[TheArchDuke]

I started a thread in a different forum about a Mosin M38 I bought today. Well Big 5 just called and said the rifle they sold me was being rung up at the same time by the manager for someone else and I can just choose another one off of the shelf when my 10 day period is up. Is that legal? I'm waiting 10 days for a gun but the serial number is going to change when I pick it up. Is that going to be a problem? I live in California by the way.

[ilbob]

if the state approves the sale, and you sign the forms for the gun with the right serial number how do you figure there is a problem?

[buzz_knox]

My best guess, and take it for what it's worth, is that the safest course of action would be to run the paperwork again. You'll need to fill out a new 4473 so there will be a record of the actual serial number. Whether you'd have to go through another background check/waiting period is unclear.

Either way, the store bears the burden of clearing everything up.

[TheArchDuke]

I just figured I'd have to start another 10 day period. It doesn't make anys ense but it sounds like something california would make us do.

[Wastemore]

I'm not providing legal advice, but I know how the 4473/DROS system works.

With a long gun, the dealer record of sale(DROS) does not include a SN. While you wait for the background check, DOJ determines whether of not you're legally elegiable to posess a firearm, but only knows that you're purchasing a rifle- they don't know what make/model or SN. With a handgun they know everything.

The DROS is the computerized portion of the paperwork where they swipe your DL, make a copy and fingerprint you.

The 4473 is the portion you fill out- all those dumb questions like: "Are you a fugitive from justice?" etc. All teh information is written down on the last page of the 4473(make/model/SN) and the 4473 is retained in the store- this is ATF's portion.

To re-ca:
The DROS is the portion the state gets electronically which, on a longgun contains no specific information about the gun. They only know that you're buying a long gun.

The 4473 is the portion that is specific to the firearm and is retained in the store for ATF perusal.

It is pretty common for a fella to order a long gun and without the gun being there, do the DROS portion(state) and the 4473 portion(ATF) and not have the specific make/model/SN filled in on the 4473 until the firearm arrives.

[TheArchDuke]

oh thanks for the info wastemore

[GuyWithQuestions]

TheArchDuke, so when they sold the gun to someone else, did they sell it to the other person before they sold it to you, or at the same time or after? If someone sold something to me and then later the manager sold it to someone else when I was waiting to pick it up, I wouldn't just let them give it to someone else just because the manager was the one who sold it to someone else, especially if I had already filled out paper work and there were signatures.

[Liberal Gun Nut]

Do the safe thing. Don't mess around with this. Pay the $25 or whatever to do DROS again. Make Big5 reimburse you for it perhaps.

[gunsmith]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bait_and_switch

A bait and switch is a form of fraud in which the fraudster lures in customers by advertising a good at an unprofitably low price, then reveals to potential customers that the advertised good is not available but that a substitute good is. The goal of the bait-and-switch is to convince some buyers to purchase the substitute good as a means of avoiding disappointment over not getting the bait, or as a way to recover sunk costs expended to try to obtain the bait. It suggests that the seller will not show the original product or product advertised but instead will demonstrate a more expensive product.

Other advertising practices, such as the use of loss leaders or the use of sales techniques to steer customers away from low-profit items, depend on many of the same psychological mechanisms as a bait and switch. In the United States, courts have held that the purveyor using a bait and switch operation may be subject to a lawsuit by customers for false advertising, and can be sued for trademark infringement by competing manufacturers, retailers, and others who profit from the sale of the product used as bait. However, no cause of action will exist if the purveyor is capable of actually selling the goods advertised, but aggressively pushes a competing product.

Likewise, advertising a sale while intending to stock a limited amount of, and thereby sell out, the loss-leading item advertised is legal in the United States. The purveyor can escape liability if they make clear in their advertisements that quantities of items for which a sale is offered are limited.

Deceptive e-mail offers that shunt the user to porn sites have been described as bait-and-switch scams. [1]

Unscrupulous estate agents commonly engage in bait and switch by continuing to advertise attractive properties in their windows that they have already sold.

In state politics (e.g., Tennessee), "caption bills" that propose minor changes in law with simplistic titles (the bait) are introduced to the legislature with the ultimate objective of substantially changing the wording (the switch) at a later date in order to try to smooth the passage of a controversial major amendment. Rule changes are also proposed (the bait) to meet legal requirements for public notice and mandated public hearings, then different rules are proposed at a final meeting (the switch), bypassing the objective of public notice and public discussion on the actual rules voted upon. While legal, the political objective is to get legislation or rules passed without anticipated negative community review.

[TheArchDuke]

No the manager was with a costumer who got their first I guess.


As for the bait and switch, they said I could choose another one off the rack as soon as I get there in 10 days. If they don't have one in perfect condition, I will get my money back for sure. What I'm hoping is none of the people who sold me the gun are there that day. I'll do a day or two late and see if it's still there.