[Jedi_7.62]

I was looking at a .357 lever and somewhat interested until I looked at rifle ballistics for a .357. I'm not impressed.

Just wondering what options there are?

Does a .45 long colt work in a .45 pistol too or is it a special rifle round?

I would be interested in rifle performance closer to that of say .30 - .30. Not necessarily that good but more in that direction.

Am I hoping for too much?

Uses would be varments and paper. More of a play toy but I'd like to be able to kill coyotes w/ it.

[Dorrin79]

I was under the impression that .357 out of a carbine is roughly equal to .30-30.

You can also find carbines like the Marlin 1895 (?) in .44 Magnum and .45 Long Colt

If you're interested in autoloaders, there are several 9mm, .40 cal, and .45 cal carbines out there (Kel-Tec Sub2K, Ruger PC, Hipoint, Marlin Camp Carbines (no longer in production though))

[TallPine]

What you are asking is basically impossible unless your handgun is one of those single shot rifle cartridge pistols.

Yes, the 45 (long) colt is a revolver round (rimmed) while the 45 ACP (auto colt pistol) is a semi auto pistol cartridge (the 1911 etc).

If you have a Ruger or comparable revolver and a newer Winchester or Marlin lever action you can buy (expensive!) or handload 45 LC up to or beyond 44 mag levels. But don't ever shoot them in a Colt SAA or other revolvers!

But you are still not at 30-30 peformance. For one thing, you are looking at a heavier bullet and you will see a lot of drop at longer ranges.

Varments (sic) ...? Not if you are talking prairie dogs at 200 yards :)

At 75 to 100 yards you can take coyotes or deer with the hot 45 loads.

You can kill paper too, with the right shot placement :D

[TallPine]

I was under the impression that .357 out of a carbine is roughly equal to .30-30.

That would be true of some of the lightly loaded "cowboy" 30-30 ammo.

[H Romberg]

They do make a 6-gun in 45-70 you know. Painful, but quite effective. :D

[Jedi_7.62]

If I was wanting swapable ammo for revolver and lever rifle would there be any options other than .45, .44, and .357?

I was using a Ruger Blackhawk recently and thought it would be cool to have a lever rifle to match it. I looked at a chart and was rather unimpressed by rifle performance of .357 and can only find #'s for the .45 in .45 - 70 nice but probably bit much for pistol.

leaning towards .44 still almost 18" drop at 200 yds but ft lbs are better.

Just fishing,



Any balistic charts other than Winchester's? online

[Desert Dog]

I have a .45 Colt Blackhawk and a Puma .454 that I shoot .45 Colt heavy loads almost exclusively through.

Out of the rifle, my hot handloads drop about 2 to 3 inches at 200 yards, which is comparable to the 30-30. However, a 30-30 slug is typically 150 grains in weight. My .45 slugs are 300 to 350 grains. :what:

My handloads exceed 30-30 specs out to about 250 yards, where both calibers drop off considerably...

Mike

[ChristopherG]

Remington has a cool ballistics feature that allows side-by-side comparison of various cartridges, including .44, .357, 30-30, et al.
cg

[Jedi_7.62]

Remington's site is pretty cool. Thanks,

However under centerfire They didn't have .357 or .45
except .45 - 70

I did see that the .30 - 30 and 7.62 x 39 are a lot closer ballistically than I ever thought. Kind of interesting.


Thanks for the help,

[Jedi_7.62]

Quetions???????

Can a .45 - 70 rifle safely fire standard .45 pistol rounds?

Can a .357 rifle fire .38 rounds the same as a .357 pistol?

What is .454??? Longer .45 round??

Thanks for the education?

[cratz2]

What exactly are you wanting to do? CASS shooting? Any of them will work. Hunting? 45 and 44 should cover most needs with the right bullets. What's your budget? 357 magnum, 45 Colt and 44 magnum will probably be best. Sounds like you have all sorts of more research to do.

In lever action and revolver type guns, you have the following options:

.357 Magnum
.41 Magnum
.45 Colt
.44 Magnum
.454 Casull
.45-70
If you get more into it, you could also throw in 44-40.

In pistols/carbines you have the following:

9mm
40S&W
.45ACP
If you look abit more a stretch your budget you could also probably do 9x23 and 10mm.

[cratz2]

As for the 44 Special in a 44 magnum rifle or 38 Special in a 357 mag rifle, I think it varies a bit from rifle to rifle. Many do but I wouldn't count on it as absolute gospel. Again, other than just versatility, why would you want to shoot 38 in a 357 rifle? For hunting, there's going to be relavitely few things you can hunt with a 38 Special that you couldn't hunt with a 22LR with fast bullets.

Not to sound too negative or too questioning, but we need to know what you are wanting to do in order to give you good answers. Without knowing more, I'd say a Super Blackhawk and a Marlin in 44 Magnum would make about the best hunting combo while a 357 Magnum revolver and rifle would be where I would go for plinking or getting into cowboy shooting.

[cratz2]

And for comparing the 357 magnum to a 30-30, I'd say they might be roughly comparable in the real world (as opposed to on paper where the 30-30 will still dominate) out to 50 yards or so. But I woulnd't hesitate taking a deer at 150 yards with a 30-30 while I wouldn't even consider it with a 357 magnum unless I was starving.

[Desert Dog]

Can a .45 - 70 rifle safely fire standard .45 pistol rounds? NO!!!!

Can a .357 rifle fire .38 rounds the same as a .357 pistol? Yes

What is .454??? Longer .45 round?? .454 Casull. A high pressure round that is dimensionally the same as a 45 Long Colt round except for length, in which it is .1" longer so it will not chamber in a 45 LC chambered weapon.

I shoot .454 shorts :D (Hot .45 Long Colt)

Mike

[Jedi_7.62]

Thanks for the info.


I'm mostly seeking information right now.

No specific purpose most common use would be paper and I would like it to be able to reliably kill a coyote. I like bigger as opposed to smaller so I want the most power out of a lever rifle and pistol combo. This idea is somewhat inspired by the cowboy stuff but I'm not looking to compete or anything just a play toy and something I think will be cool. I like the idea of swapable ammo just cause I find it an interesting idea. For strange circumstances I guess.

Not looking to hunt deer with it or anything. I don't think there is an apropriate rifle in this category for that.

or is there?


Just looking to learn from others knowledge,

Making a wish list I guess.

My next purchase coming soon is a savage .30 - 06.

It'll be some time before I get around seriously acquiring what we are talking about here.

Again Thanks for the info,

[TallPine]

No specific purpose most common use would be paper and I would like it to be able to reliably kill a coyote. I like bigger as opposed to smaller so I want the most power out of a lever rifle and pistol combo. This idea is somewhat inspired by the cowboy stuff but I'm not looking to compete or anything just a play toy and something I think will be cool. I like the idea of swapable ammo just cause I find it an interesting idea. For strange circumstances I guess.

You would probably be best off with the revolver/lever rifle combo in 357, then - just because of the ammo price.

357 should kill a coyote unless he is high on crack or something :)

[Mike Irwin]

"If I was wanting swapable ammo for revolver and lever rifle would there be any options other than .45, .44, and .357?"

Options include (including those you mentioned):

.22 LR
.32-20
.38 Spl.
.357 Mag.
.38-40
.44-40
.45 Colt.
.44 Mag.

There are likely some others, but I'm disremembering right now.

[cratz2]

I understand all about wish lists. :p

The guy I know that's taken the most coyote of anybody I personally know has taken most of them with a Winchester lever rifle from about 1985. Has an old 2.5x or 2.75x Weaver scope and I'd suppose that he takes well over 100 a year, mostly with that rifle.

I like a bit bigger boom so I'd probably lean towards a 44 Magnum. Recoil in a rifle will be minimal with either one, certainly easily controlled. Just a bit more versatile and no much more expensive to shoot the magnums in. If you feed it specials, the 44 would certainly be pricier than the 38 in a 357 rifle but again, not all rifles chambered in 357 Magnum will reliably cycle 38 Specials. Just though I'd restate that.

[Frohickey]

The 45Colt wheelgun, and Rossi combination would be the better. Or, how about a 454Casull wheelgun, and Rossi combination. You can shoot 45Colt or 454Casull in both the pistol and the rifle. Sure, your shooting distance is not as good as a normal rifle round, but maybe you can do some special spitzer-style 454Casull loads, that you load single-shot mode in the rifle.

[six 4 sure]

As many have stated the first thing you have to realize is that you are never going to get great accuracy/balistics from a pistol round in a rifle. You should be able to achive minute of coyote or minute of pie plate out to a 100 yards or so, but that's about as good as it gets.

I personally have one pistol/rifle combo in .357. I have a Win 94 Trapper (probably my favorite rifle) and a S&W Mod 28. I would also suggest the .357 due to cost of ammo and availability.

Unless you reload (which I would suggest except it's more addictive than crack) I would choose from either the .357 or .44. There is a much better selection of factory ammo. Don't get me wrong the .45 Colt is a good round, but it's true potential isn't realized unless you reload.

Six

[Jedi_7.62]

I think I've decided .357 would be the better option.

It fits my criteria and has cheaper ammo. I was considering the .44 but didn't feel like it really offered that much more.

However, the jury is still out on the .45 long colt.

Am I correct in believing that anything chambered for .45 long colt will handle .45 ACP?

How does the .45 long colt compare to the .44?

I've been unable to find rifle ballistics for the .45 long colt.

[Triad]

Am I correct in believing that anything chambered for .45 long colt will handle .45 ACP?


No.

[Andrew Wyatt]

.45 LC is not even close to .45 ACP dimentionally.


.45 LC is rimmed. .45ACP is not.

[six 4 sure]

"Am I correct in believing that anything chambered for .45 long colt will handle .45 ACP?"

This is possible in ONE and only ONE case that I am aware. Ruger offers an additional cylinder in 45 acp that can be used in a Blackhawk chamberd for .45 (long) Colt.

The .45 Colt is capable of being loaded equal to or better than the .44 Mag. But these are reloads only. Factory ammo selections just isn't as good for the .45 Colt. There are a few "hot" loads including silvertips and Corbon, but most everything else are "Cowboy loads".

For a more detailed explaination, do some searching in the reloading section at www.thefiringline.com . It may take awhile, but there is some good information and links to be found.

Six

[NordicG3K]

Here's a 9mm combo and a 10mm combo.

http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/1310754.jpg

http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/1310753.jpg

[TheLastBoyScout]

Didn't Ruger make a wheelgun in .30 Carbine? Maybe try one of those and an M1 Carb.

[tiberius]

Didn't Ruger make a wheelgun in .30 Carbine? Maybe try one of those and an M1 Carb

Excellent! Yes, I believe that Ruger still makes the Blackhawk in .30 Carbine. I have been meaning to pick one of these up for years, but have just never pulled the trigger (so to speak).

My combo is a Ruger Blackhawk and Winchester '94 Trapper (centenial edition with the oversize loop) in .44 RM. These are both excellent shooters. I do plan to pick up a Marlin .357 one of these days as well.