The process of making a cylinder!


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Third_Rail
June 13, 2006, 12:31 AM
We've decided to make a series of photos, showing steps from raw material to finished product in making a cylinder.


Here's photo #1.


http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=41085&stc=1&d=1150169369

That's a full $600 worth of raw material - our cost. This is the highest quality maraging steel money can purchase, which is why it's the steel we use. One section of this steel will become a .58 caliber cylinder.


More to come soon. :)

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carebear
June 13, 2006, 01:17 AM
So it's like rebar right? :evil:

What's the diameter of the stock?

Third_Rail
June 13, 2006, 01:55 AM
2.25" +.002, -.000, I believe. Certain on the 2.25" diameter, not certain on the manufacturer's tolerance.


And yeah, it's just like big rebar. Go try it with rebar! :evil:

RyanM
June 13, 2006, 02:38 AM
Expensive stuff. For that price, I'm guessing the tolerances are a wee bit tighter than that. $104 per foot junk (17-4 stainless, annealed centerless ground) has +/-0.003" tolerances. So 3 times as much variation, for 1/6th the price.

Third_Rail
June 13, 2006, 02:51 AM
Expensive stuff.
Quality of materials and workmanship is absolutely our top priority.



Re: tolerances, like I said, I'm not certain. I'll ask later today....


Thinking about it, I may have just assumed that it was +.002 -.000; it may very well be that the tolerance is in tenths of thous.

Manyirons
June 13, 2006, 04:11 AM
Its +- .015! Precision comes AFTER tha MANN does his business. Aint made for shafting, made for turning INTO parts.

And yep! Tha piece that got cut yesterday from this is about 100.00 and tha MANN said; when its YOUR money, you can cut it, not before! I DO gets ta carry it! Hell, tha raw material here is worth morein my house! So tha cylinder AFORE its done is 100.00 worth of steel. And ya wonder why some things cost so much?

Somethin like eighteen varieties of steels here, from AIRMETS ta 465 Carpenter stainless.ALL of em priced like gold. I get ta look at tha specs and theys all strong strong strong!

Thom

Up for his 3am shot!

Gewehr98
June 14, 2006, 01:07 AM
Known for excellent machining qualities (the Soviets used it in applications for their military and space programs where they didn't need the ultimate strength, but did need the machineability), but with hardly any carbon in the mix, it still needs a good old-fashioned heat-treat, or I'd wager you aren't going to be making Colt Walker cylinders outta the stuff.

It's also a wonderful material for constructing gas centrifuges when enriching Uranium Hexaflouride, modifying the U235/U238 ratio for nuclear weapons or submarine fuel. Be careful how much of the stuff you order and buy, you may get some unwanted attention. ;)

4v50 Gary
June 14, 2006, 01:25 AM
Wow! .58 caliber revolver to boot? Geez. That's big bore and superior steel.

Third_Rail
June 14, 2006, 01:33 AM
Gewehr98 - I don't believe it's quite the same material as the steel the USSR was using. I would post more details, but I don't think giving away business secrets to be wise! :)


4v50 Gary - Jule, the smith, is a wild man when it comes to smokepoles. A .50 caliber ROA is a regular carry piece for him, I gather.

Gewehr98
June 14, 2006, 01:41 AM
- I don't believe it's quite the same material as the steel the USSR was using.

Hypothetically speaking, there were aircrews tasked to retrieve post-impact fragments of Soviet MIRVs in the Pacific Broad Ocean Area in the late 1980s and early 1990s, then once back at home drome they got to see the alloys come off the subsequent molecular analysis like a who's who of metallurgy. Neat stuff, and now that a certain crew dawg's retired from active duty I wish I had my own ion microprobe and X-ray diffractometer. (I used the latter once to verify Oregon Trail Lazer Cast bullets did indeed have silver in them, but only in trace amounts)

Third_Rail
June 14, 2006, 02:23 AM
I do stand corrected! :)


That's why I love this place, never stop learning...

Manyirons
June 14, 2006, 10:33 AM
Tha MANN reminds that simply bein soviets didnt make them stupid, jus misguided.

We can thank them fer tha scandium alloys and likely much more we jus dont wanna!

And yep, heat treated ta be sure! like 300,000 psi worth! Ya see, them cylinder walls aint whatcha might call THICK, and tha MANN believes in redundancy! In particular when it come ta safety margins.

Gewehr98
June 14, 2006, 11:22 PM
And yep, heat treated ta be sure! like 300,000 psi worth! Ya see, them cylinder walls aint whatcha might call THICK, and tha MANN believes in redundancy! In particular when it come ta safety margins.


Every time I look at how thin the cylinder walls are on my S&W 696 L-Frame .44 Special I thank Gawd for proper metallurgy and heat treatment! :what:

Third_Rail
June 15, 2006, 12:09 AM
Here's the cylinder cut, center drilled, indexed, and it's ready for boring! :)

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=41152&stc=1&d=1150340944

pohill
June 15, 2006, 08:25 AM
Has it ever been determined how much strength a cartridge adds to a cylinder chamber? 10%, 40%, etc. In a cap & ball, the powder explodes directly in the chamber; in a cartridge revolver, it explodes in the casing which is inside the chamber.
I know, one of those questions from a metal/ballistically challenged shooter...

Manyirons
June 15, 2006, 08:34 AM
Answer! Less than 1.0%. Case wall bein thin have one job, maintain tha integrety o tha assembly (I paraphrase my mentor here) otherwise, all tha actual STRENGTH is in tha cartridge case HEAD and area there. Prevents gas from escapin. A brass case .015 or so thick aint strong!

Try findin a powder charge that WONT burst tha case ifin it were outta tha gun and propellin tha slug even a little ways, dont think you can.

carpettbaggerr
June 20, 2006, 02:41 AM
Less talk. More Pictures!

Chop chop

:evil:

Third_Rail
June 20, 2006, 03:04 AM
I've been out of state for a bit - I should be getting more pictures soon. :)

Duncaninfrance
June 20, 2006, 04:41 AM
How to build your own Black Powder ICBM in 3 easy stages :D !!!
No - don't hit me Thom, I am only joking but more pics would be nice. Ouch, now that was uncalled for TR :uhoh:
Duncan

gmatov
June 21, 2006, 04:03 AM
The MANN notwithstanding, I don't believe you guys with the 600 bucks for half a foot of your "supersteel".

It is not a supersteel, it is available to anyone. If you have a machine that csn do what the MANN can do, a good lathe will do, with a decent index table, and a few cutters, a cyl can be made.

I don't degrade the MANN, I still don't like the way you 2 are trying to push his product. You sound like Ron Popiel, the "Vegematic" guy, selling trash.

If Jule, pronounced Yuleh, is using you to move his product, no matter how good it is, he is making a big mistake. Hell, I don't know if either of you even SHOOTS BP. You both sound like shills, "Gots to talk to the MANN to answer that."

Man, either learn the product or move on to one that you do know, like Play-Doh.

Cheers,

George

Third_Rail
June 21, 2006, 07:59 AM
The MANN notwithstanding, I don't believe you guys with the 600 bucks for half a foot of your "supersteel".

It is not a supersteel, it is available to anyone. If you have a machine that csn do what the MANN can do, a good lathe will do, with a decent index table, and a few cutters, a cyl can be made.

I don't degrade the MANN, I still don't like the way you 2 are trying to push his product. You sound like Ron Popiel, the "Vegematic" guy, selling trash.

If Jule, pronounced Yuleh, is using you to move his product, no matter how good it is, he is making a big mistake. Hell, I don't know if either of you even SHOOTS BP. You both sound like shills, "Gots to talk to the MANN to answer that."

Man, either learn the product or move on to one that you do know, like Play-Doh.

Cheers,

George

George,


Sorry you feel that way - you don't have to use any of our products, of course. :)


EDIT: I truly feel that I must add more here.... while remaining civil, do you have any proof or reason why we are lying? $600 isn't exactly out of the ordinary for good 2.25" diameter maraging steel.


Like I said, though, you don't have to use any of our products. If you don't personally believe that they are worth your money, that's just fine with me. They are, however, quite obviously worth your time, as you seem persistant in your unfounded complaints.


To everyone else - another picture is forthcoming.

Manyirons
June 21, 2006, 09:29 AM
George!

Still needin attention are ya? Tha MANN himself talked to ya and yer not enough of a gentleman ta even mention tha point.

As ta yer "complaints" mentioned them this mornin to him. HE suggested that WE stay to tha HIGHROAD, and let YOU keep on your lowroad path by yerself.

An i DONT have tha keyboard ta do it but its more like that little mark over tha E, SOFT not EH.

Tinker2
June 21, 2006, 03:29 PM
Interesting information on Maraging Steel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maraging_steel

http://www.key-to-steel.com/Articles/Art103.htm


Tinker2

Duncaninfrance
June 21, 2006, 04:00 PM
Everyone has the facility to press the 'Report Post' icon if they feel that someone is not playing the game and there are 2 modorators who can act if necessary. I for one have no problems with 'product info' on this site. I can ignore it if I like or I can read it - no one MAKES ME DO IT.

It reminds me of a tale from my home area.
An American (sorry) was walking down the road when he saw a local rolling a grey/green material in his fingers and dropping the resulting ball into a bucket.
"What ya got there pard?" said the yank.
"Learning Pills" said the Yorkshireman.
"How much are they?" asked Hank.
"$4 each" said the local.
So the yank bought 2 and ate one. "Ugh!, they taste just like sheep ****" he exclaimed.
"Tha's learnin" said the Yorkshireman!

Sometimes you have to try things to learn about them; opinions are part of the process and questions add to the knowledge levels but bare rudeness is not worthy of an inquisitive mind.
If you can't be civil then don't be heard.
Duncan

Manyirons
June 21, 2006, 04:39 PM
Duncan!

Said it better than i could! Englishmen always better at this sort of cool wit thing than i am!

More comin soon, tha MANN has been nursin those bad discs in back.

gmatov
June 22, 2006, 03:07 AM
I DID say "The MANN notwistanding."

That means I would believe what HE says, and you're right, I spoke with somebody, I presume it was he. At least he had a greater grasp of his subject than you guys seem to.

A Google search found a site selling 250 grade for 243 bucks per half foot, to 350 grade for 325 or so, and it is minus nothing, plus .031.

I speak Serbian, so don't need you to teach me what the eh sound is. We do not pronounce it as "AY" as you seem to think I did, as the Canadians and just this side of the border pipple do.

It's on the Forum, I am as entitled to read and respond as any other member is. I only think that you guys are pushing a little hard. Jule does not come across as you 2 do in your spiels. Try a little less hard. Give us the facts, save your enthusiastic rants. Clear the stuff with Jule, for Pete's sake.

And, for your information, the "j" is pronounced as a "y" in my forbear's tongue, as in Jugoslavia, it is Yugoslavia here.

I am not totally down on your products, or the MANN's. I could be interested in the original swaged bullet, if I saw some reports of how they performed. NOT the moulds for the cast version. I have learned I don't have the time, as of now, to devote to casting, no matter how little time it actually takes to cast a few hundred.

Been busy, bad back and all (yes, I have at least as much back trouble as Jule has, I had to retire because of it( with my kid's new house, teaching her husband how to fix this or that. Hell, he called me a few hours ago to tell me he has a big problem, the alarm has sounded to tell him the pump to his sand mound sewage system has gone off. 6 month old 500 buck pump, with a 3 year warranty seems to not be working.

One more thing to interfere with my shooting. Can't get the time to get enough shooting in. 7 days a week of no work, 1 day a week of actual shooting, and that with a range in the back yard, at least a 20 foot high pile of dirt to shoot into, with 2 acres of their own land behind it.

I've b'marked your new forum page, don't know if I will be welcome there, it IS your own page, if you don't like me, you can just deny me access. I don't just as a matter of course badmouth people or products. I DO argue with people saying things that are exaggerations or just downright untruths.

I'll try to sign up there, may lurk a while, unless there is anything I can contribute. Hell, the other forums are getting to be dead, particularly TFL. NOONE is posting there, anymore. About 3 days of downtime, all dead.

Cheers,
George

Smokin_Gun
June 22, 2006, 03:20 AM
Hell Goerge I haven't seen ya down home in the forum starte worryin' 'bout ya...I guess you're ok from what I can tell. Stop in and say hi we been busy there...
Hope that pump ain't gone south and you don't have to work on it...
See ya when there George...
;)

Manyirons
June 22, 2006, 09:05 AM
GEORGE!

Tha BOSS DONT use discount grade UNCERTIFIED material. Or didnt ya know about that? An mebbe in george's world magnafluxin, x-ray and a buncha other testin comes fer free, but it dont on planet earth. Or didya think safety and insurin someone's cylinder is RIGHT unimportant?

And i DONT need tha language lesson, ya see, i LIVE right on tha bosses property, get all i can handle here!

And while yer complainin, i DONT see ya coming up WITH A BETTER WAY ta PROMOTE i'd call it mentionin tha products fer him. unless ya got more'n hot air ta sell yerself, and bein such an expert on EVERTHIN why're ya not helpin instead of complainin? Remind me of one o those guys that tells ya HOW yer doing it wrong diggin that ditch but aint doin sqaut themselves.

An tha BOSS decides whos welcome on tha forum, not me, not third rail. An right now i dont know ifin yer welcome!

Third_Rail
June 22, 2006, 11:44 AM
Getting back on topic...

Here's the cylinder in process, next to an 1858 Remington cylinder, and compared to the revolver it will be going on.

The cylinder is bored .500, the accuracy of the boring re: degrees has been confirmed, and the next step is to rebate the cylinder.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=41409&stc=1&d=1150987466

Next time you see this revolver, it'll be solid frame, not open top! The barrel, rammer, arbor, cylinder, and other parts will be discarded, and it will look like quite an interesting piece indeed!

carebear
June 22, 2006, 11:56 AM
Wouldn't it have been better to get the rebate on the cylinder BEFORE you paid all that money? :D

How much of the original revo is left or reuseable after the modifications? At what point does it become cheaper/easier to start the whole construction from scratch?

Third_Rail
June 22, 2006, 12:10 PM
carebear - I will pass these questions on to Jule! :)

Smokin_Gun
June 22, 2006, 02:29 PM
Damn Third_Rail that is one massive monster...can't wait to see the finished Revolver/cannon. It seemingly will dwarf the Dragoon. I take it that the .500 Bertha will have a round barrel and choice of fixed or adjustable sites? Just askin' I know it's still in the cylinder stages, but it gets exciting to imagine a finnished product. I know this is a cart gun, but any thoughts about a .50 C&B? Probly not an eventful thought with having the ability to ream a 1858 out and shoot .464" balls. But I had to ask...
Keep pluggin' BigIron Barrel Works ... it's a free forum or so I have heard. I think the reports are interesting and keep following them. Also good to see another forum out there i.e. BigIron Works Forum.

Manyirons
June 22, 2006, 03:02 PM
Its GONNA be a .58 caliber! Tha .500 is jus ta check accuracy of tha borin, will be cut out more, an finally end up at .585/.586 in tha chambers.

Manyirons
June 22, 2006, 03:03 PM
Oh ya! it'll STILL be a cap&ball, AND no CART gun, it'l be LIGHTER than a Dragoon!

Smokin_Gun
June 22, 2006, 07:06 PM
How did I know I was gonna hear I'd need to have one a these to go with my 1863 Remington .58 Zouave ... LoL! Will 500gr minnies be to heavy for it?

Manyirons
June 22, 2006, 07:38 PM
Round ball .595-.600 or 440 grain bullet designed for it, solid AN h.p. Yer mines are too small in diameter.

gmatov
June 23, 2006, 01:40 AM
Smoke,

Not needed there, Wayner has it under control, been there everyday, when I can contribute, I will.

Specially like the argument that Wayner has about the ball fitting the grooves.

Manyirons,

Livin' near the man don't mean you can speak as he does. I understand the inflections, they are in my language, too, I don't think they are in your native Ohioese. You guys are just as unable to speak any other dialect than the Cleveland Browns are.

I don't sell anything, I don''t get into promotion, I have no idea how you push a new product. I DO know that, as I said, you sound like Ron Popiel and the Veg-e-matic. And Third_rail, ditto. TOO enthusiastic. If Jule has a product that is viable, great, I'd like to hear some specifics, not your claptrap about how FANTASTIC this is. I don't think you guys, as YOU, are qualified to promote his product.

AGAIN, IF it was he I spoke with a couple weeks ago, and you gotta remember, he woke me a few hours before I normally get up, he did think you were juist a leetle bit too enthusiastic, but, you know, they are young..

And, y'know, if it is the BOSS who determines who is welcome and who is not, and I am not, I think I will survive. Forums have a habit of becoming boring or just plain uninteresting. I have stopped going to a good number of them for that reason, purely uninteresting.

Your's might just prove to be the same.

A quick perusal has not seen a single post headed by Jule, just Manyirons and Third_rail. So, who's in charge of the website? Doesn't sound like Jule.

Cheers,

George

Third_Rail
June 23, 2006, 02:22 AM
George, get your eyes checked. Who do you think "the captain" is? He doesn't like public forums because of idiots - since BigIron Barrel Works' forum is new, few idiots are there, thus he posts. You can quite easily tell which posts are his by all the hyphens and capital letters where they shouldn't be.

As long as you remain civil, you are more than welcome there! :)


Do note, we do want facts to back up any arguments, i.e. how is it of the same quality, are the tolerances the same, accuracy, etc. Just an example.

Manyirons
June 23, 2006, 09:01 AM
George!

Jus WHERE did ya see posts by me? Seein things where they aint? Been busy and hadda have a different e-mail account made cause i dont mail much.

And i AINT posted on tha new site yet! I AINT RON POPEIL, dont sell gimmicky rubbish and i aint seen NOTHIN from you yet but compainin.

Gotta problem? SHOW ME a better way and i'll try it.

And get yer eyes checked! Ifin yer seein my MANYIRONS moniker on tha new site, yer seein things and they calls that delusions or somethin like it.

And IF ya been on tha new site ya SHOULDA seen cept for those bad i eyes i spose, product review fer tha bullets. No hot air, jus real products.

gmatov
June 23, 2006, 11:49 PM
Smoke,

Lucked out with the pump, the plastic plumbing is held together, the check valve, with Fernco rubber couplings. One popped loose, lifted the lid, told the boy to take the couplings off, scratch the smooth, shiny plastic pipe pretty good and crank down on the clamps with a ratchet rather than a screwdriver this time. Should all be well, after this. Fortunately, the cover is just 2 inches or so under the ground, hell, the hoop is visible through the grass that is just starting to grow.

Back where I posted about the maraging steels I had found the prices for, did you happen to see the mention I made of the price? 250 grade for 243 bucks per half foot, 325 for 350 grade?

Mebbe I should say that was kind of an apology for doubting your price of 600 bucks worth of steel. I don't know what the length of your pictured piece was, but, at 2.25 diameter, it looks to be over 6 inches, although the perspective, end on, doesn't make it easy to determine.

I think I was wrong to doubt that remark. I think it is ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS that it could be so high, and the site I went to doubles the price for double the length, trebles for triple, etc. In other words, 1 foot costs a buck, 100 feet costs 100 bucks. No quantity discount, at least there.

That means this pistol is going to have a hellacious price. That doesn't mean there will be no market for it. Not for me, if I want my arm broke, or sore, I'll just go back to my Smith and Ruger 44 mags. Smith's a 6 1/2 inch, kicks more than my 10 1/2 inch Ruger. But, I don't like shooting cartridge any more. Box of shells goes in 20 minutes or so, even with checking the tatgets. Progressive reloader means I can replace that box in 5 minutes.

I'd rather take 20 minutes to shoot 2 C&Bs twice each. Yeah, near 10 minutes to reload 2 cylinders. WAY more fun. Think I don't even want a bench loader, any more. Too much fun doin' it the traditional way. Cappin's a pain, buit what the hell?

Actually, the eyes AIN'T the best, do need new glasses, but that's okay, don't mind that you both mention it. Would have sworn I saw both your names there.

Cheers,

George

Smokin_Gun
June 24, 2006, 03:36 AM
The Gods smiled on you George glad all went well...some days are better than others and this good deed you done was rewarded as you done it...

Anyone wants to they can quote that...LoL!

Catch up with ya George take care.

pohill
June 24, 2006, 09:23 AM
"It reminds me of a tale from my home area.
An American (sorry) was walking down the road..."

So you won't have to apologize next time when talking about people eating sheep ****, don't use an American as a story subject. Of all the peoples of all the countries of the world, We do not eat sheep **** (yes, the W in We is capitalized).

Manyirons
June 24, 2006, 09:45 AM
Hey! I eats mutton! I gots a diabetic er not SEEFOOD diet. I sees food, i eats it! Ifin it aint strugglin too much its lunch!

pohill
June 24, 2006, 10:07 AM
Don't think he was talking about mutton...

Manyirons
June 24, 2006, 10:22 AM
Ta me, sheepies is mutton. But i got it POHILL!

Third_Rail
June 24, 2006, 11:19 AM
George, for a .58 caliber revolver, $1400 isn't any huge price!


Try to get it at that price at this quality by anyone else. Not going to happen!

Duncaninfrance
June 24, 2006, 07:04 PM
Well I have to say it dear boy, a story is a story. I have also seen and read lots of Bull **** since I started to contribute to THR, TFL & TMF but I take it with a pinch of salt.

The same American asked the local how big his farm was because he (the yank) took 2 days to drive round his spread back in Texas.
"Aye" said the Yorkshireman, "I had a car like that once"!

Smile - you use fewer muscles than frowning!!
Duncan

Owen
June 24, 2006, 10:04 PM
$600 is a bit steep. As of 6.24.2006, Onlinemetals.com has a variety of maraging steel in 2.25 inch bar, 6" lengths, for $200 to $220 dollars (all orders over $100 get 10% off)

Also, what is it about this steel that has lead you to decide that it is the best steel for the job? Compared to the steels our grandfathers had to use, even lowly 4140 is light years ahead of anything they had, including 4140.

There are dozens of less expensive steels that are more than up to the job.

Third_Rail
June 24, 2006, 10:25 PM
owen, I'll not go into too much detail, but it boils down to the fact that Jule simple buys the best. You can buy cheaper maraging steel, but it may have an inclusion or other flaw. He could get away with using 4140, but then it wouldn't be as strong.

In any case, if he wants to use the best steel that he can get for what he wants to make, it's his prerogative. :)

RyanM
June 24, 2006, 11:43 PM
Those jokes can use any country, and often do. Like one joke, I've read 2 different versions. Australia is the butt of the joke in one version, Poland in the other. Actually, I think I'll post that one in the Big Iron Barrel Works forum.

And me at least, I can definitely understand Jule's use of the best quality stuff. Me, I never do a half-*** job. Sometimes I do a poor job, but that's not the same thing. Everything I do, I do with both cheeks, yessiree!

gmatov
June 26, 2006, 12:11 AM
$1400 bucks just might NOT be a steep price for a 58 cal pistol.

Forget the guy who was making a 50 cal. Have a couple replies in my e-mail, asked him about the chamber-barrel sizes. His were some 950 on your pistol, I think. Mebbe on his pistol, 5 or 6 on yours.

So there are them who will spend a couple week's pay on 'em. Last time I did that was 30 years or more ago. After that, I already had all the "good" guns I needed. Still got 'em.

Gotta admit, most of mine, at a couple weeks pay, were less'n 300 bucks, back then. Bein' an old guy, retired, don't think I'd pay half a month's pension for a 50 or a 58 pistol anymore. Just more to leave behind down the road, to them who won't appreciate them. Got too much of that now.

No argument with anyone else who wants to try one. I'm too old and puny to shoot something like that.

Just got back a few hours ago

from a Soccer Tourney 150 miles North. Granddaughter's team played. Lost the first game, won the next 2, team that beat us was tied with us, but since they beat us, they went to the Finals, we went home. Fantastic weekend. All done, now, they don't have a U-16 league, gotta watch her in high school play.

On the Voy site (don't wanna go back there, just now ) guys are talking about the "Broken Trail" mini-series. Watched the last half, immediate repeat, watching the first half and the rest of it. Pretty damned good.

Can you believe "Lowell", from "Wings" as the co-star?

Cheers,

George

Smokin_Gun
June 26, 2006, 01:59 AM
Lowell and Dovall make a pretty good team in this one...lookin' forward to tomorrow nite's.

gmatov
June 27, 2006, 01:51 AM
Smoke,

Tomorrow nite's has come and gone, and I liked it. And I liked Lowell's rendition of his part. Never in a couple hundfed years woulda thunk he could be a viable actor in this kind of movie. I LIKED IT. Just plain liked it. And, Duvall DID find a new use for a croquet mallet, no? Beat the sumbitch to death, "Don't hurt my kids!"

Then cut his ears off and send them to that sheriff who said he would wear them on his watch chain.

Good movie. You DO know they were all '73s in the movie, even though the rifles were all, or most of them, brass "Yellowboys"? No forestock, etc.

Cheers,

George

gmatov
June 27, 2006, 02:33 AM
As to the steel, I have no idea in hell why "aged" "martensitic" steel should be so expensive.

To allow anybody who makes a link from it to say "Hey, it costs like 100 bucks a pound, you gots to pay for it!"?

BP normally goes in the 8000 psi range, properly loaded. Abel and Noble DID manage to get way over 100 thou psi in abnormal loading conditions.

Others on other sites say you ain't gonna get all that much more velocity, anyway, even if you CAN shove 50% more powder in the chambers. Volumetric efficiency. You can't burn it all in the chamber/cylinder, got a big BOOM outside the barrel, the excess powder. NOT gonna go 3000 FPS with a round ball, nor a BOOLIT. IF you did, you got the same problem cast bullet shooters do with centerfire, leading when you go too fast, with a too soft alloy.

Then, you decide to harden the alloy, you got higher pressures in the BP guns, and you don't have obturation, mushing the ball, so you fire cut the ball at the niches and corners of the rifling. There goes your accuracy, again.

Making a big gun for the sake of making a big gun might be a good thing for you. Once upon a time they had the "Howdah Gun", big muthas for use on the back of an elephant just in case a tiger got THAT close. Think it was the one Michael Douglas used in "The Ghost and the Darkness".

Show me a little more about this thing. Right now, it looks like you are completely redesigning the original pistol, WAY larger cylinder, no room for it in the original frame, so must be entirely reengineered. ie, no way in hell it can look like a traditional BP revolver.

That would be a good reason to charge so much for it. It is not an add on. It is a totally new manufacture. If the rest of it is not of modern high strength steel, I would feel ripped off.

Everything about this seems to go against physics. You make such a large calibre, such a large dia cylinder, you move the thrust point so high that it HAS to recoil a ton, and none of it can be a traditional BP revolver. If it were even remotely patterned after any cap and ball revolver, it would have to look like a pregnant whale..

Ah, well,
Cheers,

George

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