[Paladin5469]

Decisions, decisions... I'm turning 21 in just a few weeks and I'm buying a firearm. I just don't know what kind. I'm saving up more then a little bit of cash while out here in Iraq (I'm getting short. Heck Yeah!). Right now I'm considering the 1250.00 (approx) STI Lawman or a 500.00 (approx)Browning Hi-Power. The Lawman because I'm attracted to the 1911 style pistol and this particular model seems to be well executed and unique. The Hi-Power could be had for far less and there is no shortage of alcolades for it. While the 1911 is sexier (opnion) and offers a better trigger, Is it worth the extra 750.00+ i would be spending? That's 150% more. Is the 1911 150% better?:confused:

[Medusa]

Well..... No. get the High Power and lot's of ammo (9 mm ammo is cheaper, than .45ACP, so that's an argument too - what's the use of 1911 if you can't afford to shoot it), you can have 1911 later anytime.

[SpookyPistolero]

I'd personally just forget the high dollar custom jobs and decide on either a simple, quality 1911 (Colt, Springfield mil-spec,etc) or the simple, quality Hi-power. Then just decide which fits your hand better, which trigger suits you more, which shoots best for you. If income will be tight for a while, it's hard to beat the price of a box of 9mm.

Save the price difference and invest, or buy extra ammo.

[Black Majik]

I see three options really...

1) Buy what you really want, a mid level production 1911 and shoot it when you can.

2) Buy a quality GI 1911 such as a SA Milspec and shoot it more with the money you saved

3) Buy the BHP, it isn't what you really wanted, but its close... and you can shoot the bejeezus outta it.

I'd personally would go #2, since you still get the 1911 platform and aren't enamored over the bells and whistles. Learn the gun first, and learn the basics. I went with a no frills Colt Government for my first gun when I turned 21 also. I'm glad I did and appreciate the bells and whistles much more now. :)

Good luck

[Jim Watson]

Springfield makes 1911 pattern 9mms, you can have the Colt ergonomics and the cheap Kraut calibre, best of both worlds. The SA can be endlessly upgraded as you learn what you want and need.
Also the STI Trojan in 9mm if you want a nicer new gun.

[ArmedBear]

Neither of those two guns, IMHO.

Shoot some guns and decide what you want, though. Feel is very important. We can all list a litany of well-made handguns; it does matter that YOU like it.

Mid-range Springfield 1911 is a very nice "forever" gun. CZ-75 is an exceptional 9mm, costs less than the Browning.

[ugaarguy]

Get a Kimber or Springfield "loaded." It'll run 2 or 3 hundred more than the BHP or Mil Spec 1911, but it'll still be a very nice 1911 for several hundred less than the STI Lawman. Heck you can even get the Kimber in 9mm so its cheap to shoot. Just some ideas...

[chakup]

What do you want the gun for?

I started with a Glock 19 before the 1911, because I wanted a carry gun, wanted the capcity there and didn't want to carry a 1911. Now that I have the occasional extra $$, I got a 1911 for my range/fun gun.

[Deanimator]

Do you have access to decent gunsmiths in your area? If so, I'd second the motion of the person who recommended an economical Springfield or other M1911. You'll spend MUCH less money and still end up with a gun you can trust your life to.

That having been said, I have multiple M1911s (Springfield, Colt, Norinco) AND a Browning Highpower. If it were me, I would choose between a basic Springfield M1911 and an Argentine Browning HP. Spend the money you save on a holster, ammunition, magazines, gunsmithing, reloading gear, training classes, etc.

[Paladin5469]

I see the economy of buying a Springfield Mill spec. It is something i probably should consider more. I have handled quite a few hi powers in the past year. It seems like every Tawfiq, Ahmad, and Muhammad either have a hi power, Tariq, Star, or Beretta 92 for protection. The hi powers I've seen seem to be really solid weapons. Trigger pull is important to me. I hear tell that the 1911 has a better trigger. How much better? Worlds different? Just as long as its better then the swinging gate my M-9 has for a trigger, Ill be happy.

[PO2Hammer]

A great .45acp for a little less money would be the H&K USP Tactical. True mil spec quality, a match trigger, match grade 'O' ring barrel.
I'll wager a dollar to a donut that the USP will be more reliable and just as accurate as any $1,200 1911.
Of course you might have a thing for steel pistols (I used to). The BHP is one of the all time great designs along with the CZ-75.
A stainless Sig P226 in 9mm would be sweet too.
My 9mm's are a Glock 17L longslide and an H&K USP 9mm, two VERY accurate, reliable and nearly indestructable pistols.

[BozemanMT]

Get both
STI Trojan 1911 in 9mm
Great gun, great quality and cheap to shoot

http://www.stiguns.com/guns/Trojan5/Trojan5.html

real price about $850.

[Vitamin G]

Why not a Colt/Kimber/Springfield/etc ($500-1000)
AND a BHP (Get the FN for $400, or FM for $300)

?

Compromising is for suckers :D

[Paladin5469]

chakup- I’m looking for a weapon that's probably going to end up at range and have fun shooting.- every weekend. If I do get a concealed carry permit (and i probably will) I think the smaller hi power would have the advantage. I’m not too concerned about super extreme 1,000,000 round reliability. I take care of my weapons.

P02Hammer- Great suggestion with the USP but if I’m going to get a 45. its probably going to be a 1911. I’ve toyed with a sig 226- It is a beautiful pistol however it didn’t feel right in my hands.

[chakup]

In that case since you've budgeted what you have-
springfield Loaded- $650
9mm of choice- $550

I think you said you budgeted $1200. for $550 you have a large pool of 9mm's to choose from. This way you have all bases covered. I say the loaded over the mil-spec because it is a very nice package for the price.

[Paladin5469]

chakup- is 650.00 the going price for a used SA Loaded? Im looking on the SA site and the cheapest loaded is going for 869.00 for the parkarized.

[Paladin5469]

.

[Paladin5469]

.

[Black Majik]

Paladin,

$859 is the listed MSRP price. Usually when you go to a store its a little cheaper than that. So I'm guessing the $650 is the street price :)

[chakup]

The loaded parked can be found new for between $650-$700 is what I've seen. Usually closer to $7ish actually I guess. It wouldn't hurt to look for a used one though. I've sold 4 guns now and all of them had lots of life left in them, just using the cash for other projects.

One thing you may want to keep in mind, a fair number of people seem to believe that Springfield pistols with serial # starting NM, rather then just N, have a better fit and finish. The two I've owned were both NM serial #'s so I can't compare, but they were both excellent guns.

[albanian]

You can shoot twice as much as the .45 for the same price. That seems like a good reason to get the BHP. You are only 21 so cash is probably not real easy to come by so get something that you can afford to feed. 1911s are fine but there will be plenty of time to pick one up if you decide you really want one. $500 sounds like a good price for a BHP if it is a nice older one.

Get the 9mm and when you find a deal on a 1911, get that if you want but never pay full price for a 1911. There are just too many of them out there to ever pay full price. I have picked up $1500 1911s for $500.

[1832]

Get a CZ 85 Combat and you won't regret it.
- Better trigger than my HP and more accurate
- DA/SA with a SA trigger that is better than most out-of-the-box 1911s

[kart racer]

I agree,get a cz and a springfield gi or milspec and have the best of both worlds.When the money comes in,you fix the 1911 the way you want it.You won't be disappointed in a cz.

[Jamie C.]

I'm afraid I have to side with the "both" crowd on this one.

It sounds like you're not entirely sold on either idea, and until you have seen for yourself are always gonna wonder if you made the right choice.

So, given the amount of money you're planning to spend, it only makes sense to spend it in the most efficient way. And that, at least to me, is to give you the maximum amount of input.

Besides.... ya got TWO hands... Ought'a have at least two guns. ;)

So, a 9mm of some kind, and a mil-spec 1911.
And when you start leaning more to one than the other, you can re-evaluate and start all over. :evil:

J.C.

[ugaarguy]

On the get both subject go to the gun store and handle a bunch of 9mmS when you get back. You have probably have fellow service members who will let you try out their personal weapons. Get the 9mm you shoot and like best. Then get as much 1911 as your willing to buy. I don't know how many gun stores are close to your home station, but I find much of the fun in a gun purchase to be going to all the stores and finding that new or used gun I cant live without that just feels right every way. Stay safe over there and know we're praying for you back home.

[Medusa]

Didn't think of CZ, too, I like my CZ 75B, something for you to consider too, paladin, at least as good as a BHP, maybe better. Best would be to try and handle several guns, see what feels best.

[Shipwreck]

I've spent mucho money on expensive 1911s before - I recently had a Springfield TRP - I had a disaster w/ a refinish job, and no longer have the gun after I got fed up w/ the whole thing - Also had an expensive Springfield PDP Defender 1911 in the 1990s. Anyway, recently, my Smith and Wesson 99 (P99 clone) was shooting better for me than the TRP was.

So, I don't think ya needa spend a fortune on a gun.

Look at an HK USP - w/ the frame mounted safety, U can carry the gun cocked and locked if you wish (like a high power and 1911). Or, look at the Walther P99 :)

[BAE984]

I turned 21 less than a year ago, and I found a deal on a low end 1911. I'm happy with the pistol, it's reliable, accurate, etc., but I can't shoot it as much as I would like due to the cost of .45. Were I to do it over again, I'd go for a BHP or CZ in 9mm like these guys are suggesting. Both guns always get rave reviews, and it seems like it'd be tough to go wrong with one.

[Deanimator]

Paladin - The Browning HP is not an NRA bullseye target pistol and does not have the trigger pull of one. That having been said, for 7 yard self-defense engagements, you are not going to do anything with an M1911 that you couldn't with a Browning. You do need to remove the magazine safety. It'll GREATLY improve the trigger pull, plus it will allow the magazine to drop free.

If you think that you might want to do serious target shooting, especially in 9mm, your choices are limited. You'll get a superlative trigger pull from an M1911 if properly smithed. The alternatives are a heavily smithed Beretta 92 or a SIG P210, neither of which I consider reasonably priced.

For plinking and self-defense you don't need a $2000 Clark custom. With a modest amount of smithing, either an entry level M1911 or a Browning Highpower will do anything you could reasonably expect.

[cxm]

I'm surprised the S&W 1911 type pistols have not been suggested.

The S&W SW1911 and the smaller/lighter 1911SC (scandium commander size) are excellent pistols, carry reliable right out of the box and a LOT of gun for the price... which is only about $100 more at $600 or so than the BHPs.

I can't say too much good about our S&W 1911 types are... they have displaced the customized commanders for carry.

FWIW

Chuck

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

I say buy the fancy 1911.

Guns last a lifetime. Trying to save a few bucks today is false economy. If you're sure you like the expensive 1911, then buy it and don't look back. Years from now you won't miss the few hundred dollars extra you spent, but you'll definitely appreciate your fine firearm. You're gonna spend the money on something, might as well spend it on something that will provide lasting enjoyment.

The only problem is to make sure that a 1911 is really what you want. It would definitely suck to spend that kinda money on a 1911, only to discover later that 1911s aren't for you.

[Marshall]

Buy the Hi-Power, you won't be sorry. :)

[Black Majik]

Buy the 1911, you won't be sorry :)

[hub]

ok paladin i know my 1911 guys are gonna rip my ass but i say dont go 1911 first. why? well my 5th year in the marines i made 14,000 dollars thats why. i would say you dont make much more 4 years later in 06. maybe if your married and have kids but thats what the money is supposed to go for living expensives and children. i think i went the right way. i bought a glock 23 from the px. better price than anywhere in yuma or around any marine base locals i. e. oceanside, jacksonville,nc you get my point. i got my glock and shot the **** out of it for a year and a half. after that my dad seemed to like my glock more than i did. well his best friend is a cop so we buy all of the clark county in police weapons off him for cheap what he would pay to buy himself. well only having a 1911 in nam he prefers the glock, and after gulf i still prefer 1911 so go figure. my fav is my kimber 1911 and his my glock 23 .40 cal. he carrys it everywhere. well pertaining to this post all the sigs i have every shot are great. not cheap but really good to shoot. im all american as it gets but sigs are top of the line no doubt. if you want to go 1911 i have to ask what are you looking for. trigger pull on some g.i. are horrible you could get a milspec for a new glock. if you like to shoot alot 9mm is wayy cheaper than .45 just a few things to think about.

[eagle24]

Buy the 1911, you won't be sorry

I tend to agree. I'm in my mid-forties and just bought my first 1911 (SA Mil-Spec). Most of my handguns are revolvers and for many years I shot nothing but revolvers, but I have to say that after 2 trips to the range I think my new 1911 will become my favorite if it hasn't already. I've had a Sig 226 for several years, and although it is a great pistol, I don't feel the same way about it that I feel about the 1911. These things are just plain fun to shoot. I'm not sure what it is about the 1911, but I regret that I waited so long to buy one. Kinda feel like I cheated myself and have a lot of catching up to do.:)

[Ala Dan]

While I can't address the STI Lawman, I can and will tell you that the
Les Baer Thunder Ranch Special is one heck'eva pistola~!:) It's scary
accurate, extremely reliable, and crafted of the finest materials known
too man.:cool: I wouldn't trade it for any three handguns~!:D

[Richard]

I guess I am the cautious one. Why? Both the 1911 and BHP require rote skills to safely handle them. If you decide on either of these handguns get someone experienced with the BHP or 1911 to show you the ropes.

If I were in your shoes I would look for a Springfield 1911A1 (loaded) and not look back. This Springer has everything you will need at a reasonable price. Hell you may have enough left to buy a reloading press.

Regards,

Richard :D

My Springer loaded:
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid104/p86b980b883b5ffada4b08e27f7a21ef8/f9935e48.jpg

[ubergeek]

Many 9mm advocates will tell you the following:

"45ACP is too expensive to practice with":
Take a 45ACP round and put it next a 9mm Parabellum round and tell me which one you trust with your life or your loved one's lives. That is the only thing to consider when choosing a pistol calibre. Sure 45ACP costs more, but that's what reloading presses are for - if you re-use shells you can make ammo for one fifth the price. (Please note that reloaded ammo should not be carried for self defense but only used for practice.)

"1911s only hold 7+1":
Ask any cop how many rounds are usually fired in self defense and he'll say "Usually one, sometimes up to three". You're not fighting an army, you're stopping an attack so make sure that your one to three shots (a) Hit your target and (b) Do enough damage to stop the attack. 45ACP takes care of (b).

"1911 is too big to conceal":
Most people who say this haven't tried. Do you wear your shirt out? In that case an IWB holster will conceal a 1911 perfectly. If you wear your shirt tucked in look here: http://www.smartcarry.com/

The Colt 1911 has the greatest following of any pistol ever made, that's gotta tell you something. The beauty of a 1911 lies also in the fact that you can make it as fancy or simple as you like. The availability of aftermarket parts is second to no other pistol. I've seen complete junkers go to race guns with a little TLC and a few hundred bucks worth of parts.

Well, that's my 2 cents - on second thoughts maybe it's more like my 90 cents :)

Further reading:
http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/other/jh_45acp.htm
http://www.sightm1911.com/

[Mandirigma]

Check out http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=212877

May pertain to you.

[MCgunner]

Another vote for save your money and get a 9. You'll obviously not be reloading and 9mm is the easiest round at the store on your wallet short of .22 long rifle. You should get a .45 someday, but I'd start with the 9, personally. And, I'd forget those high end 1911s, too, unless you're just a 1911 freak. You can get a lot more gun for a lot less money in .45ACP or you can get a servicable 1911 for a lot less money. Rock Island Armory comes to mind.

http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/review/pix/RIA-1_350.jpg

[HorseSoldier]

I'd take the $1250 or so and buy a stock High Power and a quality but mid-price range 1911 like Springfield's entry models, personally.

[weregunner]

I"m a 9mm DA/SA trigger shooter.You seem to like the SA pistols.Yeah,shoot as many and handle as many as possible.Sounds like you'ld be happy with a Highpower or a decent not expensive .45ACP.The Springfields and others have quality low cost models that come with expensive extras built in.Enjoy.

[10-Ring]

Tough choice :scrutiny: I have & enjoy both but not having either and w/ such a huge price difference, I'd go w/ the BHP 1st and get the 1911 down the road after you've enjoyed the BHP for a while :)

[Just_a_dude_with_a_gun]

Get a CZ P01/G19/FNP9/XD9 and a Springfield MilSpec/GI/Taurus PT1911, and You're out the door at or under a $1k , and you're pretty covered.

[huntershooter]

Stick with your two original choices. They are both excellent.