.22lr vs .22wmr revolvers


PDA






Lonestar
July 25, 2006, 10:48 PM
I had a thought that the perfect handgun for an elderly person was a .22 magnum revolver with a Crimson Trace laser sight. The recoil of the .22wmr is very manageable and the laser sight is good for those with poor eyesight. Got the idea from this article( http://www.taurususa.com/newsreviews/CBOH2003_000.cfm ). My concern is since the Taurus and S&W offering has one less shot from the .22 WMR vs .22lr is the .22 magnum worth it? I also read some opinions (www.mouseguns.com) that the .22wmr is less accurate (tumbles beyond 20ft??) and significant louder than the .22lr. Also isn't a high velocity .22lr round almost the same as a .22wmr coming out of a 2 or 3 inch barrel? My parents and most of their friend or relatives are not eldery yet, but I'm one of those guys everyone comes to for a gun question. I don't want to steer andyone the wrong way.

If you enjoyed reading about ".22lr vs .22wmr revolvers" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
whm1974
July 25, 2006, 11:08 PM
Myself I would rather have a revolver in .22 LR. For one thing ammo is cheaper, and more importantly, not every gunshop/store carries .22 WMR.

-Bill

Kurt S.
July 25, 2006, 11:22 PM
Well sir, let me make the only apples-2-apples comparison I can:

1) I'm not elderly, but getting there- 57 years young.
2) I have medium good eyesight- I wear no line bifocals
3) I have 2 NAA minirevolvers, 1-5/8" bbls, one in .22 LR and the other in .22 WMR. With either of the little devils, at 10 feet I can put 5 shots as rapidly as possible with a tiny little single action revolver into a 6" diameter tree trunk.
4) I have kind of shaky hands, it's an inherited condition. Still, slow fire I can put all shots from either gun more-or-less close to the bull at seven yards on a regular handgun target.

One more thing: the .22 WMR fired from any gun is WAY louder than the .22 LR. I can fire the .22 LR from just about any of my handguns in that caliber without ear protection*, but I've only tried that stunt once with .22 WMR.

When I get old I am going to get a Beretta 86 as a personal defensive weapon: see http://thearmedcitizen.com/gunpages/beretta86.htm

*I probably have hearing damage anyways from working around jets in the Naval Air and playing in country and rock bands in my younger days...

joneb
July 25, 2006, 11:28 PM
The .22 mag. would be my choice, higher velocity and more penatration . In a self defence situation does + 20 ft really matter ?

cookekdjr
July 25, 2006, 11:31 PM
As a defensive pistol for a person who needs very low recoil, I recommend The Ruger sp101 in .32 H&R magnum. This is a low-recoil round to begin with, and the solid steel construction dampens the recoil significantly.
Another alternative is a Ruger Redhawk in .44 magnum, but use .44 specials. The CCI Blazer .44 special load sends a 200gr bullet at about 875-900 fps, but the heavy steel frame of the Redhawk soaks up all of the recoil. The only downside is that the gun may be too heavy for some shooters. Still, its worth a try.
If I had to choose a rimfire, I don't think it matters much if one uses 22lr or 22 wmr. They are both so impotent it doesn't really matter. Maybe I'd give the nod to the 22lr just so I could practice 50 rounds a day for $1 each session. Then at least I'd know I could hit what I was aiming for.
-David

whm1974
July 26, 2006, 12:06 AM
Maybe I'd give the nod to the 22lr just so I could practice 50 rounds a day for $1 each session. Then at least I'd know I could hit what I was aiming for.

That's why I would perfer the .22lr. WMR is too expensive to plink with.

-Bill

mnrivrat
July 26, 2006, 12:09 AM
As a defensive pistol for a person who needs very low recoil, I recommend The Ruger sp101 in .32 H&R magnum.

I fully agree with the .32 magnum as a great choice and much better than the .22 rimfires for self defense. The Ruger may be a little heavy for some and Taurus makes a nice little airlight in the Model 731 where recoil is still very managable.
If reduced recoil is desired behond that level, than one can shoot .32 S&W longs in this gun or even go to the regular .32 S&W round for next to no recoil at all.

My elderly aunt shoots a Model 941B4 Taurus which is a 4 inch barreled all steel revolver in .22 Mag. Out of the 4 inch barrel the noise is not to bad, but anything shorter than that makes for ear spliting noise from the magnum . If a .22 rimfire is wanted that is less than 4 inches in barrel length I would stick with the .22 LR chambering

461
July 26, 2006, 12:27 AM
I'll add my vote for the .32mag SP-101. I'm totally in love with my 3" model and think it would be great for an elderly or frail person. Ammo availability is limited but can still be found and a few boxes are likely all a non-shooter will need anyway. That said I'd like to see the SP in .22mag as well as I think it'd be a great little plinker.

Lonestar
July 26, 2006, 10:33 AM
I thought about the .32 magnum, however I'm not sure how long that round is going to last. Seems real hard to find with Federal the only big name making ammo for it. I shot one before and wanted to buy one for myself, but I got the weird feeling that it might become the "Betamax" of the gun world, and I will be stuck with an obsolete gun. I read some people use .32 acp rounds in them, however I'm not sure that sounds too safe. I guess for someone who will probably rarely shoot it , .32 HR Mag ammo is not a real issue. For an avid elderly shooter, a 22 might be a better option.

DWARREN123
July 26, 2006, 10:54 AM
32 H&R mag in Ruger SP-101. I have one and love it. Ammo is expensive and can be hard to find sometimes. The 32 H&R mag has more power than a S&W 38 and almost reaches 38 spl.
For a rimfire I would have to go with the 22 WMR with 4" barrel. Heavier bullet, more speed, better bullets that are plated not washed like 22 LR.

cookekdjr
July 26, 2006, 11:02 AM
BTW, re: .32 Mag availability, you're not gonna see this ammo at the average Wal-mart, but it is easily available online. I carry GA Arms 100gr .32 mag loads. They (GA Arms) always have either that round or their 85gr version available. Even if they were to run out temporarily, there's always some online store that has some in stock. Worst case scenario, if ammo does dry up, you sell the gun at gunbroker to a collector. As it is now, the sp101 is a great way to go.
-David

BluesBear
July 27, 2006, 01:37 AM
My concern is since the Taurus and S&W offering has one less shot from the .22 WMR vs .22lr is the .22 magnum worth it?Yes.


I also read some opinions (www.mouseguns.com) that the .22wmr is less accurate (tumbles beyond 20ft??) No!


and significant louder than the .22lr. Louder? Yes. Significantly? No. Both will cause hearing damage fired indoors.


Also isn't a high velocity .22lr round almost the same as a .22wmr coming out of a 2 or 3 inch barrel?A .22 WMR from a 6" barrel has more muzzle velocity than a .22 Long Rifle does from a 24" barrel.
No matter what the barrel length the .22WMR will always be faster.

Lonestar
July 27, 2006, 03:03 PM
Louder? Yes. Significantly? No. Both will cause hearing damage fired indoors.

I guess I am just plan confused. I read everything from It will cause you hearing damage even with protection on to it is just a little louder that a .22lr. Any firearm will cause you some sore of hearing damage if you shot it indoors unprotected, however is it worse that a .38 or a 9mm??

BluesBear
July 27, 2006, 04:00 PM
It's percieved to be between .22LR and 9mm. ANd like the .22LR it has a reall sharp crack to it.
Because a .22s repost has a short duration people often think they do less hearing damage than they do.
Now I'm not saying that a .22 WMR will damages your hearing a much a 9mm but it would be close.

But any good hearing protection will work just fine.

mnrivrat
July 27, 2006, 04:10 PM
Not only will the barrel length on a revolver make a difference in the noise coming back to the shooters ear, but so will the size of the cylinder gap.

A persons experience , even with the same type gun, will therefore give different results. Thereby "significantly" is a subjective term. It stands to reason that the .22 WMR will produce more noise.

The measure for me is being able to shoot outdoors, without hearing protection, and not get a sharp pain in the ear when the gun is fired. While hearing protection is a good thing when shooting, it is not always something you might have available at the moment. I can shoot my aunts 4 inch barrel Model 941 in 22 mag without hearing protection outdoors and be comfortable. My brother had a 3" or 4" S&W in 22 mag (J-frame) that would give me a sharp pain in the ear when fired in the same manner. This is my experience & observation ,and your results may vary.

I think a safer choice in a small revolver when it comes to noise is to stick with the .22 LR . For self defense I can't recommend either of the rim fires cartidges when I believe there is a better alternative, but it is clear that the .22 mag should outperform the .22 LR no matter the barrel length.

deadin
July 27, 2006, 04:20 PM
I always am amazed by the "thread-drift" that invariably take place when someone asks a specific question.
In this case it was .22LR vs. .22WMR. Pretty simple question, huh?
So far it has drifted all the way to .44 Mag. I'm sure 12 gauge isn't far behind.:evil: :banghead:

Dean

BluesBear
July 27, 2006, 04:20 PM
I recently had a long, and I mean several hours long, discussion with an audiologist regarding loud music and shooting.

If you are waiting until you feel ANY pain then you are already way past the point of damage.

If you're shooting a .22 mag outdoors with no protection your hearing IS being affected.
A few shots probably won't cause any long term problems but if you're shooting several cylinders full it will show up sooner or later.
Even many air powered guns can cause hearing damage.

You have to remember that hearing damage is cumlative.
Every little bit counts.

BluesBear
July 27, 2006, 04:53 PM
Lone Star, the .32 H&R magnum will have a long life due to the fact that you can also fire .32 S&W Long and .32 S&W in it.
And both of those cartridges predate the .38 Special.

Besides, Georgia Arms loads it too.
Starline makes brass for it.

So there will ammo around in one form or another for a long time.

mnrivrat
July 27, 2006, 05:54 PM
If you are waiting until you feel ANY pain then you are already way past the point of damage.

If you're shooting a .22 mag outdoors with no protection your hearing IS being affected.
A few shots probably won't cause any long term problems but if you're shooting several cylinders full it will show up sooner or later.

No argument from me there - the simple point I addressed was that the .22 mag is much louder than the .22 LR . & :

While hearing protection is a good thing when shooting, it is not always something you might have available at the moment.

I think lonstar already had a good grasp on the possible hearing loss in shooting any firearm.

Any firearm will cause you some sore of hearing damage if you shot it indoors unprotected,

cyanide
July 27, 2006, 06:07 PM
I recently had a long, and I mean several hours long, discussion with an audiologist regarding loud music and shooting.

If you are waiting until you feel ANY pain then you are already way past the point of damage.

If you're shooting a .22 mag outdoors with no protection your hearing IS being affected.
A few shots probably won't cause any long term problems but if you're shooting several cylinders full it will show up sooner or later.
Even many air powered guns can cause hearing damage.

You have to remember that hearing damage is cumlative.
Every little bit counts.



Huh -
Do you sell ear protection ?

BluesBear
July 28, 2006, 12:41 AM
Do you sell ear protection ?No. But I use it religiously.
Plugs AND Muffs

My ears have always been a big part in my livelihood. And I have always tried to protect them as best I could.

During a recent mandated full physical I met an audiologist who was also a shooter.

VA27
August 7, 2006, 01:40 AM
If you think 22 mag ammo is expensive, price the 32, Long, Short or Mag! 22 Magnum is the way to go.

gogetumnow
August 7, 2006, 05:10 PM
If you think 22 mag ammo is expensive, price the 32, Long, Short or Mag! 22 Magnum is the way to go.

Let's see. The cheapest in stock factory new 22 Mag I can find at Midway is $7.99/50 for Remington softpoint.

The cheapest I can find factory new 32 S&W long is Aim Surplus for $6.95/50.
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/32_S_W_Long.html

Low cost winner: 32S&W Long

As stated above, you can't exactly walk into Wally World and buy 32 stuff, but if you do some shopping, you'll come out just fine.

Jeff F
August 7, 2006, 10:24 PM
My brother has a automag II .22wmr. We were shooting at an indoor range and that .22 mag was the loudest most obnoxious handgun being shot. It was louder then my .45 acp and .38 spl+, no one wanted within two lanes
ether side. I think it may be a little small for SD but it's better then a rock.

Jim March
August 7, 2006, 10:27 PM
The best 22Mag loads are the 30grain CCI +V and +V/TNT loads. At least in barrels under 4".

Gordon
August 7, 2006, 10:52 PM
Sounds like few have actually killed something with a .22 mag.:p
The .22mag is the slaughtering gun of choice around a large percentage of ranches I've seen in the western states. The reason is ; it is not an "iffy" proposition like the .22lr is-yes even behind the ear! I found this out years ago and being a 'gun person' have other options. Those who just want a clean drop with the minimum fuss go with the .22mag and never look back.
The mag in a pistol is very close in effectiveness to a .32auto, FMJ for FMJ and HP for HP.A .22mag is a good solid bottom rung in effectiveness in dropping ALL animals under slaughter conditions(including steers!) , like the .38spl is for humans.

I did know a pilot in VN of an 'Air America' plane that shot his capturers dead with a .22mag to the face from a High Standard Derringer, he said it dropped them like rocks!;)

telomerase
August 7, 2006, 11:40 PM
This thread needs more drift!

.22 mag is awfully loud and distracting. All rimfire revolvers have to have (OTBE) harder trigger pulls than centerfires. I think cookekdjr is right about .32 mag, it makes more sense to use a pistol round in a pistol.

So, what's the "best" .32 for an elderly or weak person (i.e., which has the best trigger, shortest trigger reach, etc.)? Taurus 731? Old Smith 631? Ancient I-Frame and handloaded S&W Long? The recently-discontinued 331? I like SP-101s too, but they are a bit bigger and heavier.

OK, OK, I'll throw myself out of this rimfire thread and start one on .32s....

kjaniak
August 10, 2006, 03:25 PM
I shoot the TNT rounds out of a 1-5/8 NAA mini. Nice gun for deep concealment and I wouldn't have any problems carrying a J frame in .22 mag for defense at all. If I could find a stainless version for a fair price I would be all over it.

bigdavep
May 10, 2009, 12:20 PM
I've looked up every data reference I can find regarding my 4" barreled Taurus .22 mag revolver, and best I can figure, I can launch a jacketed hollow point at somewhere around 1400 fps. For self defense, that means a supersonic impact and very good penetration in the target... bullet's small, 30-50 grain usually, so penetration is key to stoppage... nothing like speed to give you penetration!

Same revolver launching .22LR gets about 800fps.

I'm 6'4" and can carry my Taurus mag in an IWB holster with no problems.. it is my current choice for SD weapon.. little bullet probably won't go through a wall and kill a baby in the house next door, but I think the eight shots I get will probably deter Mr. Criminal inside my own house. And the noise, if you're listening from the muzzle end as criminals would be doing, is freaky. HUGE blast from such a small gun.

I suspect if you take two or three of these in the gut or the chest, you will know it, and you WILL be thoroughly discouraged.

And a revolver puts an end to the questions about how the safety works, whether I need to rack a round or not, and even what to do about a misfire. Just keep pulling the trigger.

Eight is enough. .22 Magnum is sufficient. :-)

Bezoar
May 11, 2009, 12:56 AM
well it seems the general gun guru consensus is that a 6 inch 22 mag revolver barrel gives you the same velocity as a 22lr rifle with a 18 inch barrel on it.

Wasnt it skelton or Ayoob who said the best little friend they had was a 9 shot 22 mag snubby?

Daizee
May 11, 2009, 01:08 AM
I use CCI Velocitors as my baseline "best" .22LR for hunting.
A .22mag would still beat it at most barrel lengths, I think, but remember the Velocitor is a full 40gr bullet.

Actual measured velocities for comparison (does anyone have anything similar for .22mag?):


5-shot Avg. Vel.
4" SP101 22"? Win 9422 20.5" CZ 452 Lux
--------- -------------- ----------------
Federal Auto Match
Bulk pack $10/325rds 1009 1179 N/A
40gr solid

RWS Rifle Target
40gr lube solid N/A N/A 1060
$50/500

Federal Value Bulk
$10/550rds 1037 1227 1258
36gr copper-washed HP

CCI Velocitor
40gr copper-washed HP 1106 1344 1415
$7-$8/50rds



-Daizee

Eb1
May 11, 2009, 01:20 AM
So, what's the "best" .32 for an elderly or weak person (i.e., which has the best trigger, shortest trigger reach, etc.)? Taurus 731? Old Smith 631? Ancient I-Frame and handloaded S&W Long? The recently-discontinued 331? I like SP-101s too, but they are a bit bigger and heavier.

I love my 32 H&R Mag in a Taurus 731 UL. It shoot 100 grain HP from Georgia Arms at an average of 1070 fps @ 15 feet.

P.S. My mother who is 63 takes it with her when she is not staying here. It is my carry gun, but she likes it. Now that I have the .22WMR in SA from Heritage. She will be taking it instead.

If you enjoyed reading about ".22lr vs .22wmr revolvers" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!