GATOFEO #1 Lube By Tha Half Pound An Pound


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Manyirons
July 28, 2006, 09:04 AM
Hi!

Tha MANN's thinkin on offerin tha lube in larger sizes fer savin people money, anybody interested afor he makes up his mind?

Thinkin 8oz fer 20, Lb fer 35.

Ifin yer shootin a lot er wanta spread some aroun yer buds, itsa gooder deal.

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gmatov
July 29, 2006, 04:46 AM
MI,

I think you are asking too much, ie, rippin' off.

20 bucks per 1/2 pound of waste grease? Or 2.50 a pound parrafin and the waste grease and a little olive oil to make a 1/2 pound of the same as you are?

Hey, commercialism is THE thing, today. You can get top buck for something, go for it.

Here, you should probably give a 90 % discount to forum members. Yeah, 2 bucks a 1/2 pound wouuld save a few the difference between yours and 7 buck Bore Butter, at some 7 ounce tube size.

Go screw all them idjits that don't come to sites like this.

Cheers,

George

Duncaninfrance
July 29, 2006, 07:00 AM
If you were only selling the raw material cost plus a profit markup then fine BUT you would not stay in business for more that 2 minutes George!

On top of the material costs you have to add:-
Cost of financing / stock retention, bank costs & depreciation, wages, insurance, packing, publicity, manufacturing time and resorces ( heat, cleaning, pans ) location costs, carriage, returns, order processing....................Need I say more?
Just work out how much you earned per hour when you were working then see how long it takes to make a pound of tallow. You might just be surprised my friend :cool:
Duncan

Third_Rail
July 29, 2006, 11:14 AM
To all those who are actually interested in making Gatofeo's lubricant, but not in making a big mess, it is a good purchase. The mixing has already been done, the materials are proper, etc.


Just for what it's worth, go look up how much beeswax costs nowadays. Now look up actual lamb or mutton tallow, not just "tallow". Beef tallow will work, sure, but it'll go rancid and smell awful in short order.

As to why we charge that, well, time + raw materials + a small profit. That's how business works, George. If everyone should sell things for less than what the raw materials cost, why would anyone have a business?

George, we respect ourselves, therefore our time is worth money. I'm sorry to hear that if you were selling your time, you would sell it so cheaply and expect others to do likewise.

Manyirons
July 29, 2006, 08:16 PM
Ya some kinda commie on welfare thinkin tha world owes ya there georgie? Add to tha list product liability!

Like it er not, theys a fixed cost per hour, 24 hours a day, EVER day, 365 to tha year. Jus ta keep tha doors open an that MANN workin.

Now go buy yerself some other lube by tha stick, add er up! Oh, thats right! Theys sposed ta GIVE it to ya!

gmatov
July 30, 2006, 02:48 AM
Just lost the first half of my reply. What key I hit, I don't know.

You know, if der Hauptmann were to give a price to chamber a barrell, I doubt very seriously he would ask the same hourly rate you seem to be asking for nuking some fats.

I gotta fault you for being a little greedy, you tell us we COULD use Gatefeo's recipe, but, for JUST 10 times as much, WE WILL MAKE IT FOR YOU.
That goes against the grain of a forum. We tend to tell each other how to SAVE money, and, I think, it is why many forums prohibit retailers and solicitors from posting.

You 2 kids have no concept of business. You think if you just keep pounding you will make sales. What does Jule say, anything over a quarter is yours? When do you make the sale of the century, drop the price to buy 1 get 7 free. Or a buck per whatever you are packing it in. Used sour cream containers, or did you actually go and buy blank containers?
Lard is free, if you eat bacon, beef fat is free if you ever eat a steak or a roast, lamb fat is free if you ever eat lamb.. Why ain't you babbling about chicken fat? You can get lots of that, in today's heart healthy diet.
Fat is fat, and, as I said, Fadala, the God of BP, says NO grease wil l help with BP residue.

You are selling a nostrum for which there is no disease. Shame on yunz. Go get a job, or ask the old man to teach you a little bit, not to banish you from the shop, because you APPEAR to be too dumb to DO the work.

I would hesitate to buy anything you 2 push. I don't think either of you have any concept of what you are pushing.

Dumb? I wouldn't say that, although you have called me that, or archaic, or whatever. Hey, I AM a litle older than you puppies. Just MIGHT be a little smarter than you puppies.

You haven't shown too much brilliance, to date, just, "Hey, Buy this, we guarantee it is the BEST. We don't know what it is or what it does but we DO know it is the BEST.!!!"Jule MUST be embarrased at your promotion.

I have to go to YOUR forum and see what HE says in his own defense.

You know, if you made lube in 1/2 pounds and asked 5 bucks, you would wipe Bore butter off the map. It's 7 bucks, I think, for 6 ounces. AND, you gotta know they have WAY lower raw material cost.

Cheers,

George

Duncaninfrance
July 30, 2006, 03:30 AM
Just wondering what you are going to mix all your bu****it with to make a lube George? Older does not always mean smarter and you obviously don't seem to understand business costings.
You want it cheap - you make it or get the Chinese to make it :evil:

I make my own from the original recipe in the sticky but I have to make it in my workshop, not in the house! As for Bore Butter - that stuff is worse than being down wind of a skunk!

Duncan

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 07:22 AM
Georgie, ya got me confused with tha MANN. AINT MINE, i's jus tha messenger an they's somethin else i AINT NEVER done afor, put someone on tha ignore list cause yer too ignorant ta waste time on. Old dont mean smart an ya jus proved that.

pohill
July 30, 2006, 07:57 AM
Seldom do I find myself on George's side - we've had our share of forum battles - but one thing George is not, and that's dumb. I gotta admit that I have no idea whatever the heck it is Manyirons is selling, but George is a consumer, and maybe you should listen to ALL consumers.

Now, you can get pissed at me for what I'm going to say, as a consumer, or you can heed what people say as feedback for your business - makes no nevermind to me. I read forums for info, not sales pitches or info-mercials written in Ebonics or some Mark Twain/Tom Sawyer dialect, which gets real annoying, real quick. I'm also kinda tired of hearing about tha Mann...who is tha Mann? When you come to a forum, selling something that forum readers might be interested in, it would help if you had some credentials. What exactly do you guys sell, what does tha Mann sell, and what makes what you sell worth buying? Don't tell me to visit your site - I don't want to, based on what I've read here. If what you sell is good, at a good price, it'll find US, instead of us seeking it out. Take a look at your sales numbers - are they good? Could they be better if you listen to, and stop insulting, consumers? Most likely, if it's a good product. As far as lubes - I use Bore Butter as an internal lube, and Crisco over the chambers - works great. And I use Wayne's excellent FREE recipe for lube pills (beeswax, etc). Make something better, sell it cheaper, and I'll buy it.

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 08:19 AM
POHILL, i'd rather hear you than someone thinkin they got somethin comin fer nothin.

I'm 52, hadda cleft palette all my life bad repair an aint never had no one outside tha MANN waste time on teachin me nothin. AN ya can go to his site and see!

An fer that guy i cant see anymore

http://www.bigironbarrels.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=592#592

pohill
July 30, 2006, 08:34 AM
Fair enough, I'll check it out. At least you didn't get pissed at me. But don't rule out what George has to say - you're up against Cabelas, Midway, DGW, Track of the Wolf - people that listen to everyone and dismiss no one, which is a good rule of retail. Like I said, make a good product, one that I can use, treat everyone with some respect, and you'll do well. George is feedback, plain and simple. I like to see Americans do well, and you're in a selling area that I'm interested in, but you gotta draw me in. Once in, I'm loyal, but it's not a blind loyalty - you, as a seller, have to earn loyalty. Sounds goofy, but it's true. I would listen to what George has to say, and reply, "Thanks for your feedback. It's appreciated." I might then stick needles in a George Voodoo doll (just kidding, George), but I wouldn't tell anyone.

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 09:18 AM
Pohill, i AINT gonna listen ta geoge cause hes proven beyond doubt in this case an others he aint gotta clue.

Midway and others bein distributors dont MAKE nothin, they jus handle it far as i know.

An at some point i understand tha MANN might have SOME of these companies distributin fer him.

Takes time though!

pohill
July 30, 2006, 09:32 AM
You gotta listen to what George has to say if you're going to make it work. George does have a clue - not a clue that I always agree with, but he is not a dumb guy, and he speaks his mind, which, again, is good feedback. He told you to sell 1/2 pound of lube for $5 and wipe Bore Butter off the map - he might be right. You sell good lube cheap, you'll sell alot of it, and you'll make money. Simple. But, piss George off, or anyone, and he'll tell 2 people, who will tell 2 people, who will tell 2 people, etc. Goes both ways - sell me a good product, and I'll tell 2 people, etc. Midway, Cabellas, etc do not make the products, they import and sell, and they can sell your products, too. And they will, if they're good products. Retail/selling is all about money, not who is right or wrong in their opinions. If you insult George for speaking his mind, you insult all consumers who will simply go someplace else.
Also, George was right about helping each other out on this forum. Give some free lube samples to forum members and they'll spread the word if it's good, or tell you what's wrong if it's bad. Again, this is not my invention - it's business. I'm on the East coast - give me a sample, I'll test it, and if it's good, I'll spread the world all over the East (no, I'm not looking for free stuff).
I'll bring some to the Kittery Trading Post in Maine and see what they have to say. Just remember, George might be your best friend as you start your business - he will tell you what you're doing wrong, and he is probably right.

Third_Rail
July 30, 2006, 10:36 AM
Again, guys, there's a problem with selling the lubricant that cheap. Look up how much beeswax and mutton or lamb (not beef) tallow cost. Sure, we could sell it for $1.00 more than that a pound, but then our time wouldn't be compensated, and we wouldn't be able to stay in business.


I do appreciate the feedback, truly, but I also would like you to put yourself in our shoes - is your time worth nothing? Do you work just so others can have inexpensive products, regardless of your cost?

Again, please don't just believe me; go look how much beeswax and lamb or mutton tallow cost per pound. We're not just making a price up from nowhere. :)

pohill
July 30, 2006, 11:21 AM
Put yourself in the shoes of the consumer - do we want to pay more so you guys can make a living? We have expenses, too. If beeswax is too expensive, then find a substitute, or find a product you can sell that no one else sells. If Crisco works for me, I'll keep using it instead of spending more on something that might or might not be as good. Bore Butter is a ripoff by the tube, but it's a good internal lube, so I use it (sparingly). If you sell good lube at a cheaper price, you'll sell lots of lube and make money that way (quantity). Find ways to make it cheaper - no one expects you to take a loss, but we don't want to subsidize you either (this ain't England or France). This is a capitalistic society - supply and demand and all that. Give us what we need, what we want, what we can afford. You might lose money at first, but it'll pay off later.

Third_Rail
July 30, 2006, 12:02 PM
Thanks for your feedback. :)

Duncaninfrance
July 30, 2006, 12:14 PM
Not everyone in this world wants the cheapest. Most want the best for the least and those that always buy the cheapest get what they pay for - rubbish.
If people only bought the cheapest products there would be no Jaguars, Bentleys, BMWs, Canon Cameras, Vintage Port, Champagne, Chateau La Tour, Purdey, Holland & Holland, Colt, Winchester...............................etc.,

I agree that you should listen to everyone with an opinion BUT you need to add filters after a while!

" Thank you for your input sir, your comments have been noted for the future"
Is a phrase that I would employ in certain cases` :cool:

Duncan

Third_Rail
July 30, 2006, 12:15 PM
But Duncan, some people simply don't believe that we use the best materials. Their loss.

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 01:36 PM
Make er CHEAP! HUH! THA MANN would kick my butt fer sayin somethin like that!

Itsa walmart world boys&girls!

QUALITY is tha onlyist thing BIGIRON sells and thats that!

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 01:47 PM
An mebbe THIRD RAIL'll go through this forum an see how many freebies tha MANNs given away an post links! Includin CASH fer those was helpful!

pohill
July 30, 2006, 03:20 PM
" Thank you for your input sir, your comments have been noted for the future"
Exactly what I was talking about. Definitely more professional than telling someone they're dumb, stupid, nasty, etc.
And, for the record, cheap and inexpensive are not necessarily the same.

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 04:13 PM
Sorry but when SOMEONES comments start out bein offensive i get my back up.

Take a REAL good look at what started this, accusin, sayin my BOSS isa thief, etc.

Aint so, an i AINT ashamed of defendin him.

An he AINT a customer till hes buyin, in cartalk theyed call him a jack or a tirekicker.

Aint no END ta FREE once ya start, peoples like locusts that way, so tha BOSS gets REAL selctive who he gives to.

Cause as he says, aint nobody at safeway givin a discount cause wes givin things away.

Ya got LOTS of reference for GATOFEO lube as a sticky thing top of this forum.

Sos, fars i's concerned, thanks fer tha comments, but until yas apologize, ya can pound sand.

Old Fuff
July 30, 2006, 04:50 PM
The Old Fuff must admit that he's interested. I have mixed my own lube, and don't particularly enjoy doing it. :rolleyes:

Store-bought lube is an easy alternative, but the products often leave something to be desired.

Crisco over the balls works (somewhat) at the range, but it isn't long before the whole revolver starts getting messy to handle.

If the price includes handling @ shipping that should be considered.

From my perspective, the real issue is, does the stuff make for better accuracy, and does the cylinder keep turning without special attention, longer? If it does then perhaps the extra cost of the lube (or other components) is worth it. Some folks shoot just for the fun of shooting. I do the same, but a better target/group makes it more interesting.

And I have noticed that Manyirons and Third Rail seem to be working toward products or services that will enhance accuracy.

Some are satisfied with a 6-inch (or larger) group out of a cap & ball revolver at 15 to 25 yards... :(

I'm not. :D

Third_Rail
July 30, 2006, 05:18 PM
My C&B revolver will keep about 50% of the shots on a clay at 25 yards. I'm happy, since I'm a terrible shot; I'll see what it can do if Jule works it over...

But yes, most of our services and products are for accuracy. If you want noise, that's fine for you. I very much like accurate firearms.

Manyirons
July 30, 2006, 05:56 PM
Fluff, shippin is included. Thanks fer tha question! Yup, usual fer it take work longer AN it aint messy.

gmatov
July 31, 2006, 02:59 AM
I be damned if I can see how you guys can accuse me of accusing you of ripping pipple off, even if I go up to whichever reply I made.

I DO accuse you of RIPPING pipple off, and the spelling is intentional, because you two have a habit of putting people down as dunces.

I'm surprised that Duncan is defending you. Duncan, go buy Sam Fadala's "Complete Guide To Blackpowder Shooting". On page 142 and 143, he says there is NO lube that will cut BP fouling, and this goes back to the original, real from the dead whale, sperm oil.

And, them who say Crisco is SO expensive, 3.50 for 3 pounds, go to Aldi's and buy the same for 1.69, for 3 pounds. Bee's wax is nowhere's near 20 bucks a 1/2 pound. Tallow, whether beef, lamb or pork, is nowhere's near 20 bucks a 1/2 pound, or a reasonable 35 bucks a pound, "yas gots it in bulk".

Jesus, I'd rather buy lamb, beef, pork, chicken and make my own. To my own spec as to pliancy, spreadability, whatever..

You want to REALLY make a buck, make a nozzle that fits the "Bore Butter" tube that will squirt the stuff into the chambers. As is, the damned thing has a hole about 3/4 inch diameter. You CAN'T lube chambers 'less you use a loader. You gotta use a stick of some kind, or your fingers.

That, however, would probably mean you, not the Boss, would have to pay for the die making for the plastic molding.

Nah, that ain't our bag. We just push stuff. I don't like either of you guys.

I am surprised that Pohill is defending me. I am not used to that. Thank you, Pohill.

I'd surely like to hear from your boss.

You guys are third string, at best. Has the local boiler shop laid off?

Cheers,

George

Duncaninfrance
July 31, 2006, 05:06 AM
Still does not get past the fact that you have no idea how a business needs to be run to survive George.
go buy Sam Fadala's "Complete Guide To Blackpowder Shooting". On page 142 and 143, he says there is NO lube that will cut BP fouling,

I have a copy of it thank you and and Chapter 15 covers Lubes ( page 96-99 ) and is an interesting read. More than I can say about some of the chapters. At $12.95 new the paper quality is poor and the photographs average. The cover is full colour so a good example of 'Fur Coat and no Knickers'

mike101
July 31, 2006, 07:06 AM
I've been shooting C&B revolvers off and on for 25 years. I used to use Pyrodex, now Triple 7. I have never used anything over the chambers, and have never had a multiple discharge. If your projectile fits
properly, it shouldn't be a problem. From what I've read, and always been told, chainfire is most often the result of poorly fitting percussion caps.

As for the price of lube issue- Bigiron has the right to make a profit. So, Third Rail and Manyirons, don't pay too much attention to these people. This is America, dammit! I am having some major work done to a Companion, and I think Jule's prices are quite reasonable. If these guys want to be up to their butts in animal fat, just to save a few bucks, let them. Do they realize how much bacteria is in that stuff?
I am amazed that someone would expect you to make this stuff at such a low profit, that you would have to take over the market just to make a decent buck. So, George, SPEND SOME MONEY!!! Isn't he the same guy who was giving you a bunch of crap about the power pills?

pohill
July 31, 2006, 07:33 AM
Wow, someone else who doesn't get it. I don't give a rat's behind what they charge for anything, all I'm saying is that George has the right NOT to be insulted because he offered an opinion, and maybe if they listened to what he was saying, they'd do well. Is that hard to understand? I have the right to use Crisco or Bore Butter or Bat Crap if I want. Bacteria? Gimme a break, will ya? This is America, dammit! No ****.
By the way, chainfires CAN occur at either end.

Manyirons
July 31, 2006, 08:56 AM
Wow kinda fun since i cant see tha missin guy no more! I'd say GO TO THA SITE and see tha prices tha MANN hisself put up.

Pohills right, use what ya damn well please an if yer a gentelman like say FLUFF, Mike, Duncan, i'll talk ta ya like one!

mike101
July 31, 2006, 09:38 AM
I didn't insult George. I told him to spend some money. And George does tend to get a little nasty, at times.

I know chain-fires can occur at either end. Like I said, I've been doing this for 25 years. The fact is, if your projectile is the proper size, they won't happen in the front. The chambers would be air-tight. If your caps are the proper size, they won't happen in the back, either. Wow, someone else who doesn't get it.

In the old days, they didn't use grease over the chambers. No time when you're dodging minie-balls.

Do you think that animal fat that has been sitting around isn't FULL of bacteria? Why, because you can't see it? Just ask my good friend, Sal Minella. Allow me to take this opportunity to decline any future invitations to dinner at your house.

Have a nice day, and by all means, use the bat crap.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 10:08 AM
George does get nasty at time. But if you're gonna start waving the flag with "this is America dammit" stuff, then honor George, a man who served his country.
Funny how a guy can offer his opinion that something is overpriced and get hammered for it, even get called a commi looking for handouts, but someone else can come onto the same forum asking for donations to help pay his bills and no one blinks an eye. Hmmmm.....
Let's see...what shall I worry about today...bacteria. Yep, that's the fear of the day. Bacteria in Crisco. Scaaaarryyyy......
Sal Minella...didn't he sing "Blue Spanish Eyes"? Nope, that was Sal Martino.
And, bat crap is way overpriced.

mike101
July 31, 2006, 10:52 AM
Hats off to George, with gratitude, for serving his country. However, it wouldn't kill him to be nicer.

I wasn't actually intending to Flag-wave, but this is America, and making a profit is not something to be ashamed of. Just ask the oil companies.

I have bats living in the wall next to my deck. I'll see what I can do about getting some discount bat crap, or Guano, if we are being technical.

I realize you are a macho guy (five shot cylinders are for sissies), so you are not going to worry about bacteria (I have to, due to medical issues), but animal fat that has been sitting around is dirty stuff. Look at all of the people who get deathly ill every Thanksgiving, or from potato salad that has been sitting around too long. It's worth the $20 just so someone else has to deal with it.

By the way, Crisco is vegetable fat. You don't have to fear the Crisco.

That was Al Martino, Sal's brother.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 11:11 AM
I have had several battles with George...ask him. But he made me realize that by really peeing me off to the point that I called him names, he was controlling me. I thanked him for that feedback.
And you are right about Crisco being vegetable fat - I realized that after I signed off. But, isn't the stuff Manyirons is selling animal fat?
Al Martino...nice guy. I remember the day he got caught shoplifting $60 worth of shirts, and he had $5,000 in cash on him. But, that's off topic.
I actually have a few five shot BP revolvers. And how do you know I'm a macho guy? I could be a transsexual grandmother...ah, the beauty of the Internet - anonymity.

mike101
July 31, 2006, 11:42 AM
I just got a private message from George. He told me you really are a trans-sexual grandmother, but a very macho trans-sexual grandmother.

I never heard the story about Al Martino lifting shirts, but I believe it. Back in the '70's, I worked at a hotel in Mt. Laurel, NJ. Al lived in nearby Cherry Hill. (both about 20 minutes from Philadelphia) He used to shack-up there in the afternoons with his teen-age girlfriend. He was condescending and nasty to everyone, like he wasn't really a "C-List" personality.
He was one arrogant little dude, and uglier in person than you would think. That shirt-lifting story cracks me up.

Yes, the stuff Manyirons is selling is animal fat. Be sure to wash your hands before eating anything. ;)

Third_Rail
July 31, 2006, 11:46 AM
Be sure to wash your hands before eating anything.

After handling lead projectiles (bullets or balls, doesn't matter) I would hope they'd already be washing their hands...

pohill
July 31, 2006, 12:35 PM
I could be George for all anyone knows...except the Moderator.
Al Martino, caught in Jordan Marsh Co. (retail store, Ma) early to mid 80s. Loads of cash on him, but needed some excitement I guess.
Anywho...I actually had 2 chambers ignite together in my Spiller & Burr repo a few weeks ago, and the cap in the second chamber was unfired. I had greased over the chambers, too, with Crisco (see? I should spring for the expensive stuff). The ball left a 45 degree burn mark down the brass frame (left side) to the ground. Apparently Colt beveled the mouths of the chambers to deflect burning gases in an attempt to stop chainfiring. I wonder what the chainfire stats would show in a nipple end vs chamber mouth end test...
Crap - I got "Blue Spanish Eyes" stuck in my head.

mike101
July 31, 2006, 02:00 PM
I've always used balls big enough to shave off that little ring of led around the chamber mouth, .457 in a Ruger, .454 in a Colt or Remmy, and never had a problem. I was afraid to use .451, because they went in too easily. So, I would think, if you had that little ring of lead, no matter what caliber, the spark would have had to have gotten in from the back, especially if you had the chambers greased.:confused:

Quick, start humming the theme song from Titanic.

Smokin_Gun
July 31, 2006, 02:45 PM
Pohill think Bonanza ... that'll get "Blue Spanish Eyes" out a yur head...LoL!

I still don't know why people don't use a mix of parafin, beeswax or bolwax, and olive oil. I was gonna sell in precut pills till I could see that people don't want cheap, easy, and somehing that actually works better that any dang thing I have used...and yes have tried most everything.
My 1858 Rems don't bind stock Rems. My Colts shoot al day also with out takin um apart and leanin um... Accuracy is excellant without swabbin the bore. fouling stays soft.
I have freely posted the recipe in several forums, for free...
I don't understand, I guess I should of posted it as Smokin_Gun's tub a lube for $20. Instead of Damnit I'm Broke Lube Pills. Work best between powder and Ball, can be used over ball.
Anyone wants the recipe I'd be glad to supply it or charge $20 for ingots of it. HeHe!

Sistema1927
July 31, 2006, 02:48 PM
I don't have a dog in this fight, but when I read:

Put yourself in the shoes of the consumer - do we want to pay more so you guys can make a living?

I almost had a conniption fit. Why does anyone offer a product for sale unless they intend to "make a living"? I am sure that they don't devote their time and effort giving it away for free.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 02:52 PM
I barely noticed it when it happened - just a little extra muzzle flash, no extra kick, and a missing ball (& powder). Like I said, the cap was still in place, unfired. I shoot .375s out of this gun (and they're very tight), and
380s out of my other .36s. But to me, it makes sense that most chainfiring does occur at the cap end - a cap jolts off, or doesn't fit tightly, a spark sneaks in.
The Celine Dion song? That's not too bad, but that stupid Vonage ad song...
do do do do do do do do...

Smokin_Gun
July 31, 2006, 02:52 PM
LoL! ... I give knowledge away...but I can't make anyone take it for free.
So pay me for it if anyone feels better...LoL!

Smokin_Gun
July 31, 2006, 02:56 PM
Do you still shave your forarm hair before going shootin just in case that chain fire happens?
:D

Check your PM's

pohill
July 31, 2006, 02:58 PM
to Sistema1927:
I think I'm misunderstood. I even offered to help Manyirons sell their stuff in Maine. All I meant was that I will not pay more for something that I don't want or need just to subsidize someone else. I will buy something that is good, at a good price, if I need it. I expect no handouts, no deals, no bargains, and certainly don't want anyone to not make a profit. All I was saying is that maybe they should listen to George's opinions as a marketing tool...nothing more.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 03:00 PM
SG, I tried checking them, but it wouldn't work.

Sistema1927
July 31, 2006, 06:54 PM
I think I'm misunderstood. I even offered to help Manyirons sell their stuff in Maine. All I meant was that I will not pay more for something that I don't want or need just to subsidize someone else. I will buy something that is good, at a good price, if I need it. I expect no handouts, no deals, no bargains, and certainly don't want anyone to not make a profit. All I was saying is that maybe they should listen to George's opinions as a marketing tool...nothing more.

I didn't misunderstand. If you don't want something, why buy it? If you don't like the price, don't buy it?

If the product sells, then the price is right. If it doesn't, then it isn't.

Don't get me started on George, I don't know him but I think that he needs someone to monitor his meds. His "ripping people off" comments are bizarre, to say the least.

Manyirons
July 31, 2006, 06:56 PM
Thanks Sistema! Preciate tha common sense bout that guy i cant see.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 07:09 PM
"I didn't misunderstand. If you don't want something, why buy it? If you don't like the price, don't buy it?
If the product sells, then the price is right. If it doesn't, then it isn't."

This is getting ridiculous. I don't want it, I won't buy it. Yes, if the price IS right it Will sell, if it isn't, then it isn't. Good luck to those trying to make a living - I EVEN FRIGGIN' OFFERED TO HELP. George made a comment and got hammered for it- maybe that's his own fault for being, well...George. All I said was maybe they should listen to the "meat" of what he was saying, thank him, and move on.
"Thank you for calling Cabelas...can I help you?"
"Yeah, I think the price of your lube is a ripoff..."
"Yeah, well, we hope you die you commi old man!"
Not likely...

Manyirons
July 31, 2006, 07:49 PM
Well les jus say a man tha wont talk er write to tha MANN, but call him a thief. Bet he would'nt do it right here to his face. Ask yerself, WHY wont that guy write direct to tha MANN? Address and links all aroun. Fraid of facts?

Think we're dealin with an old man gettin senile, o.k., so we treats him gentle an puts up with him.

By tha way pohill, at tha prices listed, fer cost ingredients, inventory, labor, and all those things tha MANN AINT goin be retirin ta tropical paradise anytime soon.

An i'll say er agin, hes tha nicest most generous man i ever met, an ya can check this board for what he's given.

When Cabelas is sellin it, they can eat peoples crap allthey want, but this guy dont play and i dont either!

pohill
July 31, 2006, 10:27 PM
I just used Cabelas as an example. Most successful companies treat people well. That's all. I'm sure your boss is a great guy. I'm sure his products are good. But you will run into people who might badmouth your company and/or products. Thank them, deal with them professionally, and move on - don't wish them dead. Ever see the Complaint Dept joke hand granade? I'm thinking you might use a real one. What are you gonna do if someone isn't happy with a special order item, like a cylinder, barrell, etc,? Nuke their hometown? You will not make everyone happy all the time. Good luck, gentlemen...I mean it.

Manyirons
July 31, 2006, 10:42 PM
NOW yer bein silly! Special orders filled happily. An attack an callin someone names AINT an order.

pohill
July 31, 2006, 11:53 PM
I meant, what if you fill a special order and the person doesn't like it? What if he says tha Mann did a lousy job? Even if he's wrong, you gotta deal with him. "You sent me a crooked barrel and your lube smells like dead sheep." What are you gonna do?

Third_Rail
August 1, 2006, 12:03 AM
To be as blunt as possible, we bend over backwards for paying customers. If someone is unhappy, we'll make them happy. Jule always does a little something extra for nothing; it's his signature mark of service.

For custom items, I'm not certain what Jule's refund policy is, or if we even have one set in stone. Things like that would most likely be taken on a case-by-case basis. :)

Smokin_Gun
August 1, 2006, 01:24 AM
Moments like this I wish I could buy everybody a 12 pack of Beer. Including myself and haven't had one since 8/2/93.
It's said that Beer can make you smart as it made Budweiser...
Pa Dum Pum!
How about them Black Powder Cap&Ball revolvers, fun ain't they? HeHe!

"Come on people now...smile on your brother...everybody get together try and love one another right now...LaLaLa!"

:banghead:

gmatov
August 1, 2006, 04:35 AM
Goddamn,

You guys have just gone too far.

You are shysters and tricksters, and I don't believe Der Ault has any control over you.

"Well les jus say a man tha wont talk er write to tha MANN, but call him a thief. Bet he would'nt do it right here to his face. Ask yerself, WHY wont that guy write direct to tha MANN? Address and links all aroun. Fraid of facts?"

I have, as far as I know, talked to the old MANN. I don't know that for sure, he sounded like a deutchman, but, you know, either of you could have been getting your rocks off.

HIM, I never called a thief. If you can point to a thread where I did, do it. YOU, BOTH, and MI more than Third Rail, I would call shysters, not shady lawyers, but damned bad solicitors. Solicitors are the asses who harbinge hotel lobbies trying to sell trash. That is where I place you.

To Mikeburke,

I hereby call you a lying son of a bitch. Scroll up to where you say:


New Member


Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 10

Hi Pohill- Off Topic
I just got a private message from George. He told me you really are a trans-sexual grandmother, but a very macho trans-sexual grandmother.

You don't like that, refute it.

Where you have come from I don't know. Just odd that you all of a sudden show up to defend the 35 bucks a pound waste fats sale of the century. Wonder if it is possible for the Mod to trace your IP address and see if you are a "Nom de Plume", don't know if anybody but Duncan, who, for some reasion I can't understand, thinks your super expensive fats are a bargain.

System,


I almost had a conniption fit. Why does anyone offer a product for sale unless they intend to "make a living"? I am sure that they don't devote their time and effort giving it away for free.

That's true. But, when you are trying to build up a product, it is advisable to make a sample available at a reasonable price..

There are flim-flammers all over the place. Buy this, and if it doesn't work just as we say it does, just send it back for DOUBLE your money back. Bull****!
I know these poor kids, who thought that you had to boil sheep fat to render it, and probably pork and beef and mebbe even butterfat, are spending many hours over the pots of boiling water. Der MANN is probably standing over them with a riding crop. "Stir, dumkaupf!"

This is entirely too long. Go buy a tub of margarine for a buck a half pound, schmear it all over the face of your cylinder. Every bit as good as these kids are trying to foist off on you, AT 35, CAN YOU BELIEVE IT, 35 BUCKS A POUND, 3 times the price of Prime Black Angus Steak.

I personally, would prefer to go get a good steak 3 times and use cheap grease for the BPs. 'Specially since, again, Fadala says ain't NO grease that will cut BP fouling. Water works best. And I don't mean 2 buck a bottle Vichy water. Tap water will do or Windex or a cheaper spray cleaner.

Cheers,

George

mike101
August 1, 2006, 05:45 AM
Quote- " I hereby call you a lying son of a bitch".

Good morning George! I see you are up early, and you're already miserable.

Who do you think I really am, Manyirons in disguise?
Are you a conspiracy nut, or just a regular, generic kind of nut? It's not a pen name. I am who I say I am.

OK, for all of you, who, like George, are wearing a hat that is way too tight, let me say that George didn't really send me a private message. George, I think it was pretty evident, to everyone but you, that I was kidding. I guess humor is just too difficult a concept for some people. Hell, Pohill knew I was joking! But then, Pohill has a sense of humor.

You are quite right, George. This lube is rather expensive. However, for people who don't care to wallow in foul-smelling gook, I think it's a relative bargain. For Bigiron to sell this stuff as cheaply as you would like them to, and make any money at all, they would have to take over the market. Pretty difficult, since this is a niche market as it is. Most gun-people don't know the first thing about black-powder guns, or their historical significance, or history period, for that matter. They look upon a gun as a tool, like a screw-driver, and associate no romance with it.

George, it's not nice to call people names like "shyster, thief, rip-off, and der Fuhrer", and ask them if the local boiler factory just laid off. You should really lighten-up on that stuff. Try more fiber in your diet, or Xanax, or something, and cheer up!

Thank you for your feedback. :neener:

Manyirons
August 1, 2006, 06:59 AM
What tha HELL?

This george guy's aroun tha bend!

But THANKS FER THA FEEDBACK:neener:

pohill
August 1, 2006, 08:02 AM
Mr Moderator,
This has gotten crazy. Maybe the following rule, taken from, IRONICALLY, the Big Iron Forum, would be a good one to adopt, if it doesn't already exist here:

"absolutely no personal attacks. Attack the argument, not the arguer."

Manyirons
August 1, 2006, 08:16 AM
Uh huh!

Thas why i's jus thankin him fer his interest. An he WERNT arguin, he WAS an is makin insults an accusations!

See argument ina dictionary. Ima dumb hick but i know tha diff!

mike101
August 1, 2006, 11:16 AM
For the record, I don't work for Bigiron. If I did, I would proudly admit it. So, they are not MY super expensive fats.

You know the old saying, "You can't stuff a steak into your cylinder chambers." ;)

Mike

Third_Rail
August 1, 2006, 11:29 AM
George, I'm going to leave most of your post alone and just point out one thing - we do actually offer a sample at a reasonable price. A stick of this lube, standard size (same size as Alox, etc.) for $5, including shipping. If you'd like to try it, it's not much of an investment, and you might be surprised with how it works.



Also, for the Nth time, the tallow is lamb, not pork or beef. Those would spoil too quick for longer term storage to be possible, and we won't compromise on quality.



As for everyone egging George on, leave it alone; remember, attack the argument, NOT the arguer. :)

Stickjockey
August 1, 2006, 11:56 AM
Just a quick reminder to check the sign on the wall, lads:

3.) As a family-friendly board, we ask that you keep your language clean. If you wouldn't say it in front of your dear old Grandma, you probably don't want to say it here.
4.) Spamming, trolling, flaming, and personal attacks are prohibited. You can disagree with other members, even vehemently, but it must be done in a well-mannered form. Attack the argument, not the arguer.

Manyirons
August 1, 2006, 12:04 PM
Hi!

Considerin this is tha HIGH ROAD, i'm sayin sorry ta anyone offended. I aint a thief, neithers my BOSS an neither Third Rail. My back gets up REAL quick an i shouldnt have let someone bait me

Jus cause SOME like low road dont mean i gotta follow.

Duncaninfrance
August 1, 2006, 06:18 PM
...don't know if anybody but Duncan, who, for some reasion I can't understand, thinks your super expensive fats are a bargain.

I suggest that you re-read my comments on the cost of running a business and you will see that I have not commented on the level of the price of this particular item. With all the pressures that companies are under these days good costing is the basis of security. It only remains for me to suggest that if you don't agree with my comments then you don't understand business and it's risks.

Sorry George but I am just :fire: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: with your attitude or should I say " The way you critisize "

Duncan

gmatov
August 2, 2006, 04:19 AM
Duncan,

I have absolutely NO idea what you are saying. Is it that it costs YOU so much to make something that WE should be HAPPY to pay that inflated price, because it costs you so much to make it in small batches?

Our entrepeneurs don't seem to be making it in SMALL batches. They are offering to sell us all we want, at 35 USD per pound. Mebbe the USD is SO cheap, over there, that it seems a bargain.

The cost of running a business? I was under the impression this was a going concern. The costs are PART of the business. There is overhead, I would assume already dialed into the Gunshop in general. These are peripheral expenses.

mikeburk (no "e")

George, I think it was pretty evident, to everyone but you, that I was kidding.

I don't give a damn that you think you were kidding. I don't think you were kidding. NEVER say I sent you any such tripe. You DO make yourself much less believable when you come here and flat out lie. AND, you DID. SO, screw you. I don't know who you are, you don't seem to be MI, he talks all ebonics, you aren't der hauptmann, he has good diction for a man with English as a second language, and you type a little differently than third rail.

As though you decided that using proper diction would make you seem to be a new poster.

I do not care what fat you use, lamb or beef or pork or ham, they will all go rancid with time. BHA and BHT will slow the decomposition. Don't know if you can buy it or if you know how much to use for a given batch.

Hell, fats go rancid in the freezer at 0 degrees. Oxidation happens, you ain't gonna stop that without chemical interference.

Goddamn, you guys don't know how I hope your "enterprise" gets off the ground. I won't pay 35 bucks a pound for what I make for the cost of a little of my olive oil, and I REALLY do gotta buy some pomace, the EVOO is too expensive for BP lube. As I said, I get my lamb fat as free as you can, the melt from my dinner. Beef fat the same, bacon fat, I got lots of and can't tell the difference, and it does not go stinky after a few months.

Belittle me all you want, you are still getting too rabid for most forums.

Cheers,

George

finlander
August 2, 2006, 06:18 AM
Nice little conversation we are having here, huh? I just plain mix olive oil and coconut butter and then spread it all over my revolver and am haappy with it. Seems it makes ramming balls on chambers easier. Whatever.

mike101
August 2, 2006, 06:20 AM
Now you went and made me mad, which is pretty hard to do, so, you accomplished your mission. I realize you enjoy pissing people off. You have alot of gaul, calling anyone else "rabid".

Quote- "NEVER say I sent you any such tripe". Who the hell are you, and what are you going to do about it, you miserable old jerk? Maybe you should get your fat from between your ears. That ought to be cheap enough for you.

I use good diction because I went to grade school, not to make you think I was a new poster. Go ahead and have the moderator investigate me. You are not worth the effort it would take to launch a conspiracy against you. Get some help!

I was most certainly kidding about you sending me a message. Don't you know what ;) means? Evidently everyone else gets it. Furthermore, I will post whatever I please, regardless of how you feel about it. If you don't like it, sue me.

You are a self-important, pompous ass, which is one reason nobody likes you, and the most miserable, nasty human being I have encountered in my life, which is the other reason.

How is the weather in Washington, D.C. today, George? Wonder how I know where you live? Now you really have something to investgate! Hint- No, I am not a cop!

Stick your feedback where the Sun don't shine, creep.

Now, you are on my Ignore List, so F' OFF.

finlander
August 2, 2006, 07:39 AM
Well well, seems we discussing in a kindergarden are we?

Duncaninfrance
August 2, 2006, 07:41 AM
Duncan,

I have absolutely NO idea what you are saying.

That,George just proves what I thought and probably a lot of others here also think the same.
You obviously live in a permenant 'senior moment'.
I don't think I will comment on your posts in the future.

:p
D

pohill
August 2, 2006, 08:07 AM
To Finlander...
Not to change the subject, which is VERY interesting...how are the gun laws in your country? Pretty broad question, I know, but maybe you could give an overview...
Thanks.

mike101
August 2, 2006, 08:29 AM
I have to hand it to you, Duncan. You are unflappable.

I apologize to any of you who were upset, or disappointed, in any way by my little rant, as long as you are not "He whose name shall not be spoken".
:rolleyes:

Mike

Manyirons
August 2, 2006, 08:55 AM
My BOSS says COVENTRY!!! Don know what that really means, guess its ignore.

Stephen A. Camp
August 2, 2006, 09:30 AM
Hello. I would ask that everyone "think twice" and "type once" before anything gets so out of hand that problems arise.

Thank you all in advance.

Best to you and yours.

pohill
August 2, 2006, 09:48 AM
I'm thinking that all this was kinda my fault, in an offbeat way, because I defended George. I should have let it die down. My only point was that Big Irons should listen to all complaints and respond professionally. Maybe they will in the future. I hope you guys do well. As far as George...I learned awhile back that George is unflappable, and tough. He made me say (type) things that I normally wouldn't say to anyone. He got under my skin and controlled me. I learned something from that. Ever see the show "Punked"? Well, we've all been "George'd." (Let it go, George - I'm only kidding. Remember, I stuck up for you). I still believe that the essence of what George said to Big Irons was correct; his delivery is not for the faint hearted.

Manyirons
August 2, 2006, 09:54 AM
Pohill, callin someone a thief AINT critical or arguin its INSULTIN.

As ta whoever, well, yer right. figure jus a sad ol man wantin somebody ta pay attention to him.

But I AINT!

Mr. Camp! Yer right an i'd like ta ask ya ta close this sad thread please!

Stephen A. Camp
August 2, 2006, 09:56 AM
Hello. I'm not into black powder and know very, very little about it and much less the lubes, but was called in on the thread as a moderator before it gets out of hand. It is certainly not a requirement that everyone agree on everything or even anything, but as per the rules here, it is necessary that "deliveries" be civil.

Part of the problem is that we cannot see each other when having cyber discussions, hear voice tones, and so forth and this can lead to misunderstandings or taking words the wrong way and lead to "spirited discussions" or " strong deliveries", etc, or other euphemisms for unacceptable behavior.

Since the original thread poster has requested that it be closed, so be it.

Thanks again to all.

Best.

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