Good .308 bolt-action rifles?


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Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 11:39 AM
I live in Sweden so semi-auto .308 rifles are ganz verboten (and the only .223 semi that is legal is the Mini-14). Thus, I need some tips on what to buy once I get my hunting license. I need something that is affordable, reliable, suitable for SHTF and self defense and preferably feedable with high-capacity mags. Does such a gun exist? Also, being able to trick it out with tactical crap (scope, laser, bipod, bayonet etc) is a huge bonus :D

Alternatively, you can try and suggest something else that does all this for me while being legal in Sweden...

Also, did you know that .50BMG rifles are legal here? Sweden, more conservative than California :neener:

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Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 11:46 AM
I'm giving serious thought to the Mini-14. The problem is I keep hearing all these bad things about it. How it's really fragile and inaccurate and what not.

What's the truth?

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 11:54 AM
How about this (http://www.blocket.se/vi/8018642.htm?ca=23_10_s)? Any good?

Just window-shoppin' currently...

VirgilCaine
May 9, 2006, 12:01 PM
There are some Enfields that were converted to use detachable magazines and other calibers for the Australian market (no semi-autos at all there, IIRC), you might look at one of those.

They had one in 5.56/.223, an "AK" in 7.62x39mm, and a .308...
"Australian International Arms", the "M42" was the .308 rifle that accepted M14 magazines. Unfortunately, I can't find their website anymore.

Edit: Also, you might try one of the late Enfield No. 5 carbines in .308?

afsnco
May 9, 2006, 12:01 PM
Classical,


Sounds like you're stuck with the Mini 14, although it's not a bad weapon to be stuck with. I don't own one, but it's my understanding that they're reliable, but not necessarily very accurate. It's probably accurate enough, however. Reliability has a way of being accurate enough eventually.:) In any case, it sounds like you don't have a lot of choices.

BTW, I spent a week in Stockholm, and a few days in Goteburg about 20 years ago. The Stockholm trip was business, but the Goteburg trip was when a couple of NFL teams went there to play a preseason game. I was stationed at Oslo for 4 years. It's funny listening to all the different Scandinavian languages: The Norwegian "sing-song," the Germanic sounding gravelly Danes, and the Swedes, which were somewhere in between. At least that's how they sounded to me.

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 12:09 PM
Am leaning towards the Mini-14...

What kind of tactical stuff is there to buy for it? I wanna go waaay overboard. Mall ninja :cool:

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 12:11 PM
For self defense usage of .223, I need 77gr hollowpoint rounds, right?

afsnco
May 9, 2006, 12:46 PM
Can you import stuff duty-free?

http://www.clipsnstuff.com/mini14.shtml

http://www.johnmasen.com/mini14.html

http://www.cabelas.com/information/Hunting--Optics/Mini-14Mini-30-Accessories0012777/Mini-14-Folding-Style-Rifle-Stocks0012777210499a.html

Vern Humphrey
May 9, 2006, 12:53 PM
For self defense usage of .223, I need 77gr hollowpoint rounds, right?

No. In fact, the Mini-14 cannot handle such heavy bullets. M16s and AR15 clones have a special fast rifling twist to handle bullets up to 80 grains. Your Mini-14 would be limited to around 55 grains or just a bit more by its slower twist. For self defense, I would recommend the 60 grain Nosler Partition Jacket, if your rifle will handle them. This bullet, unlike lighter bullets in that diameter, is designed for shooting deer.

Personally, I would choose a good bolt action rifle in .308 for all around use.

richardschennberg
May 9, 2006, 02:15 PM
Remington makes a model 7600 pump-action rifles. One of the variants for .223 (5.56mm) can use AR-15/M-16 magazines. If you don't need high-capacity magazines, there are also new and used ones that chamber .308 (7.62 Nato) and .243.
Richard
Schennberg.com (http://www.schennberg.com)

qajaq59
May 9, 2006, 02:49 PM
I'd rather have a .308 bolt action for hunting and a 12 gauge shotgun full of buckshot for self defense. If the bad guy is far enough away to require a rifle bullet, they will likely lock you up for shooting him. Besides, rifle accuracy sucks on a black night while a 12 gauge pump works great.

kennyboy
May 9, 2006, 03:15 PM
What does SHTF mean?

kennyboy
May 9, 2006, 03:16 PM
Remington, not Ruger, makes the 7600 pump rifles.

Diomed
May 9, 2006, 03:36 PM
If you want a hi-cap bolt in .308/7.62 NATO, maybe an Ishapore 2A1 would work for you, provided you can a) get it in Sweden, and b) find one in good shape. You get twelve round capacity and a rapid cycling bolt. In good shape they're as accurate as any ordinary .308, and way more reliable. You can probably trick one out with scopes and rails and all that business. (I wouldn't even scream about bubba-ing a good milsurp, because hey, it's an Ishy. No one will miss it.)

Personally, I have no use for Ishys ... but I'm considering getting one, because .303 ain't cheap no mo'.

sterling180
May 9, 2006, 03:39 PM
Also, did you know that .50BMG rifles are legal here? Sweden, more conservative than California

Well they certainly are allowed in the UK,for the moment as well-but if the GCN have things their way,then they would be banned,soon.

Classical Liberal: If you want a good all round rifle that serves all purposes,then an Armalon rifle, might just suit your requirements. Their website, I think is:
www.armalon.co.uk

sterling180
May 9, 2006, 03:48 PM
Classic Liberal, can I ask why are only .233 centrefire semi-auto rifles legal in Sweden and not .308 Winchester calibre semi-auto's?

freedom and guns
May 9, 2006, 03:52 PM
classical liberal. 1 move to a realatively free country. 2 get a winchester model 70 b4 they are all gone. 3 I prefer the name classical conservative. Kenny Boy thanks for asking about this. I have never known and always wondered what it meant and would have been to embarassed 2 ask. SOMEONE ANSWER THIS QUESTION: 2nd post:banghead: :banghead:

Vern Humphrey
May 9, 2006, 04:01 PM
I prefer the name classical conservative

A modern conservative is a classical liberal. (If you don't ask me what modern liberals are, you won't get a shocking answer.):neener:

SHTF means Feces Hits The Fan.:p

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 04:25 PM
Classical liberalism is 18th century liberalism.

sterling180: AFAIK, the Mini-14 is the only semi-auto .223 that is legal here and no semi-auto .308 guns whatsoever.

But without the ability to shoot the 77gr stuff, it does look like a bolt-action .308 is the way to go. How about a Remington 700?

Oh, and thanks to everyone for the tips and all!

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 04:29 PM
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/content/Item/21/04/99/i210499hz01.jpg

Yeah, baby :cool:

Guess I'm just too addicted to the thought of a scary-lookin' tactical .223 to be able to think clearly about the issue.

But hey, shotguns can be fitted out with stuff too :D

Vern Humphrey
May 9, 2006, 05:18 PM
Classical liberalism is 18th century liberalism

And its direct descendant is modern conservativism -- that is, respect for the principles in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 05:33 PM
Well, be glad you have such a concise and powerful Constitution. I'm a law school student and ours is a huge mess with all kinds of unnecessary crap.

Vern Humphrey
May 9, 2006, 05:43 PM
Well, be glad you have such a concise and powerful Constitution. I'm a law school student and ours is a huge mess with all kinds of unnecessary crap.

So would ours be, if we had depended on ordinary politicians to write it.

30Cal
May 9, 2006, 06:16 PM
I saw this over on another board earlier this week (a guy in Scandanavia who shoot an M1A/M14). You sure you can't get a .308 semi-auto?

I had plans to go to the range this afternoon, but the summer came to Sweden today and the beer is really good, so - no driving for me
...
Well, a new Norinco is arriving in a month so that gun shall be brokend in right. The gun is costing me 500 american dollars + shipping. VERY expensive for a new gun Just kidding...

Regards

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 06:29 PM
After some checking, it seems M1 Garands are legal. Don't know about the M1A but it would surprise me if it were legal.

Got a link to that post, btw?

AJAX22
May 9, 2006, 06:55 PM
if the M1 Garand is legal, try looking at the m14, maby you'll be lucky there too?

If not I heard a rumor that there are 25 round magazines for the HK which can be adapted to fit the Hakim which is 8mm semi auto, they're pretty cheep, not much in the way of aftermarkets, but 25 rounds of 8mm is enough to chop down a small tree if your bored.

Just a thought.

Ruger mini is a pretty good choice, they may have mag issues, they may be not quite as acurate as an AR, but they are increadibly durable for SHTF.

My own personal mini spent 10 years at the bottom of a creek prior to resurection.

Rusted solid but still put a hole in my buddies garage when we were disasembling it. I didn't use to like them very much but after that, it speeks alot for the reliability.

Classical Liberal
May 9, 2006, 06:58 PM
Well, I now have some pretty good evidence that M-14:s are legal in Sweden. I should just e-mail the police or something to confirm.

But, anyway... Oh boy, oh boy, oh boy! :D

M-14, that's a real rifle. A rifle you can put a bayonet on and a rifle that will kill a man dead.

Anyway, tactical stuff for the M-14? I'm talking mags, scopes, bipods, lasers, bayonets, stocks, the whole shebang ;)

mcmjr
May 9, 2006, 07:58 PM
If a M14 is legal, then you should get that. Ifyou want to go the bolt action route, I would look into the Finnish rifles like the Sako or Tikka, or even look into the Sig bolt rifles they are probably cheaper than a Remington.

Skoghund
May 10, 2006, 12:35 PM
Semi auto rifles in .308 are legal here in Sweden. You can't get a weapon for self defence. .223 is a class 2 weapon only for use on roedeer and beaver. Would like to see the look on the rifle club members faces when you turn up with a weapon like in the picture.

Classical Liberal
May 10, 2006, 12:39 PM
Skoghund: everyone at Flashback told me post-1942 military semis were illegal. But if not, I am very happy :D

Terrierman
May 10, 2006, 05:53 PM
I'm confused. :confused: Do you want a good bolt action .308, a .223 semi auto all dressed up like it was going to war, a .223 semi auto all dressed up like it was going to war, but with a fast twist barrel to stabilize heavy projectiles, an M-1 Garand or a .308 semi all dressed up like it was going to war? The possibliities for a rifle that will kill a man dead are not quite, but nearly endless. You need to make up your mind and in the meantime, send us over a couple of those bikini team alums (recent vintage only) OK?

Vern Humphrey
May 10, 2006, 06:07 PM
send us over a couple of those bikini team alums (recent vintage only) OK?

And you can keep the bikinis.:p

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