[cpileri]

Making it easy for the BATFE

Honestly, sometimes when I read the titles of some threads/polls like,
“show me your assault rifles” or “how many guns do you own” or “how many high-cap mags do you have” or “pics of you and your homemade silencer” or whatever, I halfway expect the text of the thread to read:

Dear THRers,
My name is agent Schmuckatelli and I am from the BATFE. I would very much appreciate it if you would please post pictures, or better yet a movie, of your self doing something illegal with a firearm. Preferred examples include waltzing around a schoolyard with a military style rifle, constructing the receiver for an unregistered NFA weapon, and illegal alterations of firearms, but even such things as standing in front of a suspiciously large pile of weapons or ammunition will be sufficient. Anything that is incriminating or suspicious enough to encourage your arrest or to allow me to harass you and confiscate your property will do.
You can of course include evidence of crimes with alcohol, tobacco, and/or explosives but its you gun owners that really pay the bills around here.
If you would neatly print or type your name, address, and the date on the back of the original photograph –or better still, send a notarized statement attesting to its veracity- and send it to:
Agent Schmuckatelli
c/o
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
Office of Public and Governmental Affairs
650 Massachusetts Avenue, NW.
Room #8290
Washington, DC 20226
I would greatly appreciate it.
You will receive a personal response to your mailing. Thank you for your cooperation in making my job so very much easier and for keeping the country safe from you.
Sincerely,
S-

Sometimes I really can’t believe I am reading some of this stuff here.
C-

[Jmurman]

I've wondered the same things myself.

[CGofMP]

Having anything to do with firearms online seems to be bait for either idiots or BATF... and (all jokes aside) I can't tell the difference.

I own an informatinal site about the M1 Garand (http://www.memorableplaces.com/m1garand/index.html) and my CMP experiences, I own a joke site about gun control (http://www.memorableplaces.com/m1garand/yuppiepage.html) , and I webmaster for 3 firearm related companies (http://www.memorableplaces.com/clients.html) (soon to be 4).

I regularly get mail from people wanting to buy this or that gun though none of the sites have ANY relation to such a weapon and NONE of the sites sell firearms online. A couple clients are in the gun business but as for myself... except for a few gun books (http://www.memorableplaces.com/m1garand/amazonbooksformyreaders.html) through amazon, I have not sold so much as a recoil pad... ever.

I got one today in fact, some guy asking about macineguns as they relate to C&R's...

he said:

-----------------------------------
" I am in the process of applying for a curios and relics firearms license and I went online to see what kinds of pistols were considered "C&R". While jumping around the internet, I visited a website with extensive lists of C&R rifles and pistols. Among the "rifles", I saw listed the MP-40 machine pistol and the Russian PPsh as well as a few others. OK...I'm so pro-gun I probably
have cordite in my piss, but machine guns for a $30 license that didn't even ask for fingerprints? I'm confused and hope you can tell me if these are truly C&R eligible firearms. Thanks in advance!"
-------------------------------------

Now whjat the HECK would an amature M1 guy like me know about THAT??!!??

As I say, someone is either really stupid or the BATFE thinks that I may just mail back syaing - "Oh yea here ya go... I'll happily sell ya somehting nice and felonious." Of course it could be the other way.. maybe they are expecting me to write back saying "OOOh I want to buy a 30 dollar felony rap where can I go to get one?".

I dont think so.

I am not making accusations here.. but I do get a lot of mail asking me to sell this or that weapon and ya know.. it just makes me wonder.

If I could only sell a couple more websites.... Hey BATF if its YOU guys I'll happily take your money if you want me to work on websites for ya... :neener:

On second thought no...never mind.. don't want to have to alienate anyone by putting Webmaster for BATF in my signature line :evil:

I don't truly know whats going on but something sure smells fishy...

Charles


http://www.memorableplaces.com/images/garandsitebuttonshadow.jpg

[Waitone]

I reserve the right to be wrong but IIRC prior to Patriots Act the federales could not browse the internet as part of their duties without some kind of court authorization. Yet they could punch out, go home and search without restriction.

Then along came Patriots Act and that little problem was fixed. I would not be the least bit surprised at who is surfing gun website and trolling a little on the side.

As long as we have a federal bureaucracy assuming lawful gunowners are bad guys, we will have to put up with it.

I find it insulting and seriously irritating, but that's the way it is.

[ScottsGT]

CG of MP or Charles.....
So your the one to blame for my Garandits! Well Thank You Very Much!!! Because of YOU, I now have a new most favorite gun in the safe!
Keep up the good work!

Scott.

[GhostShooter]

Dear Agent Schmuckatelli,

Thank you for taking such an interest in my gun collection. As you will note from the photographs, I do not have any "illegal" firearms. So, if you come and try to take my constitutionally protected firearms I will consider it a criminal assault and will respond in kind. Again, thank you for your interest and have a nice day.


Sincerely
THRer



http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/2M16.gif

edited to add:
I wonder how many watch lists I just got put on :uhoh:

[Darrin]

If the BATF was really worried about me and my .22lrs, then this country is in for it and it doesn't matter what I say on a public Internet forum.

However, if I had something illegal to hide, I guess I'd be a bit paranoid also.

[Corelogik]

The simply solution, really, is IF you HAPPEN to have illegal firearms, or do anything ILLEGAL with the legal ones you have, DON'T POST PICTURES.

Showing a picture of your gun legal gun collection is fine, nothing anyone can do.

Showing a picture of your newest aquisition also fine,...

Threating an ATF agent, joking or not, is not a wise idea. They alreay have a hard on for us, why encourage it.

[JohnBT]

A what? I hope they don't like me that much. :eek:

JT

[PlayTheAces]

I'm not overly concerned about big brother, but I stay away from those types of threads for the same reason few of my neighbors know I own guns, let alone how many or the types. I consider it common sense, though maybe I'm slightly paranoid???

I own nothing illegal so the idea of the government swooping in doesn't get me worked up - the possibility of theft does, so unless it's a close friend or relative, I'll only discuss specific weapons. I don't get into how many I own, where I keep them, values, etc.

When I was a kid I collected coins and cruised different coin shops with my dad. A good friend of ours decided to do a deal with someone he met in one of the shops and invited the guy back to his house. They found our friend buried in his backyard a few days later, shot numerous times with a .22. Since then, I've been a lot less trusting of people.

[Kinsman]

Just 'cuz yer paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't everywhere. Of course they are looking for anything at all.....cut that stock down on the .410 so your kid can shoot it more comfortably?

Possible felony.

Folks who think like this are everywhere, and anti-what-the-good-guys-fought-for.

Molon Labe!

[Darrin]

PlayTheAces,

When you bring up the idea of theft, now it makes sense to not "advertise" what you have.

If someone has the nerve to come into my house to steal anything from me, I hope they are ready for my defensive measures.

[MPFreeman]

Why would you keep all your guns in one location? At one address? In one state?

hmmm....things to think about

[JPM70535]

It is good to hear the philosophy I adhere to being confirmed. I never show pictures of my guns and only confirm the ones I own in response to a thread about that particular weapon.

The Feds have no need to know what I possess but I sure don't want to give them a reason to point their antenae in my direction.


GOD MADE ALL MEN, SAM COLT MADE THEM ALL EQUAL!!!

[AZTOY]

Dear Agent Schmuckatelli,

Molon Labe!!!


THANK YOU, MICKEY MOUSE:D

[TechBrute]

I don't mind you wearing tin foil hats, but don't tell me I should wear one.

I've been in CA for the last 5 years and aquired most of my guns there, new. Therefore, I will assume that the BATF knows about all my guns, and doesn't seem to care, as they have yet to send me so much as a postcard for my birthday.

There's a gun show this weekend, and along with hundreds of other Texans, I will participate in a completely legal face to face transaction and walk out with a gun that the BATF knows nothing about. Actually, I'm pretty well convinced that they won't give a crap about me buying another gun.

Seriously, if you called the BATF and told them that you wanted to talk to an agent so you could tell them about your gun collection, what exactly do you think they'd do? Break down your door because you've got a Glock, a Kimber, an AR-15, and a Saiga rifle?

:rolleyes:

Disclaimer: If you have illegal weapons, or commit crimes with legal weapons, watch out... the BATF is coming for you.http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/toilet_claw.gif

[Braz]

Heheh,

I swear. Have you ever seen illegal weapons on the High Road? I never have. If you're so far gone, you don't remember the paperwork you filled out at the sale, well, yikes. Fans posting pics of their legal weapons or disscussing them, is what this forum is for. Turn off the computer, put down the Black Helicopter Times, and get outside! ;)

[ball3006]

I am sure these gun forums are being monitored but I have a C&R license so there is already a neon sign pointing to me on the roof of my house. However, only two of my milsurps are valued more than the average remchester from wally world. Pawn shops wouldn't give you anything for the guns I have......chris3

[NapAttack]

If the BATF doesn't already know what I have they could easily find out. Either through those records of purchases and sales they're not supposed to be keeping or other means. They can if they wish track my purchases of parts, accessories, ammo, etc and find out pretty accurately what I own.

If you think you have any privacy in this day and age of electronic everything then you are sorely mistaken. Even with your bolted down and locked down safes and all the privacy measures you care to take, a determined and skilled hacker or thief could find out anything they want and steal anything they want to. I teach computer classes at local technical colleges and one of the first things I teach them is that they cannot protect themselves against a determined and skilled hacker. You are only protecting yourself against the casual invader. The average hacker or thief does not have access to the resources the feds do.

If the BATF or any of the feds want to find out exactly what you own they can run a black bag operation on you and you'd never know they were there. Trust me, anything you can think of to protect yourself they have thought of first. Think about it. To catch a thief you have to think like a thief. These folks have been dealing with thieves and criminals for years on end. You and I, unless we are law enforcement may never have encountered a thief.

I along with everyone else should take reasonable measures to prevent theft, both of property and privacy but if the antis ever manage to circumvent the Constitution then it's going to become the time to stand and be counted or go quietly into the dark. Hide your firearms, bury them in remote locations, keep them at friends and relatives' houses, do what you want, when the feds come for your guns, they will know what you have and where they are. As for me, until then I won't worry about it. I'll do my best to stay within the laws and if the antis do manage to outlaw firearms then I'll stand and be counted. I'll probably go into the dark but I won't go quietly and I will by God have an honor guard going with me.

[Correia]

Yes, gun and pro freedom websites are monitored. I know that this is a fact dating back to at least 1999. I'm no tin foil hatter, but I know what I know. I'm not going to elaborate.

So here is the deal. If you are going to do something illegal. First off, don't. Second if you are that stupid don't be even stupider and talk about it on the freaking internet. Also on the phone or over e-mail. Don't say anything on the internet that you wouldn't say in public.

[Destructo6]

We had one guy post at the old HK-91.com boards about how people were stupid for paying $4000+ for an auto sear. He went on to explain that it wasn't necessary because it was comically easy to simply modify a G3 gripframe/trigger box to go on a semi gun: a half hour with a file, and auto is yours for cheap. He even posted a link to his web site that showed exactly what needed to be filed. Nobody posted a response for about 3 days, then we ripped him a new one.

Either he was the world's most naive gunowner or the world's most naive BATF agent.
If the BATF doesn't already know what I have they could easily find out. Either through those records of purchases and sales they're not supposed to be keeping or other means. They can if they wish track my purchases of parts, accessories, ammo, etc and find out pretty accurately what I own.
I'd agree if LE agencies are already investigating you. Connecting the massive amounts of information out there to start an investigation is another story, IMHO.
Don't say anything on the internet that you wouldn't say in public.
Electronic stuff, unlike speech, is persistant and can come back to haunt you years later. Post nothing you wouldn't say into a camera.

[CGofMP]

ScottsGT wrote:

So your the one to blame for my Garandits! Well Thank You Very Much!!! Because of YOU, I now have a new most favorite gun in the safe! Keep Up the good work!

*BIG OL GRIN*
*BLUSH*

Yea okay I guess I can cop a "mea culpa" for a few people's Garanditis :-) I have certainly been accused of worse!

The funny thing is I never started off to do any such thing! The humongous site (which includes LARGE portions the CMP now owns) actually just started out as a single page of 'show off' pictures..... then someone asked how to do this or that and I took a picture and posted it.. then someone else asked another ...

I guess things got out of control :-)
Thanks for the kind words!

Charles

http://www.civilianmarksmanship.com/nomenclaturephotos/rearsightassembled.jpg

[Intune]

Does the BATF do ANYTHING that couldn't be done at your state level (TN Bureau of Investigation) and shared with the FBI? I can't think of the last big RedMan chaw bust or Jack Black bottles slipping out without their tax stamp. They HAVE to come down hard on gunowners, it's all they have. Hi Agent Schmoe! :D

[Standing Wolf]

If I had any illegal firearms or did anything illegal with the firearms I own, I sure wouldn't advertise it. I'm not too worried about thieves, because all my expensive and/or irreplaceable guns live in bank boxes 99.99% of the time.

[Hkmp5sd]

ATF already knows that I own NFA items since they are registered to me. My local Sheriff knows about these also since he signed for me to purchase them. ATF knows I have many classic military firearms due to my C&R license. They know of several non-restricted weapons that I've purchased over the years thanks to AFT Form 4477. They have a good idea that I have at least one gun based on my Florida CCW license. They can safely deduce that I own firearms based on my membership in the NRA and my various NRA instructor certifications.

None of my firearms are illegal and if ATF can obtain enough probable cause to get a judge to approve a search warrant, they can come in my house and look for themselves.

So talking about the various guns I own in this forum just doesn't make me all that scared that ATF is going to obtain my real name and address and come looking for me to confiscate my guns.

Looks like some folks need to replace the expired tinfoil liner in their hats.

[Sven]

All my guns and mags and everything are legal. You guys are paranoid, in my opinion, or you have something to hide.

[Jeff OTMG]

“show me your assault rifles”
“how many guns do you own”
“how many high-cap mags do you have”

Who cares? All of those things are legal in Texas. Now I have not assembled nor do I own any post-ban semiautomatic assault weapons and if you posted a thread or photo of an illegally manufactured suppressor on THR I would bet that it would get locked as soon as a moderator saw it.

Believe it or not there are people on this forum who do not post their location for fear that BATF has nothing better to do that track down posters for questions. ATF knows where I am and if they want to they know where you are too. Let me tell you that I was on TFL since a week after it opened, I have never kept it a secret what guns I have or how many, though I don't really know how many I have. If ATF wanted to raid me they would have done it years ago when Clinton and Reno were the power team, hell, they tried it on a church outside Waco, but it didn't really work out for them very well and for the record the Davidians were breaking the law and probably did have illegally converted full auto firearms and I know this because I know the dealer that was the second witness at their trial in San Antonio and he went to Indiana with a couple of them, including Koresch, and saw the materials in their possession at gun shows. Remember that if you own the full auto parts and the gun that they go in that is intent and the Davidians were guilty. If you are doing that then you might want to hide otherwise it is no big deal.

I do keep guns in what will soon be 8 different cities in 3 states so even if they were to conduct a raid they wouldn't get them all.

[NapAttack]

Destructo6,
I'd agree if LE agencies are already investigating you. Connecting the massive amounts of information out there to start an investigation is another story, IMHO.

I'm a programmer, I know that I could write a program to search databases and connect all this data together. I know if I can do it they probably already have programs in place to do the same. Enter your name or SSN and within seconds, minutes at most they have every detail of your financial life laid out in a nice pretty Excel file. Even sorted according to category. Not flaming you, but I know what I can do with computers and there are lots and lots of people smarter than me that have been working with computers a lot longer and I've been around computers since the days of keypunch cards.

[Bowlcut]

Im sure im already on record for other things....so im sure they know I am starting up a little gun collection. Do i care? nope. If they want to come take them away....there better be a court ruleing making it constitutionaly wrong for me to own them.... Until then...bite my bayonette :D

[ZekeLuvs1911]

This issue is such nonsense. If the BATF needed to know what guns you owned, they can find out through their data base. They are welocme to check my collection out since they were all acquired legally and I have all the paperwork for them. So..........:neener:

[QuarterBoreGunner]

Ok first off I always assumed that the ATF/FBI/Ridge's Cyber Power Ranger squad was combing the various forums, I mean it seems like a given.

Second, I too have never seen anything on THR that I could point to and say 'that's patently illegal'. I've seen videos of machine guns, select-fire shotguns, SBR and so forth. They may be a felony for ME to own (California...whatever) but I know their legal in somestates if you go through the hoops.

Third and last, dude, if you post something illegal on the internet, you deserve what the goon squad kicks through your door after the prefuctory 'knock and announce'.

I have no problem showing off my dutifully registered California defined AWs, evil hi-cap mags, heck I've even posted pictures of the safe we stored all the LE only Class III/NFA firearms in, when I was in the business... here I'll post it again.

http://www.swedcom.com/test_images/office_safe_web.jpg

All legal, all paperwork in order. And unfortunately all gone when the business folded.

The point is if some young cyber trooper deep in the bowels of the Patriot Act Mega Enforcement Superheadquarters wants to question me about it, go right ahead. Beacause, again, all legal. And, again, (so sad) all gone.

[Okiecruffler]

STOP, YOU GUYS ARE MAKING THE CHIP IN MY HEAD HURT!!!!! :scrutiny:

[firestar]

If you are not doing anything illegal, what is the problem? If those threads bother you, don't post! If someone is doing something illegal and is stupid enough to write about it or post pics of it, then they deserve to be caught. Does anyone want these stupid people having guns anyway?

Why all the hatred for the ATF? I know an FBI agent that investigates firearm crimes in my area and he doesn't seem to have anything against law abiding gun owners, just the ones that are grossly breaking the law. I don't tend to like cops or athority in general but as long as I feel like I am not acting like a criminal, I don't expect to be treated as a criminal.

Why don't we all just pretend like we don't have any guns and never mention them to anyone? It is people like the regulars on TFL who talk about guns and go shooting in public that are keeping gun owners from looking like a bunch of paranoid anti-government wackos! If we act like we are doing something wrong, we will be seen as people that do things wrong and sooner or later, we will be treated as if we are doing something wrong.

[Zundfolge]

dammit QuarterBoreGunner, now I gotta clean the drool off my keyboard :p


Seriously, discussions of illegal things are not allowed here ... such threads have been closed (and maybe even deleted) when they show up.

I can even think of discussions of legal things being shut down because they may give the antis the wrong idea.

Dude ... get rid of the tin foil hat ... its turning your hair green.

[Hkmp5sd]

QuarterBoreGunner,

How did you like those P90s?

PS. I see 3 guns in that safe that I also have one of and they are not dealer samples! :)

[QuarterBoreGunner]

HKmp5sd-

Well the P90's are a hoot to shoot, no recoil and pointable like your middle finger. Light enough to hang around your neck with 50 rounds loaded, fire controls like a select fire AUG. Unfortunately the ammo (at that time) was all AP so we couldn't fire it at the indoor range... and expensive. IWBJ and the NIJ have serious misgivings about the terminal ballistics of the 5.7x28 round. I guess time will tell.

The SD3 was, well, come on, suppressed machine gun? What's not to like?

The PDW is my personal favorite; itty bitty chain saw.

The MP40...LOUD!

The M4; wow how jaded do you have to be that a select fire M16 is boring?

The SBR AUG is ... interesting... full auto right under your cheek is... unsettling...

*sigh*

I miss those guns...

[Telperion]

QBG, how did National acquire its NFA toys? Were they are dealer samples, or did National have a CA DOJ machinegun license (perhaps the only one other than Stembridge)?

[DAL]

Thanks, cpileri, for posting this.

Probably a large part of the reason people respond to those kind of posts is because, in general, gun owners are such good people and they feel they can let their guard down when amongst kindred spirits. This is understandable, but it should be guarded against, not that it really matters all THAT much. Why? Because I have no doubt that somewhere out there exists records of every gun purchase ever made from a dealer.

Personally, I won't respond to these posts anymore. If I have a gun I want to talk about, I'll do so, but only because I believe it to already be in someone's database.
DAL

[QuarterBoreGunner]

pipsqueak-

We were one of the VERY few Law Enforcement dealers for Class III in the Bay Area; we rep'd for HK, FN, Bushmaster, Colt, and Benelli.

All were 'dealer samples' meaning that once we closed the biz, we had to return them to their respective manufacturers/importers...

We did have the paperwork to sell Cali defined AWs to LEOs and did sell quite a few pre-ban style ARs and AUGs to individual officers...

And by the way, the DEA based in SF and SJ have some REALLY cool toys... Mmmmm*cough*belt fed*cough*...

[cpileri]

I have never had this many people respond to a post of mine before! (Yawn, big deal. right?)

Sure, posting pics and talking about LEGAL things is no problem. But for some who live in areas where every legislative session some goof proposes a new law like: ban 50 caliber rifles, ban semi-autos, ban all ammunition sales, add a few more to the assault weapons list, etc etc;
then having a pictorial inventory of the guns you own that are CURRENTLY legal but may soon not be is very worrisome.

How very nice if you live in an area where that is not a concern.

Please, don't exasperate your fellows with advice of, "move out".

Also, and I knew someone would say it:
"All my guns and mags and everything are legal. You guys are paranoid, in my opinion, or you have something to hide."

WELL GEE WHIZZ, THEN TOTAL GUN REGISTRATION SHOULDN'T BOTHER YOU EITHER!!!

Truly, I don't want to pick on just the fellow who posted that (so, sorry up front!) but to use it as an example of an opinion no doubt shared by others as well.

And really; anyone recall the post entitled something like 'who would turn in a tax cheat?'- unbelieveable!
C-

[Bowlcut]

Oh my goodness.....someone please come clean the drool off this keyboard the boss is goign to be mad. That pic.....oh lordy.....i need a few of those....i really do.

oh do i really need those.... :eek:

[cslinger]

Good Lord I want an FN P90. Yeah the round might be inadeqate but they feel so good and look so darn cool.

So if Tom Ridge, The ATF, Illumanati or Winny The Poo is reading this post. Please let us serfs have access to these. If you do and you run for office I will personally make sure you get a few extra votes.

Cslinger.


Oh yeah and I don't actually own any guns. Sold them all long ago, all I do is borrow other peoples....yeah that's it.

My guess is when the BATF does drop by to visit we give them a good laugh as we debate over whether or not this 11 round mag is really legal and if not I will just have to use the 10 round mag etc.

[geegee]

I've wondered about this myself, but how about the various websites (very similar to THR, e.g. discussions, political, etc.), that have specific boards for "Miltia"? :uhoh: Why would anyone want to be a regular contributor there? Hard to say which would place you on a government list faster. geegee

[RustyHammer]

Note to self ... going to need bigger safe to keep up with the Jones'!

[lee n. field]

> I regularly get mail from people wanting to buy this or that gun though none of the sites have ANY relation to such a weapon and NONE of the sites sell firearms online. A couple clients are in the gun business but as for myself... except for a few gun books through amazon, I have not sold so much as a recoil pad... ever.


You're not the only one. I've gotten a few really off the wall emails related to content on my personal web site. Some strange enough that I've consulted a lawyer correspondent of mine about it. Nothing alarming, but usually nothing I want to respond to.

Sh*****t folks, the last P. R. of Illinois Atty. General (and governor wannabe) was involved in internet entrapment of gun buyers.:fire:

Apropos the thread topic, I will _not_ admit to or appear to advocate anything illegal in a public forum like this.

Yes, and "lee n. field" is a pseudonym, which I hope would be pretty obvious to alert gun enthusiasts.

[MeekandMild]

I've been thinking about this thread all day before posting. Firestar is right. I agree I really don't think the ATF is out trying to nail all the gun hobbyists. Why?

1) Where would their jobs go if we were all arrested?
2) Who would pay the excise taxes and transfer taxes if we were all in jail?
3) Can you think of anything more scary to law enforcment types than having a critical mass of normally intelligent, motivated and highly pissed off gunnies railroaded away into prison for fabricated crimes with nothing to do all day but educate their criminal peers in the art and science of gunnery?
4)Come to think of it, can you think of anything more scary to anyone than number 3?

[Hkmp5sd]

I agree with MeekandMild's #3. Sounds pretty scary to me. :) Might take a while, but I'm sure the BGs could be trained to use the sights instead of their popular gangsta shooting stance.

[QuarterBoreGunner]

Mmmmmm#3 does sound unsettling

'ok first thing, stop holding the damn thing sidways!'


Accuracy goes up instantly.


edit: Curse you Hkmp5sd! You were too quick with your edit!

[Skunkabilly]

Dear Agent Schmakatelli,

I want your job!!!

[Hkmp5sd]

Curse you Hkmp5sd! You were too quick with your edit!

:D Quick-Fingers -R- Us. Guess there actually is some benefit from years of playing first-person shooters.

[QuarterBoreGunner]

Oh sure FPS make you faster typist...only if you can communicate with only the WASD keys, the space bar and the F, G & R keys!

[jimbo]

I don't think 90% of the people here have anything to worry about. If the ATF uses any post on this forum to prosecute them, they could just pull out their "I just shot a 1" group fom my Hi-Point at 100 yards" post, thorougly destroying the credibility of any subsequent point, to the point of making all your posts inadmissible in court!:neener:

[Tamara]

Serf's up!

:D

[AZTOY]

A-CHI JO TSAH- A-KHA A-KNAH-AS-DONIH :D


http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq61-4.htm

[Psssniper]

firestar wrote
"If you are not doing anything illegal, what is the problem?"

Part of my problem here in Kalifornia is that what is LEGAL changes constantly. One day I'm just fine, the next I'm a felon.
Sure just register that "Fill in the blank" and you'll be okay
for now maybe, unless we change our minds and the laws.
Sure Mr. Gunowner this BFSC is all you'll ever need to buy a gun,
well except if we pass new requirements for your own safety.
Now they want the .50 cals and I haven't even had a chance to commit a crime with it yet!!

[Bacchus]

Numerous people have said things like, "If you're not doing anything illegal, then why does it matter" or "If you're worried about it, you must have something to hide"

IMHO, that point of view is downright scary.



A quick analogy:

Would you let a LEO search your car without PC? No? Why not?

You must be hiding something if you refuse a search, right?

Think about it.

[Travis McGee]

Agent Schucatelli! Long time no see! We knew each other in the Navy.

Your old snuffy pal,
Joe Shyttheragman

[TallPine]

Paraphrase: "Don't ever do anything illegal and you won't have anything to worry about"


Then, I can assume the term "Molon Labe" is all a big joke, right ...? :rolleyes:

[Hkmp5sd]

Numerous people have said things like, "If you're not doing anything illegal, then why does it matter" or "If you're worried about it, you must have something to hide"

Actually, that's not what we are saying. We are saying that we obey the assorted federal, state and local firearms laws and therefore do not fear speaking about the firearms we own in a public forum. There are many LEO & government agencies that can figure out what firearms we own, so being paranoid doesn't serve a useful purpose.

[Quartus]

If you are not doing anything illegal, what is the problem?


Legal , not legal?


The fact that we're discussing it proves that the Constitution can be simply ignored. What makes you think that ex post facto laws won't soon be on the books?


Oh, and if you don't think there are plenty of people who want to take ALL your guns, you aren't naive, you're just plain STUPID.

[cpileri]

Dear THRers,
That's the way... good citizens... keep it right up with that "if you don't have anything to hide then don't worry" mantra.

We are terribly overextended nowadays and people like you help us out tremendously.

We are taught in BATFE school that the true tenets of our country lie in freedom from unreasonable search and seizure and rights to privacy, and how we can expect alot of hostility from all the 'potential criminals' who know this fact as well when we hassle them.

See, we have to make a conscious choice to enforce invasions of your domicile and privacy, even though we have no idea that you are breaking any law, knowing full well that it is patently unconstitutional.

We use phrases like the one above, as well as implying that if you resist or question our actions you therefore must be guilty or are aiding and abetting terrorists; and others you have heard before to help us get our job done effortlessly.

So the more of you that think that we are "no problem" the better!
Sincerely,
Agent Schmuckatelli

p.s. A long lost Navy buddy? I doubt it as I was never in the Navy. If you ever had enough patriotism or selflessness to serve in Americas armed forces, then civillian government work isn't for you. S-
________________________________________________

(ouch!)

________________________________________________

[Majic]

Since I filled out the government required forms for over 95% of the guns I own and the other 5% forms were not legally needed why should I worry about hiding my collection. If you are that paranoid then you must have already thought of the fact that since you have posted here you are on the supposedly list also. You may have not posted a pic of your gun, but exactly why are you on a gun site if you are not associated with firearms?

[TechBrute]

Mother of god... it's the thread that WOULD NOT DIE!!!

http://images.ar15.com/forums/smiles/anim_horse.gif

Seriously, y'all with tinfoil hats: why waste your breath preaching to those of us that don't want to hear you? I have no interest in you telling me I'm stupid for posting a pic of my gun(s).

And if my perfectly legal conversation pieces suddenly become illegal one day, Molon Labe.

[Bacchus]

Well said, cpileri

My thoughts exactly.

[12-34hom]

Jeff OTMG - Thank you.

I still shake my head and laugh at some of the posts around this place.

12-34hom.

[Tamara]

Yup, I have guns.

Lots of guns.

As a matter of fact, I have one-sixth as many guns as the Branch Davidians had, and there were eighty- or ninety-something times as many of them as there are of me.

Don't like that?

Tough.

MOLON LABE

Was that loud enough, agent? Lemme repeat it for those in the back:

I'm sick of cowering, I refuse to hide, I will not be embarrassed or frightened out of exercising my natural, human rights. I have complied with all of your inane, Byzantine, useless and goofy laws, and if that's still not good enough for you, well, then: MOLON LABE and let the chips fall where they may, baby.

[Norm357]

Man I shoot with a BATF agent!!! Now I'm gonna spend my time shooting looking at that SOB sideways!!!!!!!:banghead: :)


Norm

[Tamara]

Believe it or not, the majority I've met have been nice guys and gun buffs who happened to wind up in a job where they enforce dumb laws.

However, you know how there's always that one cop in every department who waits behind billboards until he gets a chance to write his mother for three over? Well, there's ATF agents like that, too. Ask your shooting buddy, I'm sure he'll have stories.

[Norm357]

Tamara, My wife is a police officer and most of our friends are involved with law enforcement. I know exactly what you mean. My post was a weak attempt at humor LOL.


Norm

[Quartus]

:confused:


Did I miss something? I thought they were the BATF.

[Tamara]

Where'd the "E" come from?

After 9/11, F-troop got moved from Treasury to Justice, and had "Explosives" added to their purview.

[Quartus]

Ah. Yes, I DID miss something! Thanks, Good Lady Tam.




Just what those clowns need - more jurisdiction. More power. Great. :rolleyes:

[Erik]

Lot of anti-government, paranoid folks here who seemingly spend lots of time daydreaming about fighting of the hordes of folks who could probably care less about you.

That's too bad.

(Most are not, of course.)

[Quartus]

who could probably care less about you.


That would be good. I'm sure Randy Weaver wishes they had cared less about him. Those folks in Texas, too.

And the countless innocent gun dealers and collectors who have had their lives ruined by these idiots probably wish they had cared less about them.

[Tommy.Gun]

I belive someone posted somthing illegal here, anyone know what it was?

[TechBrute]

I belive someone posted somthing illegal here, anyone know what it was?

Anyone care?

I'm betting most people haven't read through all of the 74 posts. Please don't keep us in suspense...

[Tamara]

I belive someone posted somthing illegal here, anyone know what it was?

The guy who impersonated Agent Schmuckatelli?


;) :D

[TechBrute]

The guy who impersonated Agent Schmuckatelli?
He's not really an agent? :eek:

[cpileri]

Arrrgh!
How did you guys find out I wasn't really Agent Schmuckatelli?
Man, you guys are GOOOOOOOOOOD!
:)
C-

p.s. OK, so what was the illegal thing, TechBrute?
C-

[Tommy.Gun]

Safety deposit box?

[BryanP]

Yup, I have guns.

Lots of guns.

As a matter of fact, I have one-sixth as many guns as the Branch Davidians had, and there were eighty- or ninety-something times as many of them as there are of me.

Don't like that?

Tough.

Wow. I think I'm in love. Just don't tell my wife. :D

But seriously, I suspect that Oleg or one of his Designated Representatives would lock and appropriately edit anything actually illegal that was posted to this board. The level of politeness, respect and all around niceness is one of the things that set this board apart from many other forums.

Bryan
(who has nowhere near as many firearms as The Mighty T, and is unlikely to anytime soon short of winning the lottery ...)

[chaim]

If I had any illegal firearms or did anything illegal with the firearms I own, I sure wouldn't advertise it. I'm not too worried about thieves, because all my expensive and/or irreplaceable guns live in bank boxes 99.99% of the time.

That is too funny. First you say that if you ever did anything illegal with firearms you wouldn't "advertise it" and then you do just that.

I worked at several banks and one credit union while I was in college (teller, account representative and last as an account manager) and every one stressed that (and we saw documentation attesting that) keeping firearms in a bank box is a federal offense. I no longer remember if it is a misdomeanor or a felony but it is a federal crime. Sure, you probably won't get caught (if you keep your mouth and keyboard shut about it) since bank employees must give you a private place to open your lockbox, but it certainly is a crime (and if you look carefully over the contract you signed when you opened the account you'll see a notice to that effect). It is also a crime to keep cash in a bank box (if you keep it at the bank you have to keep it in a deposit or investment account).

[Carlos Cabeza]

Can't keep cash in a safe deposit box ???? WT?? Thats one of those really intelligent laws yesirree.:scrutiny: I guess cash in any quanity is illegal nowadays.:barf: Somehow I don't think the people that frequent this board are the criminal types, pre '34 that is....... :evil: :cool:

BryanP; I have long since decided that if I leave the great state of Jokelahoma, I will be seeking refuge somewhere in Tennessee.......
;) If there is one, there has to be more like her.:D