Today's headlines (Immigration)


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drinks
April 10, 2006, 09:28 PM
I have been slapped down on thr, tfl and several other PC , liberal , bleeding heart forums for warning that the Aztlan movement was actively moving to occupy and take control of the western part of the USA.
Today, you see the opening moves of the visible part.
A columnist for the biggest criminal alien invader newspaper in New York, stated on radio, that there is nothing the USA citizens can do now, the criminal alien invaders are now here in such numbers that they can dictate to the Congress and blatently ignore all laws they do not like.
We have been asleep at the switch and voting booth,we have given our country to the great unwashed criminal alien invaders.
How do we let our congress critters know we are fed up with them and the rest of the worthless burecrats?
Is there still time to do it without blood , or are we past that point?
Are there still any who believe WE own this country?
:confused: :fire:

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Biker
April 10, 2006, 09:35 PM
I hope that there is still time to work within the system.
However, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
Biker

odysseus
April 10, 2006, 10:41 PM
While I am not endorsing fully your perspective on the extreme end of it, there are many within these "shows" of people as of late who do harbor resentment for our country and those non mexican. It's the typical rotten apples in the bunch.

Now a question of mine of late is how the "silent majority" is taking in all this. I know for a fact that the polls only a year ago indicated close to 75% of Americans want illegal immigration stopped. However if you look at the media lately, it's as though that never happened and the minority of loud mouths out there are holding the common mindset. Hell, they can't even fairly represent the difference between legal immigration, and illegal crossing. I wish there could be a vote on these items, and not have it stuck in DC with their ineptitude and lack of candor and strength on this matter.

To make it gun related, I seem to find this also relative to the silent groups of what I would call stable Americans who are not afraid of firearms who remain silent against those loud smaller groups who continue to misinform and bend the truth (Brady lobby).

beerslurpy
April 10, 2006, 10:43 PM
The longer you pretend the kettle isnt boiling, the bigger the explosion in the end.

SnakeEater
April 11, 2006, 01:12 AM
I really wish that somehow we could display a show of force that would make the illegals marches look pathetic. Why are "we" so apethetic? I'm personally ready to lock n load and take to the streets NOW.

Crom
April 11, 2006, 01:16 AM
Your guess is as good as mine.

http://media.putfile.com/Aztlan-Rising

Kodiaz
April 11, 2006, 02:25 AM
Snake you aren't the only one. Gas doesn't burn without a spark though.

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 02:34 AM
I really wish that somehow we could display a show of force that would make the illegals marches look pathetic. Why are "we" so apethetic? I'm personally ready to lock n load and take to the streets NOW.

:uhoh:

Go ahead. I'm sure you'll get many more people to join your cause once the media shows footage of a deranged man with a rifle shooting down protesters in the street.

tellner
April 11, 2006, 03:08 AM
Boy, this is whole thing took no time at all to turn ugly. On one side "For La Raz, everything! For the gringo, nothing!" - a direct quote, by the bye. On the other "randomly pick one night every week where we will kill whoever crosses the border." - another word-for-word. How long before both sides are quoting the Aryan Nations slogan "Your skin is your uniform"?

Somewhere along the line the real issues of how much immigration is good, how much will just depress wages and further unravel our social contract, and who should be allowed to work or live here under what conditions have been lost. It's a shame, since they are important ones which need to be addressed.

50caliber123
April 11, 2006, 03:23 AM
I think snakeeater is trying to say we need to give the illegals a run for their money. If 2000 of the illegals and their supporters protest, 4000 or more anti-illegal immigration believers should show up. Violence may occur down the road, but I neither support nor endorse it.

gunsmith
April 11, 2006, 05:15 AM
it's really depressing
http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/
http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/graphics/thomas-debbie.jpg
One of the persons killed was Debbie Thomas, shown here, who was the mother of three. She was killed in a head-on collision on Christmas Eve 2003 when her car was struck by a car being driven in the wrong direction. The offending driver, Narciso Garcia-Jimenez, escaped from his hospital bed and is still at large. The car he drove had no inspection sticker and was registered to another person. When Debbie's mom learned that her daughter's killer had not been killed in the wreck but had escaped, she said she felt "angry, bitter and sad, all at once."

remember that guy who held his daughter up as a human sheild while shooting at cops?http://www.immigrationshumancost.org/graphics/pena&daughter.jpg



Raul Pena and daughter Suzie Jose Raul Pena is shown here with his daughter Suzie. An illegal alien from El Salvador earlier deported for cocaine possession, he was the doting father who used the little girl as a human shield in an hours-long Los Angeles shootout with police on July 10. Pena and Suzie were both killed.

During the incident, Pena used a 9-millimeter Beretta pistol which had been stolen last year in a burglary in Oregon. His office at the car dealership contained a bag of cocaine and a half-drunk bottle of Tequila — consistent with the illegal Pena's previous deportation for cocaine possession.
Videotape captured images of Pena shooting at the police while holding his daughter, yet his relatives are questioning not only whether he used his daughter as a shield, but whether he was even armed at all, according to the Los Angeles Times.

odysseus
April 11, 2006, 05:26 AM
http://media.putfile.com/Aztlan-Rising

Wow, definitely gets the blood up...

Baron Holbach4
April 11, 2006, 08:45 AM
Are there still any who believe WE own this country?

We might lose the U.S.A. but we could still win in Iraq. :uhoh:

hillbilly
April 11, 2006, 09:22 AM
I, too, have posted on THR links to places like Mexia Movement, which is a radical Reconquista organization.

I have posted links to sites wherein Aztlan types had proudly taken photos of themselves with their "Deport Gringos to Europe" signs and their signs declaring "%*&& You, This is STILL Mexico," and their Reconquista flags, etc.

And my threads were all locked by THR Mods.

In fact, the one I posted about the signs that say "F*&K You, This STILL Mexico" was closed down because of "profanity."

I'm not the one using the "profanity." It's the word that the Reconquista Radicals are using on THEIR signs and THEIR bumper stickers...........

Again, a radical group of foreign nationals inside the USA wanting to turn part of the USA into some other country has everything to do with civil rights, including gun rights.

This is not racism, this is not right-wing conspiracy stuff. This is what is happening and is being documented all over the country.

Let me ask this.

Would everyone be reluctant to condenm a march wherein white supremacists were marching and calling for Neo-Nazis to move to Washington state and declare their own little "white homeland?"

Of course not. All sorts of THR folks would be yelling about those Neo-Nazi nuts.

Well, the Aztlan, Mexia.org, meCHA, La Raza types are exactly like the Neo-Nazis, only they are the slightly darker-skinned, southern version.

They are radical, racist, and right here in significant numbers.

http://www.mexica-movement.org/granmarcha.htm


hillbilly

boofus
April 11, 2006, 09:41 AM
Texas fought to be free from <Mexico> once before and we can do it again regardless of what that fat drunken murderer from massachusetts promises the illegals.

The hispanics that lived in the area that is now Texas wanted nothing to do with the corrupt mexican government even back then. Many died fighting on the side of Texas at the Alamo and many ex-mexicans were instrumental in the writing of the constitution of the Republic of Texas.

These illegal invaders however have no desire to be free or even Americans. They want to turn TX back into mexico. If I march in a 'protest' I'll be carrying a rifle.

seeker_two
April 11, 2006, 10:05 AM
Well, Dallas and other Texas cities seemed to tolerate when the New Black Panthers marched in protest while toting rifles and shotguns... (http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/Black_Panther.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LEARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=3&item=Black_Panther)

In June 1998, Muhammad led a group of fifty NBPP followers to Jasper, Texas - including a dozen carrying shotguns and rifles - to "protect" the streets in the wake of the racial murder of James Byrd Jr. Byrd, a forty-nine-year-old African American, who was beaten and fatally dragged behind a pickup truck down a rural road by three white supremacists. In response to a rally organized by Klansmen in the small town two weeks later, Muhammad and his followers, many wearing black berets like the original Panthers, showed up to counter demonstrate. When members of the NBPP tried and failed to get past police separating them from the Klan, Muhammad told his cadre, "Black people, we can take these bastards…We can run over the damn police and take their ass. Who's with me?" There were several minor scuffles between supporters on both sides and two arrests were made.

.... maybe we should see if that "tolerance" should apply to the melanin-deficient, as well... :cool:

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 10:16 AM
Can anyone here show me where Illegal Immigrants are expressing their desire to take over the Southwest? An interview or essay or something.. show me one comment from a farm worker or roof layer where he/she states that their ultimate goal is this "Aztlan" crap you all seem to believe so strongly in.

Trying to paint everyone in these marches as being incahoots with La Raza-Type extremists is akin to me calling all of the minutemen racist because a number of extremists have participated in their demonstrations.

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 10:18 AM
maybe we should see if that "tolerance" should apply to the melanin-deficient, as well...

Why is it people here constantly have to make this into a whites vs them issue?

Biker
April 11, 2006, 10:21 AM
Well SS, it seems that 'they' have made it a race issue.
La Raza=The Klan With A Tan.

Biker

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 10:24 AM
Exactly. The Klan is an extremist fringe organzation. And if I lump all whites in with the Klan, that would be pretty stupid of me wouldnt it? But that's exactly what everyone's doing here.. lumping in a whole group of people based on the ranting of extremists.

Camp David
April 11, 2006, 10:24 AM
La Raza=The Klan With A Tan.

:) :) !!

molonlabe
April 11, 2006, 10:26 AM
When I lived in California the Aztlan movement was meeting in Riverside Ca. advocating the violent takeover of California.

My crystal ball says "I predict closurer of this thread".

Biker
April 11, 2006, 10:28 AM
SS
Unlike the Klan, La Raza has chapters on college campuses throughout the US, are accepted in the American media and have a lot of political pull. Roberto Gonzales was a member of La Raza at one point. Not exactly a "fringe group", eh?
Biker

TexasRifleman
April 11, 2006, 10:35 AM
Exactly. The Klan is an extremist fringe organzation. And if I lump all whites in with the Klan, that would be pretty stupid of me wouldnt it? But that's exactly what everyone's doing here.. lumping in a whole group of people based on the ranting of extremists.

While what you say is true, I don't remember seeing hundreds of thousands of Klan members at a rally in downtown LA carrying signs advocating overthrowing of the government etc.

This link posted earlier,
http://www.mexica-movement.org/granmarcha.htm
is a bit bigger than your average Klan rally, but look at the signs and mantra of their organization. Their slogan is even "It's not racist to confront white racism". Come on, that's a very old tactic, call the other guy a racist first then you are "protected".

It is clear from the signs and wording of their organizations creed that these ARE racist organizations, some of them advocating violence and even the overthrowing of the US government.

It's racist, treasonous, and dangerous. In this case the extremists outnumber the calm, cool, and collected.

seeker_two
April 11, 2006, 10:38 AM
Why is it people here constantly have to make this into a whites vs them issue?

Why is it that reading comprehension is no longer taught in public school? :rolleyes:

Read the link & the story I posted SLOWLY & CAREFULLY. Take notes if necessary. Then, you may have a different perspective of the issue...

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 10:39 AM
And Senator Byrd was a member of the Klan.

The kids on campus are wacked out college leftitsts. It's college.. that's what they do in college. Their views dont reflect those of immigrants or Hispanic-Americans in general. It's almost like you guys are falling for their propaganda hook, line, and sinker though

I guess my point is, they dont scare me. They have no real power.
The assertion that illegals want to capture the Soutwest and make it Mexico again is ridiculous for one reason. THEY JUST LEFT MEXICO. If they wanted to be in Mexico so bad, why risk so much to come to America? Doesnt seem very logical to me..

IMO, Their rantings are exactly that.. rantings.

Of course I could be wrong..

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 10:44 AM
While what you say is true, I don't remember seeing hundreds of thousands of Klan members at a rally in downtown LA carrying signs advocating overthrowing of the government etc.

Ok... and I don't remember seeing hundreds of thousands of La Raza members at a rally in downtown LA carrying signs advocating overthrowing of the government etc


It's racist, treasonous, and dangerous.

Racist and dangerous.. OK.
Treasonous? Maybe..


In this case the extremists outnumber the calm, cool, and collected.


I guess this is where me and the rest of the board would have to agree to disagree. Living in San Diego, I have a lot of Hispanic friends and acquaintences. Many of them are sympathetic to the plight of the illegal immigrants, but none of them suscribe to La Raza's crap. This is just my personal experience.. yours may vary I guess.

Carl N. Brown
April 11, 2006, 11:01 AM
LEGAL immigration helped make America great.

ILLEGAL uncontrolled immigration will be America's downfall.

Reality check: We cannot take in the five billion people who
would rather live here than where they are.

Ira Aten
April 11, 2006, 11:12 AM
Representatives of the Federal Legislature appear to not recognize, or are otherwise hiding their knowledge of their powers and duty as set forth in the Constitution of the United States to protect the United States against invasion. Any reasonable individual would agree to the fact that Twelve Million Illegal Aliens crossing our borders is unquestionably classified as an “Invasion”.

Article One, Section Eight states, in part…

“Congress shall have the power…
….To provide for calling
forth the militia, to execute the
laws of the Union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions.”

Regarding the organization of the Militia, the Article provides…
the “Congress shall have the power…“To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress…”

Further, that Article sets out the duty of the Congress to enforce “naturalization” regulations, and states that…

“Congress shall have the power… To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States

Although our Founding Fathers addressed the repelling of invasions in Article I, Section Eight, of the United States Constitution, almost to a man or woman every Congressional Legislator, and in addition, the President of the United States, while acknowledging the fact Twelve Million Illegal Aliens invaded our borders, has claimed nothing at all can be done to remedy this situation, other than surrendering to the idea of making illegal entry, legal.

Thousands of lawfully acting, legal American citizens have announced their willingness to volunteer their services in a Militia for this very cause by joining together, even previous to Congress acting dutifully and calling them forth. These citizens have entitled this Militia the “Minutemen” in respect for the very designers of the Article One of this Constitution. These citizens not only stand ready to serve in the Militia, they are more importantly, ready to stand down immediately upon completion of this duty.

Federal Legislators have collectively stated nothing lawfully can be done to repel these invaders due to the Immigration and Naturalization Service not being of sufficient number to repel the ongoing invasion. They go on to state they cannot detain the Twelve Million currently in our midst. These Legislators are at best, ignorant of Article I, Section Eight of the United States Constitution, or if not ignorant, duplicitous by misleading legal American Citizens into believing only the INS is charged with suppressing insurrection and repelling invasion from foreign soil.

Instead of fulfilling their duty, they meet in Congress for the purpose of granting Amnesty to the lawbreakers who burn our flag, and hoist the flag of another country where Old Glory had stood. The act of lowering our standard, and hoisting their own, is evidence of the Insurrection resulting from this invasion. Meanwhile, the legal applicant for immigration waits lawfully and patiently behind those who have no respect for our law.

To our knowledge, not one of these Congressmen has officially said in public, a single word about the fact that the Constitution of the United States prescribes a remedy which is both real, and available for this purpose, as lawfully set out in Article I, Section Eight, of the United States Constitution. They instead, talk of making illegal action, legal.

This Government has failed in its duty to exercise their powers to regulate immigration, for naturalization of aliens entering our country, thus, over twelve million illegal aliens are known to have crossed, and remain within, our Nation’s borders. The Legislative branch has admittedly failed in its duty to protect our shores from invasion.

Concern voiced by the legal citizenry, the very “People” of our Nation, at being disregarded by their Representatives in Congress today continues to fall on deaf ears while we watch Congress address the “need” of passing laws to make mass invasion legal, rather than Congress performing their duty as prescribed within Article One, Section Eight of the United States Constitution

It has long been established that Congress is bound with a duty to uphold our nation’s Constitution in good faith, and take actions reflecting the will of The People. But sadly they have not done so, and have acted only in their political interest in this matter. So much so, that we face the bizarre realization that our Congress is drafting a law specifically so as to please only one group of people, that group being the masses of Illegal Aliens mounting in number daily.

The legal citizens of the United State’s voice over their concerns about the Congressional plan to legalize the violation of our existing immigration laws, has gone unanswered too long.

Should we not demand Congress utilize the powers granted under Article I, Section Eight, of the Constitution of the United States, and take certain steps therein described to enable the Militia to lawfully halt the invasion of our shores by Illegal Aliens invading our borders as soon as possible?

Biker
April 11, 2006, 11:18 AM
Well said, Ira.
Biker

Ira Aten
April 11, 2006, 11:22 AM
Biker, I appreciate you saying that. I am not any type of "constitutional scholar" and had to do a little research regarding this issue.

But I am trying to figure out if a country boy who barely made it out of high school can find that information, why a U.S. Senator (who has a copy of the original damned document right down the hall) can't figure it out.

This Republic is bound for failure, if the clowns we have in there now continue to give in to the demands of those who would invade our shores.

Biker
April 11, 2006, 11:28 AM
Well Ira, I've never been accused of being an 'Eensteen' either, but as Robert Zimmerman said, "Ya don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows".
The duplicity of our politicians is beyond belief. Their actions say that they don't give a rat's patootie for this country or its citizens with the exception of a few like Tom Tancredo. I'm really starting to believe that this *is* part of a bigger plan to tear down America as we know it and replace it with something unrecognisable to its former occupants.
Biker

TexasRifleman
April 11, 2006, 11:39 AM
I guess this is where me and the rest of the board would have to agree to disagree. Living in San Diego, I have a lot of Hispanic friends and acquaintences. Many of them are sympathetic to the plight of the illegal immigrants, but none of them suscribe to La Raza's crap. This is just my personal experience.. yours may vary I guess.

And that may be your experience in San Diego, and I am glad thats how it is.

Here in the DFW area there are a lot more of the extreme elements out with the "innocent high school kids". And certainly you are correct that not all of the protesters believe that stuff, but at a point it gets to be a dangerous percentage.

You get 1000 people you will get 5 or 10 wackos, that's just statistics. But when it gets to be 20, 30, maybe 40 percent you have a problem brewing and from what I've been watching here in Texas that's where we sit.

Senator Byrd

Well, I didn't vote for that fruitbat :D

BIGJACK
April 11, 2006, 11:47 AM
original by Carl Brown:
LEGAL immigration helped make America great.

Absolutely true. :) Those immigrants who made america great were immigrants who learned to speak english and swore allegience to the United States Of America, accepted our way of life and swore to support the constitution of the United States.:D

Illegal immigrants are just that "illegal" and should be rounded up and trucked back to where ever they came from:fire: until they are willing to go through the process mandated for citizenship.:scrutiny:

Deavis
April 11, 2006, 11:57 AM
Well, Dallas and other Texas cities seemed to tolerate when the New Black Panthers marched in protest while toting rifles and shotguns...

Nothing illegal about that in Texas... Regular old white people who were fed up with drug dealers on their streets did the same thing.

odysseus
April 11, 2006, 12:55 PM
THEY JUST LEFT MEXICO. If they wanted to be in Mexico so bad, why risk so much to come to America? Doesnt seem very logical to me...

It's just typical hate of the haves to the have nots. There is a lot of aminosity - much of it from US born - who have a lot of misplaced anger.

Seriously, they should be taking on their own government and corrupt wealthy who have staved off a real middle class in Mexico. The difference between rich and poor is drastic, and it's a shame. There are those who profit from a situation in 2nd/3rd world conditions, and it's the middle class here in the US that bears the burden in this situation.

garyk/nm
April 11, 2006, 02:34 PM
I guess this is where me and the rest of the board would have to agree to disagree. Living in San Diego, I have a lot of Hispanic friends and acquaintences. Many of them are sympathetic to the plight of the illegal immigrants, but none of them suscribe to La Raza's crap. This is just my personal experience.. yours may vary I guess.
__________________
Just curious, since you are a not member of "La Raza", do you really think they would share that information with you?

drinks
April 11, 2006, 02:37 PM
As Biker advised, numbersusa.com is a good place to help, I have been sending faxes,calling and writing letters by the dozen for the last 2 weeks, with the help from numbersusa, it is fast and uncomplicated to do so.
:fire:

pax
April 11, 2006, 02:53 PM
Moderator Note

To the great shock of everyone involved, I'm not closing this thread.

But the next person who advocates murder will have their posting privileges cheerfully removed.

pax

ArmedBear
April 11, 2006, 03:04 PM
I guess my point is, they dont scare me. They have no real power.
The assertion that illegals want to capture the Soutwest and make it Mexico again is ridiculous for one reason. THEY JUST LEFT MEXICO. If they wanted to be in Mexico so bad, why risk so much to come to America? Doesnt seem very logical to me..

Agreed. It's downright STUPID.

The only concern I have is summed up in: "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.":p

...and remember our esteemed Lieutenant Governor along with a number of our legislators come from this same movement. It's hardly powerless.

My parents are immigrants who became citizens years ago. Lots of our family friends have been, too. I grew up around a lot of people who went through a hassle to become Americans. I think a lot of illegal immigrants just want to be immigrants, but didn't have a chance of being let in legally under current policy. (Note: I'm not naive. Some, of course, are criminals, gang members, etc., but there are some in every crowd, including native-born American citizens.)

A better message than the whole "Aztlan" crap would be: "American immigration quotas are silly! We just want to be Americans, too! We work hard, we grew up here. Rationalize immigration policy!"

But the whole movement seems so random, with so many mixed and crossed messages and philosophies. Some are positive, some are negative. Some people are fearful, some are ambitious, and some are hateful.

I think THAT'S what scares some people.

longeyes
April 11, 2006, 03:52 PM
It's not that the Mexican illegal immigants want to turn the U.S. into Mexico, it's that you do what you know, that's all. They bring their culture with them, and part of that culture is stuff that helped create the problem that is Mexico. They will live and behave as they have learned to south of the border. If we make no effort to enforce assimilation and teach them otherwise we will, yes, have Mexico inside the U.S. because doing what you've done before is always the easy way out. Right now our elites are obsessed with the idea of "acceptance," "welcoming," multiculturalism, and diversity, all ways of saying, "Hi, you don't have to change or adapt, WE will do that instead."

This shouldn't be a race issue but it's becoming one. The Aztlan zealots, with their chatter about "bronze people" are clearly racists, albeit romantic ones. The entire debate about race, culture, and ethnicity has been contamnated by extremists so that any rational discussion is all but impossible. And this is, obviously, very, very unfortunate, and very, very, very dangerous. We'd like to think that we've gotten beyond the point, here in mainstream USA, of identifying whites as a bloc but it is apparently just dandy to keep referring to People of Color. That is overtly racist and implies that all People of "Non-Color" are oppressors, which is precisely what the ultra-leftists behind all of these radical movements believe. They think white people are the scourge of history; they've told us that often enough. What's alarming is to see that same vile and invidious philosophy embraced, subtly or not so subtly, by alleged educational institutions that really ought to know better. Instead they harbor and abet such odiousness, and more often than not it's whites themselves who encourage it. Yes, the modern sickness is very pervasive.

James T Thomas
April 11, 2006, 04:52 PM
I'm beginning to get an anxious feeling about all the unrest caused by this issue also, but it is not about what may occur socially. The politicans are acutely aware of the critical situation here in our homeland.

Whenever the political, economic or military status of a nation, ours, or any other had reached a crises point in their histories, their respective governments would engage in some unexpected and attention arresting ploy in order to distract the citizens from the situation. Often it was war or another attention getting device. And they acted in advance to beat the crises "to the punch."

Now, what will the government of the United States of America engage in so that we the people are completely captured and distracted from the current immigration crisis?

Brace yourselves, and do not be distracted! Just wait. Whatever it is, it may come very soon. And suddenly too.

May God bless and protect America.

Waitone
April 11, 2006, 05:20 PM
Five minutes work.

Mexican American Legal Defense Fund http://www.discoverthenetwork.com/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6156

La Raza Unida
http://www.discoverthenetwork.com/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6781

La Voz de Aztlan
http://www.discoverthenetwork.com/groupProfile.asp?grpid=7189

MECha
http://www.discoverthenetwork.com/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6192

National Council of La Raza
http://www.discoverthenetwork.com/groupProfile.asp?grpid=153

For an alternative view consult
http://www.splcenter.org/ and do a search.

Clean97GTI
April 11, 2006, 05:37 PM
This will not end well.

Perhaps we'l see this movement start to break apart as one section achieves a goal and settles down. Hopefully, we can simply start our own protests and head this off a bit early.

Failing that...um...if the vote is ignored and the politicians ignore us, what choice does that leave?

Can'thavenuthingood
April 11, 2006, 06:10 PM
Learn Spanish.

Vick

ken grant
April 11, 2006, 06:12 PM
Arrival of aliens ousts U.S. workers
By Jerry Seper
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
April 10, 2006


An Alabama employment agency that sent 70 laborers and construction workers to job sites in that state in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina says the men were sent home after just two weeks on the job by employers who told them "the Mexicans had arrived" and were willing to work for less.
Linda Swope, who operates Complete Employment Services Inc. in Mobile, Ala., told The Washington Times last week that the workers -- whom she described as U.S. citizens, residents of Alabama and predominantly black -- had been "urgently requested" by contractors hired to rebuild and clear devastated areas of the state, but were told to leave three job sites when the foreign workers showed up.
"After Katrina, our company had 70 workers on the job the first day, but the companies decided they didn't need them anymore because the Mexicans had arrived," Mrs. Swope said. "I assure you it is not true that Americans don't want to work.
"We had been told that 270 jobs might be available, and we could have filled every one of them with men from this area, most of whom lost their jobs because of the hurricane," she said. "When we told the guys they would not be needed, they actually cried ... and we cried with them. This is a shame."
Mrs. Swope said employment agencies throughout Alabama, Louisiana and Mississippi faced similar problems, when thousands of men from Mexico and several Central and South American countries -- many in crowded buses and trucks -- came into the three states after Katrina, looking for employment and willing to work for less money.
The number of foreign workers who flooded the area after the hurricane has been estimated at more than 30,000. Many of them have been identified by law-enforcement authorities and others as illegal aliens.
The Gulf Coast Latin American Association noted in a report that whether those workers will remain after the cleanup work is completed is not clear, but the longer those jobs last, the more likely it is that the workers will settle permanently. After Hurricane Andrew hit southeastern Florida in 1992, the association said, the construction boom attracted large numbers of Hispanic immigrants to several areas, including Homestead, Fla., where the Latino population doubled during the 1990s.
Many of the illegal aliens came into the Gulf Coast states not only from south of the border but also from California, Arizona and Texas, responding to the demand for workers. U.S. Border Patrol officials in the three states have reported an increase in the number of illegals apprehended.
Some of the migrants who did get jobs in the Gulf states also were mistreated, records show. Two class-action lawsuits are pending in federal court in New Orleans in which thousands of migrant workers said they never were paid, although many worked 12-hour shifts, seven days a week and were required to remove toxic contamination from hurricane-ravaged buildings.
Some of the named companies were working on contracts from the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) and other government agencies.
Government estimates put at 400,000 the number of jobs lost in the Gulf region as a result of Katrina, which displaced more than 1.5 million people, and many of those workers left the area to seek employment elsewhere because available construction, laborer and cleanup jobs in Alabama, Louisiana and Mississippi had been filled by foreign workers, including illegal aliens.
President Bush last week signed the Katrina Emergency Assistance Act of 2006, which extended for 13 weeks unemployment compensation benefits to more than 140,000 residents of the Gulf states who were displaced from their jobs by Katrina. Their benefits, funded by FEMA, had expired March 4.
Would-be employers in Alabama, Louisiana and Mississippi, awash in cleanup and reconstruction jobs, faced little in the way of legal problems in hiring the illegal aliens after Katrina because the Department of Homeland Security temporarily suspended the sanctioning of employers who hired workers unable to document their citizenship.
Mr. Bush also had suspended the Davis-Bacon Act, which requires local contractors to pay "prevailing" wages, in the areas hit by Katrina to encourage reconstruction and cleanup.
"The men we sent to jobs in Alabama were local fellows looking for work, men who needed jobs," Mrs. Swope said. "After driving 50 miles to the work sites where they had been promised $10 an hour, they discovered the employers had found substitutes who were willing to work for less."


http://www.wnd.com/redir/r.asp?http...23506-1297r.htm


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Today, 08:23 PM

Can'thavenuthingood
April 11, 2006, 06:19 PM
Are these contractors being paid by the Federal gov to perform this work? If so, then the Davis-Bacon Act applies for federal funding, correct?

So when the President suspended Davis-Bacon requirements he endorsed lower wages for labor translating into higher revenues to the contracting companies, since the contract is written for prevailing wage.

Strange to me why he would put the locals out of work. Maybe he didn't think it through.

Am I not looking at this properly?

What am I missing?

Vick

seeker_two
April 11, 2006, 06:26 PM
What am I missing?

The conservative Republican president that we thought we elected in 2000... :banghead:

Bush has sold us out to Mexico, to the UAE, to the Saudis, and to his big-oil, big-business cronies...

Bush has done more harm to the US than Osama could ever DREAM of doing... :cuss:

Sindawe
April 11, 2006, 06:28 PM
What am I missing? The hands in Mr. Bush's back that make his eyes move, his head turn and his mouth open when his owners wish him to perform for them.

RealGun
April 11, 2006, 07:26 PM
The hands in Mr. Bush's back that make his eyes move, his head turn and his mouth open when his owners wish him to perform for them.

:scrutiny:

:fire:

bg
April 11, 2006, 09:13 PM
Sen Tom Tancredo has been fighting against illegal
immigration for I don't know how long and I believe
he wants a shot at the White House. Why aren't more
people who are also against this issue supporting him ?

http://www.teamamericapac.org/

Biker
April 11, 2006, 09:18 PM
Tancredo, at least so far, has my vote.
Biker

longeyes
April 11, 2006, 09:48 PM
Strange to me why he would put the locals out of work. Maybe he didn't think it through.

Am I not looking at this properly?

What am I missing?

The locals are predominantly black and legal citizens.

Up with Tancredo!

Biker
April 11, 2006, 09:55 PM
Yup, I left the Repubs because of Bush's first amnesty proposal, but if Tancredo runs, I just might come back.
Biker

Kodiaz
April 11, 2006, 10:05 PM
I'm going to register Repub just so i can vote for Tancredo.


How about Tancredo/Specter

Ezekiel
April 11, 2006, 10:07 PM
They are radical, racist, and right here in significant numbers.

I respect the guy who wrote this, so I'll admit immediately to taking his quote out of context.

But such [above] is the belief of every "indigenous race" to North America long before "whitey" ever showed up. This has gone on for 500 years.

Folks are surprized that, with a little power, brown-skins want it all back?

"Seems naive."

Crom
April 11, 2006, 10:24 PM
Sounds like House Republicans are softening.

I guess gun owners have been going about it all wrong, trying to work within the system and be law-abiding.

Maybe it's time we took it to the streets as well so we can get some legislation passed favorable to us.
:fire:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/I/IMMIGRATION?SITE=7219&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2006-04-11-21-12-45

GOP Chiefs Don't Want Immigrants Charged

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The two top Republicans in Congress, confronted with internal party divisions as well as large public demonstrations, said Tuesday they intend to pass immigration legislation that does not subject illegal aliens to prosecution as felons.

A written statement by House Speaker Dennis Hastert of Illinois and Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist of Tennessee, did not say whether they would seek legislation subjecting illegal immigrants to misdemeanor prosecution or possibly a civil penalty such as a fine.

"It remains our intent to produce a strong border security bill that will not make unlawful presence in the United States a felony," the two men said. An estimated 11 million men, women and children are in the United States illegally.

The Republican-controlled House passed legislation late last year that is generally limited to border security measures. It makes illegal immigrants subject to felony prosecution.

Senate efforts to write a broader bill - covering border security, a guest worker program and a path to citizenship for many of the 11 million in the country illegally - are gridlocked with lawmakers on a two-week vacation.

Frist has said he intends to bring the issue back to the Senate floor, although he stopped short of a flat commitment and the prospects for passage of an election-year immigration bill are uncertain.

The late-afternoon statement by the top GOP leaders in both houses came after days of large street demonstrations by protesters opposed to criminal penalties for illegal immigrants.

Additionally, in a Washington Post-ABC News poll published during the day, only 20 percent of those questioned said they favored declaring illegal immigrants to be felons and barring them from work. More than 60 percent indicated support for the general approach envisioned in the leading Senate proposal. It includes a requirement that illegal immigrants be required to pay a fine and back taxes as part of a process of qualifying for eventual citizenship.

Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, D- Mass., dismissed the proposal by the GOP leadership, saying: "Actions speak louder than words, and there's no running away from the fact that the Republican House passed a bill, and Senator Frist offered one, that criminalizes immigrants."

"This debate shouldn't be about making criminals out of hardworking families ... but rather about strengthening our national security and enacting a law that reflects our best values and our humanity," Kennedy said.

The question of a penalty has dogged the debate for months and been the subject of intense political maneuvering.

GOP aides pointed out that Rep. James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, had tried during debate on the House floor to reduce the penalty to a misdemeanor.

The attempt failed on a vote of 257-164, with 65 Republicans and 191 Democrats opposed. Many of the Democrats, including members of the Hispanic Congressional Caucus, indicated at the time they favored no criminal penalties, and opposed the suggested change.

In their statement, Hastert and Frist said the Democrats who did so had demonstrated a "lack of compassion." In addition, they renewed the charge that Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid is seeking to "block action on immigration legislation."

Reid has denied the charges.

While they leveled their accusations at Reid, the GOP leadership has been struggling with internal divisions.

Several House Republican conservatives have vociferously denounce Senate proposals as amnesty for lawbreakers.

And while Frist praised the leading Senate proposal last week as a "huge breakthrough," he was the only member of the GOP leadership to embrace it. Two other members of the group, Sens. Jon Kyl of Arizona and Kay Bailey Hutchison of Texas, voiced their opposition. Sen. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania opposes the measure, according to a spokesman.

Sen. Elizabeth Dole of North Carolina, who heads the party's senatorial campaign committee, declined this week through an aide to take a position on the bill.

A spokesman for Sen. Mitch McConnell, the second-ranking Republican, sidestepped a question by saying the Kentucky lawmaker favors a comprehensive approach.

Art Eatman
April 11, 2006, 11:05 PM
I don't see any compelling reason to make border-jumping a felony instead of a misdemeanor.

Art

Biker
April 11, 2006, 11:11 PM
Border jumping *is* a felony the second time. Problem is, it's just another ignored law.
Enforce the laws we have and we'll be in a lot better shape than we are now.
Biker

longeyes
April 11, 2006, 11:12 PM
I'm more concerned about border enforcement. Are the Republicans going to insist on a real wall and beefed-up border force?

But the real issue is assimilation and what a lack of that will mean for the American nation if fifty million new Americans get the vote.

ken grant
April 11, 2006, 11:14 PM
There is no reason to make illegals felons . They will not go after them anyway.
They break the law by being here. They break the law with fake I.D.'s and S.S. cards.
Politicians don't care,they want their votes.Illegals vote in some places even if that's not legal(another law broken)

longeyes
April 11, 2006, 11:19 PM
The end result of what's going on is going to be irrelevancy of suffrage and, beyond that, fragmentation of the U.S. Americans are already disenchanted with the political process, feeling unrepresented. Why would any current American citizen gave a fig about voting if ten or twenty million new citizens, persuaded by extant organizations to use bloc voting power, now have the right of suffrage and hence the right to de facto disenfranchise the rest of America? Goodbye, United States. The same thing is going on with the court system, with renegade judges ignoring popular will. I have yet to hear anyone in the mass media or political spotlight talk at length about the implications of our "compassion." I assume we know why.

crazed_ss
April 11, 2006, 11:39 PM
Sigh.. here we go..
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/8627561/detail.html
:fire:

Biker
April 11, 2006, 11:44 PM
*sigh*

That really sucks and it's wrong. So is tagging, and I condone neither.
It's gonna get worse.
Biker

RealGun
April 11, 2006, 11:56 PM
The felony thing just stripped the right to vote and change the country's politics, not to mention local and state politics, where aliens are really in great numbers. They can get the same result by being up front about it and disqualifying guest worker amnesty participants from ever voting, EVER. Those who leave the country and come back the right way can be treated as any other immigrant, fully entitled.

longeyes
April 11, 2006, 11:57 PM
Vandalism and worse is obviously not the answer to anything. Nor is Ted Kennedy's brain. We need some HONEST discussion about all aspects of this issue and we need to take our time before making final policy. One thing we do know already is that we need to stop the flow of illegals coming in now.

longeyes
April 12, 2006, 12:00 AM
The felony thing just stripped the right to vote and change the country's politics, not to mention local and state politics, where aliens are really in great numbers. They can get the same result by being up front about it and disqualifying guest worker amnesty participants from ever voting, EVER. Those who leave the country and come back the right way can be treated as any other immigrant, fully entitled.

So we're to create a permanently disenfranchised class in our midst? Only works if we have TEMPORARY guest workers in limited numbers and strict border enforcement.

sm
April 12, 2006, 12:03 AM
Emigration:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=Emigration

em·i·grate Audio pronunciation of "Emigration" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-grt)
intr.v. em·i·grat·ed, em·i·grat·ing, em·i·grates

To leave one country or region to settle in another. See Usage Note at migrate.

Emigration

n : migration from a place (especially migration from your native country in order to settle in another) [syn: out-migration, expatriation]



Immigration

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=Immigration

im·mi·grate Audio pronunciation of "Immigration" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-grt)
v. im·mi·grat·ed, im·mi·grat·ing, im·mi·grates
v. intr.

To enter and settle in a country or region to which one is not native. See Usage Note at migrate.

Immigration

n 1: migration into a place (especially migration to a country of which you are not a native in order to settle there) [syn: in-migration] 2: the body of immigrants arriving during a specified interval; "the increased immigration strengthened the colony"

DRZinn
April 12, 2006, 01:26 AM
anti-Mexican slogans were scrawled in red paint on two sides of the building.I wonder if the slogans were anti-Mexican or just anti-illegal.

Waitone
April 12, 2006, 07:42 AM
I wonder if the slogans were anti-Mexican or just anti-illegal.Box of .22's says it was oriented to illegals. How would I know? Because if it was Mexican we'd have pic. . . skuze me, images, of the artwork. And yes, I am a proud American Cynic.

Camp David
April 12, 2006, 08:01 AM
Border jumping *is* a felony the second time. Problem is, it's just another ignored law. First time...second time... let's avoid all that by building a fence to prevent it all... even a tall razor wire electrified barrier would cut down on this border jumping... I fail to understand why no real barrier is being pursued?

Biker
April 12, 2006, 08:07 AM
Well CD, the pols are selling America for votes and corporate money, IMO. That's the only explanation I can come up with.
Biker

TexasRifleman
April 12, 2006, 08:12 AM
Sigh.. here we go..
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/8627561/detail.html

Sheesh. How many restaurant owners torch their own failing businesses?

First thing you should do when a restaurant burns is investigate the owner.

My father has been in the insurance business for over 30 years and he tells the story that in all that time EVERY torched restaurant that he had coverage on was burned by the owner.

Ira Aten
April 12, 2006, 10:03 AM
Quote:
"There is no reason to make illegals felons"

Well, there sure is no reason to reward Illegal Invasion, with U.S. Citizenship.

They have, in place, an avenue for naturalization. But they do not wish to be bothered by following those steps.

So, since they do not want to bother with our rules, what would make any sane U.S. Congressman, believe that after naturalization via Amnesty, they will follow:

Criminal law (remember Resillieo Remendez?) Tax law; Traffic laws regarding purchase of liability insurance; Voting rules; or for that matter, any law at all if we simply reward them for breaking one of our main laws?

Maybe there is no need to make it a felony, but there is a need to do exactly what the Constitution mandates regarding invasion and inssurection, and that is for Congressto call forth and organize the Militia, pursuant to Article I Section Eight, to "enforce the laws of the Union" and prove that America can defend herself against Insurrection, intimidation, and Invasion.

Removing the flag of the nation you illegally enter, and burning it while hoisting the flag of another nation, sure as hell does not indicate you plan on complying with any laws of the United States.

I don't see my State Government offering any amnesty to property owners failing to pay their property taxes for five straight years.

They need the money for schools to hire Spanish speaking teachers in order to teach revisionist "Reconquistadore" history.

And I don't see the Internal Revenue Service offering amnesty to any American citizen who fails to pay ALL federal taxes, regardless if they disagree with the purposes of the tax money spent.

But for some bizzarre reason, the Federal Government is in the process of drafting plans for a law to give amnesty to people who follow NONE of our laws, if they happen to have illegally invaded our country.

One claim I hear a lot, is Illegal Aliens "pay their share of taxes."

I cannot imagine how they pay federal income taxes, if they don't have a (valid) Social Security number.

You can bet your life, they do not pay a single dime in Federal Income taxes, since any monies left over from their pay after living expenses, goes to Mexico, so the rest of their extended family can hire Coyotes to get them accross the Rio Grande. Simple as that.

But instead of Congress listening to the voice of "We the People" (read U.S. Citizens, either native or naturalized) who pay taxes and follows the rule of our government, they appear to be caving in to anarchists, and grant them amnesty, just as France gaves in to mobs demanding the "right" to never be fired by an employer, for any reason, for a period of "150 years".

carlrodd
April 12, 2006, 10:25 AM
I fail to understand why no real barrier is being pursued? -Camp David

because a majority of politicians have something to gain through unchecked illegal immigration, and even more to gain by granting amnesty to said criminals. this is the question i feel is more important than any being asked in regard to this issue: when...seriously, when are american citizens collectively going to call these rogue politicians on their complete disregard for the will of the public, and force them to find work elsewhere? i advocate permanentlyl throwing out any senator or representative that has been in office for more than six years, and then creating a law that allows an individual to ONLY serve ONE six year term in the house or senate. we NEED to shake things up. we NEED new leaders.

jmf
April 12, 2006, 10:34 AM
I'm just as mad about this invasion from Mexico as anybody else here. These mass demonstrations have been organized and funded by the communists and socialists. No, Virginia, Communism is not dead--it is thriving. This illegal alien situation is red meat for them. We need to make it clear-very clear-- to our representatives in the Congress and the Senate, that if they vote for amnesty, they will never get elected to anything again. If the don't clamp down HARD on the border, they will never get elected to anything again.

If you don't believe it about the communists, I took the trouble to look up a few of their websites. Boy! are they loving those mass demonstrations. I wrote what I think about this and put it in the soapbox part of my website. There is also a link to get your representative's email address. Just put in you zipcode and press go. I know they are ignoring us now, but that is changing as more and more Americans are getting up on their hind legs and saying, "No amnesty, no guest worker programs, secure the border!" Here's the link. http://www.refinishmilitaryriflestocks.com/soapbox/majority%20rules.htm

R.H. Lee
April 12, 2006, 11:03 AM
The most effective way to combat illegal immigration is to raise the public consciousness of the crime committed by illegals. gunsmith's post (#11) is a good example. Skip over the academic/philosophic discussions, don't get bogged down in the red herring race issue, and go directly to criminal acts committed by illegals. Publish names and photos. The goal is to equate illegal immigration with criminal activity in the mind of the public at large.

There are, what, an estimated 2 million illegals in American prisons. Their trials are a matter of public record, correct? That should provide a good start; emphasize illegal crime against American citizens. Make it a national security and public safety issue.

RealGun
April 12, 2006, 12:19 PM
The most effective way to combat illegal immigration is to raise the public consciousness of the crime committed by illegals. gunsmith's post (#11) is a good example. Skip over the academic/philosophic discussions, don't get bogged down in the red herring race issue, and go directly to criminal acts committed by illegals. Publish names and photos. The goal is to equate illegal immigration with criminal activity in the mind of the public at large.

There are, what, an estimated 2 million illegals in American prisons. Their trials are a matter of public record, correct? That should provide a good start; emphasize illegal crime against American citizens. Make it a national security and public safety issue.

Reads remarkably like an anti-gun strategy.

Biker
April 12, 2006, 12:29 PM
So you equate the battle for immigration reform with anti-2ndA tactics?
Biker

seeker_two
April 12, 2006, 12:30 PM
Quote:
Sigh.. here we go..
http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/8627561/detail.html

Sheesh. How many restaurant owners torch their own failing businesses?

First thing you should do when a restaurant burns is investigate the owner.

My father has been in the insurance business for over 30 years and he tells the story that in all that time EVERY torched restaurant that he had coverage on was burned by the owner.

True...esp. since no one's shown the "tagging" on the building yet.

Let's not blame the pro-border types yet...

Quote:
The most effective way to combat illegal immigration is to raise the public consciousness of the crime committed by illegals. gunsmith's post (#11) is a good example. Skip over the academic/philosophic discussions, don't get bogged down in the red herring race issue, and go directly to criminal acts committed by illegals. Publish names and photos. The goal is to equate illegal immigration with criminal activity in the mind of the public at large.

There are, what, an estimated 2 million illegals in American prisons. Their trials are a matter of public record, correct? That should provide a good start; emphasize illegal crime against American citizens. Make it a national security and public safety issue.

Reads remarkably like an anti-gun strategy.


Turnabout's fair play... ;)

longeyes
April 12, 2006, 12:38 PM
Reads remarkably like an anti-gun strategy.

Where we're heading won't be anti-gun, it's more likely to be social chaos, fragmentation, and armed militias. There may be strict gun laws but at that point no one will care. Everything being orchestrated in D.C. is leading to a breakdown of the electoral and judicial processes.

The question was raised: why is there still no effective wall? The politicos want a docile, controllable population to feed off for all eternity. Think MATRIX I: we exist only to keep paying higher and higher taxes so a small global elite can live out their deepest fantasies.

wingman
April 12, 2006, 01:25 PM
The question was raised: why is there still no effective wall? The politicos want a docile, controllable population to feed off for all eternity. Think MATRIX I: we exist only to keep paying higher and higher taxes so a small global elite can live out their deepest fantasies.


Large corporation Utopia, uneducated,unsophisticated consumers Lay down
there last dollar for some poor quality toy made in China or by illegal labor
in America.
This century in my view will be the turning point for America, in order
to correct the direction we are taking is going to take sacrifice but in the
end we have no choice.
:(

longeyes
April 12, 2006, 01:33 PM
First time...second time... let's avoid all that by building a fence to prevent it all... even a tall razor wire electrified barrier would cut down on this border jumping... I fail to understand why no real barrier is being pursued?

Some very powerful people, some visible, some not, want a borderless, politically unified United States, Canada, and Mexico. This is not a tinfoil "CFR" fantasy. They've met, it's documented, it's a plan. And they are unfolding it right before our eyes, little by little.

The only freedom most Americans understand these days is the freedom to consume. Unless that changes we are just along for the ride.

odysseus
April 12, 2006, 02:01 PM
Some very powerful people, some visible, some not, want a borderless, politically unified United States, Canada, and Mexico. This is not a tinfoil "CFR" fantasy. They've met, it's documented, it's a plan. And they are unfolding it right before our eyes, little by little.

FTAA, the proposed "Free Trade Agreement of the Americas". Straight insulting, didn't we have NAFTA and CAFTA pass (and yet illegal immigration is worse from the south). I increasingly get the idea that the many in power and very wealthy wish to have more access to tap a virtual slave market of poor labor, ala China and many other regions, for in their minds it makes them more "competitive" because the low living standard and wages.

However this means flushing the American middle class down the drain. Long term, many of the endemic problems that plague these countries will come here in larger numbers. No one talks about trying to help them fix their own problems in their own country, just that we have to push further past critical mass in our own country. While the Kennedy's of the world sell it to the left for their causes, it's all bull-crap.

ken grant
April 12, 2006, 03:33 PM
According to some news sources,people south of the Border are flocking to and trying to get across. They are in hope of being made legal if they make it.
The news also said there is more than ever now trying to make it.

RealGun
April 12, 2006, 03:58 PM
So you equate the battle for immigration reform with anti-2ndA tactics?

If it's manipulative and dishonest, sure I do.

Waitone
April 12, 2006, 04:07 PM
According to some news sources,people south of the Border are flocking to and trying to get across. They are in hope of being made legal if they make it. The news also said there is more than ever now trying to make it.Precisely the same result as December 2004 when Bush made his "Come Hither" speech. Border Patrol reported an immediate 25% increase in border crossers. When polled as to why they came, the number one reason given was "Mr. Bush asked us to come." I would expect the the situation to go from really bad to freakin' horrible simply because the senate opened the goody box and the house focused on border control. Now is the time to come because it will not get easier. That is clear.

Bush has his open border policy by simply doing nothing and nothing is what he has done his entire presidential term.

Camp David
April 12, 2006, 04:15 PM
Reads remarkably like an anti-gun strategy.

Differing from the Second Amendment, on the issue of Immigration Reform, most Americans want the government to do something; i.e., stop illegal immigration. On the Second Amendment, we want the government to do nothing; i.e., recognize our freedoms.

Two different issues!

That is why the best immigration reform will not involve new laws, amnesty, or any other legal effort. It will, instead, involve the building of a fence/barrier to stop the illegal immigration.

Pure and simple, we can deal with the 2-20 million illegals already here later: lets stop the border hemorage now before it gets worse. And rest assured it will get far worse!

And when these illegal aliens can't find work they will be in your backyard stealing your stuff to sell! That is the danger.

ArmedBear
April 12, 2006, 05:16 PM
Let's not blame the pro-border types yet...

I wouldn't blame them anyway.

Jamul is a little town outside San Diego. I hunt quail there. It's a neat little place, but the teenagers are probably bored.

That's IF it's not an insurance job, which is the norm.

Of course, I'm not justifying the act in any way. But I don't believe it implicates all Democrats if some kid sprays "Bu****ler" on an overpass, either.

wingman
April 12, 2006, 05:58 PM
Reports I hear from friends on the border larger then ever numbers of border crossings.



Migrants Rush to Border Hoping for Passage
AP - Wed Apr 12, 2:21 PM ET
NOGALES, Mexico - At a shelter overflowing with migrants airing their blistered feet, Francisco Ramirez nursed muscles sore from trekking through the Arizona desert -- a trip that failed when his wife did not have the strength to go on. He said the couple would rest for a few days, then try again, a plan echoed by dozens reclining on rickety bunk beds and carpets tossed on the floor after risking violent bandits and the harsh desert in unsuccessful attempts to get into the United States.

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