A righteous SD shoot...in San Francisco?


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QuarterBoreGunner
June 28, 2006, 02:34 PM
Whither Prop H now? I can almost guarantee that this story will disappear from the local news without a ripple, but it still warms my heart.

From the Wednesday, June 28th San Francisco Chronicle

SAN FRANCISCO
3 suspects shot in robbery attempt

Police are looking for a man who turned the tables on three would-be robbers and shot them early Tuesday in the Tenderloin.

Police say the three first tried to rob a man at 3:30 a.m. at Turk and Leavenworth streets, but he was able to escape. The man then watched as the suspects confronted a couple and tried to grab a backpack from them, police said.

The man with the backpack pulled a gun and shot the three, police said. One man was wounded in the leg and was quickly arrested, and a second man wounded in the arm and buttocks was found around the corner.

The third man, wounded in the buttocks and groin, went to the Tenderloin Task Force police station for help.

"You've got to go somewhere," Inspector John Peterson said. "Where he was shot, he needed the help.''

The three men each were charged with two counts of attempted robbery. Their names were not immediately released.

"It's rare to have a victim be armed and use the weapon successfully on all three perpetrators,'' (emphasis mine) Peterson said. "We would like to talk to that victim to hear the rest of the story.''
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Direct link to story on SFGate.com (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/06/28/BAG0LJLC481.DTL&hw=tenderloin&sn=001&sc=1000)

Favorite line: "You've got to go somewhere," Inspector John Peterson said. "Where he was shot, he needed the help.'' Yeah, groin shot? I'll bet he needed help. In the, uhm, 'twig and berries' sort of funny. In the femoral artery, I'm surprised he didn't bleed out ASAP.

Oh and in case anyone is curious, the Tenderloin is a very unpleasant part of town, and has been pretty much since the 1800's. It got the name from the fact that the SFPD had to pay it's officers more to patrol that part of town and so then they could afford to eat that choice cut of meat... or so local legend goes.

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Red State
June 28, 2006, 02:49 PM
Wow, good story. Makes you wonder how much of this story would have been told (or spun) if the first guy to be approached by the robbers hadn't been there to witness it.

Didn't that SF gun ban just get overturned?

sfhogman
June 28, 2006, 02:54 PM
Good story. The gun ban has been overturned, and is on (hopeless) appeal.:)

Jeff

nplant
June 28, 2006, 02:56 PM
And they wonder if guns in private hands prevent crimes. In this one couple's case, I'd say the answer is an emphatic, "YES!"

Good for those guys, getting shot like that. The unfortunate part would be if the real victim comes forward and they charge him with unnessecary use of deadly force or something because they three guys didn't have weapons. :rolleyes:

Preacherman
June 28, 2006, 02:59 PM
Well, being in SF, odds are the victim didn't have a CCW permit - so I daresay he won't be stepping forward . . .

PinnedAndRecessed
June 28, 2006, 02:59 PM
The unfortunate part would be if the real victim comes forward and they charge him with unnessecary use of deadly force

IIRC, CCW is nearly impossible in San Fran unless you're connected. My guess is the victim loses his gun(s) and is arrested.

ChestyP
June 28, 2006, 03:00 PM
the SFPD would like to talk with the victim. And talk him (or her) right into jail on various weapons charges.

QuarterBoreGunner
June 28, 2006, 03:01 PM
Yes, the onerous Prop H has been overturned, but the City Board O' Supervisors have said that they will appeal the decision.
And unfortunately, incidents like this will have zero impact on their mindset.

I'm thinking that the armed victim will most likely never be identified; the urban equivalent of Shoot Shovel and Shut-up would be Shoot Scoot and Shut up.

czhen
June 28, 2006, 03:03 PM
I love happy end stories.

from news:
The third man, wounded in the buttocks and groin, went to the Tenderloin Task Force police station for help.

I guess after the shooting and the night he had some flinching.

Ps.: We should invite him, to write some lines here around.

Czhen,
FL

torpid
June 28, 2006, 03:32 PM
"It's rare to have a victim be armed and use the weapon successfully on all three perpetrators,'' Peterson said. "We would like to talk to that victim to hear the rest of the story.''

Yes, we'll have a nice little chat about how fortunate he was to be armed, and then we'll send him on his merry way with a handshake and a pat on the back.

:rolleyes:

QuarterBoreGunner
June 28, 2006, 03:48 PM
Interesting dilemma; do you come forward and possibly (very likely) face charges for the CCW and/or the use of it or do you just stash the weapon, lose the backpack, avoid that part of town and swear your female friend to double-secret silence?

My take? Well if it was me, I'd be tempted to dispose of the gun down the deepest darkest hole I could find, hope that the bad guys didn't get too good a look at me and get on with my life.

Tough call though. I can't imagine SFPD and the DA being very sympathetic to the victim with the firearm. Part of me says, well, 3:30am, in that part of town and carrying (almost definitely without a permit), the shooter may very well not be the most upstanding citizen. But that in no way takes away his basic right of self-defense. Very tough call.

I'm going to stick with my initial thought that this was a righteous shoot by an armed citizen against multiple assailants. Good for him.

Frohickey
June 28, 2006, 03:56 PM
Would be good if this could be the nucleus of a class-action lawsuit against the County of San Francisco about CCW permit issuance.

marinr
June 28, 2006, 04:16 PM
do you just stash the weapon, lose the backpack, avoid that part of town and swear your female friend to double-secret silence?

Well, first he'd need a girlfriend who could be trusted to keep her mouth shut.

I'd say things aren't looking too good for the intended victim.

grimjaw
June 28, 2006, 04:21 PM
"We would like to talk to that victim to hear the rest of the story . . .''

". . . so we can arrest him and charge him with attempted murder."

jmm

DoubleTapDrew
June 28, 2006, 04:22 PM
"We would like to talk to that victim to hear the rest of the story.''
Then take his gun, throw him in jail, and let him face 3 civil suits from the robbers. :o

romma
June 28, 2006, 04:43 PM
Bernard Goetz :rolleyes:

JJE
June 28, 2006, 05:29 PM
I can look out my office window to Turk and Leavenworth and it's about the last place a law-abiding citizen would want to be walking around at 3:30 in the morning. Educated guess: One criminal shoots 3 other criminals.

HankB
June 28, 2006, 05:36 PM
. . . and shot them early Tuesday in the Tenderloin. Until I finished the story, I thought this was just local slang for some portion of the bad guy's anatomy . . . all I could think was "Ouch!" :eek:

I'm sure SFPD is very much interested in throwing the book at the victim - if you recall, in NYC, the prosecutor gave immunity to the perps who attacked Bernie Goetz in order to ensure their testimony - I would expect SF's DA to do the same.

To have any chance at avoiding prosecution, the victim needs to shut up. Swap out the barrel/firing pin of his pistol. Shut up. Encourage his female companion to keep quiet. Shut up. Avoid that part of town. Shut up. Get a haircut. Shut up. Lose the clothes and backpack. Shut up.

And above all, he needs to keep his mouth closed.

(I hope the witness - who'd been targeted by the bad guys earlier - didn't get a real good look at the victim. I'm sure I wouldn't have . . . )

Sistema1927
June 28, 2006, 05:40 PM
Shot in the Tenderloin? Two of them shot in the buttocks?

I guess that if it wasn't "tender" before, it is now!

QuarterBoreGunner
June 28, 2006, 05:41 PM
One criminal shoots 3 other criminals This was my thought as well; while I'd like to believe that he was a altruistic young volunteer for a all night flop house and soup kitchen hurrying home so he could rest up for another day down at the SPCA helping the little kitties and puppies find loving homes, and his back pack contained only the remains of his PB and J sammich, thermos of low-fat milk and some comic books, that his female companion was his girlfriend of 12 months that had just got off of work at the local old folks home and that they were only holding hands and he was saving up his meager wages for a promise ring and just happened to be carrying his lawfully purchased firearm that he was transporting legally with a trigger lock and the ammunition kept separate in accordance with state law...

...this may be optimistic.

Cosmoline
June 28, 2006, 05:43 PM
I hope the shooter is smart enough to deep six the iron and get out of Deadwood post haste. The SFPD and local DA will not be nice to him.

for a promise ring and just happened to be carrying his lawfully purchased firearm that he was transporting legally with a trigger lock and the ammunition kept separate in accordance with state law...

THOSE LAWS ARE WRONG AND EVIL. A man is not a criminal in my book for ignoring them, indeed I know those who have broken ********** law in order to protect themselves. To hell with that state to hell with its laws and to hell with its police forces. May they all burn long and slow.

ProficientRifleman
June 28, 2006, 08:58 PM
Ohhh!! (whine, whimper, sigh!!)

Don't get a gun...it'll only add to the violence!

profshadow
June 28, 2006, 09:16 PM
Gun? He just threw the bullets...he didn't have a gun. Heck, they were something he just picked up when he visited his family back in the mountains someplace...

Or was it like that "kung fu" movie, where he threw them ?

mp510
June 28, 2006, 09:58 PM
Well, being in SF, odds are the victim didn't have a CCW permit - so I daresay he won't be stepping forward . . .
I too would presume he does not have a permit, cont'd the immediate flight.

However, didn't somebody recently say in the L&P forum that CA has a law that protects a person from weapons charges after a legitimate self defense shooting? He definetely would lose the handgun. Civil Suits are a no brainer:(

4v50 Gary
June 29, 2006, 10:31 PM
My personal opinion (and this does not reflect the opinion of the staff at THR) as why not come forward: Civil Liability. Even if SFPD doesn't arrest him and the DA won't prosecute, the victims(?) can always file suit and then it's not a matter of settlement since settlements are cheaper than winning in court. There is something terribly wrong with our legal system today.

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