Witness FS .45 owners


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garyk/nm
September 28, 2006, 09:57 PM
So, I bought this Witness .45 at a flea market a couple of weeks ago and it came with 3 mags. First time out with it, i took my boss (female, attractive) to give her a handgun lesson. She's a gunny, but only hunting rifles so far.
Jam-fest.
2 of the mags would not reliably feed at all. The one that works best is what i presume to be the factory mag, with the red follower. The other 2 have black followers. These are all 8 round mags.
Is this a known problem? Does it sound like the offending mags are aftermarkets? I haven't inspected for bent feed lips yet, but this sounds more like a mag spring problem to me.
Any advice from owners would be greatly appreciated.

P.S. the boss asked me if it seemed like some of the mags were the cause of the problem. I think I'll keep her!

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atblis
September 28, 2006, 11:12 PM
The older and jam prone mags supposedly had black followers
Newer mags that are supposedly better have the red followers.

That is what I've heard. I couldn't tell if the black follower mags jammed less than the red, but that was in 10mm, so perhaps 45 is different.

All the factory mags I have, are marked with a T in a triangle.

atblis
September 28, 2006, 11:15 PM
The older and jam prone mags supposedly had black followers
Newer mags that are supposedly better have the red followers.

That is what I've heard. I never had a problem with the black follower mags, but that was in 10mm, so perhaps 45 is different.

All the factory mags I have, are marked with a T in a triangle.

Make sure it is not the ammo.
Clean and inspect gun.
Check feed ramp and chamber area for smoothness. Polish feed ramp
Put extra power mag springs in the mags
Polish the mag lips.

Sounds like it is the mags because one mag works fine and the other don't.

plevniak
September 28, 2006, 11:18 PM
I have all red followers in my 3 factory mags. They are all 10 rounders (post-ban style). They all work fine. My 9mm conversion came with one wrong mag (357 sig) and a preban mag for the small frame witness that didn't work. I sent the (357 sig) back for a free exchange from EAA. I would send the two worst mags to EAA for a free fix if they are truly factory mags. You should contact EAA first before sending them in. Another idea would be to splurge on a new standard capacity witness factory magazine and see how it works. CDNN has good prices on them.

If you still have problems, I've heard that wolf replacement springs make a big difference. Check out the CZ forums under the "clones" for more asistance.

http://p201.ezboard.com/fczechpistols82792frm35

Good luck.

Jim Watson
September 28, 2006, 11:25 PM
Maybe she will give you a raise so you can buy a working gun.

MDMadrid
September 28, 2006, 11:26 PM
The older and jam prone mags supposedly had black followers
Newer mags that are supposedly better have the red followers

This is absolutely true! I had three mags with the black followers and they are not worth crap! the local gun shop where i bought my .45 traded me the 3 mags I had with the ones with the red followers and they work GREAT!

atblis
September 29, 2006, 12:11 PM
Get rid of the 10 round mags. Sell them, and get the regular mags. THe 10rnd mags will break.

Lucky 7
September 29, 2006, 12:32 PM
Um...the .45 only comes in 10rds. Keep 'em ;)
Red follower+factory mag=good mag
easy formula :rolleyes:

Mags were once a problem for Tanfoglio, but the red followers fixed most of the mag issues.

Also, you said the mags held only 8 rd but the title says the gun is a full-size? :confused:

Regards,
L7

garyk/nm
September 29, 2006, 01:01 PM
Correct, 8-rounders. Must be clinton mags. :p
Inspected them closely this morning, and the feed lips look different on all 3! Also the position the followers sit at empty is different. I'm going to try to adjust the feed lips, but looks like I'll be ordering from CDNN soon.

Lucky 7
September 29, 2006, 02:05 PM
Okay toss the "8 rounders" and get the 10 round mags (they'll be a lil stiff but all 10 will fit). www.reedsammo.com has em for $20/ea which is a helluva deal and you'll get them in about 3 or 4 days.

atblis
September 29, 2006, 09:41 PM
for some reason I was thinking they were 12 rounders originially (I don't shoot 45).

Anyways, as far as Witness mags go, if they have the neutering cuts, don't buy them and or get rid of them as quickly as possible.

Lucky 7
September 30, 2006, 05:07 AM
Well, you COULD make the mags into 12 rounders with CPMI extended base pads (like I did :D ). I have had luck with those (no mag spring binding or sluggish operation) and throw one filled with Hornady TAP 230gr+P in my glove box when I head to Tampa or Jacksonville, FL.

Oh and congrats on the purchase of your Witness! It's a real sleeper of a pistol and HIGHLY upgradeable (if you're into that sort of thing). I don't think much on my pair of Carry-Comps is stock.

Regards and Semper Fi!
-L7

garyk/nm
September 30, 2006, 08:56 AM
Thanks L7, I am very happy with the performance of this one (well, except for the mag thing). After trying unsuccessfully to reshape the feed lips, I took the mags to the local gunsmith and he quickly noticed that the 2 offending mags had stress cracks at the top rear, allowing the lips to deform. Oh well.
If you don't mind, please expand on the "upgradable" thing. I love to tinker!

lee n. field
September 30, 2006, 09:10 AM
I bought this Witness .45 at a flea market

At a flea market.

<sigh>

Never see that in Ill-i-noise.

lee n. field
September 30, 2006, 09:13 AM
Correct, 8-rounders. Must be clinton mags.

Why would 8 rounders be "Clinton mags". Back in the Bad Old Days the limit was 10, which I think is where the Witness .45 tops out at anyway.

f you don't mind, please expand on the "upgradable" thing. I love to tinker!

10mm top end.

garyk/nm
September 30, 2006, 09:48 AM
That was a joke, Lee. Maybe they are 10's, but I was told they were 8's and that's all I've been able to stuff into them. Does seem odd that a double stack mag would only hold 8 though.
10mm. There's a thought!

Lucky 7
October 1, 2006, 11:11 AM
Okay, gary, here's a list of a few things that one can do with a Witness.

*Compensators (Single, Double and Triple port)
*Long-slide, Compact slide (balances like a Cmdr 1911), or Standard Length in .22LR, 9x19, 9x23, .38 Super, .40, 10mm, .45
*Ambidextrous or Left-side safety, standard or extended
*4 Different types of rear sights
*Several different triggers
*Converted to Single Action Only (both of mine are set up like this)
*Extended Magazines
*Sight Rail for red dots scopes

The list goes on. Great platform for competition. I believe D.R. Middlebrooks and his family use(d) the Witness for comp.

Regards
-L7

RooK
October 1, 2006, 10:23 PM
Well, you COULD make the mags into 12 rounders with CPMI extended base pads (like I did ).

Lucky, more info on this? If I'm not mistaken, the 10mm and .45 Mag bodies are identical except for the lips. So, those would theoretically fit my 10mm Witness mags, yes? Got any contact/dealer info? Got any sources for those Witness parts aside from EAA? $40 for triggers and hammers is a bit high.

Lucky 7
October 2, 2006, 07:45 AM
Rook: You're correct, the base pads will fit ALL of the LARGE FRAME Witness magazines (.38 Super, 10mm, .45), adding a few more rounds if you need them for competition or WW3 in the streets :rolleyes: . If you have a 9x19 or .40 Large Frame conversion (magazines of 18 and 15 capacity), and add those pads, theres a 21+1 nine mil in your hands, very formadible IMHO.

Regards and Semper Fi!
L7

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