opinions on their muskets?


August 16, 2006, 11:20 PM
They sell flintlock muskets. The catch is that the vent hole is not drilled. They say that a gunsmith can drill this later.
Anyone have experience with these arms?
Can't I just drill this myself? (or drill and tap for a screw-in vent liner?)
-If so, then what size hole?
I'm interested in their Long Land Pattern Brown Bess Musket.

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August 17, 2006, 01:36 AM
Seen um, most made in india all of em fars i knows. Theys jus o.k., lock may er may not spark right, an barrel might not be tha strongest stuff made. No vent means theys legal decorators an they AINT been tested with powder.:uhoh:

Loyalist Dave
August 17, 2006, 08:07 AM
There are groups in reenacting that swear by them. It's a myth that every barrel with a proof mark has been tested by firing. To properly proof anything, the pressure must far exceed the intended purpose. While the item (a barrel, hydrolic tube, what have you) may have held in testing, it may have been weakened by the test. So a proper proof test of a barrel takes a barrel at random from a batch, stresses the heck out of it, it's then inspected, and the rest are proof marked.

The reason they aren't drilled is that they sell to Europe, and drilling makes them actual firearms, not "antique firearms" as they are defined by the GCA of 1968 here in the US. You can get a similar musket, ready to fire, but shipped with the lock in another box, from Loyalist Arms, and another company is Middlesex Village.


August 17, 2006, 04:07 PM
Could you direct me to a forum or site where they discuss these arms.

August 17, 2006, 04:39 PM
Sat so? Funny how tha old english proof house proved every barrel. Mebbe in third world places or spain?

August 18, 2006, 04:10 AM
Any test is only as good as that specific test. In the UK for instance cars that are 3 years old have to pass a Ministry of Transport test (MOT) to confirm that they are roadworthy and safe to drive. The test is then repeated every year. All that this means is that on that particular day, at that particular time the vehicle complied with the requirements. We have the same type of thing in France only it starts when the car is 4 years old and is then done every 2 years!
The point is this. Between the original testing and when you buy the item be it rifle, pistol, car or anything else, the status can change because of use/abuse/ignorance etc., Just because it is proof marked it does not make it is automatically safe.
This rambling was brought to you by an ex Health and Safety and Quality Assurance Manager - where test certificates abound :cuss: :cuss: :cuss: :cuss:


August 18, 2006, 07:46 AM
OH ya! We knows about car inspections bein mostly window dressin, places ta eat all thats mostly a joke.

Ifin it were NEW an fer example hadda BIRMINGHAM proof (I learn a LOT from tha MANN!) i'd trust er.

An yer right about USED! Ya never know who did what.

Loyalist Dave
August 18, 2006, 01:27 PM
The question was about new Indian made barrels, and the only other option is new Italian made barrels, in factory production bess muskets.


Loyalist Dave
August 18, 2006, 01:29 PM
For the original post writer, Google "Revlist", and then check the archives for discussions on the current production bess.


August 18, 2006, 01:48 PM
An what i'm sayin ifin tha ORIGINAL brown bess could take a proof each an ever barrel, no exceptions, then tha same applies ta these indian barrels.

August 18, 2006, 04:36 PM
Funny thing .. doesn`t really pertain but made me think of it ... i won a can of black powder last year off a blanket shoot .. the can said made in China ..don`t care for things made in China so it went to the back of the powder box ... ran short of powder the other day ..and figured oh well better than nothin , so i tried it ..hey good as Goex to thinking .. Black Powder China .... They invented the dang stuff !! bet they have the makein down pat ! lol

August 18, 2006, 06:54 PM
LOL!! I HOPE theys got it right by now! Jus curious, hows tha can marked?

August 18, 2006, 10:36 PM
Thanks for the info.

August 18, 2006, 10:42 PM

I own a Bess from Loyalist and another like the ones sold from Military Heritage. Loyalist tunes the lock and it is good to go when it arrives. The others don't tune the lock, so the frizzen needs to be hardened and the touch hole needs to be drilled. My friendly gunsmith had to remove the breech plug and add metal to it's face to fill the threads of the barrel, as the barrel had more thread than the plug a possible aid to rust. He installed a touch hole liner, all the work cost me $50, which is cheap. If I had to do it over again I would stick with Loyalist, the extra cost was worth it.


August 19, 2006, 02:00 AM
Read my post from May 29th in this related thread:

There are many related threads from knowledgable buyers of Indian guns with first hand experience on this muzzle loading website if you desire, just search by the company names, "Indian" etc... or post asking for more information under the "flintlocks" forum catagory. Here's a referral link:

Dave Markowitz
August 19, 2006, 10:32 PM
I recently got to handle RON in PA's Middlesex Armory Brown Bess. The workmanship was pretty good and the lock threw a good spark. I'm very interested to see how it shoots (he hasn't fired it yet).

August 20, 2006, 09:47 PM
Dave, let us know how it shoots.

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