357 Sig feeding reliability ?


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S&W 910
September 19, 2006, 12:09 PM
Whats your opinion on the feeding reliability of the 357 sig round ?

I've read because of the bottleneck cartridge its the best round feeding wise and has little or no chance of misfeeds

I've read it has problems with case neck separations (whatever that means ?) and it is not a good round because of that

I've read it has no advantages or disadvantages of the other rounds like the 9 and 40

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atblis
September 19, 2006, 12:37 PM
That is most likely hard to measure because just about all production guns chambered in it are from manufacturers that make generally reliable guns (glock and Sig). Does HK make a 357 sig (can't remember)?

If they started making a 1911 in 357 Sig, you probably wouldn't here so much about its feeding reliability (I am sure somebody does somewhere).

Actually I have no idea whether it is any better or not (just wanted to rile up the 1911 people a poke). I could see where an argument could be made that it is.

I never really thought about it much. I could see where that might be important as a platform the LE community.

The neck seperations is most likely a reference to reloading issues.

Vitamin G
September 19, 2006, 12:44 PM
I had a friend with a sig, in 357sig (go figure), and i never saw it have a problem feeding. Ultimately, he traded it for a 1911 due to the availability of ammo, but it was a pretty nice shooter.
One thing I dont understand, is if that profile is the "best feeding" in terms of reliability, why do so many people complain about SWC's not feeding in various guns? I dunno.

S&W 910
September 19, 2006, 01:02 PM
Does HK make a 357 sig (can't remember)?


i believe they do

great point,might not hear of feeding problems because they are only made by the best gun companies that make the best guns

BrainOnSigs
September 19, 2006, 01:03 PM
In .357 Sig, I own:

1) Sig P226ST (10K+ rounds w/ zero failures)
2) Sig P229 (8K+ rounds w/ zero failures)
3) Glock G32 (2K+ rounds w/ zero failures)
4) HK P2000SK (1K+ rounds w/ zero failures)

I was using good ammo for all these. No sure what this says. These are all reliable handguns regardless of the caliber.

Harley Quinn
September 19, 2006, 01:21 PM
Since it is necked down to a 357 and going into the Chamber "hole" that is slightly larger .425 approx. the ramp does not have to be so big and the case is fully supported. The stories you usually hear that are disrespectful is that it is loud, ammo is expensive and not as available as other ammo. I don't think 45 new is that much cheaper. You get a lot less bullets for the buck if you are talking by bulk (weight). They can be reloaded just like any other round.

Very powerful round. It might be that some just can't shoot it well, due to the noise and the sharp return. You have to hold onto it but don't squeeze it to hard, just a good firm hand grip. And make sure you back it up so it will have something to stop against, no mussy stuff here.

It, like all different rounds have some slight variations to get used to but I believe it will be a good round to have in your collection.

I have a mdl 22 in 40 cal and just got a 357 sig barrel for it, have not shot it yet, will soon.
I am waiting on some brass I bought off e-bay about 1500 cases. I am looking at the 6" barrel that I got. Nice... I am going to go with Lee dies and reloding stuff for it they say it does a good job. I thought about Honrady but read a few bad things about them...:what:
It will put the stock barrel to shame on accuracy and fps with the same loadings...
I have over 3000 bullets and will be shooting 125 and 147. I can even go for the frangible which I think is a really good round around the house they are not known for the penetration but they are destructive, on humans. I am going to glue each and every round in when I seat them that way it minimizes slip back. They say that is a problem with multiple chamberings. I don't multiple chamber, in once shot:D

I understand most of the Air Marshalls are going for this round in a 85 grain frangable round or 100 grain. Fps is going to be over 1500 out of my barrel...Multiple applications and rounds.
It is the round for me I believe, along with my 40, 9s and this one, it will fit my purpose very well...

Last but not least, I would not make this my first round of choice I would become very used to 9mm before I go to the 357sig. They are both 9mms.
Might be to much gun for a newbe, or anyone who does not like hard hitting handguns.
HQ:)

Peter M. Eick
September 19, 2006, 02:06 PM
The sig is a great little round. I have a 229 sport and it is fantastic in it. Once I figured out how to properly crimp the round (first trip to the range was a disaster with buldged brass. No problems since. I have shot around 7000 rnds out of mine and I have never had a neck separation. Since I reload I would have thought I would have seen it if it were common.

The sigs tend to be quite accurate, so be prepared to see your skill level get tested. Mine is like a lazer been with light loads. You point and press and that is where the round goes. I think it is one of the funnest rounds I shoot for just plain enjoyment.

BrainOnSigs
September 19, 2006, 02:23 PM
I have over 3000 bullets and will be shooting 124 and 147

Why not the more mainstream 125 gr bullet most commonly used in .357 Sig ammo?

ccw007
September 19, 2006, 03:56 PM
I just got a Beretta Cougar in 357sig and it is going to become my carry gun without a doubt. I shoot steel plates at the range and you get tell the force this round has when it hits compared some other rounds :D

I cannot speak for other guns, but IMO this round in the Beretta Cougar 8357 it feels closer to a 9mm than a 40 cal. as far as recoil goes.

DonGlock26
September 19, 2006, 04:50 PM
I have a P229 .357Sig/.40. No jams with either barrel. .357 Sig is an impressive round. It is accurate and powerful.

gudel
September 19, 2006, 05:37 PM
what do you people use for JHP load? everywhere I go I only see the FMJ speer lawman. That's it as far as for the selection, it's very limited.

BrainOnSigs
September 19, 2006, 05:59 PM
what do you people use for JHP load?


For range use I like the 125 Gr Federal American Eagle FMJ or the 125 Gr Lawman TMJ.

My 2 favorites for carry (JHP) are 125 Gr Speer Gold Dots or 125 gr Winchester Ranger Bonded.

Federal, Remington, Hornady also have JHP .357 Sig offerings.

Harley Quinn
September 19, 2006, 07:09 PM
Thanks for bringing that to my attention.
I also have many 124s in 9mm. I think :what:

I will weigh them and follow it up later.:D
What do you think of the frangable loads? How about the idea of lands and groves with them they are going to be real hard to figure out what (gun barrel etc) they came from if they go to pieces like they say.
HQ:)

Skywarp
September 20, 2006, 11:38 AM
Never had either of my 3, 357 SIG sigs fail to feed. Of course they never failed to feed as 40's either.

Harley Quinn
September 20, 2006, 01:09 PM
My 40 is a 357 also Mdl 22. I am going to try the 40/357 slide on a mdl 17 frame and see if it works ok. Might be an ejecter problem I'll check it out before I fire it.

HQ.;)

BRASSM
September 20, 2006, 06:24 PM
I have a SIGPro 2340 in .357 Sig. About a week after I got it into my hot little hands I purchased the reloading dies. What a profuse torrent of strong anglosaxon euphanisms. 10% of the cases were being ruined during reloading. Later I found that some of the bullets slipped down into the case.:fire:
I was fit to be tied.

Then a few weks later I went to the range for a tactical excercise. All of my reloads performed flawlessly: no jams, no stovepipes,no misfires. and to top it all off very accurate.

I feel that the bottleneck case really aids in chambering. The only problem that if I reload lead [linotype] and some of it shaves off the bullet it can cause a problem in chambering. Looking at the .357 Sig I think it's a great cartridge.:cool:

10-Ring
September 20, 2006, 10:59 PM
I've put about 1000 rounds through a few pistols chambered in 357 sig. I've had no function or reliability problems w/ any of them (Glock, 1911 & new Steyr).

Harley Quinn
September 20, 2006, 11:30 PM
Model 22 Glock with a 357sig new barrel. Every time I tried to fire with the mag in and feeding, it failed at first so I went into mode b...

I shot it one at a time for 40 rounds and then tried it 2 at a time a couple of failures. New barrel and not heavy enough bullet. If I want to shoot those 85 grain I will probably have to get a different spring unit. I am going to try my mdl 17 spring with it and see if it will help just for those rounds.
I will shoot some heavier through and see if that will help, I just wanted to see how accurate and how it felt with the light stuff.

I wanted to save the brass so I load it into the mag, put one into chamber take out mag and fire. The brass falls down the mag slot and into your hand. easy. Then do it again. Slow but methodical and it works all the things that you need to know. Easy way to save the brass.

Very accurate. 6" lone wolf barrel 7 yds all in the X. dead on.

Out at 20 yds they climbed 5 inches. But were consistant. Good group, but high. Used a 6 oclock hold, 12 oclock and out of the black on a 25 yard rapid fire 9 and 10 black bullseye target. I was doing it slow fire like I explained.

I did not have much time I am going back tomorrow to really give it a going over with different rounds.

HQ:)

Glockensig
September 20, 2006, 11:41 PM
Does HK make a 357 sig (can't remember)?

H&K USP Compact
H&K P2000
H&K P2000SK

what do you people use for JHP load? everywhere I go I only see the FMJ speer lawman. That's it as far as for the selection, it's very limited.

A guy on Glocktalk keeps up on this stuff...here is his list

1.) American Eagle - 125g - FMJ F
**2.) CCI Speer Blazer - 125g - TMJ F
3.) CCI Speer Lawman -125g - TMJ F
4.) CCI Speer Gold Dot - 125g - GDHP F
5.) Collins Cartridge Co. - 125g - FMJ
6.) Corbon - 115g - JHP F
7.) Corbon - 125g - JHP F
8.) Corbon DPX- 125g - DPX
9.) Corbon Pow'R Ball - 100gr - PB
**10.) Corbon BeeSafe - 91g - BS
11.) CNC Cartridge - 124g - FMJ F
12.) CNC Cartridge - 124g - JHP F
13.) CNC Cartridge - 102g golden sabre - JHP F
14.) Double Tap - 125g - JHP F
15.) Double Tap - 125g - FMJ
16.) Double Tap - 115g - JHP
17.) Double Tap - 147g - JHP
18.) Federal - 125g - FMJ F
19.) Federal - 125g - JHP F
**20.) Federal - 150g - JHP F
21.) Georgia Arms - 125g - FMJ F
22.) Georgia Arms - 125g - GDHP
23.) Hornady - 124g - JHP F
24.) Hornady - 147g - JHP F
25.) Lancer Custom - 125g - FMJ F
26.) Lancer Custom - 125g - XTP
27.) Lancer Custom - 125g - JHP
28.) Maine Cartridge Company - 147g - JHP F
29.) Master Cartridge - 125g - FMJ (RL) F
30.) PMC - 124g - FMJ F
31.) PMC Starfire - 125g - JHP F
32.) Precision Ammunition - 125g - JHP F
**33.) Pro-Load - 125g - JHP F
34.) Reeds's Ammo & Research - 90g - XTP
35.) Reeds's Ammo & Research - 115g - XTP
36.) Reeds's Ammo & Research - 124g - XTP
37.) Reeds's Ammo & Research - 147g - XTP
38.) Reed's Ammo & research - 124g - Gold Sabre
39.) Remington - 125g - JHP F
**40.) Remington Gold Sabre - 125g - BJHP
41.) Sellier& Belliot - 140g - FMJ F
**42.) Triton - 115g - JHP
**43.) Triton - 125g - JHP
**44.) Triton - 135g - JHP F
45.) Ultramax - 125g - FMJ (RL)* F
46.) UMC - 125g - FMJ F
47.) UMC - 125g - JHP F
48.) Wagner Acuswage - 125g - TMJ
49.) Winchester - 125g - FMJ F
50.) Winchester - 125g - JHP F
51.) Winchester Ranger - 125g -SXT

Looks like a lot of choices if you're willing to shop "on-the-net"!!!!!!!

Harley Quinn
September 21, 2006, 11:36 AM
Thanks for the information. Quite a bit more then you see in the stores.:cuss:

Anyone else had any experience with the Frangible. Air Marshall's are using them so they won't go through the hull of the airplane. They have some high velocity "357 Sig". 85 grain guys. They look like a hard ceramic mud bullet:p

I am shooting them out of a 6" barrel. I have not personally chrono'd them but I am told 1500 fps is not unusual from that configuration.

I don't think they would work very well at lower fps, but hey, I am willing to learn from someone who has the experience, and knowledge.:D

Thanks
HQ:)

RustyShackelford
September 21, 2006, 12:18 PM
I'm suprised the .357SIG round is not more popular. It feeds well and is a powerful load(KE/speed). Many large LE agencies use it now and the .357SIG is made by many major firearms companies. I want to buy a NIB HK P2000 LEM .357SIG ASAP! :D

I think the biggest problem with the rise of the .357SIG is that many gun owners/LEOs/etc do not think the .357SIG is better than the .40SmithandWesson round or even the 9mmNATO. They can't justify switching even when the .357SIG has been shown to be an improvement. A major LE agency(800+ sworn LEOs) just bought new SIGarms P-226 9mmNATO pistols. Many patrol officers wanted .40 or .357SIG pistols but the Police Chief said Nyet-ski, :cuss: . Budget/training issues were the excuses :rolleyes: .

I see the .357SIG growing stronger for CC/protection/duty use. It's an improvement over the .40S&W but will still need to win over the 1,000s of 9mmNATO users, ;) .

RS

coltrane679
September 21, 2006, 12:46 PM
The biggest problem with the 357Sig is that it was developed several years after the .40--that's it. That is the only reason it is not the dominant LE round. .40 was hastily devised after the FBI 10mm "crisis" (which consisted of having too many loser agents who are inept with firearms). And the FBI effectively drives the bus on LE ammo issues (because this allows any PD in America to say "Hey, the FBI does it!" if they ever get criticized on such issues).

As they say, timing is everything in life.

I currently have two guns chambered in this caliber (a 226 and a 229) with a third on the way. They have been flawless, completely.

Harley Quinn
September 21, 2006, 07:15 PM
Have you shot any of the new frangible in the 357Sig? Has anyone?

If so what did you think?
It is easy to shoot and very little recoil, because of the low weight of bullet. Plus the Bullet is very good for around the house. It won't be going through two layers of drywall or plaster if you miss. I have got to go this afternoon and shot some more:) rig up the spring to handle the lighter bullet, like use my 9mm spring and guide.


More later.

HQ;)

Glockensig
September 23, 2006, 01:35 AM
Do you mean something like this??
http://pictures.auctionarms.com/238455/23cff2e8c47643483bd7f0e0ee536f31.jpg?aa=20060922212511

I just got some on line ( DFA .357 SIG frangible lead free 85 grain nylon ammunition ).... I will let you know what I think

Harley Quinn
September 23, 2006, 11:56 AM
Thanks for mentioning it. I have not as yet gotten back to do the testing I was planning, some other stuff came up, but, I will this weekend.:)

I believe that the spring in the mdl 40 is just to much for that light of weight bullet, so like I mentioned I am going to put a 9mm mdl 17 spring and guide into it for that bullet only. :scrutiny:

I did buy some Sellier and Bellot 357sig in 140 weight, so I will shoot the gun in the config. that it is in now, regular 40 cal with a 357 sig barrel before I do any switching and playing around.:)

If that works out ok, then go to the next step, trying to get those 85 grain dudes working well. I want those 85's for around the house. From what I have seen on the web and read they are good for what I want.

HQ:)

Skywarp
September 23, 2006, 02:20 PM
The other reason the .357 sig is not more popular is that ammo producers don't load up to the full potential of the cartridge. Most load down for liability. Shooting the double tap full bore loads vs factory defensive loads shows a clear difference however the recoil is still quite pleasant.


That and people in firearms are so slow to try new things. I realize the world was blessed in the early 1900s when God stepped down from heaven in the form of John Moses Browning and gave us the 45 ACP and the 1911 but there are other options.

Harley Quinn
September 26, 2006, 08:31 AM
Shot the 140 grain in the 357sig barrel in the mdl 22 Glock. Pounded them out with no problem, I changed barrels and shot the 165 40 cal not much difference in recoil both of the barrels are the 6"+ after market.

Switched over to the standard barrel in 40 cal about 4.5" shoots great. I shot a few of the carry 165 gold dot hp, nice group of two, touching.

Showed me where they were hitting and how well they worked no need in wasting them on paper.

I contacted "Glockmeister" and asked a few questions about the spring strength that they recommended for the 85 Frangible, I'll wait on the reply.

HQ:)

defiant73a
September 26, 2006, 10:12 AM
The other reason the .357 sig is not more popular is that ammo producers don't load up to the full potential of the cartridge. Most load down for liability.
Ammo producers load for optimum performance for their bullet designs. Double Tap loads for maximum velocity. Optimum performance (the REAL "full potential) does not necessarily equal maximum velocity. Don't forget those bullets DT is loading are designed by those producers whom you allege do injustice to the 357 SIG. Double Tap sells velocity not necessarily performance.

Liability is not an issue. The 357 SIG is a new calibre (a little of ten years old) with new weapons. The manufacturers do not have to be concerned about somebody loading in a hundred year old weapon (unlike the the .38 Special, 9x19, .45 Colt, etc.). The major producers (big four) load to SAAMI specs--liability is no issue. DT advertises they load to SAAMI specs (just like the major producers). If you are alleging DT loads beyond SAAMI specs, they might very well need to be concerned about liability issues.

Harley Quinn
September 26, 2006, 09:03 PM
Big 4,Are loading a good usable good shooting and accurate loading for what they think the general population wants. They are probably 5% under the max or even more. Some tight chambers are dangerous and some not totaly supported are also.

I was with a guy shooting at the range and he had factory ammo rounds that were not able to get out of the chamber (revolver) with out hammering them with a stick and striker. Not good. Plus those primers were pretty flat. HMMM

I would always do a visual on all of the new stuff that you are shooting until I am pretty sure it looks safe. Each box one every 5/6 rounds.

Have not heard from Glockmeister but the local guy said try the 9mm spring and rod, probably be all right for the 85'ers....

HQ:)

defiant73a
September 26, 2006, 09:14 PM
Big 4,Are loading a good usable good shooting and accurate loading for what they think the general population wants.
The big four--particularly Speer with their Gold Dot and Winchester with their Ranger T--are loaded for the highly competitve, big dollar LE market where performance is measured (using FBI/IWBA protocols) and counts.

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