Too close for comfort


June 18, 2006, 04:30 AM
Let me tell a short story about how great milwaukee is: I'm watching TV at 2:00 am on a sunday. All of the sudden i hear a lot of shouting coming from outside. I mute the TV and go out on the porch to see what was going on. I see a large group of males, both white and black standing in front of a house across the street. About 60 yards away. The group is split in two and both sides are yelling at each other. All of the sudden half of the group walks away down the sidewalk still exchanging words with the other half. 2 members of the group that walked away then turn around and pull guns out of their waistbands. They begin running at the group still at the house yelling "I'm gunna air you out". The members of the group near the house either turn around or run. The guys with the guns then begin smashing in windows on cars in the streets (with their pistols!). By this time I'm sure 90% of the rest of the people on my block, including myself, had called 911 and were watching the situation. The guys with guns start waving their guns in the air while yelling at the rest of the group. Then the sirens started approaching and everyone ran or drove off. I had sent everyone to the other side of the house (farthest from the street), got my little black protection device, and was watching the situation from what i thought was the most concealed location possible. To my dissmay, my roomate managed to snap a couple pictures, effectively ruining my concealment... But here they are. It was a solid 10-12 minutes from when i called 911 to when the cops showed up. So to answer in advance, no, i wasnt doing that when the cops were around.

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June 18, 2006, 04:46 AM
Just curious, what if anything did the police do?

I think this city is getting worse; we had 28 (reported) shootings over memorial day weekend. Thankfully most of the thugs are not proficient with guns.

June 18, 2006, 05:16 AM
by the time they got there everyone was gone, i went out to talk to them and gave the the vehicle description and the description of the guys with guns. the cops didnt seem to care much though since no one actually got shot... sad

and to answer questions in advance, all the lights are off in the house and the doors are locked. I'm on the second floor watching the situation at an extreme angle, the odds of me being spotted were practically nil. My roomate sure did get reemed out after the situation expired. and no, i did not plan on taking pot shots at the guys across the street. they kept running across the street and into my yard, i was simply making sure that i had a full idea of what was going on, and if they deemed it necesssary to enter my house, they would quickly find out that it was the wrong decision. By hiding in my house, like some people in other forums have suggested, i wouldve lost tactical control of my situation. in my position, i knew the exact location of everyone who was a possible threat and could make my decisions accordingly. fortunatly for everyone involved, my only decision was whether to go back to watching tv or to go to bed after i got done talking to the cops.

June 18, 2006, 06:36 AM

And +1 again for good trigger discipline.

Sad to say that other neighbors weren't out to talk to the police.

June 18, 2006, 08:22 AM
What possible reason would your roommate have to take a picture of YOU at a time like this? Just curious.

June 18, 2006, 08:53 AM
Well, jondar, his roommate probably thought it was a cool 'Kodak Moment' and didn't think about the consequences.

June 18, 2006, 08:57 AM
Why did your room mate do what they did - taking a pic, turning on a light, giving away your position and status.

I have ran into the same situation w/ my wife, story follows:
It was about 2:00 am on a Sunday night-Monday a.m, I heard what I thought was my truck door slamming shut. :eek: I jumped-up, went out into the yard. My wife got up and turned on the porch light giving away my position and the fact that I was unarmed. No one was found around my truck, nothing was missing. :uhoh:

She gave me no back-up, and broke up the element of surprise in my favor.

I quess if you haven't had any training, that is what should be expected. :banghead:

June 18, 2006, 09:07 AM
Ahh, the joys of cibig city life. And to think I passed that big city, over crowded type of area up - twice.

Glad all are ok. maybe, just maybe this would be a hint to relocate one's dwelling place.

June 18, 2006, 12:36 PM
My roomate: "Dude this is awesome" *SNAP*
Me:"***? knock it off man!"
My roomate: *snap* (hand in picture telling him to get back.)
Me: Ok if you do that again I might shoot you. Now get back man, this isnt safe.

everyones good, a cop came by at about 8 this morning, i guess they stopped the car and got the gun a few blocks from here. wanted to know if i could maybe do a photo array of the guy with gun. Sadly i couldnt.

June 18, 2006, 12:49 PM
Not a darn thing wrong with assuming a good defensive posture when the crapola is possibly going to hit the fan outside your house. If shooting had started, some of those guys could have tried to enter your place seeking cover, putting you in grave danger.

Good job. smack your roommate though and confiscate his camera.

June 18, 2006, 03:11 PM
Better idea would be to tell the roomate WHY taking a picture with the flash (without the flash, while probably not good for picture quality, would generally be fine) was a bad idea at that time.

Man, I hope I never have gunfights outside my house. What's wrong with these kids? Where are the parents? :P

June 18, 2006, 03:19 PM
WEEDWHACKER - "...Where are the parents? "

In jail?? :uhoh:


June 18, 2006, 04:14 PM
Good posture and trigger control. Sounds like you did everything right, except give your room mate a swift kick in the posterior.
I trust you were very explicit as to why he should not have done what he did.

June 18, 2006, 04:26 PM
thanks guys :D

June 18, 2006, 05:04 PM
I have a quick question for those more tactically astute than myself... You were on the second floor, which would be the best place to be for observation, and probably be the best place to be if lead should start flying. What should you do, though, in the aforementioned scenario that has some of those being shot at breaking down your door, looking for an escape? Run downstairs and try to repel boarders? Stake out the top of the stairway and wait for any that try to ascend?

Or would it be better to observe from a ground-floor hide?

June 18, 2006, 05:27 PM
Just curious: whereabouts in Milwaukee do you live (north side, northwest, south side, southwest, etc)?

June 18, 2006, 09:03 PM
thats some serious stuff man. good you didnt get involved. and as dumb as ur roomie was for revealing you position, its still a good picture to go along with the story as stated before + for trigger control

quick question. what did u have loaded, plain ball?

June 18, 2006, 09:15 PM
What should you do, though, in the aforementioned scenario that has some of those being shot at breaking down your door, looking for an escape? Run downstairs and try to repel boarders? Stake out the top of the stairway and wait for any that try to ascend?

At the farthest point from the top of the stairway that would give you a clear shot at anyone coming up it. From that position, you can take the first guy, maybe the second guy, as they're coming up and off balance, and be in a good position to get the third and fourth through the wall or the floor. #3 and #4 can't shoot back, because all they'll see is the guys in front of them getting perforated. Knowing criminals, they'll almost certainly run away after that.

June 18, 2006, 09:41 PM
I would be tempted to stomp the roommate’s camera so he really gets the message. :evil:

The flash not only could have blinded you but could have been seen as a threat from the guys with guns outside sending lead your way. :cuss:

You need to move Dude.

June 18, 2006, 11:44 PM
ceetee: I live in the upper of a duplex, i dont have a downstairs part. :D In that pic, im literally 5 steps away from my front door, which is at the top of a staircase that goes directly to the front of the house.

Monkeyleg: i live on the east side, north of downtown, south of shorewood. aka the "up and coming" riverwest area. About 3 blocks south of UW-Milwaukee.

Eleven Mike
June 18, 2006, 11:59 PM
The biggest problem? You're not tactical enough, dude. Yellow t-shirt, baseball cap, no web gear, no big flashlight or laser on your piece? Sooo untactical. Now if your ball cap said H&K, or something, yeah that would have been tactical.


June 19, 2006, 12:01 AM
You did good. The picture flash sure blew your cover. But, that is the way of roommates. He probably thought it a big joke.

June 19, 2006, 12:10 AM
Glass doesn't stop bullets well!. You kneel at corner of window and peek out only exposing the least possible meat for the least time.Reasonable stud bracing at edge of windows Good time to wear the hat hommie style!:) . Never shiloette a weapon , keep it out of sight till the last minute.

June 19, 2006, 12:16 AM
jgeiken I think if this should happen agin I would go to that window behind you and open it up and get into a kneelling position for cover/concealement and a stable shooting rest if it came to that .

It sounds like you could use a cheap video Surveillance camera on your porch , ones that hook up to a VCR and record both audio and video can be had for as little as $50 .

here are a couple of links

June 19, 2006, 01:10 AM
Wow, crazy night I am sure. I was wondering could you give me a hint at where in Milwaukee this happened? I live here too and like to know what goes on. You don't need to provide your address or anything, some major streets would be awesome.

On the grand scale, I am have been feeling less and less safe in the city, maybe it is because of my new found interest in protecting myself and the lack of laws allowing such, or maybe it is because of an increase of overall crime.

June 19, 2006, 02:20 AM
I finished reading your post over at I'm glad the THR members here are little more mature, and aren't giving you grief about the ejection port door being closed. :barf:

I grew up in a tough area, so I know the feeling....

Stay safe.

June 19, 2006, 02:41 AM
Lessons learned, and nobody died. Good outcome.

June 19, 2006, 12:11 PM
"Wow, crazy night I am sure. I was wondering could you give me a hint at where in Milwaukee this happened? I live here too and like to know what goes on. You don't need to provide your address or anything, some major streets would be awesome."

Cramer and Locust. About 3 blocks south of UWM. In the amazing riverwest community. :barf:

thanks creampuff, yah a couple of the arf guys were being real dicks, but about 90% of the other posts on there were good and had my back. kinda just made me laugh a little.

June 19, 2006, 03:26 PM
First glad nobody was hurt/second glad the Police sound like they got the BGs.
Could you post link to arf thread? I don't spend much time there and am too lazy to hunt. :)
Next time tell roommate to go outside and take pics from neighbors landing. (better angle) That way he can give them to Police. :)
I might suggest having serious words with him. and grab a spare mag.

June 19, 2006, 04:23 PM
heres the post on, made it to 4 pages... wow, mainly because a couple of idiots kept posting.

i had another 30 rd. in my back pocket. :D

Ala Dan
June 19, 2006, 04:35 PM
Nice look'in "evil Black widow maker" there my friend~!:cool: I have a Colt
M4A3 that favors it quite a bit; only my Bushnell HOLO-sight sits atop a
Calvary Arms Mount, whereas I can use either the regualr sights or the

June 19, 2006, 05:42 PM
"Cramer and Locust. About 3 blocks south of UWM. In the amazing riverwest community."

I did my time at UWM about 15 years ago, and lived on Cramer and Kenwood for a couple years. Even then, there were plenty of lowlives that would make their way east across the river for the easier pickings near the college.

One time, my roommate found some random lady and her gradeschool-aged child climbing the stairwell to our upper-level duplex. They were obviously not lost college students. When he asked them what the f**k they thought they were doing in our house, he got some BS story about needing a bathroom, or a telephone, or something. Riiiiight.

Glad everything turned out okay, and I hope you can escape soon. Stay safe,


June 19, 2006, 07:25 PM
That looks like an EOTech sight. How do you like it?

If you could make the decision today would you still buy it, or consider another?

June 19, 2006, 08:16 PM
its a bushnell holosight, made by eotech, its amazing, unlimited eye relief, lightningfast sight aquisition, one word, awesome.

June 20, 2006, 12:53 AM
Thanks for link. That was fun to read. :)
So what happened when you talked (hope thats all you did) to your RM? Did he understand how it endangered both of you?
I have to admit I thought of the Police Officer shot in Mlps? couple yrs ago. The Officer was checking on a person asleep in their car (iirc Sunday morning and someone thought he might be dead or something) Well guy wakes up and shoots Officer. Then he takes Officers gun and is going to shoot him some more. A gent up the street was watching from his second floor window and sees Officer get shot/BG get out take his gun. Citizen grabs his (IIRC .22 LR) and fires at suspect and drives him off. (I think Officer dies but gave him a chance I hope I am wrong and he lived)
I would have to admit last week when (things went bump outside) I grabbed gun and had just underware on. Moving thru house to listen at windows (and pulling pants on)

June 20, 2006, 01:00 AM

History Prof
June 20, 2006, 01:45 AM
Gotta wonder about some people at ARF.COM. As far as the "did it really happen," I believe you. BTDT. My last year working on my PhD, there was a shooting in the parking lot of my apartment, 2 blocks south of campus, in a "nice" neighborhood. Unfortunately, I lived in a half-sunk apartment that had bedroom windows AT ground level facing the parking lot (on the outside, the top of the windows were about knee high - the bottom about 6 inches from ground level). I heard a shot and then a double-tap. My reaction was not as "tactical" as yours. I was on the phone with 911 within seconds, handed the phone to my wife and went to my daughters room and carried her to the living room, where I armed my wife and myself. I put myself in the hall that faced the two bedrooms, but where I could keep an eye on the front of the apartment, too. Things seemed to calm down, and the cops told me that they didn't find anything. But we woke up at about 2AM because there were flood lights in the parking lot. I looked out the window and saw about 50 cops.

I found out the next day from the detectives that after the responding officers told us things were ok, they looked behind a boat that was parked about 20 feet from my window and found a couple of bodies. Turns out that two johns had shot a pimp and a hooker (the shot was in the hooker's chest, the double tap was in the pimp's head). I didn't even know there were hookers in our neighborhood. Fortunately, I was a week away from my dissertation defense, and we got out of there as soon as I got a real job. I love small towns......

Best of luck, and keep it safe. Start lounging in camo so the gangbangers won't see your bright yellow shirt! :neener:

Eleven Mike
June 20, 2006, 08:09 AM
I didn't even know there were hookers in our neighborhood.

And if you had? :neener:

June 20, 2006, 12:16 PM
Quinch Posted

"Milwaukee. Wisconsins A-hole."

Was that in response to my post? I did NOT say I recalled all details. I (THOUGHT) Note question marks. Also note a couple IIRC (If I remember correctly)
You could have said the correct location and actually there have been MORE THEN ONE incident where Officers have been shot and a citizen drives off attacker. Just because news media does not give it much air time does not mean it does not happen.

June 20, 2006, 01:22 PM
Larry, I think he was making the statement towards the city of Milwaukee rather than you. Having grown up in Wisconsin myself, I would have to say that it is also my opinion that Milwaukee is the armpit of the state...

June 20, 2006, 02:05 PM
if you look at a map of wisconsin, milwaukee is literally the armpit. Theres the little arm that sticks out into the lake (door county, beautiful area) and then a little below it is milwaukee, in the armpit. :neener: sorry, but after being on, i needed a little humor.

June 20, 2006, 03:17 PM
got my little black protection device

Your hat?

50 Freak
June 20, 2006, 03:33 PM
I hate to say it but your roommate is an idiot and could have gotten you guys killed.

Gangbanger across the street. "oh look, Tyrone, someone is taking pictures of us from that house over there. Just saw a couple of flashes....Let's go kill those poor unarmed citizens because they definitely can ID us with those pictures".

Your roommate: "dude that's some cool pictures....what's that noise downstairs....":banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

June 20, 2006, 08:18 PM
Let's go kill those poor unarmed citizens because they definitely can ID us with those pictures".

exactly why i had my "little black protection device waiting. Whats that noise downstairs? Its two gangbangers taking their last breaths because two guys with 9 milly "glocks" with a clip (actually i'd be suprised if it was even that, gun of choice for gangbangers around here is usually some "saturday night special .22") isnt gonna cut it agianst a full up .223 and someone that knows very well how to use it.

But besides that, I was fully aware of what my roommate did, and i wasnt happy... to say the least. He just kinda laughed when i told him that it compromised my position, like i was taking the situation too seriously. I'm sure he woulda been singing a different tune when bullets started ripping through the wall. some people just dont get it. but with 28 shootings in milwaukee over memorial day weekend, im not messin around when stuff like that goes down.

History Prof
June 21, 2006, 12:13 AM
I didn't even know there were hookers in our neighborhood.

And if you had? :neener:

In the days before I was married and a Born Again Christian, I probably would have known that. But that was all behind me at the time of this incident...;) Gotta be honest, though, the "old" me did begin looking around the neighborhood a bit better those last few weeks we lived there - not to do anything of course, but just to look.:o


pete f
June 21, 2006, 12:57 AM
re where are their parents, according to most statistics, mom is out on the town attempting to lure another man who promises to take care of her back home for a 15 minute breeding session. Her other 6 children by five different men are now being raised by her mother.

dad is A) unknown, B) in prison or C) out on the town spending some money he did not get by working on some lady who needs to be lied into thinking this man will be different than the other sixteen before him and really have a real job and take care of her, so she can justify having him over for fifteen minutes of sex with a stranger while her "babies" all pretend to sleep in another room.

Sorry if I offend, but this is reality in the community.

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