cactus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cactus), especially prickly pears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Prickly_Pear). Those hurt like the dickens.
Roses. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose)

This page (http://www.infowest.com/business/g/gentle/pp.html) has a couple of interesting ideas.

All I have is feline deterrent. :(

jmm

[MrTwigg]

The "Rosa Hansen Hedge" can survive winters as cold as -50 and can take the heat of Florida & Texas according to The United States National Arboretom. This can grow in; Full Sun, Partial Sun and shade. 6 to 10 feet high at maturity and nearly as wide as well. They do get thick after a while !

My wife likes their pretty flowers too.:D

The only problem with blackberries is the fast growth rate. They are fairly invasive too. Those canes grow fast ! The plus side of blackberries is ... delicious berries ! Full suit of armor required for harvest tho...:uhoh:

[Abby]

Concertina wire works. Boy, does it. Seems I can't get within 20 yeards of the stuff without getting it stuck to my pants. :cuss:

I'd second the big thorny bushes.

[gmarshall139]

Concertina wire can very easily kill someone caught in it. Matters not whether it's a ninja stalking you, or an 8 year old kid looking for his dog. Why not just put in some man traps and land mines? Better yet release some rabid grizzly bears.

[neoimpaler]

i agree concertina wire is way too much of a liablility.

ups, fedex, newspaper, realitives with kids, curious pets, drunken friends..anything could get into that stuff.

not to mention, think about halloween. imagine all the kids coming by (assuming you live somewhere where the kids can come by) if one of them got into that at all, man, what a lawsuit.

[Moondoggie]

Ditto on the effectiveness of concertina wire!

I managed to get just one barb stuck into my leg once. I had to "back it out" properly to avoid gashing my leg open. NOT a pleasant exprience, plus I had help and it was daylight. Fortunately, this was bright, shiney, new wire, but the corpsman still jammed me with a tetenus shot!

At Camp Lejeune once upon a time we had 3 strands around our compound out in the woods. There was a curious black bear that wanted to know what kind of goodies we had. I saw that bear stroll right through that wire several times on his way into/out of our area without even a pause...stuff had zero effect on him. Imagine it would be the same for deer, too. Most animal skin is unbeliveably tough.

BTW, the base game wardens had to dart the bear and truck him across the base to reduce the risk for everybody concerned.

It would be good stuff to have around post TEOTWAWKI, though.

[Lee Lapin]

One more vote for electric fencing. We have six-strand high tensile around our five acres, with 48" stock fence around the house itself. The stock fence is topped with a strand of high tensile wire that is connected to the same fence charger- guaranteed to stop casual fence climbing. I've even topped our 6' privacy fence on the inside with a couple of strands of wire (one hot, one ground) about an inch apart- it's really there to keep my MIL's cat in when they visit, but if you were to wrap your fingers over the top of the fence- ZAP!

The big name fencing companies (Kenco, Dare etc) print giveaway guides to building high tensile fence, it's among the least expensive options for durable effective fencing. There are fence chargers that work off batteries or even solar power, and a few thousand volts are an effective deterrent against casual trespass. Electric fences are in common use around here, every kid old enough to walk already has a healthy respect for them, as do meter readers etc. They aren't considered odd or out of place and are used as much to keep critters out as to keep them in.

lp/nc

[Sam]

I work inside the stuff 4 days a week, 5 coils on the low side and 3 on every cyclone fence.
Forget it. No amount of posting will free you from the liability, which is considerable.

My company pays me an allowance for shredded cloths and it is used. They do not pay an allowance for the rips and tears in my hide and the nasty little infections that follow when it has been up for more than a couple of weeks.

It is only useful for keeping people in 1 spot so you can get a good shot at them.

Sam

[ABTOMAT]

As much as I like ideas for securing one's property, I gotta agree with everyone else. If you put up razor wire around your house, just keep going with the Claymores, punji pits, camo netting, sandbags, and gun emplacements with interlocking fields of fire.

In other words: Unless you're in an area prone to military infantry assaults, forget the razor wire.

[NineseveN]

You not only have to think about wandering animals and children or nosy folks not intent on doing you any harm, but hades forbid you have an emergency and some poor cop or other first responder gets disfigured or worse. That's just a terrible idea, there are better ways to secure one's property that won't be a needless hazard and a liability. There were some very good suggestions in this thread, I suggest you take them under consideration.

[tater_salad]

Hey all, just for information, concertina wire / barbed wire were never designed to be barriers or to keep people out of an area. Has it been used that way, sure, but incorrectly. I'll give a quick example, our unit just finished up our AT overseas in Africa (Niger, actually). We had a platoon sized patrol base set up at one of the training areas (read: middle of the fricking desert). Anyways, it consisted of a large cami-net, about 30 cots, 2 HMMWVs, and a Water/Chow/Ammo Supply Point. Whichever platoon got there before us thought it would be a good idea to set up a spool of C-Wire the entire perimeter of our patrol base with one opening for an entrance/exit. We saw that and laughed at it. Then we took it down. That C-Wire wasn't going to keep anyone out, what it would do though, it would keep us trapped in there if all of a sudden we started taking fire. Talk about a machine-gunner's wet dream. In short, C-Wire and the like are channelizing devices, meant to slow down and channel an adversary into a predetermined path or point, to restrict or slow movement/manuver.

[sacp81170a]

That's one of Murphy's Laws of Combat, I think. When you make it harder to get in, you make it harder to get out. :D

[half elf]

If you live in a semi-warm climate plant a "Decorative?" cactus garden, with rose bushes under each window. Beaver tail or prickly pear cactus in a line around the perimeter will discourage most, and it will grow slow enough to allow trimming. Cholla cactus would be great IF you do not have chidren/pets/neices/nephews/grand children, otherwise leave that bad boy alone.

[ewb45acp]

Roses, raspberries, blackberries, etc...

There is a variety that grows wild around our property. I don't know what it's called. It's similar to blackberry bushes. It flowers but does not produce berries. I swear the stuff is possessed! It seems to reach out at you. Miserable stuff.

[Oldnamvet]

Start raising some pet geese in the yard. They are the best alarm system for intruders I have ever seen. And they make a lot of noise and attack too.:D

[NineseveN]

Sooo, uh, what caliber for "assault geese" then? :D

[Dave Markowitz]

Firethorn bushes planted under windows will keep pretty much any burglar out. I had one at my house that the previous owner hadn't trimmed back in several years. Taking it out was NOT fun -- imagine inch long thorns that go through heavy leather gloves like a hot knife through butter.

[JE223]

Thanks all for the great posts and info. The electric fencing/cactus ideas sound really promising...

I want guests to feel welcome at my home, which, thinking about it now, the concertina wire would definately not help to foster that idea. Someone visiting would be bound to notice it, if their kids/pets did not first. Good ideas there, you have probably kept me out of some hot water. Thanks.

Lets keep this thread going ... Thank you.

JE223

[p35]

I solved a problem with neighborhood dogs running up and down my fence teasing my dogs by planting rosa rugosa in front of the fence. It's a primitive rose bush, grows fast and incredibly thorny. The Highway Department here uses it as a ground cover along the freeways. Also look at Grootendorst- a lot like Rugosa but flowers all season with bunches of little roses maybe 3/4" across. Rugosas bloom once in the spring and that's it. I wouldn't plant blackberry around here- while it would make a totally impassable hedge you'd spend a lot of time cutting it back and digging thorns out of your skin when you finish.

BTW, I maintain the Rugosas with an electric hedge trimmer- cut them down even with the fence once a year and they grow back even thicker. SWMBO doesn't like them obscuring the house from the street.

Where do you live? Makes a big difference on what will work well.

[meef]

There is a variety that grows wild around our property. I don't know what it's called. It's similar to blackberry bushes. It flowers but does not produce berries. I swear the stuff is possessed! It seems to reach out at you. Miserable stuff.
Exactly the experience I've had whenever I went to trim any blackberry bushes on my property.

It does Not like being cut. And that tendency/ability to reach for you when you're ticking it off is downright eerie! I've never encountered a plant that seemed more sentient and hostile than blackberries.

I suppose a fly would feel much the same way about a Venus Fly Trap, however.

[aerod1]

A lot of businesses in the southern sector of Dallas use the concertina wire to protect their business from burglary. You see it a lot around the Fair Park area. I can understand why.

[possum]

hey why don't you set out some claymores while your at it!:)