So you want to fight California gun laws?


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50 Shooter
August 25, 2006, 04:29 PM
I'm going to post this here and anywhere else that I can think of, feel free to post it every where you want.

Seeing how this issue started in this thread http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=217614 and the idea came up as a combination of ideas, here it goes.

If you truely want to help us out in California because you hate the gun laws that the politicians keep freely passing here, here's the idea. "We" as gun owners need to take a stand against **********. This is going to involve contacting ALL gun Mfg's and even aftermarket Mfg's to tell them to stop selling to all agencies (law enforcement) if AB352 passes. If they DO NOT stop there will be a Nationwide ban against them. Here's just a piece of info for people out there, I spoke to someone that know's Ronnie Barrett. He asked other Mfg's to follow his lead but they refused. Reason given was the "stockholders" had to be kept happy.

So, if they want to keep the "stockholders" happy they will need to listen to the American public. This is where "we" the people ALL need to come together and let them know we're tired of Kali gun laws. Let them know they will feel it in their pocket book and from the "stockholders" if they continue to sell firearms to **********.

Please feel free to start adding contact info for all gun Mfg's so that people can start writing, calling and emailing.

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knoxx45
August 25, 2006, 04:58 PM
Your post gave me a bright idea. How many of us are stock holders of gun companies. I own a couple of hundred shares of S&W and Olin. Who will be getting a call from me sating that I AM a stock holder, and I fully support the ban to law enforcement.

50 Shooter
August 25, 2006, 05:08 PM
Smith & Wesson

By Email: qa@smith-wesson.com



By Telephone:
1-800-331-0852 (USA)
Mon-Fri 8:00AM-8:00PM Eastern Time

1-413-747-3286 (International)
Mon-Fri 8:00AM-5:00PM Eastern

By Fax:
1-413-747-3317 (USA)
1-413-731-8980 (International)



By Mail:
Smith & Wesson
2100 Roosevelt Avenue
Springfield, MA 01104

ArmedBear
August 25, 2006, 05:19 PM
An important part: credibility.

Does anyone know if there are currently manufacturers who don't sell to CA agencies? It needn't be for any particular reason; it's just important that they don't.

A mere threat may not be credible, since the attitude might be, "What choice do they have?"

However, a web site listing any manufacturers who already meet our criteria, or nearly do could go a long way. E.g., if a manufacturer sells to a pro-gun county agency, but no where else, they too could be noted as a preferred source.

Then, the threat will be more like: We don't have to buy from you. We can and will buy from these manufacturers instead.

Thoughts about this?

Thefabulousfink
August 25, 2006, 05:49 PM
We also need to find one or several of the gun advocacy groups to help champion this cause (or form our own). Some one that can collect donations, run adds, and contact lobbyists. A dedicated website would be nice as well. The bigger, more professional, and more vocal that we appear, then the greater chance the gun companies will listen and the stockholders will get nervous.

Armedbear is right as well, we should be very public about the companies that support our cause. Encourage people to buy from them and show the benifits of supporting us.

NukemJim
August 25, 2006, 05:49 PM
Does anyone know if there are currently manufacturers who don't sell to CA agencies?

Ronnie Barrett of Barrett Firearms Mfg Inc.

NukemJim

Lupinus
August 25, 2006, 05:53 PM
more need to follow his lead.

************ wants its citizens disarmed or at least as close to disarmed as they can weasel, I say it's time their law enforcment get a taste of the same thing.

rangermonroe
August 25, 2006, 05:56 PM
Maybe we chould contact Mr. Barrett and get his thoughts and advice on this.

I am on board in any case.

Zundfolge
August 25, 2006, 06:11 PM
Here's what I've pulled from a few company web sites


------------------------------------------------

GLOCK Inc. USA, Canada
6000 Highlands Parkway
Smyrna, GA 30082
USA
Tel.: +1 770 - 432 1202
Fax.: +1 770 - 433 8719

------------------------------------------------

TAURUS CUSTOMER SERVICE TEAM

Phone: (305) 624-1115
Fax: (305) 624-1126

Mailing Address:
16175 NW 49 Ave.
Miami, FL 33014

------------------------------------------------

Kimber America

General consumer information & questions; catalog requests:

info@kimberamerica.com

Phone Numbers:
General consumer information & questions; catalog requests:
(800) 880-2418

Custom Shop inquires
(914) 964-0771 Ext: 228

Military & Federal Sales Inquires
(914) 964-0771 Ext: 243
fax (914) 964-9340

Physical addresses:

Corporate Manufacturing

Kimber Mfg., Inc.
1 Lawton Street
Yonkers, NY 10705

Marketing & Sales
Kimber
2590 Hwy. 35, Suite B
Kalispell, MT 59901

------------------------------------------------

Beretta U.S.A. Corp
17601 Beretta Drive
Accokeek, MD 20607,
USA
To contact Customer Support, call (800) 636-3420
http://www.berettausa.com/contact_us.htm

------------------------------------------------

Kahr Arms
http://www.kahr.com/email.html

Phone & Address

Wholesale Division
Contact: Frank Harris
Mailing Address:
P.O. Box 220
Blauvelt, NY 10913

TEL: 845-652-8535
FAX: 845-735-4610

Consumer Sales
Mailing Address:
130 Goddard Memorial Dr.
Worcester, MA 01603
Attn: Sales Dept.

TEL: 508-635-1449, 508-635-1450
FAX: 508-795-7046

Dealer Sales
Contact: David Konn
Mailing Address:
13833 Wellington Trace Road
Unit E4, #182
Wellington, FL 33414

TEL: 845-652-8537
FAX: 561-656-1549

Consumer Service
Mailing Address:
130 Goddard Memorial Dr.
Worcester, MA 01603
Attn: Service Dept.

TEL: 508-635-1400, 508-635-1440
FAX: 508-795-7046

------------------------------------------------

SIGARMS, Inc.
18 Industrial Drive
Exeter, NH 03833
Ph: 603-772-2302
Fax: 603-772-9082
http://www.sigarms.com/

SIGARMS Academy
233 Exeter Road
Epping, NH 03042
Ph: 603-679-2003
Fax: 603-679-1639
http://www.sigarmsacademy.com/

Customer Service Department 603-772-2302

------------------------------------------------



There's more out there so keep posting contact info.


Someone who's good at such things should type up an outline of what should be in these letters, emails and/or phone calls.

Liberal Gun Nut
August 25, 2006, 06:26 PM
This boycott has a chance of working. If this thing passes, few of these manufacturers will continue selling guns in CA anyway. It won't be worth it. AB 352 applies to LEOs equally. California will return to the days of the revolver.

IMPORTANT: The message should not be, "stop selling to LEOs". It should be, "don't introduce any models that comply with the California law". Which, by default, means no more sales to LEOs also.

A simple message: "Glock, don't introduce a California model."

Thefabulousfink
August 25, 2006, 06:34 PM
I think the chief idea is to get the gun companies to tell CA that they wont sell to them BEFORE the bill is passed. That way it will lose LE support and be seen as too costly to the politicians. You know that CA LE agencies aren't going to be forced to comply with this because no gun company can afford to make a this new "Laser-Gun" just to sell in CA.

The anti's know this and are trying to use this as a "back door" ban. The ATF and CA DOJ will rule that the LE are exempt from the laws of the state and they can use normal weapons. We need gun companies to make it clear that IF this legislation passes normal weapons won't be available to the police if they aren't available to the public.

Euclidean
August 25, 2006, 06:38 PM
Actually, what you need to do is swing is so that our brothers in no arms in Kali can buy something to protect themselves with, but the state agencies can buy nothing.

50 Shooter
August 25, 2006, 11:07 PM
So who wants to start up a website? Isn't there still places out there that offer free websites? It doesn't have to be fancy, just to the point.

VARifleman
August 26, 2006, 01:06 AM
Les Baer Custom
29601 34th Ave | Hillsdale, IL 61257
Phone (309) 658-2716 | FAX (309) 658-2610
lesbaer@starband.net

NorthernExtreme
August 26, 2006, 02:41 AM
Mr Barrett just made up my mind for me. He'll be getting my money by the end of the month. Don't forget, Gun and accessory manufactorers are not in business to not sell their product. We need to let them know there will be a reward from the rest of us for helping the people of Kfornia. I would also like to know which companies are willing to sell to the Kfornia Police weapons that don't comply with the restrictions on its Citizens.

There should also be a price for not helping out!

kludge
August 26, 2006, 10:52 PM
We have to remember that Kali is a HUGE market. >12% of the US polulation lives there. >36 Million people. If 1% of the population buys one gun new a year that's 360,000 guns per year, and at $500/gun, that's $180 Million per year. Over 10 years it's a nearly $2 Billion pie. Would you tool up to have part of a $2 Billion pie?

If we can only get 2 million people to join the NRA out of 80 Million gun owners, how can we 'boycott' the manufacturers?

I don't want to be a doomsayer. In reality it makes me want to :cuss: :cuss: :cuss:. The manufacturers fall all over each other to get LEO contracts. Reality is that they would rather gain market share than do the right thing. And yes they would trade next year's profits for the profits of the next decade.

If the 'stockholders' is why companies make decisions, then we need to target the stockholders.

Then every gun owner in ********** needs to march on Sacramento, demanding they repeal oppressive, anti-freedom gun laws. The government does not trust you with your freedoms.

It's a funny thing about trust, if you keep giving it after it's broken, it becomes increasingly abused.

kludge
August 26, 2006, 11:12 PM
One more thing...

Ray Barrett aside, what he's doing is fantastic, but I just don't have a need for one of his firearms (If they were $500, I might be able to find a need, though :D ).

Here's something I would do...

To the first handgun manufacturer that thumbs their nose to the State of California and refuses to sell their weapons to the State of California or its representatives, I pledge to buy one of their pistols or revolvers, up to $600. (sorry I'm not rich and have five kids to feed).

Maybe we could start a "pledge" drive. Only 359.999 to go!

billwiese
August 27, 2006, 02:02 AM
The above posts bring up several issues...

- Firstly, it appears many co's guns are sold to CA LE agencies thru distributors. The recent CHP S&W vs Sig bid scandal seems to indicate they go thru a dealer/ distributor and not Smith directly. (Some other companies might or might not, not sure how prevalent the practice is). There may be some legal issues about a mfgr telling a distributor who its (otherwise lawful) customers may be. Imagine if Ford directed its (independent) dealer base that F150s would only be sold to those with hunting licenses, and if dealers didn't comply they'd get no new supply. There may be something that could be done with warranty support, dunno...

- Many cos have 'safe gun' compliant guns already set up for CA - loaded chamber indicator, mag disco safety, etc. Other states (MA, MD?, etc) have similar or partially overlapping requirments, and major gun cos' engineering depts can see the future a bit and have been working on this stuff.

Many gun cos would (completely separate from LEO biz) give up their OR, ID, NV, AZ, NM, etc. biz to keep CA commercial biz - it's too big a market to ignore.

There's still a (very reasonable) chance AB352 will be vetoed by gov.

Bill W.
San Jose CA

Mr.V.
August 27, 2006, 03:33 AM
50-Shooter--

This is a fantastic idea and I'd like to help. I wonder though how we will get through to the foreign manufacturers.

50 Shooter
August 27, 2006, 04:15 PM
Most of them have offices here in the States.

To contact Heckler & Koch
in the United States, call:


Phone: 205.655.8299
Fax: 205.655.7078

Email:
Customer Service Law Enforcement -
leinfo@hk-usa.com

Customer Service Hours: 9am-4pm EST
HECKLER & KOCH
7661 Commerce Lane
Trussville, AL 35173
USA

FNH USA COMMERCIAL AND LAW ENFORCEMENT OPERATIONS:


Rick DeMilt
Senior Vice President
Sales & Marketing
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-288-1292 x115
F: 703-288-1730


Bob Ailes
Sales Coordinator
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-288-1292
F: 703-288-1730


Sarah Perry
Marketing Manager
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-288-1292 x117
F: 703-288-1730


Bill Buie
Manager
Law Enforcement Field Activities
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-980-0921
e: wrbuie@att.net




Bucky Mills
Director
Sales, Marketing & Training
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-288-1292 x116
F: 703-288-1730


Jamie Moore
Sales Coordinator
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
F: 703-288-1730



Soha Eido
Office Manager
PO Box 697
McLean, VA 22101
T: 703-288-1292 x100
F: 703-288-1730


Ken Flood
Regional Sales Manager
PO Box 105
503 East Nifong Blvd
Columbia, MO 65203
T: 573-449-0590
F: 573-449-0585
e: kenf@fnhusa.com


Rossi USA

Phone:(305) 474-0401
Fax: (305) 623-7506

Mailing Address:

16175 NW 49 Ave.

Miami, FL 33014

50 Shooter
August 27, 2006, 04:38 PM
Wanted to add this, besides Barrett there are two other manufacturers that have said they won't sell to **********.

http://www.cobb50.com/
www.serbu.com

Geno
August 27, 2006, 04:43 PM
Even though I live in Michigan, I am just as concerned for the Californian gun laws as I am for Michigan. What the politicians successfully take away there, other states' "leaders" can learn, and try like-wise elsewhere. We're all in it together. Think nationallly and vote locally.

Doc2005

molonlabe
August 27, 2006, 07:18 PM
I say the first mfg that rolls over on the bullet imprinting insanity gets boycotted from me.

Green Lantern
August 27, 2006, 10:23 PM
I think it's a great idea! One would think that gunmakers would be having indigestion already at the cost of making guns that comply to this moronic law...

So, THE BOSS (that would be US, btw, their customers!) suggesting that they tell the Kommies to "shove it" should hopefully be seen as encouragement! :cool:

leadcounsel
August 28, 2006, 04:33 AM
To add to this, a nationwide gun owners collaboration to STOP supporting the California economy by stop spending money in California or for California goods.

NO more California wine, produce, trips to San Fran, LA, San Diego, you name it.

Gun owners are 100,000,000 strong or larger, so let's UNITE and make it clear that if they don't welcome our guns, they are also turning away our money.

50 Shooter
August 28, 2006, 10:36 AM
Rugers contact info.

Corporate
Headquarters
Lacey Place
Southport, CT 06890
Telephone: 203-259-7843
Fax: 203-256-3367 Ruger


Firearms Sales
Lacey Place
Southport, CT 06890
Telephone: 203-256-3860
Fax: 203-255-5201

Kentak
August 28, 2006, 10:57 AM
Hate to be a wet blanket, but it won't work. I agree with the spirit of the post, though.

K

Green Lantern
August 28, 2006, 11:02 AM
And you KNOW it won't work...how? :rolleyes:

50 Shooter
August 28, 2006, 11:17 AM
Here's a good article for everyone to read.

http://americandaily.com/article/15263

Correia
August 28, 2006, 11:18 AM
As much as I would like to see this work, I don't think it will. All it will take is for one of the big handgun companies to go ahead and do the stamping, even if every other manufacturer agrees to the boycott, then that particular company will own the largest law enforcement pistol market in the country.

There is just way too much greed involved. If the law passes, one of them will do it. I have no doubt in my mind.

In a perfect world, this would be great. I love what Ronnie Barrett has done. (heck, I shook his hand at SHOT show and said thank you). However Barrett is just one little US company. Even if every US owned gun company (doubtful) boycotted California law enforcement, I guarentee that one of the European owned companies will sell go along with the stamping just to get all of those PD contracts and to be the only game in town for all of the Californian gun owners.

The gun industry is a cut throat, no holds barred business. Sorry guys, I'm just calling it how I see it.

50 Shooter
August 28, 2006, 12:39 PM
Colt

COLT'S MANUFACTURING COMPANY LLC
Customer Service Department
P.O. Box 1868
Hartford, CT
06144-1868 U.S.A.

Tel: 1-800-962-COLT
Fax: (860) 244-1449

COLT'S MANUFACTURING COMPANY LLC
P.O. Box 1868
Hartford, CT
06144-1868 U.S.A.


Tel: (860) 236-6311
Fax: (860) 244-1442

Zundfolge
August 28, 2006, 12:43 PM
The gun industry is a cut throat, no holds barred business. Sorry guys, I'm just calling it how I see it.
Larry's got a good point, however its pretty clear that the S&W boycott hurt S&W enough that they sold and the new owners are saying "the agreement" is dead.


Frankly I expect that Glock, HK, FN or Colt would ignore the boycott and produce for CA anyway.


Regardless, gun owners NEED to stand up against this (even if it means we stand up against "our own"; the gun manufacturers).




Hopefully Arnie does the right thing and vetoes this pile of ......

50 Shooter
August 28, 2006, 04:00 PM
Another article.

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=/Politics/archive/200608/POL20060825b.html

Law Enforcers Oppose Calif. Micro-Stamping Gun Bill
By Jeff Johnson
CNSNews.com Senior Staff Writer
August 25, 2006

(CNSNews.com) - A bill passed by the anti-gun California state Senate to require "micro-stamping" by all semiautomatic handguns was quickly criticized by pro-Second Amendment groups Thursday. One day later, law enforcement officers are also coming out in force against the bill.

As Cybercast News Service previously reported, California Senate Bill AB 352 would expand the definition of an allegedly "unsafe handgun" to include any semiautomatic pistol that does not include a "microscopic array of characters, that identify the make, model and serial number of the pistol, etched into the interior surface or internal working parts of the pistol." That information must be "transferred by imprinting on each cartridge case when the firearm is fired."

Second Amendment groups immediately laid out the opposition to the bill on constitutional and practical grounds. Now, current and former law enforcement officers are expressing their concerns.

James Fotis, executive director of the Law Enforcement Alliance of America (LEAA), wrote members of the California General Assembly Friday, urging them to kill the bill.

"This legislation is an impractical and costly measure that will not improve public safety," Fotis wrote. "AB 352 is a distraction from real and proven crime-fighting efforts."

LEAA counts more than 75,000 current and former law enforcement officers among its members and supporters.

Fotis' letter is one of dozens of negative comments written about the bill by law enforcement veterans, including critical letters from the Sheriff-Coroners of California's Riverside, Kern, Orange, Mendocino, Modoc, and Tehama Counties.

Despite the opposition from those law enforcement veterans, Griffin Dix, president of the California Million Mom March Chapters, believes the bill should become law because police are unable to solve about 45 percent of California's murders due to "lack of evidence."

"This bill will help police," Dix claimed, "by providing them with new and meaningful leads for solving handgun crimes."

Paul Helmke, the new head of the anti-gun Brady Campaign, praised the California State Senate for "embracing this innovative technology."

But Fotis, a retired, career police officer, calls the idea of "micro-stamping" shell casings "vaguely described and untested technology."

"This idea won't reduce crime on the streets," Fotis said. "LEAA stands with California sheriffs and other law enforcement leaders who have voiced their clear and strong opposition to AB 352."

Anthony Craver, sheriff-coroner of Mendocino County, Calif., was more direct in his assessment of whether or not the bill would "help police," as Dix claimed.

"With millions upon millions of existing handguns owned in California," Craver said, "the probability of this bill having any positive effect on public safety is absurd."

Orange County, Calif., Sheriff-Coroner Michael Carona agreed.

"I cannot see any benefit," Carona said, "other than the simple act of symbolism in the passage of AB 352."

Technology to "micro-stamp" shell casings in a semiautomatic pistol as they are chambered or fired is not commercially available. Firearms experts argue that normal wear and tear within even a seldom-fired gun would interfere with such technology. They warn that the part or parts used to "micro-stamp" the casing would also be subject to tampering or easy removal.

In a joint letter, Modoc County, Calif., Sheriff Bruce Mix and District Attorney Jordan Funk wrote that the proposal would "unnecessarily complicate and hinder proven crime-solving strategies."

Fotis notes that those "proven crime-solving strategies" require something the California legislature cannot afford to squander: funding.

"California is in the midst of a severe money shortage for fighting crime," Fotis wrote.

"Rather than pursuing AB 352, which is costly, unproven, unnecessary-and would ultimately be shown to be ineffective in stopping crime-law enforcement would rather see the money and legislative effort spent on increasing prison space and helping cops on the street break the back of gangs!" Fotis added.

Fotis concludes that the bill "cannot be expected to provide any measurable impact on major crimes like murder."

Thefabulousfink
August 28, 2006, 04:28 PM
But Fotis, a retired, career police officer, calls the idea of "micro-stamping" shell casings "vaguely described and untested technology."

"This legislation is an impractical and costly measure that will not improve public safety," Fotis wrote. "AB 352 is a distraction from real and proven crime-fighting efforts."

"With millions upon millions of existing handguns owned in California," Craver said, "the probability of this bill having any positive effect on public safety is absurd."

Technology to "micro-stamp" shell casings in a semiautomatic pistol as they are chambered or fired is not commercially available. Firearms experts argue that normal wear and tear within even a seldom-fired gun would interfere with such technology. They warn that the part or parts used to "micro-stamp" the casing would also be subject to tampering or easy removal.

But what do they know??? After all, they are only police officers:rolleyes:

And Griffin Dix of the Million Mom March said:"This bill will help police," Dix claimed, "by providing them with new and meaningful leads for solving handgun crimes."

And with their extensive background in crime fighting, why shouldn't we listen to the MMM.

Mr.V.
August 28, 2006, 04:36 PM
Fink--

It's all part of Koretz's chess game to achieve a total ban on firearms. When this bill doesn't work, and Koretz himself probably knows it won't, the failure will allow him to preach, "Existing gun laws aren't strong enough, because of the loopholes like existing guns not having the technology. We won't be safe until all the guns are gone."

Green Lantern
August 28, 2006, 10:32 PM
Now, I liked Correia's post better. "It MAY NOT work" is better than "it WILL not work!" Morale counts for a lot when trying to get people roused! ;)

I know very well it might not work, and that the odds aren't so good...

But, I REFUSE to just sit around like a bump on a log and do nothing! It really makes me want to :barf: that only a small percentage of gun owners are in the NRA (1 out of 5, maybe? Forget where I read the exact # referenced on here). I do know that NRA claims 4 million members...but they also say that only 100,000 of these members bothered sending in the postcards (THEY provided!!!!!!) in protest of the IANSA/UN Global Gun Grab! For the love of....ALL a person had to do was sign their name and affix a stamp 3 or 4 times! :cuss: :banghead: :cuss:

If more people don't start getting active in protecting the 2nd Amendment, then I'M going to adopt a defeatist attitude and probably turn my guns in myself....

Okay. Rant OFF.

Now then, has anyone actually called yet? I called Glock and Taurus today, and quickly got the impression that I was jumping the gun...as neither company had heard wind of the Kali happenings yet. I tried to explain the whole scenario, but was referred to an answering machine in Glock's legal department. And the girl at Taurus suggested I write a letter to the company.

The bull may be a lost cause anyhow...it's unfair to say that THEY didn't know about microstamping because they said "we thought that was just in Maryland and New York...but you can order the parts you need from us"

HUH??? :scrutiny:

Manic Moran
August 29, 2006, 07:52 PM
Personally, I prefer the idea of marching on Sacramento. I don't think I've ever partaken in a political rally before, could be fun.

NTM

50 Shooter
August 31, 2006, 11:05 AM
AB 352 failed! Granted reconsideration.

http://calnra.com/legs.shtml?year=2006&summary=ab352

Green Lantern
August 31, 2006, 10:34 PM
Yee HAW!!!:neener:

For NOW at least....:uhoh:

50 Shooter
September 1, 2006, 02:10 AM
It failed again but.... Don't think it's over yet!

50 Shooter
September 10, 2007, 04:55 PM
Seeing how this has resurfaced and passed this time around, reviving it from the dead for contacts.

Remember that it all comes down to Arnie, if enough people contact the manufacturers and tell them to contact Arnie.... The idea of them telling him they will not sell to any CA agency could work. It can't hurt and will only take a few moments out of your time whether you call or write an email.

***Remember, this time around it's AB1471***

Scorpiusdeus
September 10, 2007, 06:34 PM
As interesting an idea as this is, do you realize how many handguns are sold toe LE agencies in CA? Probably more than most other states if not all other states.

I'll write some letters, but I think we're peeing in the wind here.

flynlr
September 11, 2007, 04:23 AM
is it me? "probably" does California seem headed towards the "utopia"
shown in the movie Demolition Man. I am a California Native who escaped 6 years ago, best move I ever made. it really sucks to see my state of Birth going down the tubes .if a boycott will in anyway help the situation I am all for it. I would hope someday I could move back with all the contents of my safes and not be committing hundreds of Felony's by doing so. :cuss:
From the Movie

You see, according to Cocteau's plan I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think; I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech and freedom of choice. I'm the kind of guy likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder - "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecued ribs with the side order of gravy fries?" I WANT high cholesterol. I wanna eat bacon and butter and BUCKETS of cheese, okay? I want to smoke Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section. I want to run through the streets naked with green Jell-o all over my body reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly might feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiener".

Harley Quinn
September 11, 2007, 11:47 AM
Geez this is why so many dislike gun owners :eek:

Trying to fight the high rate of crime and you want to stop it, because of some right you have to bear them :confused:

The more I read the more I see a pattern here at this location.

I'd say many who are voicing their thoughts probably don't even vote or are old enough :D

Just one gun persons thoughts.:evil:

:rolleyes:

romma
September 11, 2007, 12:02 PM
California would just suddenly import Commie guns for the police..

50 Shooter
September 12, 2007, 11:05 AM
Here's THR members assignment, start calling.:evil:

CALL Gov's Sac number (916-445-2841)

Press 1 - for English
Press 2 - for Voice your opinion on Assembly Bills
Press 1 - for Micro Stamping Bill (AB1471)
Press 2 to OPPOSE the gun control bill.

Blackbeard
September 12, 2007, 12:16 PM
All it will take is for one of the big handgun companies to go ahead and do the stamping, even if every other manufacturer agrees to the boycott, then that particular company will own the largest law enforcement pistol market in the country.

Not necessarily. Presumably the "microstamping" technology will increase the price of the guns, and they would therefore be unable to compete on a price/effectiveness basis with revolvers. Smaller jursidictions with limited budgets may go the cheaper route.

Erebus
September 12, 2007, 02:24 PM
I have started a page at http://www.gunpolitics.com (http://www.gunpolitics.com)for this issue. Click on the CA-AB1471 tab at the top of the page. Here's a direct LINK (http://www.gunpolitics.com/?page_id=23).

If someone would like to write a more eloquent heading for the page please PM it to me. I threw this together quickly. I will keep adding to it as I can.

Perhaps someone would like to create a template letter that people can print and send to the manufacturers. A PDF would be great. I can host the file and create a link to it from this page. IF you create one let me know and I will PM you my email address you can send it to.

The more ideas the better. Feel free to post suggestions to this thread or to PM them to me. Feel free to criticize as my ego is not easily bruised.

I plan to change the title of the page as CA-AB1471 is rather ambiguous to most people

desert_fox
September 12, 2007, 10:41 PM
Here's THR members assignment, start calling.

CALL Gov's Sac number (916-445-2841)

Press 1 - for English
Press 2 - for Voice your opinion on Assembly Bills
Press 1 - for Micro Stamping Bill (AB1471)
Press 2 to OPPOSE the gun control bill.
I had nothing to do at work today so I just called that for like an hour...hahahaha

748
September 13, 2007, 11:00 PM
I don't boycott gun manufactures because its kind of rare when I buy guns.
So what I do is when I find the newest, badest, blackest, "assualt weapon" that has lots of bad press I buy it.
Latest gun like that I bough was the Saiga 12ga, very bad ass and the one before that was my FN Fiveseven USG modle hand gun (5.7x28mm) the anits call it the "cop killer" :rolleyes: .
I would get a 50cal but can not cough up the $x,000 for one.

LAK Supply
September 13, 2007, 11:46 PM
Firstly, it appears many co's guns are sold to CA LE agencies thru distributors. The recent CHP S&W vs Sig bid scandal seems to indicate they go thru a dealer/ distributor and not Smith directly. (Some other companies might or might not, not sure how prevalent the practice is). There may be some legal issues about a mfgr telling a distributor who its (otherwise lawful) customers may be. Imagine if Ford directed its (independent) dealer base that F150s would only be sold to those with hunting licenses, and if dealers didn't comply they'd get no new supply. There may be something that could be done with warranty support, dunno...


Distributors WILL listen to manufacturers..... the distributors I deal with are scared *****less of just infringing on the mfr's MAP agreement..... I'm sure something more significant would be listened to and respected, even if just out of fear.

The trick would be getting the mfr's to do this.... the boycott would not have to be the entire CA market, just anything government-related. I've heard rumors (unsubstantiated) that Glock has threatened to void warranties on all of their LE arms if this thing passes and Glock is not granted an exemption.

If it were me I would re-tool to comply and sell only to private citizens.... LE would be on my ineligible list....

billwiese
September 15, 2007, 02:19 AM
Publicly-traded companies must act in the fidciary interest of the shareholders.

Ruger, S&W and others can't just be politically-correct-to-gunnies and say "we're not doing biz with Agency X or state Y no matter what". They are not allowed to turn down business that would be at expense of shareholders.

A gun company forcing a distributor to not do biz with another entity (state, agency, etc.) would be attacked so fast it's pitiful.

Bill Wiese
San Jose CA

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