shooting both eyes open vs. one eye ???


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richiequan
September 29, 2006, 03:05 AM
What do you guys think is the best?
what do the police, swat and all train to do?
advantages and disadvantages?

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Snowdog
September 29, 2006, 03:28 AM
I think this was recently discussed, Richiequan. It's a fairly common question the search function might help with.

Personally, I've always shoot handguns with both eyes open and usually rifles with only one eye.

Ben Shepherd
September 29, 2006, 10:18 AM
Both eyes open is better. Why?

If you close one eye you lose depth perception. This is not good, especially in a gunfight.

.45 Cal
September 29, 2006, 01:05 PM
I'm completely crosseyed unless I close my right eye. Which is odd since I'm right handed but left eye dominant. Can shoot a handgun from either side, but can't line up a rifle sight on the right to save my life.

Steve C
September 29, 2006, 01:46 PM
One or two eyes. Depends upon what game your shooting. When shooting close up rapid fire combat or plate games then two eyes open work as long as you can stay focused on the font sight.

For precision work at 25yds or greater like shooting bullseye then one eye is better. It is actually better to keep both eyes open and occlude the other eye. When shooting bullseye many competitors will tape over one of the lenses of their shooting glasses to block off the vision of the non aiming eye allowing both eyes to remain open. I've seen some specialized shooting glasses that have one lens opaque. This avoids the tension caused by holding one eye closed or squinting the non aiming eye.

warmrain
October 3, 2006, 08:12 PM
Defensive shooting: Both eyes open is best if you can do it... Give depth perception but more importantly it gives you periphery vision. Many cannot keep the target or the sights from "jumping" and many don't even know if they close an eye or not.

Some that are cross-dominant eyed have trouble keeping both open.

I close an eye when target shooting, but I have no idea what I do while shooting in a PPQ or IDPA... I'll have to have someone watch :uhoh:

Likewise it is said that shotguns are better shot with both eyes open. I personally cannot do that. I close an eye as I do with a rifle...

So, I think if you can keep both open and do as well as closing one... do it!

10-Ring
October 3, 2006, 09:47 PM
Both eyes open! :what: ;)

Skpotamus
October 3, 2006, 10:10 PM
I've tried to shoot with both eyes open on several occasions, I can, but not fast and definitely not on a moving target. From my teaching (NRA Rifle, Shotgun and ML'ing Rifle Instructor, mostly for BSA), the kids with perfect vision could do this pretty easily, the kids that had to wear glasses had a VERY tough time keeping both eyes open.

For instance, I'm a glasses wearer, if I keep both eyes open, and keep my front sight focus, I literally have two targets. At 10 yards, the targets are several feet apart. With practice I could probably get good enough to trust to hit the correct one at speed, but squinting one eye is pretty natural for me (boxing and martial arts do this a lot with incoming strikes).

I only close the eye to line up the shot, the rest of the time it's both eyes open and scanning for targets, identify, close eye, bring gun up, fire, open left eye and scan.

YMMV.

KUJO2388
October 3, 2006, 10:14 PM
When I shoot a rifle with iron sights I keep both eyes open but I shut my left when using a scope. When I fire a pistol I shut my left eye. I am a righty.

.38 Special
October 3, 2006, 10:27 PM
Jeff Cooper pointed out that shooting a scoped rifle with one eye closed led to the "annoying habit of getting 'lost in the scope'", i.e. holding up the rifle, closing an eye, looking through the scope, not seeing the target, waving the rifle around in an effort to find the target, and so on and so forth.

Personally, I found that the rifle scope was a good trainer in ridding myself of what the good colonel convinced me was a bad habit. "Shifting" between looking through the scope with the right eye and then looking at the target with the left eye -- without moving the cheek weld -- was not horribly hard to master, and the technique was then easily transferable to the handgun.

I now shoot everything with both eyes open. And no, I'm not any more accurate than I used to be, but I never get "lost in the scope"!

.38 Special
October 3, 2006, 10:28 PM
BTW, one effect of closing an eye is that the iris of the other expands. This may or may not affect shooting, depending upon who you talk to.

RyanM
October 3, 2006, 10:39 PM
Usually both eyes open, focused on target. If I focus on the sights with both eyes open, it's impossible to figure out which sight is supposed to be aligned with which target.

If using a red dot, always both eyes open. Cross-dominance is probably an advantage when using a 1X red dot. Lower priced glass doesn't allow a very clear picture in low light, but your other eye sees everything unimpeded, and your brain will automatically put the dot in the right place, even if you have the lens cap on.

SolaScriptura139
October 4, 2006, 11:53 AM
Lately, I've been shooting with one eye closed. I am right-handed, and I believe I'm left-eye dominant. I'm going to experiment with both to see what works best for my accuracy with a pistol. I have always closed one eye when using a rifle with a scope, just seems to work easier.

longeyes
October 4, 2006, 12:50 PM
Both. Eyes. Open.

The way God made ya.

psyopspec
October 4, 2006, 01:53 PM
I shoot with both eyes open unless it's a scoped rifle or my accuracy is starting to fall off from range fatigue.

Two eyes gets you better depth perception and allows a wider field of vision.

greener
October 4, 2006, 07:56 PM
After reading this http://www.starreloaders.com/edhall/nwongarts.html I decided that two eyes open is better than one eye open. I'd just started doing it with a tactical red dot sight, and these series of articles convinced me to switch. It didn't take long to train my eyes to focus correctly and I only saw one image. I think my shooting has improved because of it. Of course, that only means that my groups have decreased from 0.6 barns to 0.45 barns (doors closed).

Kangspec
January 17, 2010, 09:20 PM
sorry for bring old thread back. (better than making new thread)

When shooting with both eyes open, you still bring guns to one eye right? i meant line up with right eye, instead of bring gun to center of your face (line up with nose).

ArchAngelCD
January 17, 2010, 10:18 PM
I "try" to keep both eyes open when shooting handguns and shotguns but I do close one eye when looking through a scope on a rifle.

Kangspec
January 17, 2010, 10:27 PM
well, i can shoot both eyes open with scope, but hand gun so hard. lol i need to keep practice.

Owen
January 18, 2010, 11:26 AM
Kang, yes, with both eyes open you are still just using one eye to aim. If you find the gun ends up centered on your face instead of one eye, you may have eye dominance issues.

Manco
January 18, 2010, 12:38 PM
I always shoot with both eyes open in order to maintain better situational awareness (i.e. depth perception and peripheral vision), as a real life situation can be quite fluid. Strangely, neither of my eyes seems to be dominant over the other, but as long as I keep the gun to the right side of my face (I'm naturally right-handed) I can use my right eye to aim; my left eye is used to aim when shooting with my left hand, and that works fine, too (I could cross over with either hand, but that would be silly).

cornman
January 18, 2010, 01:51 PM
So you compensate for bullet drop?

"If you close one eye you lose depth perception. This is not good, especially in a gunfight."

Manco
January 18, 2010, 02:12 PM
So you compensate for bullet drop?

No, but depth perception gives me superior awareness of my surroundings in case there are other assailants or bystanders moving around, or obstacles in my way if I'm moving around. Wouldn't you feel more aware and even more comfortable with both eyes open in an actual gunfight, as opposed to shooting at a paper target? Keeping your other eye open is analogous to using a head-up display (HUD) in a fighter jet instead of staring down at your instruments during a dogfight.

Zerodefect
January 18, 2010, 03:37 PM
I like to close both eyes, scream like a girl, and spray bullets in all directions. I sign in at 3 gun competitions as "Captain Death Blossom".

In all practicle defensive senerios I've practiced, I use both eyes open. Unless my contacts/glasses get screwed up or I get water or smoke in my eye. then sometimes I have to squint my "off" eye a little to keep my brain planted on the correct eye.

But usually it deosn't matter. Either eye will do at combat pistol ranges. Just point and shoot. And my rifle has an Eotech, so anyway that dot gets on target is fine.

jfrey
January 18, 2010, 11:03 PM
I always enjoy this question when it is raised. I was a fairly good shot before I lost the sight in my left eye and I can still hold my own pretty well. If I close my left eye, as I do when I shoot a rifle (from being taught that way) it doesn't really matter. If I shoot with both eyes open, it doesn't matter either. If you loose sight in one eye the other one will take over and be a lot more acute. I suggest you try both and do what ever works best for you.

1SOW
January 18, 2010, 11:14 PM
IMO: With handguns (Other than Bullseye Competition), keep both eyes open-with or without glasses. You have full peripheral vision. You have depth perception. You can shift to a second target much faster.

Bring the front sight up to the target.
Look at the front sight, the target will become blurry but still in view.
Fire
The dominant eye will keep you on target.

You can see how it works by extending your arms in front of you, and forming a triangle by touching the tips of your index fingers and thumbs together. Look at a target centered in this triangle. Don't move your hands and close your left eye. If the target didn't move, you're right eye dominant. Close the right eye and the target will move out of the triangle. Left eye dominant will be the reverse of the above.
While looking at the target through the triangle, look at the point where your thumbs meet. You can still see the target, but it will be less clear, but still dead center. Fire! :-)

Your dominant eye will keep you on target with both eyes open. With a little practice, you'll gain confidence that this works.
You can stay aware of your surroundings and make target transitions much faster.

Manco: I'll bet you a coke your right eye dominant. :-) Try this test. Call me at br499 if I'm wrong.

Solascriptura: It works even better for moving targets. You have faster sight and target acquisition with both eyes open.

MCgunner
January 19, 2010, 09:48 AM
Ridiculous argument for me when I can't see CRAP out of my right eye. That's why I had to learn to shoot lefty with long guns about age 8.

KBintheSLC
January 19, 2010, 10:55 AM
two eyes open work as long as you can stay focused on the font sight.

I have never understood this notion. If you use 2 eyes and focus on the front sight, you will be seeing 2 highly blurred targets very far apart. It seems much more effective to be focused on the target when using 2 eyes.

Front sight focus is more of an 1 eye aimed sighting technique. IMO

Here is an in-depth description of both 1 and 2 eye shooting...
2 eyes (http://brasstard.com/?p=195)
1 eye (http://brasstard.com/?p=164)

Just One Shot
January 19, 2010, 11:15 AM
I've seen some people who shoot with both eyes CLOSED!
:scrutiny:

:D

CorpITGuy
January 19, 2010, 11:20 AM
I've seen some people who shoot with both eyes CLOSED!

That'd be me. ;) It have the toughest time keeping my eyes open when I'm shooting my LCP.

Every other gun... I do fine. :)

There's just something about having to (a) squeeze the trigger so hard that blood vessels start busting and (b) knowing it's going to hurt like the dickens. :barf:

Manco
January 19, 2010, 12:41 PM
Manco: I'll bet you a coke your right eye dominant. :-) Try this test. Call me at br499 if I'm wrong.

When I tried your test with my hands, closing either eye made the target move in my visual field. With both eyes open and focused on the target, I see a double image of my hands, and, believe it or not, the target moves to the center of my visual field. Moving my hands to the right results in a transition to effective right-eye dominance as my left eye's view of the target is blocked; similarly, moving my hands to the left results in a shift to left-eye dominance as my right eye's view is blocked. Focusing on where my thumbs meet results in a double image of the target (the view of both eyes combined); closing either eye while so focused results in opposing views with neither centered on the target.

When using iron sights pre-aimed at the target and positioned at the middle of my face, I cannot form a sight picture at all, as among the rear sight, front sight, and target, when I focus on one the other two are double images with both eyes open and off-center with either eye closed. Finally, when I move the sights in front of either eye and focus on the front sight or target to aim I get a single image of the target and a double image of my hand and gun--when shooting right-handed I use the left-most image to form a sight picture (easy because it's centered rather than off to the side), and when shooting left-handed I use the right-most image (also centered in my field of view). With the training I've done, I have no trouble quickly acquiring a target and achieving "combat accuracy" using iron sights with both eyes open. It's a bit easier for me to do this with my right eye either because I'm slightly right-eye dominant or because I've trained so much more on that side, being right-handed, or maybe both. I have no idea from personal experience how and what other people see, although I presume that it must be different if one eye is truly dominant over the other.

Just One Shot
January 19, 2010, 03:25 PM
That'd be me. It have the toughest time keeping my eyes open when I'm shooting my LCP.

Every other gun... I do fine.

There's just something about having to squeeze the trigger so hard that blood vessels start busting and knowing it's going to hurt like the dickens.

:confused:

I've heard that before and it always confuses me. I have an LCP and I don't have any problems with the trigger or the recoil.

I put mag extensions on mine so I can get 2 fingers on the grip and it greatly improved the handling when firing.
:)

I've never measured it but my trigger feels like it's in the 4-5 lb. range. It's a little long on the pull but I wouldn't have it any other way on a gun with no safety.

Maybe you should just send yours to me along with some ammo and let me shoot it for a few months so I can break it in for you.
:D

oneounceload
January 19, 2010, 04:57 PM
Shotguns and pistols should be shot with both eyes open and focused on the target; rifles with scopes should be also, but can be done with one eye closed.

NMGonzo
January 19, 2010, 07:32 PM
:confused:

I've heard that before and it always confuses me. I have an LCP and I don't have any problems with the trigger or the recoil.

I put mag extensions on mine so I can get 2 fingers on the grip and it greatly improved the handling when firing.
:)

I've never measured it but my trigger feels like it's in the 4-5 lb. range. It's a little long on the pull but I wouldn't have it any other way on a gun with no safety.

Maybe you should just send yours to me along with some ammo and let me shoot it for a few months so I can break it in for you.
:D

With the cheap .380 ammo my Bersa shoots powder back at my face.

With the Fiocci ... not at all

1SOW
January 19, 2010, 08:22 PM
KBintheSLC: [Handguns] That article is referring to "point shooting". Close range (varies with different shooters, but maybe out to 5 yds), point your handgun at the target, not really focused on the gun sight and fire. This actually works well for close non-precision targets like USPSA/IPSC.

At longer ranges or with smaller targets like steel plate the front sight becomes more important.

At even longer ranges the rear sight becomes as critical as the front sight--The "10-X" for Bullseye shooters. At this point they often block the vision of the unused eye.

Explaining all this makes it sound complicated. It's not. It's actually a natural use of a normal eye function. A little practice and it will feel natural.

My son and I have a tradition at the end of a day at the range. We often line up shotgun hulls at 25 yds and compete for speed and accuracy with a .22 target pistol with iron sights. We both shoot with both eyes open, front sight, front sight, front sight. On a good day day I win, but he's way faster on a USPSA stage.

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