Enfield at SOG


PDA






Flyboy73
May 10, 2006, 02:22 AM
Just got my SOG paper today and they are selling Unusual enfileds for $195.

I have not idea what model it is. Looks kinda like a mark 4

Is this reall made in england, or a cheap indian knockoff?

See pic

Brion

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=39791&stc=1&d=1147242921

If you enjoyed reading about "Enfield at SOG" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
swingset
May 10, 2006, 02:53 AM
Weird Punjab creation, they did a "unique" conversion on the No4 rifles and came up with these things....kind of an Enfield/Mauser bastard love-child.

Weird.

John G
May 10, 2006, 03:16 AM
Ugh. :( She ain't much of a looker. Unless it shoots well, no thanks.

rangerruck
May 10, 2006, 03:46 AM
i have shot one of these before, and i liked it very much. i likey the mag cutoff, and also the sights were quite good.

rmgill
May 10, 2006, 05:52 PM
That's not a No4 Reciver/Bridge. Thats a No1 or Lee Enfield style bridge. Strange that it's shorter. Could be a carbine version. I don't see what the local folks would bother with British Stamps unless it was done back before the crown left.

Here's a C.L.L.E. as it were (Charger Loading Lee Enfield)
http://www.mindspring.com/~rmgill/britkit/weapons/images/73.jpeg

The rifle pictured was originally made by Enfield as a L.E., Mark I* in 1902
and was converted to a C.L.L.E., Mark I* by V.S.M. in 1910.

The Magazine cutoff is for single shots until the push comes and then you fire volleys. They were omitted on the SMLE third marks and after. Some rifles were rebuilt to remove those or modified to later standard. Odd thing about the one in the SOG flyer is that it's shorter. Perhaps a cavalry carbine version? Interesting.

Ash
May 10, 2006, 09:10 PM
The Turks made an Enfield/Mauser hybrid and those are worth quite a bit.

Of course, there are fake Martini-Enfields, so it is said, being sold by SOG as well. These may be made in the same factory as those!

Ash

mustanger98
May 11, 2006, 12:24 AM
Those Enfields ain't all that unusual. They just ain't No.1 Mk3's. It looks like a No.1 Mk1 or No.1 Mk2.

My best info is that "GRI" is the mark of Ishapore prior to 1949 when the Brits relinquished control to the Indian gov't. "RFI" is Ishapore after 1949.

British and Indian troops both would have been issued this rifle until the issue of the No.1 Mk3.

Limeyfellow
May 11, 2006, 01:41 AM
Indian No1 Mk1 Lee Enfields, aka the Magazine Lee Enfield. Turn of the century. They are actually quite nice and I think I may pick one up if they are still in stock. I would love an actual British No1 Mk1 but they are unfortantly rather rare. Indian troops like many commonwealth troops didn't get the best weapons and they probrobly got the old tooling equipment for the mk1 and a bunch of older ones when Britain updated to the No1 Mk3.

Flyboy73
May 11, 2006, 01:51 AM
All told is the rifle worth what SOG wants?


Brion

Diomed
May 11, 2006, 02:23 AM
I can't say anything about the ones at SOG (aside from "I would never buy from those lying bastards"), but these rifles have been flooding the market the past few weeks.

What exactly they are is still somewhat undetermined. Some are legit British made rifles that have been played with a little, some are legit British rifles that have been "rebuilt" using hacksaws and hand tools, and some are most likely hand made somewhere in Afghanistan. Old Western Scrounger had a bunch at the Chantilly show, which they claimed came out of South Africa. SA by way of Kabul, maybe.

Thats a No1 or Lee Enfield style bridge. Strange that it's shorter. Could be a carbine version. I don't see what the local folks would bother with British Stamps unless it was done back before the crown left.

It's a Magazine Lee Enfield, and it's been shortened to the SMLE length (25" barrel). In Australia/New Zealand they would be known as a "range rifle". I actually have one of these (not from SOG!), because it's a Sparkbrook, and I am powerless to resist Sparkbrooks. It's all WD parts, or if they're local-made they're amazing craftsmanship. The bolt and rear sight are mismatched, the butt is off an SMLE, and the mainspring is barely able to move the firing pin, but it's legit. It will definitely be spending some quality time at the 'smith before I even think about shooting, but it is real. Whether the shortening was done for a target shooter or by the village gunmaker, I'm not sure. Probably the latter.

The Khyber copies of Martinis actually do have British proofs - they're just not quite right. Of course the larger stuff is the giveaway (backwards "N"s being the most common tell).

The Turks made an Enfield/Mauser hybrid and those are worth quite a bit.

Seriously? The Enfausers on Gunbroker are appalling.

Of course, there are fake Martini-Enfields, so it is said, being sold by SOG as well. These may be made in the same factory as those!

Oh they are totally fake. Totally. One day, one of them will blow up in someone's face, and SOG will rightfully get sued to its knees. :fire:

If by "factory", you mean "hut in a mountain village", you are probably correct!

Those Enfields ain't all that unusual. They just ain't No.1 Mk3's. It looks like a No.1 Mk1 or No.1 Mk2.

They are not No. 1 rifles. An easy way to recognize a "Number" rifle is whether it has full-length wood handguards. These are Magazine Lee Enfields (or Charger Loading Lee Enfields). They are not a part of the "Number" scheme.

My best info is that "GRI" is the mark of Ishapore prior to 1949 when the Brits relinquished control to the Indian gov't. "RFI" is Ishapore after 1949.

Pretty much. The "GRI" is actually the Imperial cypher (Georgius Rex Imperator), which changed with the monarch, e.g. ERI for the Edwards, VRI for Victoria, though I've never seen one.

British and Indian troops both would have been issued this rifle until the issue of the No.1 Mk3.

Not exactly. British troops would have mostly switched over to the SMLEs before the CLLE appeared. Native troops would have gotten lesser stuff, like Martinis, or the older MLEs. The whole system was complicated. By WWI, Indians were mostly carrying modern rifles.

The CLLEs did get used in WWI, due to shortages. I think New Zealand was armed with virtually nothing but various Long Toms when they landed at Gallipoli.

No one is reading at this point, so here endeth the lesson.

All told is the rifle worth what SOG wants?

Two hundred bucks? Well. If you want a shooter (which you don't want to have to restore or have inspected by a very, very thorough gunsmith - think magnafluxing), probably not. There's no way to know what you're getting. Could be decent, could be a nail, could blow up.

You can get a decent newer Enfield for that much if you're not looking for a period rifle.

If you enjoyed reading about "Enfield at SOG" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!