sig 226 vs browning hi-power


PDA






mr e man
April 23, 2003, 11:23 AM
I own a Para ordnance p-14.45 ltd wich I am very pleased with, and now time has come for my next purchase. I have considered HK usp9, Walther p99, Browning hi-power and sig 226. I dont like the trigger on the usp9, nor the ski jump style trigger guard on the p99 wich bugs my index finger. That leaves me with the 226 and the bhp. Any suggestions ? pros and cons ?
Lets hear it guys and gal's...

Stay safe...

If you enjoyed reading about "sig 226 vs browning hi-power" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Admiral Thrawn
April 23, 2003, 12:05 PM
I'd go for the SIG-Sauer P-226. A superb pistol.

hksw
April 23, 2003, 01:47 PM
Hmmm. This one would be a Krone toss for me.

MK11
April 23, 2003, 02:17 PM
Tough choice. I loved the P226 from the start but the Browning took some getting used to. I've never felt a worse trigger pull. After I got used to it however, the BHP might just be my favorite handgun. Nothing handles quite like it.

If you're looking at a new one, I'd get the BHP first. They're becoming hard to find. You can always buy a P226 (and at some point, you should).

Berg01
April 23, 2003, 02:25 PM
Like them both, but between the two, I would take the BHP Standard with adjustable sights.

HankB
April 23, 2003, 02:32 PM
My usual carry gun is a BHP. Get rid of the magazine disconnect (do NOT call it a magazine safety!) and the trigger improves considerably. The manual of arms (draw . . . swipe off safety . . . shoot) is very similar to your Para Ordnance.

SIG 226's are good guns, but they don't actually point where they should . . . at least in my hands. And I never really liked the DS/SA crunchenticker mechanism.

If you go with a BHP - and I recommend that you do - try and get one that actually says "BROWNING" on it. I've seen the ones being imported by FN, and even though they made the pistols for Browning, I haven't been impressed by the workmanship or finish on the new guns. And they have some of the most deeply engraved or stamped numbers I've seen on a pistol.

Ala Dan
April 23, 2003, 02:53 PM
as you have picked some mighty fine handgun's!:uhoh:
Although, I'm a SIG kind'a guy; I must vote for
the Browning Hi-Power. These guns are really
magnificent firearms, in every respect. Most folk's will
tell you the older the Browning is, the better. But, FWIW
I owned a BHP "Practical" model that I purchased NIB
in October of 1998; and I'm here to tell ya' that was
one fine shoot'in iron!:) Only reason I got shed of it,
was cause I needed to generate a little cash flow;
otherwise I would still have it.

In closing, I don't think you can go terribly wrong with
any of the choice's that you have listed! Make your
decision, and most of all- ENJOY.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

Poohgyrr
April 23, 2003, 04:06 PM
I have a friend who has a thing for full size Sigs... And no doubt about it, they are nice. But I'd definitely go for the Hi Power, just 'cause ;)...

My favorite would be the MKIII or a Practical. Put good night sights and thin grips on it, and be happy :)......

Handy
April 23, 2003, 04:31 PM
As I've stated on other occasions, for the majority of people and situations, a good DA/SA gun with a decocker is the best choice for carry. If you have to, the gun can even be stuffed in a waistband. That's a point for the Sig.

The BHP is an all steel gun, but not a heavy one. Mags are CHEAP, plenty of aftermarket parts and the bad trigger is easily corrected at home. Aside from the slightly old fashioned trigger system, this gun has it all. Compared to the alloy SIG frame, I would expect close to twice the longevity (rounds fired) from the BHP.

Given the big picture of design, finish, etc., it likely comes down to whether you want more of a combat/tactical/matte black type of gun, or a more refined heirloom quality piece with pretty bluing. Both guns are damn reliable and accurate. Neither would be the wrong choice.

Rebel Gunman HK
April 23, 2003, 04:45 PM
Carry the Hk USP cocked and locked and the trigger pull isnt a problem anymore.

Angelo
April 23, 2003, 04:47 PM
Ala Dan, I don't post a lot but I read THR quite often. I never thought I'd see the day when someone asks "what's your opinion, Sig or X company" and you DIDN'T say Sig:what:

You're right though, either gun would be great to own. I just never thought I'd see the day......:D

Angelo

Dr.Rob
April 23, 2003, 05:44 PM
If you want SA, go with Browning or a high end clone (like mauser's sa-80), or even an FEG.

If you want DA/SA the 226 is probably the BEST da/sa I've ever handled.

Mags are more plentiful for the bhp, but really these are two VERY good choices, you won't go wrong with either.

mr e man
April 23, 2003, 06:45 PM
Hmmm.... Tough one, I know.... I feel I need both. Good replies guys. Thanx

Stay safe

Bowlcut
April 23, 2003, 09:04 PM
I dont know im still a huge fan of the p99. i love its da/sa trigger and how it locks back after the first round so its a super short pull. that ski jump really isnt the problem that bothers most peoples index fingers. its the mag release. i shifted my finger up a hair, well the knuckle/whole hand up a hair and all iiratation went away.

striker fired, so nothing to snag. slide release well molded so will not snag. tennifer slide so easy wear finish. ergonomics....i just dont see what sig has over them, the walther frames fall right in hand and feel like its part of the hand. factory adjustable sights, and backstraps. pre ban mags for the 9mm at a cost but can be found cheaply.

Plus its a Bond gun :)

actualy all the guns i think are good choices and ive actualy thought about getting any one of the 3 as the next gun

Newton
April 23, 2003, 09:15 PM
***NEWSFLASH*****

Ala Dan doesn't choose the SiG, World stops spinning, French win war, Oprah stays slim etc etc


******************

Seriously Ala, there's something about your posts man, I just love 'em, all of 'em. I reckon that you sir are THE quintessential firearms owner :) :)

Newton

45R
April 23, 2003, 09:38 PM
Ala Dan-

You need to come into my office to have your head examined by a medical professional. J/K


I own the Sig 226 and have shot the BHP on many occasions. Like everyone says you cant go wrong with either gun. Both are shooters at the range and for business applications. They are both great guns. I like the ergonomics on the BHP better than the fatter 226 Pistol grip.

Shoot them both and pick the one you love most. Either way you will wind up with both. :)

stevec
April 23, 2003, 10:46 PM
The Sig is going to have a better out of the box trigger, but the Browning seems like a more robust and substantial gun.
As nice as the Sig is, I think if you get the BHP, and invest in a trigger job and maybe some aftermarket grips (Uncle Mike's for comfortable shooting, Spegels for easier carry), you will become a True Believer in the BHP.

Steve

mr. e
April 23, 2003, 11:33 PM
I have owned and shot both, and I'd have to say that although the P226 is the better gun and more accurate at slow fire targets, its fat grip requires that you have very large hands.

My hands are slightly larger than most (I'm 6' -2" and 200 lbs.), and I just couldn't get comfortable with the 226's grip size.

I have a P229, however, that fits my hand like it was designed just for me.

agony
April 24, 2003, 12:21 AM
The SIG P226 is an extremely fine and fun pistol.
Ultra reliable, and utalitarian.
The P35 is prettier. Some say the P35 has the best ergos out there.
I own both, and lean towards the SIG. Any SIG.

Difficult choice to make until you're able to handle and fire both.
Find a range that rents them, and go for a test drive.

Neal Bloom
April 24, 2003, 01:36 AM
I like the way the BHP feels in my hands much better than the SIG. Geting rid of the mag disconnect works wonders. Both are fine handguns and I mean fine!

mr e man
April 24, 2003, 09:17 AM
In the december etition of "guns & ammo HANDGUNS" there is an article on the new "hammer down" hi-power from FN Herstal (HP-DA) wich has a "traditional double/single action" and a decocker. It has no manual safety. Any of you guys have any experience with this fine looking piece? Or any opinions for that matter?

Stay safe..

Berg01
April 24, 2003, 12:21 PM
The DA/SA FN Herstal may be a very fine gun; the Para Companion is a very unique 1911-pattern gun with a very smooth DAO trigger action.

Having said that, and I may get BK flame-broiled for this, but I have to tell you that the BHP and the 1911 are SA classics that (IMHO) work best in SA, and prove that the K.I.S.S. principle is always the best way to go.

O.K., thats my story, I'm sticking to it, so let 'em rip.

Handy
April 24, 2003, 01:15 PM
Mr. E,

I was thinking of suggesting the FN DA pistol, but that would have introduced a third pistol to your question about two.

I have never seen one in the flesh. It has existed in one form or another since the XM9 trials in 1985. It is all steel, like the BHP, matte black like the 226 and uses ambidextrous decocking levers, no safety. A thoroughly modern gun.

I would not expect to find 15 round mags for it, and it doesn't accept BHP mags.

If you can find one, I'd take a good long look at it. They apperently retain the excellent grip of the BHP. Seems like the best of both 226 and BHP, if the quality is there.

I used to have a Browning BDM, which is a different DA design. It had alot going for it, but the build quality was not to BHP or Sig levels, so I sold it. Hopefully, the FN DA is closer to the BHP in execution.


I would agree with Berg that KISS is a good guideline, but I personally don't think having to release a safety before firing is simpler than just pulling a DA trigger.

Ala Dan
April 24, 2003, 01:16 PM
Hey Guy's- Hold Up Just A Minute!:uhoh:

The TRUTH has been spoken. You folks know
that my favorite two SIG's are the "American Classic's"
commonly known as the P220A in .45 ACP and
the 9m/m P228. Although the SIG P226
and the P229 are great weapon's in their own
right; they just did not work out well for me!:uhoh:

Hey I kind'a like to use the :uhoh: icon!

My reasoning behind my decision are two-fold. First,
I don't care for the "European" grip style of the P226;
as it does not fit my hand well.:( Second, the P229's
milled all stainless slide seems a bit top heavy; making
the weapon feel unbalanced in my hand.

OTOH, the Browning Hi-Power feels and balances
extremely well (however, not as great as the SIG P220
and P228) while in my shooting grip; even with the BHP
"Practical" model's Pachmayr rubber grips!

But, I guess one might say that I just like QUALITY
firearms period! Friends, in my collection NO JUNK
will be allowed. Maybe, I don't appreciate the work (or
lack there of) that goes into the Ravens, Brycos, F.I.E.
Titans, Arminus, Charco's, Jenning's, High Point's, and
other's!;) NOTICE: I did not say anything bad about
Tauri International product's. Wow! I eat, sleep,
work, and play thinking about that darn Taurus "Life
Time" warranty package. Sure wish SIG Arms would
do that; so we could create more SIG owners!:uhoh:

Having Fun-

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

PS: I'm 10-10 at my home 20, cuz I'm almost late for work!

mr e man
April 24, 2003, 01:37 PM
Where I live, there is no 10 round limitation for handguns, so full capacity mags is not an issue. What's the story on that strange law anyways...? Is the 11'th round statisticly more lethal or something? I keep hearing sweet things about the Sig 228, and I want to give it a test run before deciding, if I can find one. Great replies guys, keep 'em coming... and stay safe!

Handy
April 24, 2003, 01:50 PM
The 228, if you can find one, have been something of a bargain lately. My local shop had one for $599 recently, a good $100 or more better than the 229 and 226.

I picked up a like new 225 with 4 mags for $450 several months ago, and like it. The 239 is also a bargain.

Handy
April 24, 2003, 02:07 PM
Here's a link to the new FN pistol:

http://www.fnherstal.com/html/Index.htm

CDNN is selling the compact for $399.

And here's a full size for sale:
http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=8524249

mr e man
April 24, 2003, 02:15 PM
Interesting , Handy.

Ala Dan
April 24, 2003, 03:04 PM
Hello Mr. E Man In The Great Country Of Norway-

and a huge welcome from the THR family of friends!

Yes sir, I would have to admit that the SIG-Sauer P228
is all that its cracked-up (laughing loudly) to be. With
its sheet metal slide, compact frame, and excellent
weight distribution; it makes for a perfectly balanced
weapon, at least in my opinion. A little wider (to accept
the double-stack magazines) than its cousin the P225;
but it still makes for a great CCW firearm.:scrutiny:

Mine, is one of the older ones; with West German
proof house marks indicating that it was made in 1990.
The SIG-Sauer P228 wasn't even introduced until late
1989! These weapons are in use by several U.S.A.
government agency's; namely the U.S. Park Service,
U.S. Bureau of Printing & Engraving, U.S. Army C.I.D.
unit's, and U.S. Naval Intelligence. By the way, its
frame uses the "American" style grip angle, or same
as the SIG P220; whereas the P225 uses the famed
"European" grip angle, or same as the P226. A big
time difference; at least in my book.

The SIG-Sauer P226 high capacity magazines hold more
rounds; but HECK, if you are a good shot who needs any
more than 13+1?

Best Wishes My Friend-
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

PS: Good Luck on finding a P228, as they just might be
scarce in Norway!

mr e man
April 24, 2003, 03:27 PM
Thank you very much for your warm welcome Ala Dan!
I will definetly check out the Sig p228 before purchasing a 9mm. I'll put in some serious effort in my search for your favourite 9.
As for 13 rounds, I reckon that's plentiful... if not , I'll probably need a rifle,shotgun or a rocket launcher. :uhoh:
again, thanx... and stay safe

Handy
April 24, 2003, 04:47 PM
It surprises me that the 228 and 226 grip angles are much different considering the mag compatibility. This must be a minor difference.

Just to add some other 228 users:

US Secret Service
Army
Navy
Marines
Air Force
Coast Guard

Dave Markowitz
April 24, 2003, 09:11 PM
SIGs are great pistols, but get the High Power. It has the best ergonomics of any handgun, except a Navy Colt. :)

Mannlicher
April 24, 2003, 10:16 PM
I have owned and shot Brownings for over 30 years. I owned one Sig, some years back. I won't buy another.

Ala Dan
April 25, 2003, 08:42 AM
from Mannlicher:

"I owned one Sig, some years back. I won't buy another."


Greeting's Sir!

Care to explain details? Such as model, caliber, reason.


Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

Ala Dan
April 25, 2003, 09:05 AM
Question for mr e man-

Greeting's again sir! Was wondering what kind'a price
these weapon's might cost the consumer in U.S.
dollars in Norway?

a) Sig P220, 226, or P228

b) Browning Hi-Power (standard or "practical" model)

c) H&K USP (full size or compact)

Just curious as to what citizens of other country's have
to pay for these firearms. Thanks for your help, and
looking forward to reading your reply!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

Poohgyrr
April 25, 2003, 02:55 PM
mr e man,

I just remembered something. I've never been to Oslo, but I think it gets cold there. If you do much outdoor shooting with gloves, the Sig does have more room inside the trigger guard than my favorite Hi Power.

This may or may not be important to you, and both pistols are very good.

Best wishes.

guy sajer
April 25, 2003, 05:20 PM
I have owned most Sig models over the last 20 years . I like the design and functioning . They just don't fit me . The HP is like an extension of my arm . It feels right at home . :)


Novak and Pat Crawford make a good team .:cool:

guy sajer
April 25, 2003, 05:23 PM
Another Novak .

megatronrules
April 25, 2003, 09:01 PM
I recently bought a mark 3 hi power and it great beautiful gun in every way. It says "browning" on it to :) its worth owning you won't be dissapointed with it. That being said i've owned 2 sigs and sold both dut to thair high bore axis and two trigger pulls. But for me thats all I've ever really shot is single action guns with the exception of my beretta 92fs.

I'd get the hi power IMH its a beter pistol than any sig infact its almost replaced my glock 17 as my daily carry gun.

Bruegger
April 26, 2003, 01:05 AM
SIG P228 is my duty weapon and I carry it on and off-duty. I'm very happy with its natural pointability and ergonomics. Shoots really well, too. Good compromise between concealabilty and being enough gun.

mr e man
April 26, 2003, 09:47 AM
Hello Ala Dan!

The Sig Sauer pistols are: (approx.) $1250. (same as beretta 92)
Hk usp/glock pistols: $900
Walther p99: $1000
I'm not sure about the hi-power, but I know of one used for $900 , but I have not inspected it myself yet. My Para Ordnance p14.45 limited was $1500. Hope this gives you an idea.
As you understand, prices are cracy In the "Great Land of Vikings".
What would the prices in "The Heart of Old Dixie" be?

Poohgyrr: Good point. May be what tip's Sig in my favour for now. But I want a hi-power too. Seems to be no way around it.

Nice guns, Guy Sayer...

Stay safe guys......

Ala Dan
April 26, 2003, 10:14 AM
Greeting's Again Mr. E Man,

Thanks a million for the information; as that will give us
some idea of prices around the globe!

Here in the good ole' U.S.A. gun prices rise as per
supply and demand. Most take at least a 5%
increase every year. Listed below are some of the
current market prices in MY area:

a) SIG-Sauer "Classic" P-series pistols are as follows:

1. P220A in .45 ACP $639.95 to $700.00

2. P226 in 9m/m $629.95 to $750.00

3. P228 in 9m/m $650.00 to $750.00

4. P232 in .380 $469.95 to $479.95

*FootNote- SIG prices can increase rapidly, if one
elects a finsih other than the standard blue; or if
they opt for SIG-LITE night sight's, or a combination
of both!:uhoh:


b) H&K USP models:

1. Comapct models in 9, 40, or .45 $689.95 - up

2. Full size models in 9. 40, or .45 $700.00 - up


c) Browning Hi-Power's:

1. in 9m/m or .40S&W from $600.00 to $650.00


d) Beretta 92f and fs series-

1. in 9m/m starting at around $500.00 and going up,
again dependent on the type of finish.


e) the least expensive QUALITY firearms are the CZ's
and Ruger's. As they generally start out in the $350.00
price range, and max out at close to $500.00.


However, this country is filled with scrupolous dealer's;
some of which will gogue a perspective purchaser for
every dime they can wiggle out of them!:uhoh: So, it
pays to compare prices among other dealers. Hope
this gives you some idea, as to what our current market
value is here in the U.S.

As always good to hear from you my friend; as I consider
you a gentleman and a scholar! Take care and enjoy the
shooting sport's.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

guy sajer
April 26, 2003, 10:32 AM
mr e man for the compliment .

Ala Dan
I'm the "unscrupulous" dealer that gouges till it hurts . ;)

Mitch
www.oldeenglishoutfitters.com

mr e man
April 26, 2003, 10:45 AM
Ala Dan!

Interesting to see that Hk usp models are in the same price range as the Sig's. (approx. $350 difference in Norway). I would think polymer guns are much cheaper to produce. As you said; supply and demand.... strange.

This is a great forum! I feel right at home.

Stay safe...

Ala Dan
April 26, 2003, 11:00 AM
Again Mr. E Man- and Guy!

I'm not a great big fan of polymer frame handgun's.
My reasoning is a little far-fetched, by here it is:

"I just don't know how long polymer frames will
hold up?" I think the jury is still out regarding this
issue. With the GLOCK arriving on shore in
about 1980; I guess only time will tell. OTOH, you
take a company like Beretta who has been making
guns for approximately 480 year's; it looks like the
use of aluminum frames has survived for a
long, long time.

I have owned one full size H&K USP in .45ACP; it
was a great firearm, and I really have NO complaint's.
And I have owned all of (3) Glock's! Again, great guns
but I just didn't like the feel of plastic. The Glock models
that I owned were the 17 (9m/m), the 23 (.40 S&W) and
the 27 (.40 S&W). All functioned flawlessly; and shot
extremely well. I used the model 27 as a CCW for a
short period of time; on a trial basis. But, it didn't take
long for me to return to my much beloved .45 caliber
SIG P220!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

guy sajer
April 26, 2003, 11:59 AM
The P220 is the one Sig that I can shoot well . My first 220 was a 9mm I wwe took in on trade about 1985 . I wanted a .45 . but the 9 was available . It was a great shooter . Later tried the Browning BDA 45 , 220 in .38 Super and a couple 220 .45's . I'll probably have another some day .

I don't worry too much about the polymer frame higher end guns . HK , Glock , Sig . I think they will outlast most of us . :)

Poohgyrr
April 26, 2003, 01:08 PM
Fwiw, I was looking at a CZ75B a few weeks ago. If I remember right, the price was about $400. I do remember it was considerably less than the Sigs & HK's, which were right around $650 to $700.

These prices struck me as kind of high, especially when I can save a bit more & get a Smith Performance Center 8 shot .357 for about $200 more.

They haven't had a Hi Power in stock at this store for quite a while :(,,,,,

guy sajer
April 26, 2003, 01:27 PM
Poohgyrr
In our store we carry a few Browning marked HP's . We sell maybe 10 a year . Not many . 10-15 years ago we sold maybe 25-35 . I think there are so many choices that if the mfg doesn't advertise , they aren't going to sell well . Reputation is going to sell a few , but you have to advertise .
The FN imported pistols seem to be in the wholesale pipeline . They aren't moving that well though . Atleast not here in Ohio .

I think the CZ 75 is a great value ! :D I'd rate it a best buy for the $ .

Poohgyrr
April 28, 2003, 04:17 PM
Guy,
I certainly won't argue about advertising. And the FN's are "approved" here now. An Fn marked Hi Power just seems somehow appropriate to me, and I do want one, although it will likely be a while. The CZ does have my interest, and I'd likely buy one if I didn't already have my Hi Power. Maybe my wife needs a CZ though. Hmmmmmmm........ ;)

buzz_knox
April 28, 2003, 04:22 PM
When firing both, I had a smile with the Sig 226, and a bloody hand with the Hi Power. I'm one of those unfortunate ones who gets bitten by the hammer rather viciously by the Hi Power. So, for out of the box use, I'll take a 226 over the HP any day.

If you're going the custom route, then the HP comes into its own. But, in that case, I'd still get the 226 to keep me warm and happy while the HP is on its way to and from the smith.

George Hill
April 28, 2003, 04:32 PM
http://www.fnherstal.com/html/FNP9/FNP9.jpg
The new FN... Boy, she is one ugly gal, aint she?

Pilot
April 28, 2003, 05:38 PM
Mitch,

Those are two beautiful Hi Powers. Nice!

guy sajer
April 28, 2003, 07:07 PM
Thanks for the compliment ! The High Power has been my favorite since I was a teen in the seventies . I had a Nazi P35 back then and many have passed through my hands over the years . I'm down to the 2 Novaks .

Poohgyrr
Heres a pic of my 75 . It's a 1984 gun . I was always impressed with their smooth DA pull . I don't think you can go wrong with a CZ . Some models we've been getting recently are coming with a 15 rd mag and a 10 rd mag .

Mitch

If you enjoyed reading about "sig 226 vs browning hi-power" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!