I saw this gun on a documentary about the Beslan school massacre when Muslim terrorists murdered children in their classrooms.
The school now has armed guards and they could be plainly seen carrying the following AK variant.
Clearly an AK action with black plastic furniture. The stock was fixed with the longitudinal "dimple" on each side, the fore grip was also black plastic, but there was no "over-grip" behind the gas tube as with a standard AK.
There was also a prominent gas regulator, and the gas vent tube did not sit high above the barrel, in fact it was so close to the barrel that the plastic grip covered it. Made for a very clean, neat looking carbine - oh yes it had maybe a 12 or 14 inch barrel, no more.
Anyone know what it is.
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June 12, 2006, 12:06 AM
Its probably the new AN94 (Abakan). Its supposed to be the latest encarnation of the AK74. Sorry, not much info.
Heres a link http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,14632,Soldiertech_AN94,,00.html
June 12, 2006, 12:17 AM
From Max's site - the AN94 (http://world.guns.ru/assault/as08-e.htm). Was this the weapon you saw?
June 12, 2006, 12:20 AM
I checked out every AK variant on this site
and none of them matched what I saw.
One distinctive feature was that gas regulator. It had a very large circular end piece with a notch cut in it so that you could use a straight edge to turn it - just like an H&K.
Very different from the standard AK, the nearest description I could give is that the forward part of the weapon looked like an elongated MP5 or an HK53.
June 12, 2006, 12:26 AM
Sorry rbernie just saw your response.
No, while the stock and receiver were the same (usual AK safety lever) - the forward part of the weapon is totally different - definitely not an AK94.
The plastic foregrip was smooth, no ribs, and it extended almost all the way to the barrel - giving it a very smooth profile, like an extended MP5, especially without that prominent gas tube that the older AKs have.
ps- The front handguards you're describing sound a lot like a Saiga. Are you familiar with that make?
June 12, 2006, 09:51 AM
If the weapon you saw didn't have the usual curved AK magazine jutting out of the bottom of the receiver I am going to venture a guess that what you saw was a 9X18 caliber Bizon submachine gun.
June 12, 2006, 05:47 PM
I couldn't see the mag, but the reciver was pure AK.
With thanks to SpookyPistolero - this weapon as linked previously, looks to be close in appearence, the stock and reciever are perfect but the fore end still has an over-guard on the gas tube though, not quite right.
Sorry guys, I really shouldn't ask without a photo, my bad.
June 12, 2006, 10:11 PM
Could they have been carrying the AK based submachine gun, the PP-19 Bison. It is based off the AK action, with black furniture and an awkward forend and helical mag rig.
June 13, 2006, 02:04 PM
Sorry it's not the PP-19 either, I'm going to try and get a screen shot of some kind.
Now it's really bugging me :banghead:
June 13, 2006, 09:05 PM
HMMMM...... mabey a .410 bore SAIGA
If you fit that with a polymer AK funiture
looks like what you describe kina.....
June 14, 2006, 12:36 PM
DING, DING, DING - A WINNER !!!!
With congratulations to MagnumCaliber357, it was THIS one:
The plastic furniture, short barrel, the prominent round gas block just above the barrel, the lack of a gas tube, the AK receiver - it was THAT gun.
That's incredible though, a short barrelled .410 automatic - what a weird choice for a security guard - or is that gun also available in rifle calibers.
Great job with the ID.
June 14, 2006, 12:56 PM
It was most likely the .410 version. If I recall correctly, the Russians have adopted shotguns in .410 and 10 gauge.
June 14, 2006, 06:13 PM
Buzz, 12 gauge. Man, I wish there was a 10 ga. Saiga. That would be cool.
June 15, 2006, 10:19 AM
Correia, if memory serves, the Russians adopted the .410 as their standard shotgun caliber, but also have a 10 gauge that they use for special occasions. It's a pump shorty. Ouch.
I need to review Charlie Cutshaw's The New World of Russian Small Arms and Ammunition to be certain.
June 15, 2006, 10:42 AM
Gotcha, I was thinking of Saigas.
June 15, 2006, 01:00 PM
But a .410 as an armed security guards weapon ?
Maybe I'm missing something, I thought the .410 was something of a "fun" round - not generally regarded as a serious defensive caliber by a wide stretch of the imagination.
June 15, 2006, 01:10 PM
I would think Saiga or VEPR As far as the an94 goes. Those cant be had by us can they? Also, can anyone identify the AK at the bottom of this pic