Safety Question


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jondar
August 28, 2006, 11:16 AM
I have a 1911 USP made in 1918, number of rounds through it unknown. If you put the hammer at full cock, engage the thumb safety, then depress the grip safety, holding back on the trigger, push the thumb safe to the "down position, the hammer will drop. Is this normal? And if not, what will I have to do to remedy it? Thanks for all comments.

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1911Tuner
August 28, 2006, 11:50 AM
Nope. Not normal, Jondar. The safety should be replaced or refitted. You can peen the engagement area on the lug a little...or send it to EGW to have it welded up. If you elect to replace it, you may have trouble finding one that's correct...if that matters. Peening the lug is the field expedient method.
Welding and refitting is the correct method.

Knucklehead2
August 28, 2006, 02:54 PM
I just tested my SA Mil-Spec and the hammer dropped 9 out of 10 times.
I have tested the safety every other way I have read here and elsewhere and it always passed. Tuner please explain what is happening (or what should be happening) when pressure is kept on the trigger and the safety is released. I am assuming the lug is short by your suggestion, help!
There is a word for guys like me, I want it correct.

1911Tuner
August 28, 2006, 03:47 PM
Knucklehead...

There are three "points" on the safety lug. One of those points bears against the left sear leg. With the safety oriented as it would be in the gun, it's the bottom point. If the point doesn't touch the leg, pulling the trigger rotates the sear out of engagement with the hammer hooks. If the gap is large enough, it gets the sear right on the very edge of the hooks, and wiping the safety off lets the hammer fall off the sear. if the gap is just a little wider, pulling the trigger will actually knock the safety off...and because the trigger is pulled...the half-cock notch won't stop the hammer.

Correctly fitted, the point bears lightly against the sear leg and blocks any sear movement. If it bears too hard, the safety is hard to engage. Too lightly, and it lets the sear rotate.

Knucklehead2
August 28, 2006, 07:10 PM
Thanks Tuner!
But what I do not understand is if you are pulling on the trigger when you wipe the safety off why would it not drop the hammer? Once in ten times (for me) this was the case. All the other times while pulling on the trigger and wiping the safety the hammer fell. Should you have to release the trigger then pull it again?
I will have to think on this one awhile. Maybe even remove some stuff to see it better.

1911Tuner
August 28, 2006, 07:22 PM
Howdy Knucklehead. You wrote:

>But what I do not understand is if you are pulling on the trigger when you wipe the safety off why would it not drop the hammer?<

I didn't say that. I said that if the gap between the safety lug and the sear is wide enough, you can pull the trigger with the safety on, and the hammer will push the safety into the "OFF" position...and the hammer will fall.
With the trigger pulled, the half-cock notch won't stop the hammer, and if the gun is loaded, it'll fire.

Knucklehead2
August 28, 2006, 09:31 PM
I re-read the original post and now I am more confused.

If you put the hammer at full cock, engage the thumb safety, then depress the grip safety, holding back on the trigger, push the thumb safe to the "down position, the hammer will drop. Is this normal?

'Holding back on the trigger' . I must have mis-read your answer and probably should not have hi-jacked this thread. I do not think I have a problem now.

Thanks Tuner.

1911Tuner
August 28, 2006, 10:40 PM
Knucklehead wrote:

>If you put the hammer at full cock, engage the thumb safety, then depress the grip safety, holding back on the trigger, push the thumb safe to the "down position, the hammer will drop. Is this normal?<
***************

Yep. Perfectly normal. The safety may be a little harder to disengage, depending on how hard you pull the trigger...but when it does, the hammer should fall.

It's when you engage the safety...pull the trigger...let OFF the trigger...disengage the safety, and have the hammer fall that you've got a problem. OR...When you repeat the above, and the safety disengages all by itself with the trigger pull that you've got a BIG problem.

No hijack that I see. You had a related question on the topic. :cool:

jondar
August 29, 2006, 09:27 AM
Thanks for the replies. After the first replies I took two other pistols I have and tried the same procedure as in my first post. One an Astra 400 with internal hammer, the hammer fell. The other, a Beretta Model 418, a striker fired pistol also fired.

jaybar
August 29, 2006, 12:25 PM
Jondar in your original post you said:
If you put the hammer at full cock, engage the thumb safety, then depress the grip safety, holding back on the trigger, push the thumb safe to the "down position, the hammer will drop.

If you are "holding back on the trigger" when you release the safety the hammer/striker will drop on most any gun you try. This is not usually considered proper operating technique. About the only exceptipn to this is if you hold the trigger back and cycle the slide to cock the hammer/striker. In so doing you disconnect the trigger from the sear. Then puttiing the safety on and off while "holding the trigger back" should not result in any hammer full. If it does you definitely have a safety problem.

jondar
August 29, 2006, 12:34 PM
The point I was trying to make in the second post is that in trying the procedure on three different, United States, Spain and Italy, weapons and getting the same result from all, then it appears there has been no concerted effort to avoid the results described. Not that I would try this procedure "in real Life," not being homicidal or suicidal.

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