"tactical" M1A


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Foxtrot427
May 10, 2006, 04:47 PM
I have been looking to get one of those M1a collapsing stock "EBR" style rifles. What are some of the cheaper M1s around? I have no objection to buying used as long as it is in good condition. So who all makes those style stocks? I know Sage and troy. Are sages drop in? Im on a budget for gun purchases btw.

Im looking to do something that looks like this.
http://www.impactguns.com/store/media/sage_inuse.jpg

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arizcowboy
May 10, 2006, 04:57 PM
Research the price of those tactical M1A stocks before you buy a cheaper M1A copy to put in it. You could almost pay as much for the stock as the rifle itself. That soldier is holding almost $2000 worth of rifle and stock if purchased commercially.

Correia
May 10, 2006, 05:20 PM
That is a Sage EBR stock. Heavy, and expensive, but very well made.

Vltor also has a stock. Not as fancy, but lighter, and not as expensive.

There are no cheap M14 type rifles out there anymore, unless you happen to come across a good deal on a used one. I've been looking for a project gun for awhile.

N3rday
May 10, 2006, 05:34 PM
Doesn't Norinco make an M14 knockoff?

here ya go:

http://www.marstar.ca/gf-norinco/M-14S.shtm

Now, I know thats a Canadian website, so you can't exactly order it from there (at least, I don't think you can), but it at least shows you they are out there.

Correia
May 10, 2006, 05:38 PM
Not in the states. The Norcs can't be imported anymore.

hso
May 10, 2006, 05:52 PM
Correia's spot on. Norinco M14S rifles can't be brought into the U.S..

I can only assume you're not familiar with M14 derivative rifles since you're asking about price.

You're looking at anywhere from a low (if you're very lucky) of $700 for a used Polytech or Norinco, don't buy the Norinco if you can get a Polytech, to upwards of $1,200+ for Springfield or some of the other U.S. manufactured complete guns. You might get out with the same price of a Springfield if you buy a reciever and have the gun built from parts.

If you get a used Polytech you'll want a GI bolt and bolt carrier to put in. If you're lucky ,again, you'll spend $125 for that. Now with a nice used Polytech that isn't shot out with a GI bolt you'll have $825 in to it.

Now for the Buck Rogers hardware. Figure on another $500-$800 for the swoopy stock. Add a couple more hunderd for the rail forend and your pushing $1500 - $2,200 to get gun in the picture.

Of course you could just buy it for $2800 from Fulton Armory.

Foxtrot427
May 10, 2006, 06:06 PM
wow I didnt know these damn things were so expensive. I love the look but as of now and for a long time, I wont be able to afford that. Hopefully there isnt an AWB when I can afford it in a few years.

trbon8r
May 10, 2006, 08:38 PM
I would advise buying a bone stock M14 type rifle and shooting it before buying any fancy aftermarket parts.

I've been shooting these rifles a long time and have found that a bone stock rifle with GI fiberglass stock will do just fine. Recently I tried experimenting with some new "gee whiz" stuff like an Aimpoint mounted on a Knight's RAS. I didn't like it, and found that I could shoot more accurately with the iron sights. I've since sold the RAS and I'm going back to a traditional handguard and iron sights. I can't think of any other rifle where the KISS principle applies more than the M14.

odysseus
May 10, 2006, 08:43 PM
I agree to keep things simple starting out with the m1a/m14. There are a lot of things one can do, and with this system people try to wedge it into roles it might not be best for.

Speaking of stocks, for the record here is another good one:

http://www.jae100.com/

AndyC
May 10, 2006, 09:11 PM
That JAE is one sweet looking rifle:

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7941/jae100rifle1au.th.jpg (http://img136.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jae100rifle1au.jpg)

Foxtrot427
May 10, 2006, 09:13 PM
I would probably buy a stock one first. And the stock, I would want to be able to come on and off when I want. I like the gun in both forms.

FXR
May 10, 2006, 09:39 PM
I have a Fulton version of the M1A with the wood stock which I like tremendously. You can buy several (slightly) used synthetic stocks, paint them different camo colors to suit your mood, and do little else and still have a great rifle. I may even paint one hot pink or lavender just to keep up with those stylin' AR's I see at the range...:cool:

The Sage stock looks good but not on my budget; the wood stock does just fine for my needs. I suspect that the adjustable feature of the Sage is very compatible with the body armor our guys wear in Iraq so the the stock has a place for them.

K

Dienekes
May 11, 2006, 01:39 AM
Concur with the KISS principle. Irons are fast, reliable, and accurate at short to medium ranges and obviously the weight is negligible. I am not an eagle-eyed kid anymore but as long as I can make do with my Mk.1 eyeballs things work out pretty well. I have a Smith Ent. side mount and am trying to get up to speed on practical optics just in case I really have to upgrade someday. So far I have been able to defer that. So far so good.

If there is a problem with irons it is in target identification and definition at 150 yards plus. Sort of a nonissue. Most combat is a lot closer than that, so I question the need to hang a bunch of stuff on an otherwise decent handling rifle.

Better to spend the bucks on training and ammo.

stealthmode
May 11, 2006, 06:28 AM
That JAE is nice

scbair
May 11, 2006, 09:07 AM
Considering its genesis and capabilities, since when is a stock M1A NOT "tactical"??? :scrutiny:

geekWithA.45
May 11, 2006, 12:10 PM
Tac stocks add up to 2.5 pounds of weight (or more) to what is already a heavy rifle.

3 gun
May 11, 2006, 01:52 PM
I broke down and picked up a Sage stock. Best money I've spent. It makes shooting major in USPSA possible. You can watch your hits thru the scope, it cuts recoil that much.

http://www.members.aol.com/gse1100/OhioTFL/sage.jpg

hso
May 11, 2006, 05:12 PM
Turning a fine battle rifle into a Christmas tree is bad, but if the Sage cuts fealt recoil then it's a good thing.

Mannlicher
May 11, 2006, 05:37 PM
so far, I am quite happy with the stocks that came on my SOCOM and my M1A Loaded, from Springfield. I use the irons on the M1A, and have a EOTech 511 on the SOCOM.

3 gun
May 11, 2006, 06:25 PM
Another big plus with the Sage is how well the receiver fits into the stock. Just the stripped action fits so well that you need to use something to "punch" it out. You can't just pull it out or flip it over and wiggle. And that's BEFORE you add the beefed up barrel band. It is a match rifle kind of fit. Group sizes have been reduced enough that you can tell before and after groups with the naked eye. Other than the receiver and barrel band, nothing touches the stock. With the open design the gun stays cooler while firing and cools faster after the stage. Add in the solid, trouble free rail to mount a red dot and you have a HUGE step up from the standard rifle and scope mount. I'll say this, it works better than it looks like it should. I'd buy another in a heatbeat.

Sry0fcr
May 11, 2006, 06:33 PM
I like Troy's CBR stock.

Link (http://www.troyind.com/modular_stock_system.htm)

I wonder how much it weighs?

Gewehr98
May 11, 2006, 11:10 PM
If you get a used Polytech you'll want a GI bolt and bolt carrier to put in. If you're lucky ,again, you'll spend $125 for that.

Where exactly is the bolt carrier is on my M14NM? I've been looking all over hell and high water looking for a bolt carrier on my gun. I've got a bolt, and an oprod...

Most of the Norinco/Polytech M14SA guns with the dreaded soft bolts had both their bolts and barrels replaced, since a USGI bolt seldom headspaced properly with the original Chinese barrels.

I broke down and picked up a Sage stock. Best money I've spent. It makes shooting major in USPSA possible. You can watch your hits thru the scope, it cuts recoil that much.


So one can't make major power factor in USPSA with a standard USGI stock? :confused:

Considering its genesis and capabilities, since when is a stock M1A NOT "tactical"???

Good call. Christmas trees notwithstanding, the definition of "tactical" has become a long and slippery slope. I fear my own M14NM is no longer tactical, since it's neither SAGE-stocked, nor does it use batteries in the optics. Real POS, it's really only good for hitting man-sized targets out to 800+ yards. Poor pitiful me, guess I should sell it, 'cuz it just ain't the shiznat...

http://mauser98.com/m14nmbench.jpg

3 gun
May 11, 2006, 11:39 PM
True the power factor doesn't change with the stock, the ease of use does. The increase in accuracy, reduced recoil, better fit and ease of mounting optics all make the Sage stock superior to the standard stock it replaced, at least where I shoot. Same reason I took the time to make 30rd mags work in my rifle. It levels the field between the ARs and my M1a. YMMV

Spark
May 12, 2006, 02:48 PM
I thought there were problems with the SAGE stock not being secure enough to retain zero when optics are mounted on it?

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