[rsilvers]

Click for larger images.

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4178.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4178.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4163.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4163.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4164.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4164.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4165.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4165.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4173.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4173.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4174.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4174.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4175.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4175.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4176.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4176.jpg)

http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4177.sized.jpg (http://www.modernrifle.com/albums/Akins/IMG_4177.jpg)

[mattw]

cool. too bad it costs $1000.

[rsilvers]

I think someone should make a nice looking stock for it. Then maybe convince them to sell the mechanism without their stock.

[clange]

I think someone should make a nice looking stock for it. Then maybe convince them to sell the mechanism without their stock.
For what? 900?

[rsilvers]

If the mechanism was $150 and the stock was $150 that would be be nice.

[harvester of sorrow]

I agree, but a lot of things in the firearms industry are overpriced. If AAC suppressors were only $150, that would be nice, too. Guess they think their research and development costs are worth the extra.

[Guy B. Meredith]

Oh. I thought that was "Askins photos".

:confused:

[rsilvers]

Part of the reason suppressors are expensive is because of needing a license and dealing with the ATF. If not for that, there would be $30 sound suppressors.

[harvester of sorrow]

According to the MGDB 4th edition, a Type 07/02 pays $1150/year if they did less than $500,000 business the previous year. I understand that FET has gone up since that printing, but that doesn't seem like that much of a factor in increasing per unit prices from your $30 figure up to what they actually are. Maybe suppressor manufacturers have overheads to meet.....maybe Akins does too.

[jwp]

"Part of the reason suppressors are expensive is because of needing a license and dealing with the ATF. If not for that, there would be $30 sound suppressors"

since aac suppressors tend to be 600 - 800 that means 2/year sales?

[rsilvers]

It is not the yearly fee. It is filling out the paperwork. Any reasonable suppressor company needs to hire an additional person to do that for about $30K a year. Also your NFA lawyer will cost you $10,000 to $100,000 a year easily.

[harvester of sorrow]

Yep, attorneys cost alot. Akins Group probably incurred significant expenses with James Jeffries, their dealings with FTB, and their patent attorney, also.

[jwp]

point is atkins and aac have other costs, don't berate them for their price as was done earlier, if the price is too high, no one will buy the product, if not both will make money

or make a stock that can pass atf scrutiny, patent it so it doesn't interfere with any others, and sell with/without stock for 300/150 and win the total market share for the device

possibly doable sure, go to work and amaze us

[rsilvers]

They should sell it for whatever price will make the most money.

[ElChupacabra]

Just curious, Robert, why don't you sell your photomosaic software for $10 download or $15 on CD? By now every copy has to be 100% profit, and you'd sell a ton more.

See, we can all do this.

[rsilvers]

I believe they are being 'anti gun' by picking a high price, and are doing it to restrict the product from people with less money assuming they will abuse it more.

[Third_Rail]

I highly doubt that's why it costs $1k. More likely is that there was a large amount of R&D, lawyer fees, etc.; someone has to pay for all that.

[rsilvers]

You all misunderstand me if you think I would care if someone wanted to pay back bills or make a good profit. If it is a form of gun control I would care. Kind of like the bans on 'Saturday Night Specials' (low cost guns) or the 1968 Gun Control Act import ban on small/low-cost pistols.

[RossinFL]

They're making a mistake by overpricing it. If it was priced at say $400 to $500, there wouldn't be a market for another similar & cheaper device to be built. Possibly a chinese rip off, possibly something that deviates enough to not infringe on their patent, possibly just something people will start making themselves for personal use. By pricing it as high as they are, eventually they will create another market, instead of dominating the market for Akins type devices.

[rsilvers]

I just remembered where I heard that.

"I talked with Tom Bowers about it a few months ago. The price is intentionally set high to prevent hood-rats from buying it.

He wanted it to price it out of the range of anyone who did not have a steady job and did not have $1k discretionary income, as these folks would likely not be inclined to commit crimes with his new toy."

http://www.silencertests.com/silencer-forum/viewtopic.php?t=4248

[No_Warning]

I'd like to get one but for $1000 I'm going to be looking into an AR15.

[Third_Rail]

rsilvers - if that is a true quote, we're in agreement. Pricing something high specifically so that "criminals" :scrutiny: don't get it is dumb.

[swingset]

Just because you CAN sell something for $1000 to a couple hundred guys doesn't mean it was good business.

You could have sold 5,000 units for $500, and made 3x as much and made 4,000 guys happy.

And, better yet, not earned the scorn of "low class" shooters who can't afford a $1000 price tag and get lumped in with "hood rats".

Screw Akins, I'll build their device myself, and laugh all the way to the bank. That's what any good "hood rat" would do, right? :fire:

[jwp]

or just steal one - banger is code for criminal?

[harvester of sorrow]

Yeah, Robert, I believe Tom said that because somebody on your website says so.:rolleyes: Getting banned over there must be a real annoyance for you.

[50 Freak]

I spoke with one of the guys from Akins...Price is high due to the ton of money they used to start up this little project.

Alot of the costs are related to patent attorneys, firearm attys and general start up costs.

They've already had to fight some patent infringements and continue to do so.

They had to hire good firearms attys to make sure they were okay to sell this product and as you know the ATF isn't very "willing" to help in something that they see as a "legal" machine gun. Hence the high atty fees to push the matter.

If you guys have never started a company, you really don't know the costs to get something from just an idea to an actual product.

And if you look at it this way. A FA 10/22 would run you about $10,000 not including the legal heartaches you would have to contend with. So someone comes up with a product that basically does the same thing at a 10th of the price and no legal paperwork hassles...Is it worth it??

P.S. they are still working on it, but this product was originally designed for a SKS and the one on the drawing boards is a MAK90 version.....:evil: :evil: :evil:

I can't wait.....