Buy cold tablets, get put in a computer database....


Jeff White
April 12, 2006, 08:12 PM
Gee a couple of weeks ago the cold pill restrictions were working so well the Mexican drug gangs were moving into the area to service the customers who could no longer make their own meth.

Now we have a proposal to change the log of cold pill buyers into a computer database so the meth cooks can't shop in multiple jurisdictions. Come on Missouri legislature, the law is either working or it isn't.
Bill would replace cold-pill log books with database
By Matthew Hathaway

Two area legislators are pushing for a statewide, computerized system to track sales of the over-the-counter cold pills used to make methamphetamine.

Although the bill is unlikely to become law on its own this late in the legislative session, Reps. Michael Frame, D-Eureka, and Jeff Roorda, D-Barnhart, said they hoped the legislation could be attached to another bill, perhaps as early as this week.

While Missouri continues to lead the nation in meth lab busts, the numbers are declining. Police reported more than 2,200 lab seizures last year, a 19 percent drop from 2004 figures. Officials credit a new state law restricting the over-the-counter sale of certain cold pills that provided an inexpensive ingredient for meth. Jefferson County continues to lead the state in the number of meth labs raided by police.

Under Missouri's new cold-pill restrictions, most pseudoephedrine remedies are available only at pharmacies and only if consumers agree to show ID and be recorded in a log that's available for police inspection.

But reviewing log books at every pharmacy, Frame said, is "a cumbersome and time-consuming process for law enforcement."

And it's not foolproof, either. Police say savvy meth cooks can avoid detection by shopping for pills at several different stores in different police jurisdictions.

Under the Frame bill, the Missouri Highway Patrol would be granted the authority to establish a single, real-time, electronic database to replace the separate log books used by each of the state's pharmacies. The legislation does not provide any funding for the system nor does it set a timeline for setting up the database.

Frame said he didn't yet know how much the system would cost but said money could be found. "I don't think we can afford not to do this," he said. "Right now, we're tracking these (pseudoephedrine) sales in a 19th-century way, and it doesn't make sense. If we're going to do this, let's do it right."

Roorda, a former Arnold police officer who worked undercover on drug investigations, said the database would "send a message to criminals ... that they will be found and prosecuted."

Frame and Roorda concede that it is unlikely the bill will reach a full vote in both chambers before the Legislature adjourns in mid-May. But the bill, they said, could be tacked on as an amendment to a larger crime bill as early as this week.

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April 12, 2006, 08:23 PM
So, I figure I will drop into the L&P forum for a quick skim of the free for all, and I see this.

I know, I really should not be suprised, but this is getting ridiculous.

Unfortunately, there seem to be few candidates for political office who have that sense which we would all like to think is "common".


April 12, 2006, 08:25 PM
We already have to do this in TN, and there is still a meth problem.

April 12, 2006, 08:30 PM
The money available to upgrade law enforcement is just too juicy for any sensible legislation. Ask any arms or equipment salesman. And police administrators get lots of perks from them. Ditto legislators.

Legalization and control of ...clean.... drugs would put more cops and lawyers out of business than anything since prohibition.

Just the "new" database will provide countless amounts of bag money for equipment and training and new staff to monitor.

And what will it accomplish? Nothing. Just like we have come to expect from the public "servants" that screw us with gay abandon.

And the "cold pills" will still move unhindered. Several years ago, a truck drive I knew wanted me to front the money for him to buy an entire truckload of Sudafed.

He....acted..... like he didn't know what it was used for when I told him.


April 12, 2006, 08:33 PM
And for more .....PROOF:

:D HAAAAAAHAHAHAHAAaahahahahhaaahaaa

Standing Wolf
April 12, 2006, 11:10 PM
Some people commit crimes, so we need to keep a close eye on everyone.

Josef Stalin surely would have understood.

April 12, 2006, 11:19 PM
I believe a couple weeks ago I read in the Sentinel that Centralia and other local pd's are gathering the cold tab logs and building a searchable database as well. Any word on that from your area?

April 13, 2006, 12:38 AM
Do you think the ACLU will stand up and make this a privacy issue? This is probably a lot more useless than gun control. The simple truth is that the beaurocrats and administrators who are in charge of combating problems do not know what to do. They just refuse to come out and admit it. Silly registration and keeping track of who buys what, or how much sudafed someone bought will not stop the problem. And what really hits home here in IL is that I am unable to protect myself legally from the scumbags who are high on this crap. At the same time the legislature is keeping me defensless and not addressing the meth issue in a manner that will do something effective.

April 13, 2006, 01:11 AM

As I shared with Antipitas at TFL


North Little Rock First To Test Meth Deterrent

Yeah , seems the lure of fed dollars are just to tempting for elected-critters not to turn down.


April 13, 2006, 01:39 AM
We've been fighting the war on drugs here in Oregon since I graduated from high school in 1969. We had some reasonable grade pot, turkish hash, LSD and mushrooms and a few bennies and cross tops readily available. Heroin was rare, but around.

Today we have very high grade pot. Lots of methamphetamine. Some heroine, cocain and psychedelics. Crime is up. Prisons are full and school funding is compromised.

We have the Oregon Liquor Control Commission to govern distribution of alcohol. We adopted the mom and pop retail distribution system to market illegal drugs. It isn't working. The legislature has met to pass more laws to control the drug problem. More criminal penalties. Same old same old.

April 13, 2006, 07:47 AM
Criminalize cold medicine and only criminals will have cold medicine.

Don't Tread On Me
April 13, 2006, 07:52 AM
Ah yes. I remember when the Senate passed that Sudafed bill a while back...

Heh, and to think that some people on this forum actually argue that the government won't actually confiscate firearms. LMAO! A government that wants to put you on a list for a nasal decongestant will certainly take away your guns.

Enjoy the tyranny.

April 13, 2006, 08:02 AM
I refuse to participate in this nonsense. I guess I'll be buying the new, less-effective cold medicines when i need relief.

April 13, 2006, 09:12 AM
So come next winter, the only people who don't have a cold MUST BE CRIMINALS!...or something.

Seriously, it takes hundreds of boxes of Sudafed to cook up into a little bit of crystal meth. Are they going to track who is suspiciously going to about 500 stores in a row and buying one box in each? So why make you register to buy ONE BOX?!

BTW, they've extended it to DayQuil and Nyquil now, even the liquid. Because meth cooks are going to be able to fractionate and separate the psuedoephedrine from the tylenol and cough suppressant in that. Of course.

April 13, 2006, 09:29 AM
Ban cold medicine?? I've got a better idea: How about we declare open hunting season on meth lab operators and meth pushers? No bag limit, night time hunting authorized, no hunting license required, may hunt nationwide.:evil:

April 13, 2006, 09:31 AM
You mean actually put the meth cooks and dealers in JAIL for a LONG TIME instead of letting them back out on the street over and over and over?

Of course not. They're victims of society. They have to instead arrest as many addicts as possible to keep the court system bureacracy well-paid, and harass law-abiding citizens who have colds. :barf:

The Drew
April 13, 2006, 10:05 AM
I was in a local CVS yesterday and notices that all the cold pills are no longer on the shelf. THey have little cards you must take up to the register to buy... I don't even think we have a major meth problem around here... but we DO have a heroin problem, and none of those idiots are gonna do something as ambitious as cook up some meth....

I say let the bastards keep blowing themselves up... and don't screw with my cold medicine or put me in a database as a potential meth cook....

Next thing you know people will have their guns taken away because they bought too much cold medicine in a year... Doesn't matter if you bought it for you sick wife or kids, you have exceeded the allotted amount and that PROVES you're involved in manufacturing meth... Not that they can convict on such charges, but they sure can make your life miserable....

April 13, 2006, 10:09 AM
I say let the bastards keep blowing themselves up... and don't screw with my cold medicine or put me in a database as a potential meth cook....

The problem is that some of them have been blowing themselves up in old and unsafe apartment buildings in inner cities, starting serious fires that have killed families and kids in the building.

The SOLUTION would be to actually put the cooks in jail when they're caught, but they tend to not be punished very severely. Back on the street in in a couple years, months or less, or off on a technicality.

As usual, punish the law-abiding, not the criminals.

April 13, 2006, 10:27 AM
Well, when you criminalize something that isn't a real crime, you still create real criminals.

If we didn't have so many prohibitions on what we can put in our own bodies, we wouldn't see these nasty drugs being cooked up on the streets.

Funny, this seems very familiar. I think I read about it before...somewhere.
Oh yeah, it was during prohibition. Lots of people got really screwed up drinking improperly made alcohol. Fortunately we knew when to cut our losses and prohibition went bye-bye.

Wonder when we're gonna see the same thing happen again. It amazes me that the government has no constitutional authority to prohibit such a thing, yet its seemingly harder to change than the actual constitution itself.

April 13, 2006, 10:54 AM
Tpogun hit right on the head- there is too much money being made from illegal drugs for them ever to be legalized. On both sides.

But- just but- can you imagine the consternation of the drug lords if we simply legalized it and cut thier cash stream?
And how happy we could make those farmers growing it, paying them more for the crop?
And how much less street crime we could have , being free from the crazed junkies needing thier next fix?
And how much money would be freed up for education?
And no more "no knock" raids?

My cousin, the closest thing to a brother I had growing up, died from a drug related suicide. I do have some emotional stake here. The "war on drugs" is the biggist crock of crap ever sold to the american people.
It has done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to deter or reduce drug use. NOTHING.

April 13, 2006, 11:04 AM
Our superfluous Texas legislature enacted this same crud last year. Hasn't made a dent in meth manufacture. In fact, BP and the Minutemen are catching illegals smuggling OTC meds and other chemicals across the border in increasing numbers....

...shall we go for the trifecta?... ;)

I wonder just how long it will take before for judges start issuing "no-knock" warrants based solely on the number of times a name appears on the "database".... :scrutiny:

April 13, 2006, 11:13 AM
why is it that we let the government punish the entire populace for the abuses of a few?

I don't know why we don't turn this around on them and not elect anymore businessmen, doctors, lawyers, exterminators, and any other profession based people to office since they have abused their authority.

we should start electing the average joe back in to office.

April 13, 2006, 11:25 AM

I like the way you're thinking.
For a nice real-world example, look at Rumsfeld and Tamiflu. He served as Gilead Research's chairman (the biotech firm that owns Tamiflu) from 97 till 01 when he joined the Bush admin.
He has a stake worth millions in that company. Oddly enough, we've got new fears of avian flu entering this country and can't manage to supply enough of the required antiviral drug and guess who stands in line to profit?

April 13, 2006, 11:51 AM
Next thing you know people will have their guns taken away because they bought too much cold medicine in a year... Doesn't matter if you bought it for you sick wife or kids, you have exceeded the allotted amount and that PROVES you're involved in manufacturing meth... Not that they can convict on such charges, but they sure can make your life miserable....
No kidding. Both my wife and I have sinus issues so we are regular purchasers of Sudafed--it's the only thing that works for me, and I refuse to use the half-as-effective non-PE crap that the drug warriors are trying to push as a Sudafed replacement.

We have to be really careful to space out our buying. I get paid every 2 weeks; if we buy 2 boxes each time we do our biweekly shopping, we commit a CRIME. We have to go 2, 1, 2, 1, 0, 2, 1, etc. to avoid buying more than 3 boxes in any 30 day calendar period. If we buy 4 boxes in any 30-day period, then we become drug criminals. Welcome to the land of the free and the home of the brave... :scrutiny:

April 13, 2006, 04:23 PM
You are all looking at this the wrong way. Clearly the only solution is to nip this whole thing at the DEMAND side of the equation, not the supply side. Get rid of the demand and there is no more problem.

Ban congestion.

April 13, 2006, 04:36 PM
I say we strip citizenship from any meth cooks. Many aren't citizens to begin with, and most get their product illegally via Mexican runs.

All of them get parachute-evacuated into Mexican airspace somewhere in the deep sonoran desert with enough water to make it to the next town, 25 miles away.

And we secure the border with guns, bombs, artillery and air surveillance/support.

April 13, 2006, 04:37 PM
Safeway put us in the database since we are evil non-drowsy Benadryl pimps :rolleyes:

You'd think they'd be a little more worried about the numb-nuts over at WSU over some parents buying medicine for their kids...

April 13, 2006, 05:02 PM

-We have Politicians on databases, pulling all kinds of Non-Constitutional infractions...

-We have Bankers , Lawyers, CEOS, and name any Professional Group on various database pulling illegal stunts.

These Folks are in the spotlight, public view, and that Database. In that database is pictures , fingerprints, where they live, what kind of car they drive...and all sorts of other information...

We cannot stop / catch all the crime these folks do, in the proportions they do, in the amount of monies and hardships they cause...and we have all sorts of data on databases. Add these high-profile folks are under view of surviellance cameras and even body guards in daily affairs


Returning the ping pong ball to the Politician's side of the Table Tennis Table...tell me again how effective this Database Idea is again.

Hey, I am a law abiding citizen. I just bought 3 boxes of Sudaphed PE, (generic) and The 100 tablet bottle of Benedryl ( generic), bottle Tylenol ( generic) these I do not have to sign for here along with a tin of Zippo Lighter fluid, two books of matches, two small boxes of matches .

One has to sign for Sudaphed and generic versions here I don't buy those.

Big Brother,
Pollen season is here and my sinues / allergies are in full swing. I use Zippo Fluid for my lighter and to clean GUNS. Matches I keep handy in truck, backpack and just in case.

Get off my back and do something read the COTUS that you swore to uphold.

According to the public database - some of you elected folks are not showing up for work, much less voting...

Big Brother,
all you want is Control. I am not the only one that knows this - and knows amongst other things controlling guns are on the list.

You gonna attempt return my Slam or lie to me some more?


April 14, 2006, 12:19 PM
You know, there may be a day when huffing gasoline will be a "problem." Then our information will have to be entered in a database to purchase fuel.

Oh well, if it saves even one life, it's worth it . . . right?

Tom Servo
April 14, 2006, 01:11 PM
This is allergy season in Georgia, and mine act up something awful for the first few weeks. The crowning irony is that I'm allergic to antihistamines. I have to take the stuff with pseudoephedrine.

Of course, north Georgia is meth central, so anywhere I go, the stuff I need is locked up, and I have to take the little card up to the counter and show ID sheepishly. It makes me feel like I'm buying porno or something.

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