Is 9mm easier to start reloading than .40 s&w and 10mm??


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hartzpad
June 6, 2006, 08:01 PM
I wasn't going to try reloading 9mm because I won't save a ton of money doing so, but as a first time reloader, I was thinking that starting on 9mm might be easier than starting with .40 s&w and 10mm, especially because I plan to start out with a Lee Pro 1000 progressive press and as I become confident with 9mm and I just buy anther Lee Pro 1000 for .40 and 10mm reloading use. That way I will have 2 cheap but good quality presses for under $300 total. 9mm has lower case pressures and seems like it would just be easier for a beginner to start on than .40 or 10mm. Am I right?

Or should I just keep buying 9mm and only reload .40 and 10mm? I shoot a few thousand 9mm (maybe 3500) a year and probably about 1000 10mm a year. I will definitely shoot more of all calibers when I start reloading though.

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EddieCoyle
June 6, 2006, 08:06 PM
9mm is really no easier or harder to reload than a .40 or 10mm. I'd start with the .40/10mm because you can load both with the same set of dies.

The Bushmaster
June 6, 2006, 08:19 PM
Guess that answered that question...I'd go for the 40/10mm also...

LexDiamonds
June 6, 2006, 08:20 PM
The first cartridge I loaded for was 10mm and I found it to be about perfect in terms of a "learning cartridge". Big enough not to be awkward and with blue dot, the pressure curve was smooth. As above poster mentioned you cant really go wrong with loading for either.

You will save more money by loading up 10mm first even if you continue to buy 9mm for a while.

pedaldude
June 6, 2006, 08:30 PM
I always wondered if you can trim 10mm cases that have cracked mouths to .40 like 357/38spl

and is there any savings reloading 9mm? I haven't shot it that much but plan on it when I get a CZ75 since now I've been mostly shooting 45 and even though I don't reload yet I've been saving all the empties, right now I've prolly got 1k and change. I'd save the 9mm too but would either recycle it or pass it on to someone that reloads it since if the difference between reloading 9 and 45 is only a few cents I'd just stick to reloading 45.

The Bushmaster
June 6, 2006, 08:50 PM
Pedaldude...Just how do you chamber a trimmed down.357 magnum case into a .38 Special cylinder. In my .38 Specials (and I have three) I would need a hammer to drive them in that last 1/8th inch or so. Just curious...:D

Sorry to get off topic on this....:o

hartzpad
June 6, 2006, 08:51 PM
Well, I've been buying Miwall 125 gr. 9mm reloads for the last few years for around $89/1000 (no shipping at gunshows) but the price now increased to $109/1000, it has made me start looking at reloading. Their .40 reloads only increased from $115/1000 to $124/1000. I may just use a few more thousand just to collect brass as I have with their 10mm reloads (alot of them are nickel cases too!).

If I remember, most .40 cases use a small primer and 10mm a large primer? Is that correct?

pedaldude
June 6, 2006, 09:26 PM
Pedaldude...Just how do you chamber a trimmed down.357 magnum case into a .38 Special cylinder.

I wouldn't know, read it in a book, possibly the intent was to reuse it in the 357 that fired the case, I can't remember but it might have even said to trim the 38spl down to 38s&w length after it started to crack then, it was an old book and I can't imagine anyone being that hard up but i imagine in case of emergency if supply was low enough.

the same book also mentioned duplex, triplex and "quadra" rounds in 357 for self defense, aside from the much debated liability issue today I'd be mighty leery of plugging the barrel in such a manner.

I guess I should be dubious of all the other information in same book if the trimming down 357 is poor practice.

I frankly wouldn't want ammo floating around lying around that wasn't spec'd to the headstamp. wether for an auto or a revolver, just wondering if in a bind it was possible.

RyanM
June 6, 2006, 09:32 PM
9mm would be harder. 9mm uses a tapered case, while .40 and 10mm are true straightwall. So 9mm is more sensitive to die height and stuff, and also harder to size.

huntershooter
June 6, 2006, 10:18 PM
Due to it's size, I find 9mm quite tedious to reload-unless you use a press with a case feeder. Also, chamber pressures for 9mm are not lower than .40 s&w. Standard loadings in respective calibers are around 35,000 psi from memory. Of your options, I'd go with the .40/10mm.

mrapathy2000
June 7, 2006, 05:52 AM
40sw was easier when I started.

I need two seating dies to get 9mm made to my standards on turret press otherwise you can get cokebottle and canted bullets they can shoot fine but are fugly. had to make my own seating stem on lathe in addition to that. but where I am I just have to adjust toss turret onto press 9mm or 40sw adjust final seat and crimp check OAL and powder adjust as needed.

9mm and 40sw saami spec pressure is 35,000psi
most 9mm brass can handle +p pressure in fact some 9mm brass is no different than +p brass difference being headstamp starline even states such.

I would suggest you do not reload commercial reloads. get factory ammo and spend the extra $10-25 and shipping for the factory new brass.

I love handloading its great you get to make stuff not available easily or cheap with commonly available commercial componets.

watch the OAL and get lots of load data start low work loads up use search button lots.

PowerPistol is good powder to start on its fun in 9mm np making 1200-1300fps with 115 and 124/125gr and stay in standard pressure it can send a 147gr bullet nearly 1100fps. pretty good 40sw powder too.

40sw uses small primer,10mm uses large. not sure if anyone makes 10mm brass with small pistol I know some do that for 45acp.

shu
June 7, 2006, 08:22 AM
disclaimer: i don't do .40 or 10mm. i do 9mm, 38/357, 357sig, and 45acp in pistol, with single stage rockchucker.

i do the 9mm not because it is particularly cheaper, but because of what can be learned from messing about with different components.

if you shoot .40 and 10mm, then start with that. for my fingers, 9mm is just a bit smaller than optimum for rapid assembly.

stay safe - shu

WayneConrad
June 7, 2006, 11:51 AM
"Just how do you chamber a trimmed down.357 magnum case into a .38 Special cylinder."

A 357 mag case is exactly the same as a 38 special case, except in length (1.290" vs. 1.155"). If you were to size a 357 case case and trim it down to 1.155", it would become a 38 special case. Unless I'm missing something, a 38 special gun ought not to know or care that it used to be a 357 case.

RyanM
June 7, 2006, 01:18 PM
.357 magnum cases are thicker. Especially deeper in. If you're using heavy bullets, seating the bullet 1/8" deeper could cause the case to swell out. I guess? :confused:

The Bushmaster
June 7, 2006, 01:41 PM
Wayne...Did some checks here and I'll concede to you (I hate that when that happens:o ), but I still wouldn't do it. Why? If you are trimming a mouth split .357 case down to a .38 special it would seem like a waste of time because the case has already indicated that it was wore out. Besides .357 magnum and .38 special cases are a dime a dozon. I have thousands of each.

Ryan...Now you've got me thinking again. Have you cut one down to check the thickness at the shorter length?

WayneConrad
June 7, 2006, 03:00 PM
Bushmaster, I think you're right. 38 special brass is a dime a dozen, so I wouldn't go through the bother.

Ryan's got me thinking, too. I might sacrifice a 357 case or two and see.

raz-0
June 7, 2006, 05:06 PM
9mm is more awkward due to small size and the case taper.

.45 is really easy (and the cost differential is pretty large to boot).

ball3006
June 7, 2006, 05:16 PM
Cases of the 40 and 10mm are larger and easier to hold.......everything else is the same......chris3

RyanM
June 7, 2006, 11:46 PM
Never tried it, since I don't have that many right now. It would be worth an experiment or two if I actually had more than 150 cases, though. And a trimmer of some sort. I can't cut a straight line by hand to save my life.

WayneConrad
June 8, 2006, 01:01 AM
I decided to find out if 357 can be trimmed to 38 special length and still chamber. It looks like it can.

I picked a once-fired 38 special case and a once-fired 357 case from inventory. Both have the Winchester headstamp. They were both cleaned and sized. Then I trimmed the 357 case to 38 special length using the Lee trimmer.

38 special
length: 1.148"
outside diameter at mouth: 0.373"
wall thickness at mouth: 0.009"

357 mag trimmed to 38 special
length: 1.151"
outside diameter at mouth: 0.373"
wall thickness at mouth: 0.009"

They look the same, right? Only until I weighed them:

38 special: 65.3 gr
357 mag trimmed to 38 special: 77.4 gr

There's 12.1 grains more brass in the case that started as a 357. That's the weight of about half an inch of 0.009" thickness, 0.373" diameter cartridge brass tubing. So somewhere in that 357 case is a whole whole half inch more of brass.

But will it actually work as a 38 special case? To find out, I chamfered and deburred the once-357 case and seated a 125gr plated flat-point bullet using a light roll crimp. It seated easily into the 38 special max cartridge gauge.

So, at least this once, trimming Winchester 357 brass down to 38 special size worked. Will it work every time and for every brand of 357 brass? Beats me.

RyanM
June 8, 2006, 01:20 AM
You may want to seat the bullet so that the base is at about the level it would be with a 158 gr, 180 gr, or 200 gr bullet, and see if you get any bulging. I don't know at what depth bulging starts, but I know I did manage to ruin a case once when I wasn't paying attention, and tried to seat a bullet with the case mouth belling die. Oops.

WayneConrad
June 8, 2006, 01:49 AM
Ryan, I believe it. That extra 12 grains of brass has got to be somewhere. Why not in the case walls near the mouth?

pedaldude
June 8, 2006, 04:07 AM
I decided to find out if 357 can be trimmed to 38 special length and still chamber. It looks like it can.


Pretty cool!

looks like the oldtimer in the book I read was right, I'm guessing that if you cut a 357 the long way that you'd see most of that extra brass is in the base since that should be the weakest point of any cartridge. Also if it hasn't caused too much trouble he also mentioned that the same applied to 44mag/44spl and 41... saying that most of the elongation and wear is at the mouth so you can use trimmed brass a decent amount, wish I had written down the name of the book, the local library has so many books on reloading.
so while the case trimmer is out can you trim 10mm cases that have cracked mouths to .40 like 357/38spl and of course this is all academic since fresh brass for .40 isn't by any means scarce and for that matter I often wind up leaving the range with 10 or so .40 cases picked up with my .45s, it would just be interesting to know that it could be done in a pinch if push came to shove.

mrapathy2000
June 8, 2006, 04:52 AM
could you guys stop the thread hijack and start pming each other or start a new thread

elric
June 8, 2006, 12:47 PM
I plan to start out with a Lee Pro 1000 progressive press and as I become confident with 9mm and I just buy anther Lee Pro 1000 for .40 and 10mm reloading use.

Just a comment from my firsthand experience ... I started reloading in the early 90s with a Lee Pro 1000 in 9mm. I'd have to recommend against that press. It was fine at first, when it was all new and tight, but after several thousand rounds all the pot metal and aluminum started wearing and loosening up, and the thing just didn't work that well anymore. Primer feed was awful and the shellplate autoindexer thing got real touchy. Got real frustrating to try to make decent ammo as the thing kept getting sloppier and sloppier.

Looking back I should have started with a nice solid single stage, like the RCBS I use for rifle these days. Would have prevented a lot of frustration. Get a high quality progressive later once you learn the basics.


Are you the hartzpad I remember from audiworld? If so, think of the Pro 1000 as a Kia ... it'll get you there, and the warranty will fix it ('cause it will break), but you'll always wish you had bought the Audi (Dillon, RCBS) instead. :)


Oh, and 40 and 10mm are easier to reload than 9mm in my experience, since the thin tapered wall of the 9mm can be finicky sometimes.

Good luck!

P.S. Anybody want the remains of a well used pro 1000? :D

helpwanted
June 8, 2006, 01:13 PM
Starting reloading with a high pressure cartridge and a progressive: recipe for disaster.

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